[AJB]

	Originally Posted by Sliderule To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	....... Is there a better way to show that you're in it to win it than simply staying in the game?

Maybe standing up in front of your family, friends, the community and/or your religion and promising them and your significant other that your "in it to win"?

[LionsPride]

The legally binding part is usually easier to uphold legally then the other ways of committing. I'm not saying my commitment is any way linked to that paper, but it allows me legal representation in my spouse's world. For instance, being the incontestable (mental stability aside) next of kin when the doctor asks "do you want us to resuscitate your SO." Now things have come a long way for common law and other relationships, but that little piece of paper is still the benchmark.

[karenk]

	Originally Posted by Sliderule To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	If you truly love a person and want to be with them "forever" then just do it. Is there a better way to show that you're in it to win it than simply staying in the game?

I like ths idea very much.

[ElstonGunn]

	Originally Posted by karenk To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I'm open to the idea of a life-long relationship, but I have no interest in a marriage certificate to legalize a commitment. The license is no guarantee. People can still opt out of the situation. I just wouldn't see the point for myself.

Originally Posted by Sliderule To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Why do you have to marry someone to be in a long term relationship with them anyway? If you care about someone enough and get along with them you'll stay together, if not then you won't. Why complicate things by going through a legal binding ceremony? If you truly love a person and want to be with them "forever" then just do it. Is there a better way to show that you're in it to win it than simply staying in the game?

Some people see it as a symbol of the commitment, which makes it important to them. Some people like the hullabaloo of an engagement and a wedding. Some people see it as a distinct milestone that can be used to measure the relationship. I'm not saying you have to be with one of those people. That would probably be a bad idea for anyone who thinks marriage is stupid. I'm just saying that most people probably don't think about it the same way you (whoever the "you" there is). That doesn't automatically make them wrong or stupid.

All that aside: tax breaks. That's something you get out of a legal marriage. The thing LionsPride was talking about is another good practical advantage. I'm sure there are a lot of little advantages like it:

	Originally Posted by LionsPride To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	For instance, being the incontestable (mental stability aside) next of kin when the doctor asks "do you want us to resuscitate your SO."

[SeaCzar]

I was married once, and I'll not do that again. I agree with Sliderule
Why do you have to marry someone to be in a long term relationship with them anyway? If you care about someone enough and get along with them you'll stay together, if not then you won't.

Why complicate things by going through a legal binding ceremony? If you truly love a person and want to be with them "forever" then just do it. Is there a better way to show that you're in it to win it than simply staying in the game?

It took a lot of time and six figures to get this. I sure as Hell get it now.

[changos]

Originally Posted by SeaCzar To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I was married once, and I'll not do that again. I agree with Sliderule Why do you have to marry someone to be in a long term relationship with them anyway? If you care about someone enough and get along with them you'll stay together, if not then you won't. Why complicate things by going through a legal binding ceremony? If you truly love a person and want to be with them "forever" then just do it. Is there a better way to show that you're in it to win it than simply staying in the game? It took a lot of time and six figures to get this. I sure as Hell get it now.

I guess society gets messed up with the celebrations. People want to make a great deal out of it.Take a look how people dream about the celebration!!!! (of marriage). It seems to me that the act of marriage is more important nowadays than the marriage itself. What I mean (agreeing with you) is... it only takes the agreement between the two of you to stay together, not a big party and additional agreements.

I ended up very confused and "scared" after discussing this with my ex (she is a lawyer, we were going to get married). She got pretty mad but what I said was true and still is: there was a great gain for her if we divorced. WHY? I mean, I have what I have because of my work, not because of her. But our laws state that my house is in trouble if we divorced... (she had no house of her own to this days) so... if everything goes wrong, she gets half a house!!!!

It sucks. People don't respect their word nowadays.

I say, lets celebrate marriages when you reach 10 or 20 years together, not the ceremony.

[Deliberator]

How "useful" marriage is depends on how much your humanity overrides your self-absorption.

