Where does creativity come from?

**Dodeca** · 10-31-2011, 10:51 PM

What capacities are known to be creative in different environments. What aspects of the mental process would be labeled creativity when compared to normal intellectual feats in those areas.

**Vagrant** · 10-31-2011, 11:38 PM

Here's a generic response: Intelligence.

People who are considered to have very high IQ's (eg Einstein, Tesla, Hawking, Steve Jobs, etc) were/are known to be incredibly eccentric. Eccentricity works well with arts and creativity. Most artists I've known who are truly good at their craft are very intelligent, with a dash of depression, bipolar, or BPD.

Creativity is a matter of seeing something different when everybody else is seeing the same thing. There's one primary way this occurs -- diversity. Diversity of intelligence makes the largest difference in my opinion.

psykhe · 11-01-2011, 01:07 AM

	Originally Posted by Dodeca
	What capacities are known to be creative in different environments.

Perhaps the ability to provide a new solution to a problem, a new method or device, or a new artistic object or form. Generally how original the thought is.

	Originally Posted by Vagrant
	Here's a generic response: Intelligence.

Umm..not entirely. Creative people may tend to have average to above average IQ test scores yet there is but little correlation between creativity and superior (genius-level) IQ scores. Thing is, standardised IQ tests measure convergent thinking (ability to come up with single correct answer) whilst creativity involves divergent thinking (ability to come up with new and unusual answers. Also, researches have found environment to be more important than genetics in influencing creativity. Early experiences at home or school plays a crucial role in a child's creativity. Whether it is encouraged or discouraged, is the turning point.

Torrance Test of Creative Thinking is one known paper-and-pencil test which measures divergent thinking.

	Originally Posted by Vagrant
	Eccentricity works well with arts and creativity.

Eccentricism is what society labels to people who refuse to follow the norm. It's just nothing but another societal prejudices.
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**Sean O** · 11-01-2011, 06:28 AM

Creativity has more to do with the creation/invention process than the parts of the mind used in that process. Both left-brain and right-brain faculties can be a part of the creative process, and often are. Artists need creativity in order to put their thoughts or emotions into a form that others can experience viscerally. Scientists need creativity in order to see beyond established knowledge bases and thought paradigms, then come up with new research questions and methods of carrying out that research. Anything that pushes the envelope or goes outside the box had to arise from some form of creative thinking.

One of the beautiful things about human creativity is that it can't really be defined in 100% concrete terms.
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**Quett** · 11-01-2011, 06:36 AM

Originally Posted by Sean O
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Creativity has more to do with the creation/invention process than the parts of the mind used in that process. Both left-brain and right-brain faculties can be a part of the creative process, and often are. Artists need creativity in order to put their thoughts or emotions into a form that others can experience viscerally. Scientists need creativity in order to see beyond established knowledge bases and thought paradigms, then come up with new research questions and methods of carrying out that research. Anything that pushes the envelope or goes outside the box had to arise from some form of creative thinking.

One of the beautiful things about human creativity is that it can't really be defined in 100% concrete terms.
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Something is beautiful because it is undefinable?

That makes my thinker parts angry.

**Polymath20** · 11-01-2011, 07:06 AM

Most of what humans do is not creative in that they do not generate completely unique information, but rather reinterpret or misinterpret other information. You paint a frog, good job, you simply recreated what you saw. It was not unique. Some of the greatest creations have come from dreams, drugs, or other such experiences. Again, nothing unique, just someone who was able to compose and convey a story or experience through some medium.

**Vagrant** · 11-01-2011, 11:59 AM

Originally Posted by Polymath20
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Most of what humans do is not creative in that they do not generate completely unique information, but rather reinterpret or misinterpret other information. You paint a frog, good job, you simply recreated what you saw. It was not unique. Some of the greatest creations have come from dreams, drugs, or other such experiences. Again, nothing unique, just someone who was able to compose and convey a story or experience through some medium.

Although, in the end, everything is simply a recreation, reinterpretation, or misinterpretation of something else.

