[curiousgeorge01]

Originally Posted by SelfMadeBum To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I never once denied that men bear effects of abortion or denying their child. Never once. I merely stated the experience of each party cannot be equal and no law can combat that. Therefore the idea that allowing men to completely walk away from pregnancies they had equal part in creating doesn't equalise anything. ( Show Spoiler ) What are these orange flags at the beginning of each post? To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Right but b/c of biology, rules are in favor of women, which gives them the upper hand.

[SelfMadeBum]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Right but b/c of biology, rules are in favor of women, which gives them the upper hand.

So you are afraid that women will win at the game of life?

Is that it?

Is life just a competition between the blue team and the pink team to you?

[curiousgeorge01]

	Originally Posted by SelfMadeBum To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	So you are afraid that women will win at the game of life? Is that it? Is life just a competition between the blue team and the pink team to you? In any case, because of biology, women bear the greater burden regarding the creation and sustenance of a fetus.

No, I'm seeking acknowledgement that anyway you spin this, one of the sexes is going to suffer so it was never fair to begin with.. So the fact that Feminists keep saying they're seeking parity is bull. It's to get the same as men and to keep enjoying what they have now. And maybe get a little more if they can.

Yes, but which they have the choice of cancelling.

[Saggita]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Right but b/c of biology, rules are in favor of women, which gives them the upper hand.

Poor little men who don't have to carry a pregnancy around -- that could be fatal -- for nine months...

This thread is ridiculous from the last few pages. If I start, I'm not going to stop. Just chiming in to point out the irony of women considered to have the upper hand in a case where men are attributed consequences for something that is equally their responsibility. That is equality, not opression.

Or is the male privilege of feeling entitled to blame it on the women and walk away being kicked in the balls.

[curiousgeorge01]

Originally Posted by Saggita To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Poor little men who don't have to carry a pregnancy around -- that could be fatal -- for nine months... This thread is ridiculous from the last few pages. If I start, I'm not going to stop. Just chiming in to point out the irony of women considered to have the upper hand in a case where men are attributed consequences for something that is equally their responsibility. That is equality, not opression. Or is the male privilege of feeling entitled to blame it on the women and walk away being kicked in the balls.

You really want to make it equal? Get your tubes tied until you want a baby since you're afraid it may endanger your life. Putting a law in someone's favor is not equality.

[Saggita]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	You really want to make it equal? Get your tubes tied until you want a baby since you're afraid it may endanger your life. Putting a law in someone's favor is not equality.

Why you don't get your tubes tied until you want a baby?

Of course that pregnancies are just caused by women walking around without their tubes tied, and they accidentally impregnate themselves, and the men have no responsibility on that. Silly me.

[SelfMadeBum]

	Originally Posted by Clueless To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	It's interesting though that you have no issue with women walking away from pregnancies they had an equal part in creating. Are you oblivious to this double-standard?

Pardon?

Having an abortion is not "walking away" in the same way that men can. She can't just walk away, she has to deal with it. This is my entire point. In the case where the child is born, I won't support the right of either the woman or the man to be completely free of it. Financial support is the minimum expectation of any parent.

All I am denying is the pervasive mindset that somehow when a woman has an abortion that she gets off scot-free, therefore the man should be able to as well. This is far from the reality.

[curiousgeorge01]

	Originally Posted by Saggita To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Why you don't get your tubes tied until you want a baby? Of course that pregnancies are just caused by women walking around without their tubes tied, and they accidentally impregnate themselves, and the men have no responsibility on that. Silly me.

Because like you said it's YOUR life in danger. You don't want to endanger your life? Tie your tubes, otherwise you take the risk. That's making it equal. Men can't have babies, when you're tied then women can't either.

[Saggita]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Because like you said it's YOUR life in danger. You don't want to endanger your life? Tie your tubes, otherwise you take the risk. That's making it equal, men and women then can't have babies.

So how is biology putting women in the upper hand again?

[SelfMadeBum]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Because like you said it's YOUR life in danger. You don't want to endanger your life? Tie your tubes, otherwise you take the risk. That's making it equal, men can't have babies? When you're tied then women can't either.

Don't want children? Get a vasectomy until you do.

Ridiculous suggestion is ridiculous.

[Saggita]

	Originally Posted by SelfMadeBum To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Don't want children? Get a vasectomy until you do. Ridiculous suggestion is ridiculous.

The worst of it is that this was the same guy saying women have the upper hand. How come having to handle all the consequences from an act with two people is having the upper hand?

Double standards are double.

[curiousgeorge01]

	Originally Posted by Saggita To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	So how is biology putting women in the upper hand again?

Because you have the law in your favor.

It's hypocritical how Feminists keep talking about equality while using their biology to get the upper hand legally. The fact that biology separates man and woman makes it unfair in the first place. Instead of saying it's equality they should say it as doing a favor or an accommodation. Equality has the the underlying meaning of entitled.

---------- Post added 06-14-2012 at 02:49 PM ----------

	Originally Posted by SelfMadeBum To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Don't want children? Get a vasectomy until you do. Ridiculous suggestion is ridiculous.

No that doesn't work b/c to equalize we need to make women into men. So the equal thing to do would be to take out the womb or to sterilize them to prevent actual birth.

[Zephyranthes]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Because like you said it's YOUR life in danger. You don't want to endanger your life? Tie your tubes, otherwise you take the risk. That's making it equal. Men can't have babies, when you're tied then women can't either.