[Necrosis]

I've been pondering this myself. My g/f is all for it and I wouldn't say needing but needs support. I on the other hand am completely independant and I don't rely on a mate for anything; its more of a have fun and enjoy company kind of thing. I don't see the rush or need to marry and it's not because I'm afraid of commitment but b/c what's the difference of the state recognizing you as such. On the other hand, she want's it because it makes her feel comfortable with society, gives her support, and finalizes things. It's more of a tradition for her and her family. It really does complicate things, I would get married but only if it was on my time and I felt the person would be with me regardless; then ill take the leap to make them feel comfortable.

[Karamazov]

	Originally Posted by Deliberator To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	How "useful" marriage is depends on how much your humanity overrides your self-absorption.

Elaborate on "self-absorption". Retaining greater autonomy and solitude seem like legitimate reasons. That is, if people here consider marriage somehow to be an entirely self-less enterprise. Some replies to the OP seemed overly sensitive.

[Mau]

	Originally Posted by Deliberator To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	How "useful" marriage is depends on how much your humanity overrides your self-absorption.

Self-absorption? quite a strong way to put it. But how does my "humane" qualities can make a marriage more "useful"? Does that mean that In marriage myself should no longer be a priority to ME?





Mau added to this post, 2 minutes and 36 seconds later...

Originally Posted by srod511 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I've been pondering this myself. My g/f is all for it and I wouldn't say needing but needs support. I on the other hand am completely independant and I don't rely on a mate for anything; its more of a have fun and enjoy company kind of thing. I don't see the rush or need to marry and it's not because I'm afraid of commitment but b/c what's the difference of the state recognizing you as such. On the other hand, she want's it because it makes her feel comfortable with society, gives her support, and finalizes things. It's more of a tradition for her and her family. It really does complicate things, I would get married but only if it was on my time and I felt the person would be with me regardless; then ill take the leap to make them feel comfortable.

How about this analogy:

Why buy a car when you can lease it? (you can get a newer and better car every year!)





Mau added to this post, 1 minutes and 38 seconds later...

Thank you for that KARAMAZOV

[le Duc]

	Originally Posted by Mau To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	How about this analogy: Why buy a car when you can lease it? (you can get a newer and better car every year!)

A car is a depreciating asset. 'Nuff said.

[Mau]

	The divorce rate in America for first marriage, vs second or third marriage 50% percent of first marriages, 67% of second and 74% of third marriages

Very interesting statistics....

[ElstonGunn]

	Originally Posted by srod511 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I on the other hand am completely independant and I don't rely on a mate for anything;

Then why haven't you ditched her? It takes effort to maintain a relationship, doesn't it? Why bother with that if you're completely independent and if you don't need her for anything?

[Ezion]

I believe marraige is the official commitment that you'll stick with each other through thick and thin. Religious reasons aside, getting married (not counting social benefits) can add extra weight that forces you to work out your problems together, because it makes it much more difficult to separate (your friends and family can hold you accountable for your actions).

[ross]

	Originally Posted by Mau To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	3)Marriage sets you back rather than move you forward. (kids & wife will occupy a substantial amoun of time that could be employed to improving yourself)

This strikes me as a dangerously narrow minded thing to believe. You might want to reconsider the scope of your self actualization.

[Sliderule]

	This strikes me as a dangerously narrow minded thing to believe. You might want to reconsider the scope of your self actualization.

How so? A person only has so much time in the world, and if they have a family and want to raise decent kids at the very least this is going to take quite an investment of time, energy, and money. All three of these things could be applied to personal development be it a career, passion, invention, quest for the grail etc..

Now is one wants to improve themselves by becoming a parent/spouse and building a family, more power too them. It's not for me but I can see the appeal of raising a family. I just think that it is ignorant to think that you can have your cake and eat it too. I don't see how, at least in this country, one can spend a lot of time with/on family and not lose something else in the process, be it career, free time, sanity etc.

