Welcome to INTJ Forum

This is a community where INTJs can meet others with similar personalities and discuss a wide variety of both serious and casual topics. If you aren't an INTJ, you're welcome to join anyway if you would like to learn more about this personality type or participate in our discussions. Registration is free and will allow you to post messages, see hidden subforums, customize your account and use other features only available to our members.

Disillusioned

Why do girls wait so long to have sex

77 posts in this topic

Why do girls wait so long to have sex? It seems like the more a girl likes a guy the longer she waits to have sex with him. I'm talking about in the context of a potential relationship not one night stands where both people have a mutual understanding that they are just using the other person to meet their physical needs. To me it doesn't make sense that a girl will have sex with a guy that she doesn't have strong feelings for but then won't have sex with the guy she does. It's almost like I'm getting punished for being a good guy!

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not just looking for sex. I will only consider dating a girl if I'm mentally as well as physically attracted to her and I will never pressure her to go further than she is comfortable with but it just seems like if the girl likes the guy she should want to have sex with him even more and express herself physically as well as emotionally to him but then purposely holding back sex seems unauthentic and deceptive (Ironic when girls are always so eager to point out the importance of trust in relationships).

It seems like most girls hold to that '3rd date rule' as if their lives depended on it while others have admitted on forums and such that if they really like the guy they may likely wait a month or longer to sleep with him. I can't speak for all guys (ESFP's and the sort) but for me, I am gunna like the girl the same whether she sleeps with me on the first date or the tenth. It's silly that girls think that withholding sex will actually make a guy like them MORE. Girls are always saying their excuse for waiting is that they want to make sure the guy is interested in them as a person and not just looking for sex so if he stays past the third date(or whenever) the girl thinks she is less likely to get used or hurt. This is rubbish! the guy is either genuinely interested in you or just wants sex, so if he stays after the third date it either means he is just that determined in his goal of getting you to bed (or likes the challenge) in which case once he has gotten sex you will likely get hurt anyways (all you did was prolong the inevitable) and in the case that he does genuinely like you he will just feel hurt and confused why you seemingly don't trust him enough to allow him to satisfy you physically(as well as emotionally) which he wants to do for your sake as much as for his own.

In fact, I'm inclined to like a girl less the longer she waits to have sex with me. It's not about the physical act of sex, rather what it represents. I start to lose my interest in her because I feel she is not willing to show me the same level of trust that I show her. My opinion is sex should just come at a natural stage in the relationship, girls withholding from sex for no other reason than 'it hasn't been the right number of dates yet' is just stupid and hurts relationships rather than helps them. But that's just the rational opinion coming from this INTJ male. Interested to see what others views are about this, especially females of any personality type.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is not rocket science.

Men have infinite sperm. Women have finite eggs.

Do the math.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is not rocket science.

Men have infinite sperm. Women have finite eggs.

Do the math.

I don't quite get what you're saying. Girls don't run out of eggs faster by having sex earlier. It's called menopause they all reach it around the same time. Maybe you should study some anatomy. And also I'm not asking why they wait so long from an age sense just from a relationship sense

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I can't speak for all guys (ESFP's and the sort) but for me, I am gunna like the girl the same whether she sleeps with me on the first date or the tenth. It's silly that girls think that withholding sex will actually make a guy like them MORE.

If a girl is willing to have sex with me on the first date than I will be less interested in them long term. Just am. I suppose it has a lot to do with them having low inhibitions there, which in my mind also translates to faithfulness in a relationship. I don't want a girl who is too casual about sex. In fact, if I like a girl as having LTR potential and she goes home with me on the first or second date, I won't even try to have sex with her. Why? I guess partially that I don't really want to know if she puts out that easily and partially I would just prefer to not get my feelings for her confused with the excitement of sex. Of course, some girls have expressed either insecurity about my not trying or disappointment.:rolleyes: In fact, for many I think it is a turn-off. I think I get "nice guy" labeled and have had some acquaintances (girls) explain to me that if a guy doesn't try to sleep with them and they are willing they either think he is a wimp or he has a tiny penis or some other problem. Great... So if I am NOT the kind of guy many girls complain about all guys being like, there's something wrong with me?

