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Cockney Red

Row over BBC transgender programme aimed at children

236 posts in this topic

Pretty shocking, but not surprising.

Not only do I consider this essentially child abuse which will destroy many young kids lives and whole families, but the ideology of indoctrinating young kids into "gender fluidity" is also one sure to lead to the death of any culture which embraces it, for pretty obvious reasons.

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If it's actually aimed at children around age 6, I don't really get it... It's not that I approve or don't approve, it's that at that age, children aren't exactly going to grasp what's going on in the program. Doesn't sound like it's going to run for long, if that's the case.
I think it might be a popular show if it was aimed at children around 12, instead. They've got more of a grasp on what's going on, and a bit of a grasp on the social ramifications as well.

I wouldn't worry about indoctrination either way... When children are old enough to understand complex concepts, they're old enough to make their own decision on them, so by and large, indoctrination is a non-issue, at least in the information age in first world countries, where there's information from every viewpoint readily available.

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in a world where everything can be changed to suit one's whims, who can be surprised. but try arguing that some things are best left alone, as i have, and you get labelled as ignorant or worse. LGBTQIA have another letter to add to their ever expanding label: C for confused. who wouldn't be!

perhaps best of all this is fiction. it's not even real life. it's what someone thinks real life is like.

Edited by monkey

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It's just an audio diary of a kid talking about the stuff she's worried about. This is no different than when I was a kid and everyone worried that shows with gay kids would 'confuse' kids. The reality is, kids only get 'confused' if they are deliberately kept from having appropriate information.

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15 minutes ago, dala said:

It's just an audio diary of a kid talking about the stuff she's worried about. This is no different than when I was a kid and everyone worried that shows with gay kids would 'confuse' kids. The reality is, kids only get 'confused' if they are deliberately kept from having appropriate information.

There is a difference between information and indoctrination. This is undoubtedly part of  a deep ideological drive to "degender" society. The change in just the past 5 years has been incredible, when I look at 18-24 y/o's today compared with my generation (I'm 29). At this rate the upcoming generation raised on shows like this will essentially be androgynous.

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Just now, Cockney Red said:

There is a difference between information and indoctrination. This is undoubtedly part of  a deep ideological drive to "degender" society. The change in just the past 5 years has been incredible, when I look at 18-24 y/o's today compared with my generation (I'm 29). At this rate the upcoming generation raised on shows like this will essentially be androgynous.

Saying 'transgender people exist and they're just people' is hardly indoctrination or 'degenderization.' Pretty sure what's been going on is people are starting to accept people for who they are, and it will hopefully stop a lot of these kids from flat out killing themselves as they have done historically due to bigotry against them.

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13 minutes ago, dala said:

Saying 'transgender people exist and they're just people' is hardly indoctrination or 'degenderization.' Pretty sure what's been going on is people are starting to accept people for who they are, and it will hopefully stop a lot of these kids from flat out killing themselves as they have done historically due to bigotry against them.

I accept the need to take on bullying, when I was at (Catholic) school homophobic bullying was terrible, and I am glad to hear the situation has improved.

But from there to accept as 'normal' a pre pubescent child taking tablets for an eventual sex change is quite a leap, let alone making a tv show about this and showing it to even younger children.

The fact is the whole 'transgender' thing is not fully understood, and while nobody should be bullied, neither in my opinion should we normalise it. To teach on national television that little children can decide they simply want a sex change, is crazy. I am sure even many believers in the idea of "transgender" or "gender fluidity" would agree.

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1 hour ago, Cockney Red said:

At this rate the upcoming generation raised on shows like this will essentially be androgynous.

... we already are. it's called 'equality'. the feminist movement wanted women to be like men. gay rights wanted gay people to be like straight people. it's already possible for genetic engineering to create people that don't have just one mother and one father. who really knows where all this will end. but that's progress, or so we're told!

Edited by monkey

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49 minutes ago, monkey said:

in a world where everything can be changed to suit one's whims, who can be surprised. but try arguing that some things are best left alone, as i have, and you get labelled as ignorant or worse. LGBTQIA have another letter to add to their ever expanding label: C for confused. who wouldn't be!

perhaps best of all this is fiction. it's not even real life. it's what someone thinks real life is like.