Getting married and having a kid often monkeys up the work, hence why a lot of men respond to the news of pregnancy with "oh shit". Often this work is at the cost of the individual parent. Which is not a bad thing, the world needs parents, but they should be aware of the responsibility and sacrifices that will inevitably have to be made.

And on a side note why can't you have a ceremony (non legally binding) and simply sign over power of attorney to your loved one?

And yes this poster is heavily biased against marriage my mother was a divorce lawyer for some time.

[Grace]

The things my children gave to me in terms of opportunities for personal growth, especially in respect to my INTJ personality, couldn't possibly have occurred in any other fashion.

I think 'self-absorption' was an apt description of your current mindset, and I thought so from the first statement in your op. I encourage you to look at this closely.

[intj1999]

Marriage is not for everyone. You need to figure out who you are and what you want from life. Sometimes your opinions change as you get older, sometimes they do not. What you want at 20, may not be the same thing that you want at 40. Sometimes you meet someone who you want to be with for the rest of your life, because they enrich your quality of life and help you to achieve your goals. If you do not meet this person, and if your goals can be achieved on your own, then marriage is not for you.

[Tachyons]

Take it from someone who's been married for 18 years, with 2 kids, 2 stepchildren, and now 2 grandkids. It was hard...I mean VERY hard work to get here. If you're not willing to compromise, see the other's point of view, or simply learn "how" to love, don't get involved. Relationships are fascinating things to observe and analyze, especially from the inside. Nothing wrong with being alone, but that is how you'll die...keep that in mind.

[karenk]

	Originally Posted by ElstonGunn To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Then why haven't you ditched her? It takes effort to maintain a relationship, doesn't it? Why bother with that if you're completely independent and if you don't need her for anything?

Sounds like he wants to be with her as opposed to needing her which is its own kind of compliment in a way.





karenk added to this post, 4 minutes and 22 seconds later...

	Originally Posted by Tachyons To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Nothing wrong with being alone, but that is how you'll die...keep that in mind.

So I never understood this statement for a reason to get married. It sounds like fear is the motivation. (I know there could be good reasons, but I don't see this as one.) Most men die before women btw.

[Firebrand]

	Originally Posted by ricearoni To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	That's actually a reason to stay married.

Unless you get a prenup. Donald Trump swears by them. You know someone loves you when they don't care if they get half your money if they were to leave.

[ElstonGunn]

	Originally Posted by karenk To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Sounds like he wants to be with her as opposed to needing her which is its own kind of compliment in a way.

Well nobody needs anybody. Depending on how literal you want to get, sick people don't even need doctors. The worst that can happen in that case is that they'll die slowly and painfully.

As for marriage, no one needs that, either. I've never heard of anyone dying from acute bachelorhood.

	Originally Posted by karenk To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	So I never understood this statement for a reason to get married. (I know there could be good reasons, but I don't see this as one.) It sounds selfish imho. Most men die before women btw.

The dying alone thing, to me, is actually a reason to not get married. I'd hate to have a bunch of people watch me die. That's a somewhat strong argument against getting married, as far as I see it.

[Firebrand]

	Originally Posted by Synamon To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	..compromising when necessary...

Ugh compromising? Maybe on my time but never myself.

[Karamazov]

	Originally Posted by ElstonGunn To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	The dying alone thing, to me, is actually a reason to not get married. I'd hate to have a bunch of people watch me die. That's a somewhat strong argument against getting married, as far as I see it.

Here, here. I'm always struck by family and friend alike, when they balk at my hoping to die alone; not having a group of sentimental people weeping like grandmothers at a wedding. I never cared much for the bromide people served to me, warning me that I'll be all alone in the world.

[Synamon]

	Originally Posted by Firebrand9 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Ugh compromising? Maybe on my time but never myself.

Compromising means finding a balance. Being able to find what works for both of you. It is not about giving up, it is about giving.

From the Merriam-Webster dictionary:
compromising
1 a: to come to agreement by mutual concession b: to find or follow a way between extremes

Extremes are lonely places.