Anyway, girls aren't necessarily wrong to think that it registers with a guy somehow when they sleep with him really early on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It has nothing to do with biology and everything to do with social conditioning. WHen she has a vested interested in wanting to keep the man she will go to great lengths not to be perceived as the easy lay. She may in fact biologically be wanting to consummate on the first date but she knows she runs a high risk of being rejected if she does so. Guys have kind of dug their own hole on this one. If it wasn't a habit for women to get rejected after some fast sex, they'd be more willing to participate in it. When the emotional risk is low she'll go for it but when it's high she won't.

I don't need to know you love me to get my kit off, but I do need to know you're not then going to turn around and judge me for doing it. The notion that just because she has sex with you easily means that she has sex with anyone easily is quite false. What it really means is that she has high motivation to have sex with you. That does not translate into unfaithfulness or being easy. But we have the media to thank for the perception that a woman's willingness to have sex must mean she is indiscriminant.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I don't quite get what you're saying. Girls don't run out of eggs faster by having sex earlier. It's called menopause they all reach it around the same time. Maybe you should study some anatomy. And also I'm not asking why they wait so long from an age sense just from a relationship sense

Okay, it was poorly phrased or conceptualized, but evolutionarily, back in the day, a guy can go impregnate 5 girls in 5 days and doesn't lose out on potential mates. A girl has sex with a guy on day 1 and if she gets pregnant, she's stuck carrying his offspring and being unable to have more for at least 9 months, so she should be pickier about sex. Now people way back then didn't conceptualize it this way (at least one would presume) so the underlying biopsychology should to be set up for women to be more choosy as part of their nature.

That's what I think the point of that was.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the end product of sex (i.e. pregnancy) is much more of a commitment for her than it is for him. Regardless of protection used, the risk and cost to a woman is infinitely greater than for a man.

birth control hasn't been around nearly long enough for it to affect adaptive behavior.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well, in order to know you like someone or trust someone, you must spend time with them. As we know, people generally present their best side initially, and hide their flaws. Perhaps a woman waiting for sex is doing so because she conflates trust, emotional connection, and sex. She believes the actions of her body should match the morals in her heart and the convictions of her mind. So, recognizing that a man she likes may very well be "playing her", she is cautious.

Of course, he may still have "played her" after her waiting, but it is certainly not as likely. Generally men who only want sex are weeded out when a woman refuses to sleep with them right away.

This behavior is not an affront to you, but merely a defense mechanism.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Why do girls wait so long to have sex?

Because they're... girls?

You just haven't met the right cougar yet...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It has nothing to do with biology and everything to do with social conditioning.
I don't need to know you love me to get my kit off, but I do need to know you're not then going to turn around and judge me for doing it.

That looks like biologically driven reasoning to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well, in order to know you like someone or trust someone, you must spend time with them. As we know, people generally present their best side initially, and hide their flaws. Perhaps a woman waiting for sex is doing so because she conflates trust, emotional connection, and sex. She believes the actions of her body should match the morals in her heart and the convictions of her mind. So, recognizing that a man she likes may very well be "playing her", she is cautious.

Of course, he may still have "played her" after her waiting, but it is certainly not as likely. Generally men who only want sex are weeded out when a woman refuses to sleep with them right away.

This behavior is not an affront to you, but merely a defense mechanism.

I agree with this. There are certainly more than enough men who will lead on a woman who is genuinely interested in them and becoming emotionally involved/attached just for sex. If the man gets the sex early (and many players are impatient about it), then some types will stick around even if they don't care for anything about her other than her attractiveness and the sex. When they do move on, she's been built up to have a bit of a heartbreak, but perhaps moreso the feeling that nobody (male or female) likes: that they've just been tricked and used by someone who doesn't give a crap about them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Why do girls wait so long to have sex?