Don't want to endanger your bank account from getting a girl pregnant? Don't have sex with her, otherwise you take the risk. That's making it equal.

[curiousgeorge01]

	Originally Posted by Zephyranthes To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Don't want to endanger your bank account from getting a girl pregnant? Don't have sex with her, otherwise you take the risk. That's making it equal.

Yes you're right. While we're at it, nobody should have sex then. See how ridiculous equality sounds?

[vampyroteuthis]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Because you have the law in your favor. It's hypocritical how Feminists keep talking about equality while using their biology to get the upper hand legally. The fact that biology separates man and woman makes it unfair in the first place. Instead of saying it's equality they should say it as doing a favor or an accommodation.

To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

	Equality has the the underlying meaning of entitled.

Exact opposite, actually.

[Zephyranthes]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	No that doesn't work b/c to equalize we need to make women into men. So the equal thing to do would be to take out the womb or to sterilize them to prevent actual birth.

So to make women "equal", they would have to become men. So men are above women, have more rights and freedom than men, and men should be in control of things below them. This really shows your perspective.

[Arcanist]

The best thing would be to make both parties sign some sort of standardized contract before initiating a physical relationship. THAT would be fair. No emotions getting in the way.

Don't want to sign? Have sex at your own risk.

[curiousgeorge01]

	Originally Posted by Zephyranthes To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	So to make women "equal", they would have to become men. So men are above women, have more rights and freedom than men, and men should be in control of things below them. This really shows your perspective.

It doesn't show anything. It's empowering women to make the same choices as men b/c they became close to one.

[Saggita]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Yes you're right. While we're at it, nobody should have sex then. See how ridiculous equality sounds?

This is fun. You think women should handle the pregnancy and they shouldn't have to have the law in their favor to atribute at least the finantial consequence of it into the men. Men can walk free, women is pregnant and needs to spend a lot of money to keep that pregnancy healthy.

You seem to be missing that we all should handle the consequences of what we do, and that sex that ends in pregnancy are made by, necessarily, two people. How is it ridiculous to atribute some consequences to the male counterpart for what happened?

Is there a new concept of ridiculous am I not aware of?

[Zephyranthes]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	It doesn't show anything. It's empowering women to make the same choices as men.

So women are below men, and some sort of... movement to give them equal rights and opportunities and choices as men, who already have these rights, as an equal member of society would be a good idea?

[Saggita]

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	It doesn't show anything. It's empowering women to make the same choices as men b/c they became close to one.

You just confirmed what Zep said.

[Clueless]

Originally Posted by SelfMadeBum To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Pardon? Having an abortion is not "walking away" in the same way that men can. She can't just walk away, she has to deal with it. This is my entire point. In the case where the child is born, I won't support the right of either the woman or the man to be completely free of it. Financial support is the minimum expectation of any parent. All I am denying is the pervasive mindset that somehow when a woman has an abortion that she gets off scot-free, therefore the man should be able to as well. This is far from the reality.

What I'm denying is that either party can get off "scot-free". To paint either gender with the broad brush by insinuating that there is no underlying guilt, shame, etc is belittling to the character regardless of which direction such opinions are aimed.

It is equally wrong in my view to try and gloss over the fact that biology prevents a truly "fair" solution to the problem of unplanned pregnancy. By affording women the right to choose society necessarily pigeonholes the male involved into accepting the "stereotypical traditional role" of provider, without his expressed consent or at minimum without him having the same opportunity for reconsideration as such a choice provides the female.

I'm not against it, there's no better way to do it. But I'm in favor of calling it like it is.

[curiousgeorge01]

Originally Posted by Saggita To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

This is fun. You think women should handle the pregnancy and they shouldn't have to have the law in their favor to atribute at least the finantial consequence of it into the men. Men can walk free, women is pregnant and needs to spend a lot of money to keep that pregnancy healthy. You seem to be missing that we all should handle the consequences of what we do, and that sex that ends in pregnancy are made by, necessarily, two people. How is it ridiculous to atribute some consequences to the male counterpart for what happened? Is there a new concept of ridiculous am I not aware of?

Yes two people make the baby but when the baby is actually formed it's at the sole discretion of the woman of what to do with it. So fair would be for the baby not to be formed at all hence either no sex or women become actually like a man so they never have that burden.

---------- Post added 06-14-2012 at 02:59 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Clueless To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

What I'm denying is that either party can get off "scot-free". To paint either gender with the broad brush by insinuating that there is no underlying guilt, shame, etc is belittling to the character regardless of which direction such opinions are aimed. It is equally wrong in my view to try and gloss over the fact that biology prevents a truly "fair" solution to the problem of unplanned pregnancy. By affording women the right to choose society necessarily pigeonholes the male involved into accepting the "stereotypical traditional role" of provider, without his expressed consent or at minimum without him having the same opportunity for reconsideration as such a choice provides the female. I'm not against it, there's no better way to do it. But I'm in favor of calling it like it is.

Yes my problem is with the wording. It's not equality so stop calling it that.

[SelfMadeBum]

Curiousgeorge is going from absurd to absurder. He stopped making sense quite a few posts back.

[Saggita]

I think this is what happens if you try to get logical with a MRA or something. I said it once that I have nothing against masculinism, but some people take it in the wrong way.