[Shinqui]

Greetings,

I have often come across variations of the following statement when I look into the ramifications of an INTJ personality.

"When under a great deal of stress, the INTJ may become obsessed with mindless repetitive, sensate activities, such as over-drinking. They may also tend to become absorbed with minutia and details that they would not normally consider important to their overall goal." 1

In my experience as an INTJ I have noticed that a great deal of stress is the normal state for extreme introverts thrust into the social moray of society. I have also noticed that turning off my continual analytical thought process is somewhat therapeutic for my overactive mind. However, in my experience, the only activities that provide this type of stress relief or emptying of analytical thought all have negative repercussions. Admittedly I have focused on somewhat easy and enjoyable distractions such as alcohol cigarettes and green.

Lest I appear to revolve around mood altering substances, I should mention another easy and enjoyable thing that has negative repercussions for me. The state of mindless bliss I am able to achieve in a nightclub, dancing by myself for hours straight, soaked in sweat, thoughts driven away by the volume and persistence of the music played has worked quite well in the past. However, tinnitus is a negative effect that I now live with and earplugs reduce the experience to next to useless. Also, the presence of hypersomnia, a symptom of atypical depression, is only exasperated by the shift in sleep/wake times on the weekend. Not to mention that I’m thirty seven now, I imagine that I appear to be looking for my children when I arrive at a nightclub these days.

Since I feel that this type of coping mechanism should be quite familiar to this venue. I am very interested in what types of activities other INTJ's use, particularly ones with positive or neutral consequences and certainly ones that are enjoyable.



1
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[LionsPride]

TV. When everything is 'too much' I watch TV. This is usually followed by my second coping mechanism, sleep.

[publicdonkey]

I AM that quote, and indeed every last letter of the description cited. The very attention to detail that drives me to success in my career also seems to have pushed the envelope of my condition as a supremely functional alcoholic... A condition I am trying to recover from... it takes a LOT of will if one is unable to hit any "rock bottom" or suffer external consequences. That said... What is my path to deal with the realities of who I am?

Mindfulness meditation. I was introduced to this by way of Jon Kabot-Zinn's work, whose acclaimed program at the University of Massachusetts Medical School is little-to-nothing short of true Buddhist meditation practice.

Kabot-Zinn is a name that really, really deserves to be more widely known. His program is ZERO new-age and based in the Western intellectual and medical model. I would have derisively dismissed Buddhist thought prior to introduction to his program.

That said, I now attend meditation practice at a local Buddhist monastery. At my first visit, when the Abbott stated without equivocation that the Buddha was not a god, my desire was vindicated to follow this path as a tool for psychological development rather than any new-agey spiritual enlightenment.

As far as I'm concerned, Gotama Siddhartha, AKA the Buddha, was more or less the Einstein of psychology, who happened to be born a few thousand year ago.

I don't seek any new-age spirituality, don't believe in reincarnation (if only other belief systems could take metaphors as metaphors so readily!), and don't ask you to read this post and think much other than, "whoa, this guy's whack!"

If the OP and other readers can appreciate that it's not a "flip" post, but is one written with thoughtfulness, then I haven't wasted keystrokes...
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[Seppuku Savant]

Exercise, healthy eating, and sleep. They all work to keep an individual balanced when used consistently over time. When I'm stressed, I do vigorous exercise.

[Fanowene]

When I am stressed I do tend to find even more things I could do, things that wouldn't have to be done (like reorganizing my desk, cleaning my room, cleaning my aquarium, doing nails, etc.). It could maybe be called procrastination, but it's productive procrastination.

I too am discovering that hanging out with friends and having a great time (even though that eats up some or even a lot of time) makes me happier and more productive overall. To make sure I stay happy and motivated (and thus more productive) I have to make sure to do at least some activities I really enjoy (but not too much; I don't want to loose too much sleep time).

But I also have to make sure I get enough sleep so my brain functions at an acceptable level (though I can go a night or two on very little sleep, depending on how motivated I am), and I definitely need time to think. When I'm under stress (and get little sleep for a couple nights in a row), I normally fall right asleep as I hit the bed, which means the normal falling-asleep-time-thinking doesn't happen. I need time to figure out everything that's been happening around me. Or else my brain just gets even more clouded up. An hour of just lying around (I normally can't take naps during the day, so there's no big danger of me falling asleep) will often do the trick. I normally set an alarm, though, if I know I have to get back up at a certain time. That way I don't have to check my watch until it's actually time to go.

Oh, and I keep track of everything I should be doing (mentally, but I also have a planner), then eliminate all the items off of that list that don't have to be done by the next day, so I again can free up some of my brain for other thought processes. Forgetting/ignoring things that lie to far in the future helps calm me down, make me feel like I'm in control of my situation. If there's something big coming up, though, I might do some of the work ahead of time.