There's no feminine code that people follow, however women are disparaged when they are overtly sexual, they get names thrown at them like whore and slut while men who act the same get called players and hi-fived by their mates. The standards are not the same. The potential outcome with unwanted pregnancy is also uneven, don't know how many men consider the possibility before they get into bed with someone but I expect most women would have considered what they would do at some point.

Plus of course the answer that you seem to think is rubbish: A woman may want to wait to be sure that her partner isn't just using her for sex. Read up on the PUA stuff and see the lengths some guys will go to just for a lay.

It's almost like I'm getting punished for being a good guy!

(Ironic when girls are always so eager to point out the importance of trust in relationships).

Your generalisations and assumptions are odd.

It seems like most girls hold to that '3rd date rule' as if their lives depended on it while others have admitted on forums and such that if they really like the guy they may likely wait a month or longer to sleep with him.

A forum is hardly a scientific way of determining what "most girls like". Traditions for traditions sake are lame but that is a separate issue to not jumping straight into bed.

I can't speak for all guys (ESFP's and the sort) but for me, I am gunna like the girl the same whether she sleeps with me on the first date or the tenth. It's silly that girls think that withholding sex will actually make a guy like them MORE.

Iunno, some people place higher value over things that don't come easy. Women have social stigma attached to sleeping with men without "making him work for it" so to speak which may mean he will form a low opinion of her as he believes her willingness to sleep with him is a sign that she would sleep with anyone.

In fact, I'm inclined to like a girl less the longer she waits to have sex with me.

Then it would be in her interests not to jump into bed with you early.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Don't know about the other ladies, but I would be wary of the man who tries for sex too fast. This suggests to me that he's done this with other women to some degree of success (Pavlov's dog). What if he was just going around having dates with women to get sex, pushing for it on the first or second date every time? To me, that implies he doesn't care about a lasting relationship, would be more likely to be unfaithful, and definitely more likely to be carrying STDs- which almost always are incredibly worse for women than men. Not to mention pregnancy- if a woman gets knocked up, she's often stuck raising the baby alone, and even if she decides to abort or put it up for adoption, the stigma of having an illegitimate child/giving the child up/aborting will follow her forever.

So, by waiting for sex, you're making sure the man is interested in you (not giving up on you after a couple dates because of lack of sex), increasing your chances of staying together.

And before somebody says "not all men are like that!" I'd like to remind you, it only takes one bad apple to spoil the whole bunch. Because there are SOME men like that out there, women feel the need to stay on guard with ALL men.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

:anxious:Sometimes, the guy makes the girl wait for sex.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
That looks like biologically driven reasoning to me.

Oh really? What part of my ovaries is responsible for my aversion to having sex with someone who may turn out to be an asshole? I'm so tired of the argument that humans are slaves to biology....yawn....:dozey:

As a biologically sterile woman I'd assume that my biological enslavement mechanism would be intelligent enough to know that my ovaries are as useful as boiled eggs. Further I would expect to have zero sex drive since no issue would be forthcoming from my baby factory. Guess biology has really screwed up there....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Okay, it was poorly phrased or conceptualized, but evolutionarily, back in the day, a guy can go impregnate 5 girls in 5 days and doesn't lose out on potential mates. A girl has sex with a guy on day 1 and if she gets pregnant, she's stuck carrying his offspring and being unable to have more for at least 9 months, so she should be pickier about sex. Now people way back then didn't conceptualize it this way (at least one would presume) so the underlying biopsychology should to be set up for women to be more choosy as part of their nature.

That's what I think the point of that was.

Got it. Though, a girl can still have just as much sex as a guy, all this means is she has to be responsible for using birth control. girls should be responsible for their own bodies and not expect that every guy will have a condom (cuz many won't). I always use condoms cuz I don't want to get STD's but some guys just don't give a f*** or they ran out the day before the situation arises (this excuse is most of the time complete rubbish).

I do have a friend though that has gotten six girls pregnant. I think this is pretty irresponsible on his part but it is kinda hard to argue that the girl isn't also 50% responsible (there are plenty more forms of birth control than condoms i.e. the pill, which girls should consider if they choose to be sexually active).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm so tired of the argument that humans are slaves to biology....yawn....:dozey:

How can you break the bonds of slavery if you don't even recognize them?

