[Project 2501]

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[pottersjar]

George Carlin became an increasingly humorless, bitter, whiny, leftist, anti-capitalist, conspiracy freak. Your post is just one example of it. Of course there are selfish opportunists in capitalism. There are selfish opportunists in EVERY economic system. But the idea that the failure of education is corrupted capitalism is hypocritical and sophomoric. The failure of education is that capitalistic principles of competition to achieve a better product or service is the one thing that the NONcapitalists have forced out of our education system. There is nothing capitalistic about a system of union lords controlling who gets to teach and what is taught and how it is taught. Private schools STILL produce a better product because they COMPETE in a system of parental choice. You will see private schools trying to do a better job educating so they can lure more kids (bringing more capital), and both sides are happy - the parents who are willing to pay for their kids to get a better education and those who are willing to provide it for a profit. You want to improve education? Two things are lacking now: BAD PARENTS who do not involve themselves in educating their own children and NO CHOICE for poor and middle class kids who cannot afford to get out of the failing socialistic and ineffective education of the masses we call public school. Want to improve our education? Let POOR and MIDDLE CLASS kids' parents CHOOSE where their kids go to school by a voucher system; then those (supposedly evil) capitalistic private schools (the ones that produce the best education) will have a motive to expand into the neighborhoods that need their services the most.

Carlin has is exactly backwards; he is right that cronyism infects capitalism, but he is wrong the capitalism is the problem with education - cronyism is cheating in capitalism, but he has no evidence that capitalists want people to stay poor. Quite the opposite; the more wealth the masses have to spend, the better capitalism works. Capitalism does best when the people are doing best; socialism on the other hand thrives when the masses are suffering and looking anywhere, even to government, to feed them and care for them.

[Distance]

A lot of the net product of what he states is true. It's the conspiracy theory process and ascribing of intent that's quite frankly, fucked in the head.

• Business cares about profit.
• The top tier feel they're entitled to a larger piece of that profit so they take it since they run the businesses.
• Business is competitive so they try to limit their competition, hence a form of cronyism.
• Education is a business. They look to volume processing so the subset of individuals who aren't self-learners, who don't fit the mold for generic learning get marginalised and left behind.
• Business then looks at the clones that get cranked out and selects the "best" ones whereby "best" is defined by their subjective beliefs of what "objective" standards should be and that's based on educational degrees and how well the individual will fit into their corporate environment. Bear in mind that business believes that time is money so they're looking for the easiest and most efficient way to select employees of which degrees, elitism of institution and trusted friends (known entities) are a few ways.

So instead of getting into the conspiracy theory aspects of deliberate intent to marginalise, look to greed and profit where the government tries to limit self-interest through the progressive taxation system. The only problem is that progressive taxation doesn't help people who are being left behind since it doesn't help their ability to be self-sufficient. Instead it can make them more dependent on government hand-outs which can be detrimental to human psyches in that they believe themselves to be failures and outcasts.

And anyways, say the educational system is improved. What good is improvement when jobs have been outsourced, whereby it's an employers' market?

So the fix is four-fold. Get those jobs back into the country, limit global conglomerate corporate power by supporting small to medium businesses who provide fair wages to citizens/residents while dissuading outsourcing through taxation, crank up the top tier progressive taxation rates and improve on the educational system.

Oh and before I forget, find a way to ensure "too big to fail" doesn't happen again within the financial sector.

I could rant on and on about this but it's now tl;dr. That is all.

[WeAreAllKosh]

Originally Posted by pottersjar To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

