[Tactical Panda]

This was written to be deliberately unexpected, but isn't a joke.

Comparison of INTJs and ESFJs

• Both are more concerned with accurate and reliable information than interesting information, and take the communication of reliable information as something they hold themselves accountable for.
• Both don't mind directly confronting their problems and stating their true stance compared to other types.
• Both don't mind spending the time to comprehend what the other person says if the person makes clear that it is important.
• Both can seem aloof or suspicious externally while deep down are loyal and caring. This often can rub people the wrong way or lead to childhood bullying for both.
• Both are more intelligent than initial impressions may give people - the INTJ being too quiet the the ESFJ being too talkative.
• Both are long term planners when others are more concerned with goofing off.
• Both are concerned with the future and commitment and organization and planning for the family.
• Both have serious issues about even bringing up the issue of love and couples that they don't particularly discuss with others when it hurts them for no apparent reason.
• Both view the needs of the organization from "what is likely about to occur and what I can do about it to fix the problem".
• Both treat responsibility as not enough - and take on responsibilities outside of what they are expected and are more reliable than most when they do.
• Both are trying to live up to high standards of unsaid internal expectations.
• Both treat the tools they have as a reason to give back rather than always just enjoy for themselves - INTJs help with problems for no apparent reason using their minds while ESFJs socially help out people using their social planning.
• Both take on responsibilities for themselves and generally don't like shunting it off onto others once they are committed.
• Both don't prefer existing a world of unresolved ideas and prefer a consistent and strong but reliable understanding.
• Both are kind of dorky but attractive in their own ways that appeal to particular tastes - INTJs have the strong, silent, reliable thing going and don't BS, power play and go on throw consequence to the wind in order to go on emotional tirades as much as most of the other types, which always earns intelligence, charm and maturity points as long as you don't blow it by being stupid, and ESFJs are kind of funny in that they are stuck in that classic ESFJ mode in the superficial level.
• Both are wary of developing leadership complexes - for serious business it isn't just a game. Under normal circumstances they tend to differ to those who are responsible and know what they are doing if it seems the reasonable action to take.
• A degree of self reliance - both would rather take the suffering on themselves if they can make something better than to drag others they care about into it.

In this context INTJ uses Ni, Te, Fi and Se while ESFJ uses Fe, Si, Ne and Ti as main functions in that order.

In this context I am generally speaking - individuals may differ, as always.

Discuss anything on the topic of INTJs and ESFJs. Unless you are stuck in INTJ or ESFJ hater mode.

I didn't include the contrasts, for starters.

[True Rune]

ESFJs do not seem suspicious. Nobody will suspect an ESFJ of creeping unless that's what they're doing. INTJs on the other hand are as true as you say.

I've found the things that bother us lie in our perceptions. Things that may plague an INTJ are holes in their belief systems, uncertainty.. while for an ESFJ, it's something that is out of place. We are both people of order.

My brain is fuzzy, but I have a lot of experience here.

[Tactical Panda]

	Originally Posted by True Rune To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	ESFJs do not seem suspicious. Nobody will suspect an ESFJ of creeping unless that's what they're doing. INTJs on the other hand are as true as you say.

Are you sure?
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People who suspect that they are too happy or too fake? There are a few people out there who don't like ESFJ normal behavior out there - mostly for reasons founded on suspicion.

I don't think its a matter of creeping. I think its a matter of social conduct and intentions.

Sort of like attacking the person who sets a good example so you feel better about what you are doing if it looks not as good in comparison before the mud slinging. Its irrational, but happens too frequently. All you need to do is present yourself as an attractive target, give them what may nearly be a plausible excuse and people will do the rest.

[True Rune]

Fe based "intentions" are usually not suspicious save passive aggressive warfare.

Another similarity, though polar opposites..

ESFJs tend to be hyper aware of what's "normal", which is similar to INTJs and their devotion to logic.. so both are annoyed that people don't act "normal"/"rationally". They both apply these standards to everyone, hence why ESFJs are greatly influenced by their upbringing and INTJs are at odds with bureaucracy.

[Tactical Panda]

What of interpretation of intentions? The part that goes on between people.

[Ghostwheel]

	Originally Posted by Tactical Panda To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	A degree of self reliance - both would rather take the suffering on themselves if they can make something better than to drag others they care about into it.

Right off the bat, this strikes me as true. I'll have to think about the others in more detail later on.

My father and younger brother are both ESFJ, btw.

(Mother is ENFJ—I grew up with three EFJs!—and I find her loads easier for me, INTJ, to communicate with.)

[Tactical Panda]

	Originally Posted by Ghostwheel To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Right off the bat, this strikes me as true. I'll have to think about the others in more detail later on. My father and younger brother are both ESFJ, btw. (Mother is ENFJ—I grew up with three EFJs!—and I find her loads easier for me, INTJ, to communicate with.)

I have taught some of my ESFJ friends to delegate so they don't collapse.

They now say "See, [Tactical Panda], I'm delegating!"

I'm worried about these guys burning out or taking on more than should be taken on.

[JulietCapulet]

It's so hard to compare these two as they are so different. Almost polar opposites.

[Tactical Panda]

	Originally Posted by JulietCapulet To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	It's so hard to compare these two as they are so different. Almost polar opposites.

How so?

This is the place to discuss it.
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[silicon212]

I used to work with an ESFJ (he has since moved on) and we both got along great, and seemed to share a vision for the company that I work for, which is contrary to what the owner feels.

I certainly miss his presence there, and the company up front (he was the salesman for the small computer company I work for) has suffered as a result.

[Tactical Panda]

I met up with an old ESFJ friend accidentally yesterday. It felt like little to no time had passed at all, when it reality it was closer to... half a decade since we last spoke.

Seems easy to communicate with them with day to day stuff as compared to communicating day to day stuff to some of the other types.

But thats only been my experience, and only so far.

Is it just me or do INTJs rarely disagree with ESFJs in person and vice versa compared to with others? We seem to just talk it out naturally instead of butting heads - provided talking actually happens.