Why don't you accept private messages? I was going to say nice us agreeing for once! ;)

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6 minutes ago, Cockney Red said:

I accept the need to take on bullying, when I was at (Catholic) school homophobic bullying was terrible, and I am glad to hear the situation has improved.

But from there to accept as 'normal' a pre pubescent child taking tablets for an eventual sex change is quite a leap, let alone making a tv show about this and showing it to even younger children.

The fact is the whole 'transgender' thing is not fully understood, and while nobody should be bullied, neither in my opinion should we normalise it. To teach on national television that little children can decide they simply want a sex change, is crazy. I am sure even many believers in the idea of "transgender" or "gender fluidity" would agree.

No one simply decides they want a sex change, any more than people decide they want to be gay. People are who they are.

Your comment about pre-pubescent children is telling. They are taking puberty blockers, which means they are pre-pubescent by definition. These drugs are reversible if you simply stop taking them, and all they do is stop you from developing secondary sex characteristics.

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1 hour ago, Cockney Red said:

Why don't you accept private messages? I was going to say nice us agreeing for once! ;)

... because i suffer from severe depression and often shut-down. at such times my natural instinct is to isolate myself. and since the forum change i've no idea where a lot of these options are anymore.

Edited by monkey

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1 hour ago, monkey said:

... because i suffer from severe depression and often shut-down. at such times my natural instinct is to isolate myself. and since the forum change i've no idea where a lot of these options are anymore.

Top right hand corner where it says Monkey, click the scroll down arrow, click the second option "Messages" to enable.

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26 minutes ago, Cockney Red said:

Top right hand corner where it says Monkey, click the scroll down arrow, click the second option "Messages" to enable.

... this will have to wait until i'm using a PC. my windows 8 phone looks nothing like that.

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Aimed at six year olds? Name one six year old that would sit still long enough to watch a show that isn't animated or upbeat. Okay, and even with that, the six year old isn't going to understand it. Plus, the parents can monitor what their young ones watch.

I'm not opposed to this show for middle school children and above. This is clearly for puberty aged children, not six year olds, puh lease.

     Mr Wells told the Mail on Sunday: “The more we promote the idea that a boy can be born into a girl’s body and a girl can be born into a boy’s body, and that drugs and surgery can put things right, the more children will become utterly confused. Respecting and preserving a child’s birth sex should be seen as a child protection issue.”

Children [teenagers] will be less likely to be utterly confused if they're receiving a proper education at school and at home.

I see more absolute garbage in Keeping Up with the Kardashians and Basketball Wives than I do with this show. With respect to the impressionable youth.

 

Oh for fuck's sake-- it's about a prepubescent boy blocking puberty with medication? Dafuq? Is that even legal?

Yeah this show won't last long on air. 

Edited by Cak

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Man, I sure wish somebody cared as much about what's in y'all's pants as you seem to care about what's in mine. 

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Reminds me of this father I talked with ten years ago on another forum, who had a fit about a poster in the metro that showed two men kissing, because he didn't want his son to know homosexuality exists.

Yawn.

If you don't want your kids watching X or Y or Z there is such things as limiting access to the TV you know. If your six years old watches programs you disapprove of without your authorization you have more important things to worry about the off chance they'll get curious about transgender issues.

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The more knowledge a child has, the more informed their decisions and responses can potentially be. Why should they be shielded from knowing this exists? Restricting their knowledge is as stupid as those who believe that teaching children about (safe) sex is bad because the more they learn about something the more they will want to do it, despite the fact that those who grow up less comprehensively educated about sex have a less mature attitude towards it and are more likely to end up having unprotected sex.

 

Seems to be little more than a combination of mollycodling and transphobia.

 

Heaven forbid we give children ALL of the relevant information from all sides of an issue so they can question, prod, probe, and make up their own minds in an informed way. Quite the opposite of indoctrination, really.