George Carlin became an increasingly humorless, bitter, whiny, leftist, anti-capitalist, conspiracy freak. Your post is just one example of it. Of course there are selfish opportunists in capitalism. There are selfish opportunists in EVERY economic system. But the idea that the failure of education is corrupted capitalism is hypocritical and sophomoric. The failure of education is that capitalistic principles of competition to achieve a better product or service is the one thing that the NONcapitalists have forced out of our education system. There is nothing capitalistic about a system of union lords controlling who gets to teach and what is taught and how it is taught. Private schools STILL produce a better product because they COMPETE in a system of parental choice. You will see private schools trying to do a better job educating so they can lure more kids (bringing more capital), and both sides are happy - the parents who are willing to pay for their kids to get a better education and those who are willing to provide it for a profit. You want to improve education? Two things are lacking now: BAD PARENTS who do not involve themselves in educating their own children and NO CHOICE for poor and middle class kids who cannot afford to get out of the failing socialistic and ineffective education of the masses we call public school. Want to improve our education? Let POOR and MIDDLE CLASS kids' parents CHOOSE where their kids go to school by a voucher system; then those (supposedly evil) capitalistic private schools (the ones that produce the best education) will have a motive to expand into the neighborhoods that need their services the most. Carlin has is exactly backwards; he is right that cronyism infects capitalism, but he is wrong the capitalism is the problem with education - cronyism is cheating in capitalism, but he has no evidence that capitalists want people to stay poor. Quite the opposite; the more wealth the masses have to spend, the better capitalism works. Capitalism does best when the people are doing best; socialism on the other hand thrives when the masses are suffering and looking anywhere, even to government, to feed them and care for them.

Don't forget about supply-side economics. You want more supply-side economic policies, like tax cuts, enacted... right?

[Bobsama]

	Originally Posted by WeAreAllKosh To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Don't forget about supply-side economics. You want more supply-side economic policies, like tax cuts, enacted... right?

I love tax cuts--I just don't love subsidiaries or mandates.

[Vulture]

agree with video... except instead of a "conspiracy," it's the natural way that large complex societies have operated... since the fucking Egyptians...

i'm still a bit split on the idea if those "in the club" are consciously trying to "own" everyone not in the club, but honestly, historically, i think it's a fairly safe bet to say they are.

so then... is the "conspiracy" something that has gone on since the beginning of time, or is it really just a natural way us humans are wired to operate?

[Blunderbus]

Originally Posted by Vulture To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

agree with video... except instead of a "conspiracy," it's the natural way that large complex societies have operated... since the fucking Egyptians... i'm still a bit split on the idea if those "in the club" are consciously trying to "own" everyone not in the club, but honestly, historically, i think it's a fairly safe bet to say they are. so then... is the "conspiracy" something that has gone on since the beginning of time, or is it really just a natural way us humans are wired to operate?

I agree. And that's why it's so difficult to focus one's frustration! It's not a conspiracy per se. There ain't a boardroom of 20 international head honchos calling the shots... No, the system has evolved to work this way.... People who say the system is broke are wrong, because the system works! This sounds counter-intuitive, but look who funds re-election campaigns and who benefits by our congressmen being able to invest in the laws they write. It is neo-feudalism and people who blame the poor for their not being able to advance are missing the point. They are not meant to advance. Blame anyone you like, but no one in power (republican or democrat) really wants the poor to be empowered.

It has almost always been that way, it seems.

[benr3600]

Electing Ron Paul would be a huge step towards eradicating the corruption


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They will be on him hot and heavy, 15.5 hours until we find out the truth

[Paul Siraisi]

I love that guy, but he's wrong this time: A dumber population produces fewer owners.

[Project 2501]

I think the jist of what he says passes the reality litmus test here.

1. Money buys policy.

2. Our elected officials are puppets controlled by the highest bidder. It doesn't matter who we elect nothing will change until we can out-lobby (read out-bribe) our elected officials to change policy in favor of our interests.

3. All our media is controlled by a few major companies.

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4. SOPA is the latest bit of legislation bought and paid for by big media, and the MPAA, and RIAA to stop the free flow of information on the Internet. If passed in addition to protecting their interests, it will allow the DOJ to stop us from accessing websites like wikileaks and other sources of information they disprove of.