Umm..not entirely. Creative people may tend to have average to above average IQ test scores yet there is but little correlation between creativity and superior (genius-level) IQ scores. Thing is, standardised IQ tests measure convergent thinking (ability to come up with single correct answer) whilst creativity involves divergent thinking (ability to come up with new and unusual answers. Also, researches have found environment to be more important than genetics in influencing creativity. Early experiences at home or school plays a crucial role in a child's creativity. Whether it is encouraged or discouraged, is the turning point.

I never said intelligence was the entirety of creativity. Diversity of intelligence is a huge portion of it though.

**minusmg** · 11-01-2011, 12:04 PM

Innovation and originality. Connecting things in a way which has not been previously done or predicted. Intelligence is not a prerequisite, but will help in advanced fields.

**Distance** · 11-01-2011, 12:05 PM

A lack of boundaries, genetic, self or externally limiting.

**Still Standing** · 11-01-2011, 11:39 PM

Haven't you been paying attention in the G&A subforum? It comes from the Y chromosome.
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But seriously, I think creativity can come from different places, depending on the type of creation and the intention: need, greed, inspiration, open-mindedness, curiosity, self-expression, etc. I wouldn't automatically link it to intelligence, though. Actually, the less intelligent may tend to not second-guess themselves as much with rationalizations and reality checks so they'll have less restrictions in their creative process.

**gestalt** · 11-02-2011, 04:55 AM

I characterize creativity as neural crosstalk between the physical portions of the human brain responsible for understanding images, color, and words. An organism's epigenetics being modified by experiences along the way too...

**WhirlsTwirls** · 11-02-2011, 09:42 AM

Originally Posted by Polymath20
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Most of what humans do is not creative in that they do not generate completely unique information, but rather reinterpret or misinterpret other information. You paint a frog, good job, you simply recreated what you saw. It was not unique. Some of the greatest creations have come from dreams, drugs, or other such experiences. Again, nothing unique, just someone who was able to compose and convey a story or experience through some medium.

I'd say it goes deeper than that, even if it doesn't stem from a "spiritual" experience. The painting of the frog may seem superficially trivial, but behind it there's a motive, a statement, a desire, a story.

I'd also say, from the perspective of a musician of sorts, that this sort of experience plays a very little part in the overall process of creating something. Most of it, by far, is just plain hard work.

**Sean O** · 11-02-2011, 10:38 AM

	Originally Posted by Quett To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Something is beautiful because it is undefinable? That makes my thinker parts angry.

True - but would it be as interesting if it could be that easily defined?
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**Polymath20** · 11-03-2011, 10:48 AM


	Most of it, by far, is just plain hard work.

Genius is 1% inspiration and 99% perspiration. Well said.

**mieu** · 11-04-2011, 03:10 PM

The ability to conceive of something novel, perhaps as an amalgamation of existing concepts, either in an effort to solve a problem, or just for the hell of it.

**Allie** · 11-04-2011, 04:19 PM

Curiosity...Desire to explore and discover...Fearlessness and willingness (less boundaries) to take risks, bordering on impulsiveness...Plus talent. Rinse and repeat. Or, shake, stir, cover tightly and put on high heat.

**Erebos** · 11-05-2011, 12:21 PM

Well, it definitely doesn't come from neuron connections in your head, right?

**bdpqbd** · 11-11-2011, 11:07 PM

	Originally Posted by psykhe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Thing is, standardised IQ tests measure convergent thinking (ability to come up with single correct answer) whilst creativity involves divergent thinking (ability to come up with new and unusual answers.

Convergence and divergence are the same thing in opposite directions. Also divergent thinking is not prone to be conclusive, though its "products" may be used in that manner.

**tms1337** · 11-12-2011, 07:46 PM

Creativity is a coping mechanism that intelligent people use when they realize the things they love aren't around, things didn't work out the way they planned, the world didn't conform to their ideal vision of it. The list goes on.

**n8ey** · 11-12-2011, 07:52 PM

The science channel recently has shown a series called "ingenious minds" where they've been measuring activity in the brain and mapping it.

some of what they show for creative types is that they experience linkages between active areas of the brain in both left and right halves, between three or more areas that do not appear to act in concert across individuals. Non-standard activity, in other words.