[schwartzie]

For stress management, cigarette smoking and really really loud electrocore are perfectly interchangeable. except for less cancer with the music.

[fearlessphoenix]

Sleep and mindless web surfing

[Grace]

I love to sing, especially singing with others, and ESPECIALLY if the music is really challenging. It is very consuming of one's entire attention! I am in a choir, to that end. I also walk alot when under stress. If I'm angry, the whole house gets a good scrubbing, and the rugs get literally beaten! If the weather is too nasty for a good long walk, then I will throw myself into a good novel, something really engaging. All these things are better if I make a list of things to do accompanied by a schedule for accomplishing them. Before I go to bed, I like to drink tension tamer tea. For me, it works as well as a glass of brandy.
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[Shinqui]

Many thanks to those who have responded to this thread or messaged me. There has been a wealth of information so far, and it has given me much to think on.

Anyone else want to throw their two cents in?

[rara avis]

Smoking, reading light fiction to the point where I've sometimes wondered about a 12-step program for it, and sleeping. I quit smoking for a couple months recently- knew it would be difficult, was not prepared for it to be so ...upsetting? Love the sleeping and the fiction. I do not recommend smoking.

Might be nice if just one of my coping mechanisms was productive or impressive in any way.

I did have a really hard time a while back, when I short-circuited after many years of taking Ritalin, Dexedrine, Adderall, and various antidepressants. Itchy compulsive actions, and whatnot... I used to do my eyeliner over and over. And over.

I also felt good at the time cutting tiny pictures and letters out of magazines with cuticle scissors. Years later, I now have several kind of cool boxes of intricately cut out little icons- (sorted alphabetically and by subject, thank you). It'd make for a good object lesson if anyone ever needed to understand just how far off the rails I was back then.

[Algol]

Doing some competitive activity with one or several friends is one of my favorite ways to deal with stress. Since I am INTJ, however, and have few that I call friends, I sometimes have to deal with it in other ways, like the ones that have been suggested above.

[Kisai]

Any sort of "get away from everything" activity is great: a long drive, meditation, walking.

If I'm generally stressed, I like to go to a nice eatery and read comics.

[Olympics2010]

Good question, I was actually wondering about the very quote that you point out in your discussion myself.

I think that I wondered about the quote because I think that in order for it to be true, it first needs to be clarified what we mean by "stressful situations".

As such, my response to the quote has to do mainly with clarifying the notion of a "stressful situation".

In order to respond to the quote, and to arrive at possibilities of handling stress in more constructive ways, especially given that we are INTJs, I want to discuss the notion of stress.

The way I see it, a human being that functions normally - for instance, a human being that is able to have normal brain/mental functions - will probably be able to handle stress a lot better than a human being that has less healthy control over some aspect in their lives, such as their mental functioning, which is probably intertwined with other functions, such as bodily functions, etc. Those who are relatively healthy/normal human beings are able to handle a lot more before they get stressed, and when they do get stressed, they are able to cope with their stress such that they don't have to resort to mindless activities. Perhaps one healthy way that a healthy individual can cope with stress is to just relax, and do nothing about the situation that would cause more stress. In other words, the idea is to do some real tough, smart work with the situations that make us stressed, so that we can push our coping boundary and be able to at least handle those situations better, if not make them completely unstressful. I think that in this way stress is telling us that we've arrived at a boundary within ourselves that ensures that we remain healthy and not pass it, and so to try to overcome stress seems like a wrong-headed approach. We must respect the boundary, but also try to work with it, so that we don't run away from it. And who know what we will discover about it when challenging it. Perhaps it is just a useless boundary that we have created for ourselves in order to feel safe of exploring ourselves further, and living out our lives as they are truly meant to be lives, which is in the best way possible. I think that it is wise to remain healthy and be able to handle stressful situations better by respecting when the body tells us that we are stressed, and at the point in which we feel stressed, to take a step backwards, not forwards, for instance, while doing the work of acknowledging all about the stressful situation. Because then we start moving in the wrong direction, such as compromising output for a whole lot of wasted input energy, which is exactly what mindless repetitive tasks IS. This is when an INTJ chooses to react to the stressful situation, instead of dealing with it in a normal way. There is healthy stress, which has less of an impact on us, the kind of stress that we'd expect in our normal, natural lives, and then there is the unhealthy stress, which is not part of a normal life style. Unhealthy stress tells us that we cannot work much, when we should be working smarter to be able to handle a lot more in life, and also to make healthy stress a more natural part of life.