5. Americans ARE kept stupid, although this may be purely a culture phenomenon and not a conspiracy.

Healthy food is more expensive than junk food, compare a pound of Twinkies vs a pound of carrots (this is mostly due to subsidies). We load up our children mouths with mercury based fillings which have been proven absolutely to leak and contaminate the human body causing kidney and brain damage among other things.
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There are numerous other products which will be ingested or otherwise enter the human body that we purposefully add mercury to, or is contaminated with levels of mercury known to be unsafe. We fluoridate our water supply, and treat our beds, pillows, and other furniture with neurotoxic chemicals like brominated flame retardants. We feed our chickens arsenic containing compounds (roxarsone) which accumulates in their meat. We spray our crops with chemicals known to be neurotoxic and are exposed to many other sources as well.

We actively discourage kids from being intelligent, America has become an anti-intellectual society. If you show your intelligence and are unwilling to lift weights and fight you will be bullied over it in American high schools. Nerds and geeks are looked down on, in comparison to football jocks and athletes. Look at the salaries they pay pro athletes vs our nations top scientists. We are constantly distracted by day time reality tv which is anything but, and have little interest in anything beyond our immediate and personal environments.

As far as I am concerned we are living in an Idiocracy.

[Dru]

	Originally Posted by Paul Siraisi To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I love that guy, but he's wrong this time: A dumber population produces fewer owners.

surely that's the point. why would you want all that pesky competition? there's a reason pyramids get narrower toward the top.

[Project 2501]

Maybe that's why they are called the 1%
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[TigerDak]

He starts out saying how dumb education is. Then he says corporations don't want educated people who can think critically.

[Project 2501]

If we wanted to fix education and make it affordable for even the poorest Americans, we could do so easily.

Have the department of education create standardized testing for each and every major high-school and college class much like (CLEP), then take a Hollywood budget and the best, most passionate, and lucid teachers in each field and have them create documentary style classes on DVD that can keep the student entertained and inspired while learning. Do that for every single possible class, and keep it updated and refreshed as need be. Create self study guides to go along with the DVD, and let students go to testing centers to test out of the class, let them do an entire university education like that.

I do realize that some things like art, music and science labs cannot be done in this manner, BUT for the majority of classes they could be, and it would be an affordable option for even the poorest people.

There really is no reason for our brick and mortar education institutions to exist even.

Most of the teachers I've had in my life have been mediocre at best.

Mass production has given us affordable personal computers, and automobiles, and most other products we use, and it's reduced their cost greatly.

Education is so expensive because you have so much unnecessary waste, the entire industry is obsolete.

There is no reason to pay thousands of teachers nationally to perform the same function a dvd, software, a self study guide and a standardized test could provide.

Absolutely none.

Originally Posted by pottersjar To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

George Carlin became an increasingly humorless, bitter, whiny, leftist, anti-capitalist, conspiracy freak. Your post is just one example of it. Of course there are selfish opportunists in capitalism. There are selfish opportunists in EVERY economic system. But the idea that the failure of education is corrupted capitalism is hypocritical and sophomoric. The failure of education is that capitalistic principles of competition to achieve a better product or service is the one thing that the NONcapitalists have forced out of our education system. There is nothing capitalistic about a system of union lords controlling who gets to teach and what is taught and how it is taught. Private schools STILL produce a better product because they COMPETE in a system of parental choice. You will see private schools trying to do a better job educating so they can lure more kids (bringing more capital), and both sides are happy - the parents who are willing to pay for their kids to get a better education and those who are willing to provide it for a profit. You want to improve education? Two things are lacking now: BAD PARENTS who do not involve themselves in educating their own children and NO CHOICE for poor and middle class kids who cannot afford to get out of the failing socialistic and ineffective education of the masses we call public school. Want to improve our education? Let POOR and MIDDLE CLASS kids' parents CHOOSE where their kids go to school by a voucher system; then those (supposedly evil) capitalistic private schools (the ones that produce the best education) will have a motive to expand into the neighborhoods that need their services the most. Carlin has is exactly backwards; he is right that cronyism infects capitalism, but he is wrong the capitalism is the problem with education - cronyism is cheating in capitalism, but he has no evidence that capitalists want people to stay poor. Quite the opposite; the more wealth the masses have to spend, the better capitalism works. Capitalism does best when the people are doing best; socialism on the other hand thrives when the masses are suffering and looking anywhere, even to government, to feed them and care for them.