Edited by holdyourhead

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I don't care what children watch, but 11 yo taking sex change drugs, like what the fuck? Isn't that something you should only be allowed to do as an adult. At 11 I would have wanted to get my arm chopped so I can put a prosthesis to look like a transformer ffs. Those kinds of decisions should not be available to children.

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3 hours ago, Seablue said:

Reminds me of this father I talked with ten years ago on another forum, who had a fit about a poster in the metro that showed two men kissing, because he didn't want his son to know homosexuality exists.

Yawn.

If you don't want your kids watching X or Y or Z there is such things as limiting access to the TV you know. If your six years old watches programs you disapprove of without your authorization you have more important things to worry about the off chance they'll get curious about transgender issues.

Sure, but have you considered some people may have an interest in the future of society beyond their own children? Plus, social changes will impact on ones own kids whether or not one lets them watch such a show directly.

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1 hour ago, IreOfDesire said:

I don't care what children watch, but 11 yo taking sex change drugs, like what the fuck? Isn't that something you should only be allowed to do as an adult. At 11 I would have wanted to get my arm chopped so I can put a prosthesis to look like a transformer ffs. Those kinds of decisions should not be available to children.

My instinct is to agree with you but I've read transgender writers saying there is an urgent need to stop transgender children from going through the wrong puberty, lest they become suicidal as their bodies diverge ever more sharply from their gender identity. My question is, but how do young children KNOW they're transgender. Like really know.

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It's only a problem if you think kids knowing about transexuality will harm society. I don't.

Kids should learn about what goes on in the world, in an age appropriate way if possible. Including stuff we may consider bad, wrong. Come on, we teach kids about pedophiles and war and terrorism but sex change is off limits?

Last but not least the outrage over those drugs the character takes is absurd. Blocking puberty is not harmful ; stop taking the drugs, puberty comes. It is not a «sex change» drug. It doesn't change you to the other gender. It's just a tool to let a child make up their mind about their gender when they're too young for transitition, while ensuring they don't develop secondary sexual characteristics that may make them depressed/suicidal and have to be removed surgically later. But again, if the boy decides he really is a boy, then he stops the drugs and he goes through male puberty. Where is the horribleness here?

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The video is available on a website only. To watch it, you'd have to go to the website and click play. If you don't want to watch it or you don't want your child watching it, you don't. Not a big deal.

1 hour ago, IreOfDesire said:

I don't care what children watch, but 11 yo taking sex change drugs, like what the fuck?

They aren't sex change drugs at that age, they're drugs to stop the onset of the puberty. The person makes the decision to transition at a later age.

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Oh man, first kids could catch teh gay, now they can catch teh trans just by hearing about it!  Pretty soon everyone will be changing their gender, just like how everyone is gay now!  Then the world will explode!

Jesus Christ.

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1 hour ago, Storm said:

The video is available on a website only. To watch it, you'd have to go to the website and click play. If you don't want to watch it or you don't want your child watching it, you don't. Not a big deal.

They aren't sex change drugs at that age, they're drugs to stop the onset of the puberty. The person makes the decision to transition at a later age.

I'd admit I'm not well informed on the effect of those drugs, but I know one or two things about child psychology. If they work as they say - stopping puberty its likely that way more children would like to use them than just the trans kids. Let's face it puberty is a horrible period and most kids wouldn't want to go through it - hair grows for boys, boob grow for girls, voice modification, mood swings, acne. Also notice children are not keen on the concept of delayed gratification. If you give this as a free option to kids, at least half of them would take the drugs.

And yeah sorry, but I do feel like finishing puberty as soon as you can would be for the best. Imagine a workforce into puberty, yeah let's not do that. Modern civilization has already delayed adulthood way too much for young people. We don't need more man-children and aging princesses.

Edited by IreOfDesire

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1 hour ago, Storm said:

 

They aren't sex change drugs at that age, they're drugs to stop the onset of the puberty. The person makes the decision to transition at a later age.

Yeah, I'm sure that's a harmless thing for an 11 year old child to be taking, and that they are in a fully informed position to make such a decision. Just a little thing like altering your hormones to delay puberty, no big deal.

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