If we work too much, keep getting stressed, for not much pay off, then we are not really working properly, and thus, we are not leading our lives the way we deserve. The point is to work smarter, not harder. Working harder just to get more stressed is probably just our unwillingness, or procrastination, about doing the real work that is required to lead healthy/normal lives. Ironically, we have to go back and do more work in order to learn how not to become stressed, because only working smarter will allow us to avoid getting stressed to easily, or prevent us from handling stress in the right way. Not only that, but by working harder the smarter way, we will be able to do a lot more, with a lot less, and so we will be less stressed, which is good for us INTJs, since we value efficiency, in killing as many birds as possible, with as little rocks as possible, as they say. Plus this mechanism for finding new amazing solutions, and seeing any one situation from many points of views, is inherenly built into the INTJs way of thinking. So, I suggest to try it.

I guess my answer, ironically, is that the answer to relieving stress is to work harder the smarter way, in order to find workable solutions to stress. Us INTJ's love to work, we love solving intellectual challenges, and it is said wisely that work keeps us happy in life no matter who we are, so this is a good investment. My theory about becoming more healthier of a human being in life is that we can use our behavior to influence our thoughts, or our thoughts to influence our behavior (a feed-back loop that will soon seem natural to you), not to mention that our behavior and our thoughts have a feedback on our emotions, and our physical well being. So an INTJ needs to channel their energies to their minds, and then their behavior, and really work hard to manage themselves. From there, their whole existence will take on a much more productive, healthy, enjoyable lifestyle, involving a whole lot of efficient work (since I believe that INTJs work all the time anyway, work is a part of life anyway that we cannot avoid, since this is the way that we are designed, especially INTJs, for our minds to constantly work, so we must constantly rely on our minds to help us to survive), and the ability to maintain a less stressed state constantly throughout, enjoying just working, and having the ability to exercize the mind to relax too. The catch is that even relaxation takes a bit of effort. The idea to resolving unhealthy responses to unhealthy stress situations is to work harder to monitor those responses; the idea is to work harder the smarter way in order to be able to handle a whole lot more, with a lot less stress. All the goodness grows from there as much as possible without leading to more unhealthy stress experiences, such as the ability of living comfortably with ourselves in any situation that we may find ourselves in, from moment to moment, and the ability to detach ourselves when we sleep also. In this way, INTJs will not resort to mindless stuff when they are stressed, because they are more experienced at being able to handle the stressful situations. And don't worry, what feels like tough, worth-while work the first time around, will get easier, and more enjoyable soon enough. And soon we'll figure out how to make the process of recovery towards better roads of life both inside ourselves, and outside ourselves with little problem.

Good luck with this.

[Bioplasmoid]

Im pretty stunned how many smokers there are here. So I guess I may as well throw my ashtray in the air, and admit that I too share the 'habit'. Like others there are many ways I flick the switch. Loud Music,Alcohol,Mindless Television,Overeating,Sex,Long Hot Showers, are all handy to turn the mind off for a period of time. I don't think sleep counts so much as I have plenty of intense dreams, or at least have been lately. Dreamless deep sleep on the other hand is fantastic, the next morning!

It seems I am becoming addicted to herbal teas of the sleep inducing variety, except i use them just to unwind, and feel refreshed. At least they are legal, for now!

[Shinqui]

	Originally Posted by PurpleFnords To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Im pretty stunned how many smokers there are here. So I guess I may as well throw my ashtray in the air, and admit that I too share the 'habit'.

It was very freeing to realize that being intelligent enough to comprehend the negative effects of smoking and drinking, but still doing so, was actually a fairly common INTJ trait.

All hail the Internet!

[Seraph]

Originally Posted by Grace To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I love to sing, especially singing with others, and ESPECIALLY if the music is really challenging. It is very consuming of one's entire attention! I am in a choir, to that end. I also walk alot when under stress. If I'm angry, the whole house gets a good scrubbing, and the rugs get literally beaten! If the weather is too nasty for a good long walk, then I will throw myself into a good novel, something really engaging. All these things are better if I make a list of things to do accompanied by a schedule for accomplishing them. Before I go to bed, I like to drink tension tamer tea. For me, it works as well as a glass of brandy. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I also love to sing when I'm unduly worried or stressing over something. I've found the most helpful songs are the very lighthearted ones that you can belt out with your friends- anything to lighten the atmosphere, elicit inordinate amounts of laughter, or just to take your mind off of whatever is bothering you.

Another major technique I utilize to cope with stress is through *surprise* analyzing the situation even more. By this I mean that I try to identify what exactly has me so stressed out, and if it is obvious then this process works wonders; if not, then see below. Once I can identify what has my stress level so high I then take a massive leap backwards and let it go. It is a nice feeling to put something in perspective and realize that life will (hopefully) go on.

If I feel too overwhelmed by some force that I can't identify or deal with then I typically would read the Bible or even better, talk for a while with my minister. This doesn't have to be a religious figure at all, and could just be a trusted friend willing to listen.

[NephilimAzrael]

Talking to schizophrenics in the clinic, at any time in my career has been a wonder.. At alone time, I retract to smoking, reading and listening to music.