There is no chain around my neck, pulling me down this path before me, I am free... yawn.... :whip:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
There's no feminine code that people follow, however women are disparaged when they are overtly sexual, they get names thrown at them like whore and slut while men who act the same get called players and hi-fived by their mates. The standards are not the same. The potential outcome with unwanted pregnancy is also uneven, don't know how many men consider the possibility before they get into bed with someone but I expect most women would have considered what they would do at some point.

YES!

There is a double moral standard when it comes to sex. This might be a reason for women to inhibit themselves somewhat.

Also, this isn't some kind of cosmic rule. You speak of "girls" as if this was one homogenous, uniform group of people.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
If a girl is willing to have sex with me on the first date than I will be less interested in them long term. Just am. I suppose it has a lot to do with them having low inhibitions there, which in my mind also translates to faithfulness in a relationship.

I see your point. I would never try to sleep with a girl the first night I meet her (definition of a one night stand) if I want a relationship with her. But I think it also has to do with the connection you have with that person. And with what actually constitutes a date. For instance, I was seeing this girl for about 3 weeks. I'm in college so I'd hangout with her every weekend when we threw parties at my apartment (which is where I met her in the first place) and we would sometimes go to other parties together. So even though we had been hanging out almost every night for 3 weeks (or at least 3 nights a week) we hadn't really gone on a ‘formal date’ like going to a movie or dinner. She had stayed over a few nights and we watched a movie together at my place one night (I guess that equals '1' date). But she still wouldn't even let me touch her below the waist.

What I'm saying is that it's all relative. We had been seeing each other for 3 weeks but just because we hadn't necessarily gone on 3 official dates doesn't mean she doesn't know me. But yet then someone could meet a girl and take her out the next three nights that week and then she would sleep with him on the third night (if she is going by the '3rd date' rule). I've seen the girl 9 times in the past 3 weeks where as a girl could see a guy 3 times and know much less about him but have sex with him (according to this rule) that's what I mean when I say it is irrational and that sex should just come natural in the relationship. Many people are equating the date thing to mean the first time she hangs out with a guy and the third time she hangs out with him. Of course I have less respect for a girl who is willing to sleep with me the first night but that doesn't necessarily equate to the first date. the girl just needs to use common sense and her judgment instead of relying on some dumb rule.

As we know, people generally present their best side initially, and hide their flaws.

haha not true for INTJ's

INTJ = socially awkward

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
It has nothing to do with biology and everything to do with social conditioning.

Oh, baloney. Of course, it has to do with biology. Care to explain why women have such a strong preference for tall men? For muscular men? Because in modern day society it's really important to be tall and muscular, right? Pfftt. Just one example. People don't decide on who to get into a relationship with on rational grounds. If that were the case, we'd be swapping relationship resumes. People make these deicions based on emotions, emotions tied to biology. Look at the human brain. Sexual attraction and strong emotions surrounding dating are centered in the most primeval parts. We don't use that fancy new part of the brain where reasons sits much when it comes to selecting a mate. We say we do, we may wish we do, but we don't. Women date men for whom they "feel it." And no ladies, it ain't your hormones. It's that he appeals to a largely biological instinct of yours. The women on this focrum who've indicate a strong preference for strong, goal-oriented, amibitous and assertive, confident men have provided ample evidence. Are there exceptions, sure. But let's no go too far down the road of idealized wishful thinking.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
We don't use that fancy new part of the brain where reasons sits much when it comes to selecting a mate.

We should try it. We might wait for sex.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
the answer that you seem to think is rubbish: A woman may want to wait to be sure that her partner isn't just using her for sex. Read up on the PUA stuff and see the lengths some guys will go to just for a lay.

My point exactly. Simply waiting til the third date does not guarantee that the guy isn't still just using her for sex. Thanks for further proving my point

It's almost like I'm getting punished for being a good guy!

(Ironic when girls are always so eager to point out the importance of trust in relationships)

Your generalizations and assumptions are odd.