Granted, the science channel is hardly an authoritative or academic resource, but it is interesting to consider.

**Vulture** · 11-12-2011, 08:04 PM

i'm reading here a lot of people attempting to "define" creativity.

i'm wondering if there's specific personal examples to draw from to expand the discussion.

it seems to me that the creative process might be better explained by people describing it within themselves. i have lots of ideas on this, but am curios to see what others have to say.

**Thinktress** · 11-12-2011, 10:42 PM

I've always thought that creativity has a lot to do with the reticular activating system and what it does and does not allow at different times and in different people.

**irini** · 11-12-2011, 11:22 PM

I think creativity refers more to "talent". A talented artist is more likely to make an exceptional piece of art...a talented scientist is more likely to invent something effective and innovative...a talented enterpeneur is more likely to create a succesfull business. I define talent as the obvious ability of a person at a specific area that urge that person to interfere in this area and excel at it. Of course talent is not enough. I believe appropriate environment and hard work are also necessary for creation...But a really creative person is the one that really can conjure difficulties through the process of creation.

**Haumea** · 11-13-2011, 02:32 AM

I'll just crib from Paul Cooijimans, 'cause I like his explanation so much:


	The components of creativity (and therefore of awareness and of genius) are intelligence, conscientiousness and associative horizon.

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**Fmax** · 11-13-2011, 06:59 PM

For me, creativity is a combination of connecting several elements together in a non-obvious way. I think creativity must be learned, trained, and exercised. You have to create those connections in your brain that go beyond level 1 association. So in my opinion intelligence determines the rate at which you can improve your creativity. No one is born with huge creative skills, these are learned and trained over the years.
If you put yourself in the right environment you can hone your creative skills quite fast. There is a book that is really great on this topic, it is called "Thinker Toys".
A daily quota to come up with one new concept, idea, or method to solve your own problems and challenges is something that has helped me tremendously.