---------- Post added 01-09-2012 at 03:02 PM ----------

	Originally Posted by TigerDak To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	He starts out saying how dumb education is. Then he says corporations don't want educated people who can think critically.

The education system is dumb, its obsolete and highly inefficient and needs to be replaced with a better model.

The truth of the matter is being educated doesn't mean you can think critically, or that you are intelligent. I've seen plenty of people with degrees in how to jerk of a bull that are still just as stupid as the day they started college.

It's a GIGO system, garbage in garbage out.

Those in power want sheep that will follow, not critical thinkers that will question, and certainly not people with the balls to say something about it.

[Tristan]

Originally Posted by Project 2501 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

1. Money buys policy. 2. Our elected officials are puppets controlled by the highest bidder. It doesn't matter who we elect nothing will change until we can out-lobby (read out-bribe) our elected officials to change policy in favor of our interests. 3. All our media is controlled by a few major companies. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. 4. SOPA is the latest bit of legislation bought and paid for by big media, and the MPAA, and RIAA to stop the free flow of information on the internet. If passed in addition to protecting their interests, it will allow the DOJ to stop us from accessing websites like wikileaks and other sources of information they disprove of. 5. Americans ARE kept stupid, although this may be purely a culture phenomenon and not a conspiracy. Healthy food is more expensive than junk food, compare a pound of Twinkies vs a pound of carrots. We load up our children mouths with mercury based fillings which have been proven absolutely to leak and contaminate the human body causing kidney and brain damage among other things. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. There are numerous other products which will be ingested or otherwise enter the human body that we purposefully add mercury to, or is contaminated with levels of mercury known to be unsafe. We fluoridate our water supply, and treat our beds, pillows, and other furniture with neurotoxic chemicals like brominated flame retardants. We spray our crops with chemicals known to be neurotoxic and are exposed to many other sources as well. We actively discourage kids from being intelligent, America has become an anti-intellectual society. If you show your intelligence and are unwilling to lift weights and fight you will be bullied over it in American high schools. Nerds and geeks are looked down on, in comparison to football jocks and athletes. Look at the salaries they pay pro athletes vs our nations top scientists. We are constantly distracted by day time reality tv which is anything but, and have little interest in anything beyond our immediate and personal environments. As far as I am concerned we are living in an Idiocracy.

These youtube link threads are annoying nearly to the point of being
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material. I appreciate that you eventually wrote something. This post should have been the OP. I didn't watch the video.

As to the substance of your complaints, though, I have my own counsel on who the idiots are and why they are so. If most Americans want the government to manage large amounts of money (
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), then of course they will find themselves governed by money. Money will write the policies, money will determine the elections, and money will serve in the Constitution's stead as the very architecture for governance. People will vote based on who promises them more money. Corporations will lobby and pay protection money. My take: money doesn't corrupt people. Corrupt people corrupt money. People who don't want to trade value-for-value and instead want to just see it forcibly shoved their way— and thus violate the underlying principle of money— they're the pillar of Idiocracy.

[Project 2501]

	Originally Posted by Tristan To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	These youtube link threads are annoying nearly to the point of being To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. material. I appreciate that you eventually wrote something. This post should have been the OP. I didn't watch the video.

Here is a partial transcript, George Carlin is a comedian and this is a general rant against the way our government functions.


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---------- Post added 01-09-2012 at 03:37 PM ----------

We have a fiat currency with nothing tangible backing it's value, so I view it more like a stock in a company than a unit of value, accordingly I invest in physical tangible assets like gold.

[Paul Siraisi]

	Originally Posted by Dru To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	surely that's the point. why would you want all that pesky competition? there's a reason pyramids get narrower toward the top.

You could be right. I'd like to think that the cream of our crop was smart enough to want future crops that produce enough cream, but maybe not. The (cross-generational) pyramid already narrows without help, and too narrow a base means a shorter pyramid, and the end of civilization.

[Dru]

the base is not made of owners, the base is made of slaves, or their modern cousins, minimum-wage workers. there will always be a large base.