Well, that's cuz those two lines came from completely different paragraphs. What I really said was

It's almost like I'm getting punished for being a good guy!

Don't take this the wrong way, I'm not just looking for sex. I will only consider dating a girl if I'm mentally as well as physically attracted to her and I will never pressure her to go further than she is comfortable with but it just seems like if the girl likes the guy she should want to have sex with him even more and express herself physically as well as emotionally to him but then purposely holding back sex seems unauthentic and deceptive (Ironic when girls are always so eager to point out the importance of trust in relationships).

Makes a little more sense now. Nice attempt at a logical fallacy though

It seems like most girls hold to that '3rd date rule' as if their lives depended on it while others have admitted on forums and such that if they really like the guy they may likely wait a month or longer to sleep with him.
A forum is hardly a scientific way of determining what "most girls like". Traditions for traditions sake are lame but that is a separate issue to not jumping straight into bed.

It may be but the main point of my argument is that adhering to traditions like the '3rd date rule' for traditions sake is dumb so I'm glad to see we agree about that. And the reason I brought it up in the first place is because you always see girls asking 'how many dates should I go on with him before I go all the way' and the most common answer given is 3 hence the '3 date rule' it's a pretty common rule of thumb, google it.

I can't speak for all guys (ESFP's and the sort) but for me, I am gunna like the girl the same whether she sleeps with me on the first date or the tenth. It's silly that girls think that withholding sex will actually make a guy like them MORE.
Iunno, some people place higher value over things that don't come easy.

As an INTJ we don't. we are rational, a goal has value in its own right. How hard it is to achieve that goal just depends on our ingenuity. It doesn't have EXTRA value just for being harder. If you can achieve your goal with minimal effort, all the better.

That's why most people would take it as a complement if you were to tell them "it's easy to like you"

Women have social stigma attached to sleeping with men without "making him work for it" so to speak which may mean he will form a low opinion of her as he believes her willingness to sleep with him is a sign that she would sleep with anyone.

I address this in my previous post but in short I agree that I will most likely have less respect for a girl who will sleep with me the first night I meet her but this does not necessarily equate to the first 'formal' date.

In fact, I'm inclined to like a girl less the longer she waits to have sex with me.
Then it would be in her interests not to jump into bed with you early.

Again, way to take my argument out of context and then attack it *cough* straw man *cough*

If you read the next sentence it says

In fact, I'm inclined to like a girl less the longer she waits to have sex with me. It's not about the physical act of sex, rather what it represents. I start to lose my interest in her because I feel she is not willing to show me the same level of trust that I show her.

Here it is in baby terms for you. My reason for being inclined to like a girl less the longer she waits to have sex with me has nothing to do with the physical act of sex (in other words I'm not using her for sex) but rather it has to do with me feeling more and more like she does not share the same trust level in me that I have in her. And as trust is an important factor in any relationship, it is only natural that I am inclined to like a girl less the more I feel she does not trust me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Oh, baloney. Of course, it has to do with biology. Care to explain why women have such a strong preference for tall men? For muscular men? Because in modern day society it's really important to be tall and muscular, right? Pfftt. Just one example. People don't decide on who to get into a relationship with on rational grounds. If that were the case, we'd be swapping relationship resumes. People make these deicions based on emotions, emotions tied to biology. Look at the human brain. Sexual attraction and strong emotions surrounding dating are centered in the most primeval parts. We don't use that fancy new part of the brain where reasons sits much when it comes to selecting a mate. We say we do, we may wish we do, but we don't. Women date men for whom they "feel it." And no ladies, it ain't your hormones. It's that he appeals to a largely biological instinct of yours. The women on this focrum who've indicate a strong preference for strong, goal-oriented, amibitous and assertive, confident men have provided ample evidence. Are there exceptions, sure. But let's no go too far down the road of idealized wishful thinking.