10-31-2011, 10:51 PM	#1
Dodeca Member [30%] MBTI: INTP Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 1,200	What capacities are known to be creative in different environments. What aspects of the mental process would be labeled creativity when compared to normal intellectual feats in those areas.
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10-31-2011, 11:38 PM	#2
Vagrant Core Member [155%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 6,225	Here's a generic response: Intelligence. People who are considered to have very high IQ's (eg Einstein, Tesla, Hawking, Steve Jobs, etc) were/are known to be incredibly eccentric. Eccentricity works well with arts and creativity. Most artists I've known who are truly good at their craft are very intelligent, with a dash of depression, bipolar, or BPD. Creativity is a matter of seeing something different when everybody else is seeing the same thing. There's one primary way this occurs -- diversity. Diversity of intelligence makes the largest difference in my opinion.
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11-01-2011, 06:28 AM	#4
Sean O Member [20%] MBTI: ENFJ Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 830	Creativity has more to do with the creation/invention process than the parts of the mind used in that process. Both left-brain and right-brain faculties can be a part of the creative process, and often are. Artists need creativity in order to put their thoughts or emotions into a form that others can experience viscerally. Scientists need creativity in order to see beyond established knowledge bases and thought paradigms, then come up with new research questions and methods of carrying out that research. Anything that pushes the envelope or goes outside the box had to arise from some form of creative thinking. One of the beautiful things about human creativity is that it can't really be defined in 100% concrete terms. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
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11-01-2011, 07:06 AM	#6
Polymath20 Core Member [412%] MBTI: ENTP Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 16,492	Most of what humans do is not creative in that they do not generate completely unique information, but rather reinterpret or misinterpret other information. You paint a frog, good job, you simply recreated what you saw. It was not unique. Some of the greatest creations have come from dreams, drugs, or other such experiences. Again, nothing unique, just someone who was able to compose and convey a story or experience through some medium.
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11-01-2011, 12:04 PM	#8
minusmg Member [04%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 176	Innovation and originality. Connecting things in a way which has not been previously done or predicted. Intelligence is not a prerequisite, but will help in advanced fields.
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11-01-2011, 12:05 PM	#9
Distance Core Member [411%] MBTI: eNTj Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 16,459	A lack of boundaries, genetic, self or externally limiting.
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11-01-2011, 11:39 PM	#10
Still Standing Core Member [138%] MBTI: Isfp Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 5,543	Haven't you been paying attention in the G&A subforum? It comes from the Y chromosome. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. But seriously, I think creativity can come from different places, depending on the type of creation and the intention: need, greed, inspiration, open-mindedness, curiosity, self-expression, etc. I wouldn't automatically link it to intelligence, though. Actually, the less intelligent may tend to not second-guess themselves as much with rationalizations and reality checks so they'll have less restrictions in their creative process.
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11-02-2011, 04:55 AM	#11
gestalt Veteran Member [84%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 3,374	I characterize creativity as neural crosstalk between the physical portions of the human brain responsible for understanding images, color, and words. An organism's epigenetics being modified by experiences along the way too...
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11-04-2011, 03:10 PM	#15
mieu Core Member [183%] $/)^3^(\$ MBTI: xNTx Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 7,346	The ability to conceive of something novel, perhaps as an amalgamation of existing concepts, either in an effort to solve a problem, or just for the hell of it.
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11-04-2011, 04:19 PM	#16
Allie Veteran Member [54%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,196	Curiosity...Desire to explore and discover...Fearlessness and willingness (less boundaries) to take risks, bordering on impulsiveness...Plus talent. Rinse and repeat. Or, shake, stir, cover tightly and put on high heat.
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11-05-2011, 12:21 PM	#17
Erebos Member [02%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Oct 2011 Posts: 91	Well, it definitely doesn't come from neuron connections in your head, right?
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11-12-2011, 07:46 PM	#19
tms1337 Member [05%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 232	Creativity is a coping mechanism that intelligent people use when they realize the things they love aren't around, things didn't work out the way they planned, the world didn't conform to their ideal vision of it. The list goes on.
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11-12-2011, 07:52 PM	#20
n8ey Veteran Member [56%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 2,242	The science channel recently has shown a series called "ingenious minds" where they've been measuring activity in the brain and mapping it. some of what they show for creative types is that they experience linkages between active areas of the brain in both left and right halves, between three or more areas that do not appear to act in concert across individuals. Non-standard activity, in other words. Granted, the science channel is hardly an authoritative or academic resource, but it is interesting to consider.
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11-12-2011, 08:04 PM	#21
Vulture Member [49%] MBTI: intj Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 1,968	i'm reading here a lot of people attempting to "define" creativity. i'm wondering if there's specific personal examples to draw from to expand the discussion. it seems to me that the creative process might be better explained by people describing it within themselves. i have lots of ideas on this, but am curios to see what others have to say.
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11-12-2011, 10:42 PM	#22
Thinktress Veteran Member [52%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 2,112	I've always thought that creativity has a lot to do with the reticular activating system and what it does and does not allow at different times and in different people.
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11-12-2011, 11:22 PM	#23
irini Core Member [183%] MBTI: eNFj Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 7,347	I think creativity refers more to "talent". A talented artist is more likely to make an exceptional piece of art...a talented scientist is more likely to invent something effective and innovative...a talented enterpeneur is more likely to create a succesfull business. I define talent as the obvious ability of a person at a specific area that urge that person to interfere in this area and excel at it. Of course talent is not enough. I believe appropriate environment and hard work are also necessary for creation...But a really creative person is the one that really can conjure difficulties through the process of creation.
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11-13-2011, 06:59 PM	#25
Fmax New Member [01%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 7	For me, creativity is a combination of connecting several elements together in a non-obvious way. I think creativity must be learned, trained, and exercised. You have to create those connections in your brain that go beyond level 1 association. So in my opinion intelligence determines the rate at which you can improve your creativity. No one is born with huge creative skills, these are learned and trained over the years. If you put yourself in the right environment you can hone your creative skills quite fast. There is a book that is really great on this topic, it is called "Thinker Toys". A daily quota to come up with one new concept, idea, or method to solve your own problems and challenges is something that has helped me tremendously.
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