The "biology" bit is that the woman WILL do it with the man, but not because she loves him, rather because he is "healthy" whatever that means - tall, "masculine", muscled, dominating, whatever. She wants to invest in healthy offspring. Think about it in simple terms: just because he awakens some primeval urge in you that makes you go hot and shaky doesn't mean you even want to talk to him, in fact you might hate his personality, and personality compatibility is essential for long term commitment.

When she makes him wait for "it", it's not only because he's "healthy" or because he's the "healthiest" she can find but because she wants to have a long term emotional relationship with him (presumably he's healthy enough). Long term emotional relationships are a social norm in our culture, in other words conditioning as opposed to biology. Many cultures do not have the same kind of marriage-style relationships where emotions are the main reason for choice of the particular partner, or not in general in their population.

Besides, in many cultures throughout the ages, and perhaps in early human history, a woman-man long term bonding was not necessary for successful rearing of healthy offspring, so why would she need him to stay around for that? Look at single mothers today. Their offspring can be perfectly healthy/functional people.

I have always suspected that the whole argument that women want to save their eggs for providers stems from the patriarchal culture in which the theory was developed and in which its developers were conditioned as scientists. Biologists are not exactly progressive people in some institutions that i've seen.

Despite humans having evolved biologically, they have also evolved socially and cerebrally and are not ONLY motivated by the most basic instincts. Inevitable motivation by basic biological instincts could be an excuse for anything, were it thought to be true. The whole reason humans think they're so special compared to other species is they think they know they can rise above such basic instincts by contrast with "animals". To what extent they have is a whole other topic ...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Oh, baloney. Of course, it has to do with biology. Care to explain why women have such a strong preference for tall men? For muscular men? Because in modern day society it's really important to be tall and muscular, right? Pfftt. Just one example. People don't decide on who to get into a relationship with on rational grounds. If that were the case, we'd be swapping relationship resumes. People make these deicions based on emotions, emotions tied to biology. Look at the human brain. Sexual attraction and strong emotions surrounding dating are centered in the most primeval parts. We don't use that fancy new part of the brain where reasons sits much when it comes to selecting a mate. We say we do, we may wish we do, but we don't. Women date men for whom they "feel it." And no ladies, it ain't your hormones. It's that he appeals to a largely biological instinct of yours. The women on this focrum who've indicate a strong preference for strong, goal-oriented, amibitous and assertive, confident men have provided ample evidence. Are there exceptions, sure. But let's no go too far down the road of idealized wishful thinking.
The issue is not attraction, it's sexual patterns of behaviour. Sex behaviour is cultural, meaning it is defined and therefore constrained by society; female sexuality far more so in many cases compared to males'. We can try to make biological explanations to the exclusion of the importance of societal influence, but then we'd be ignoring a major influence on a female's sexual behaviour.

Some time ago we advanced past the mammalian brain where instinct accounted for everything. There are plenty of sound logical reasons why a female would hesitate to become sexually active with a potentially serious mate, a number of which have been pinpointed.

I won't say biological influence amounts to nothing, but please don't be so short sighted to believe society is a pure reflection of biology, or that it somehow matters little in the decisions we make, sexually or otheriwse.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The issue is not attraction, it's sexual patterns of behaviour. Sex behaviour is cultural, meaning it is defined and therefore constrained by society; female sexuality far more so in many cases compared to males'. We can try to make biological explanations to the exclusion of the importance of societal influence, but then we'd be ignoring a major influence on a female's sexual behaviour.

Some time ago we advanced past the mammalian brain where instinct accounted for everything. There are plenty of sound logical reasons why a female would hesitate to become sexually active with a potentially serious mate, a number of which have been pinpointed.

I won't say biological influence amounts to nothing, but please don't be so short sighted to believe society is a pure reflection of biology, or that it somehow matters little in the decisions we make, sexually or otheriwse.

Yes, a female may rationally over-ride her attraction, but attraction is the most important factor. Sufficient attraction means sex is very likely to occur much sooner than otherwise, and the male will be judged much, much more kindly (in many cases the woman will use her rational brain to rationalize bad behavior exhibited by the male she's attracted to). Attraction is the primary force behind mating behavior. Yes, it battles at times with other forces but it tends to win more often than not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now