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Old 11-05-2011, 01:31 PM   #51
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  Originally Posted by some other forumemale
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I am from the Eastern Hemisphere. Every school in my country has school uniforms and I've lived long enough outside my country in various continents to have seen other systems as well. My take on this is: Uniforms are good. Kids can do with one less thing to compare about. I like the idea of homogeneity in schools - the lesser the stratification that is visible among children in a class (be it by religion/class/money/gender, whatever), the more they will focus on other things like the curriculum being taught and how a friend is 'hurt', rather than how a friend is 'rich'!!

I like most of what you are saying, but here is the million dollar question: were the uniforms gender neutral? (Ie the same one for everyone.)

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Old 11-05-2011, 01:54 PM   #52
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Here in Buenos Aires it's the kids with school uniforms that are getting kidnapped the most.
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Old 11-05-2011, 11:08 PM   #53
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  Originally Posted by zibber
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I like most of what you are saying, but here is the million dollar question: were the uniforms gender neutral? (Ie the same one for everyone.)

Thank you, Zibber.

No, the uniforms are definitely not gender neutral and haven't ever been. I suppose that didn't bother us much because we anyway knew who was boy and who was girl and the uniforms didn't create or remove any stratification beyond what we already knew. In other words, wearing a uniform would not have given children any additional information than they already had.
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Besides, boys and girls aren't treated similarly (which is different from equally, btw) where I come from. To a great extent, girls are expected to behave like girls and boys like boys. (And convent schools like mine are notorious in enforcing these things!) I have no comments on whether that is fair or not, but we accepted it. Having said that, when it came to grades, you just had to do well in every subject - be it crafts for boys or robotics for girls - regardless of gender!
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And as girl scouts, we built houses for poor people with our hands and boys tended to old people in old age homes tenderly. The clothing did not take our responsibilities away from us, believe me.
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And we girls fought the boys as hard in sports and debates and Math Olympiads too, the traditional male bastions. Gave us big time kicks to do so too.
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Then again, the society I come from is reasonably conservative (I can say this about the country as a whole even to this day) and sexual preferences are expected to be largely 'traditional' and decidedly heterosexual. I don't think we are given much room to even wonder if we could be anything other than decidedly boy or girl!! LoL! Not for a moment am I suggesting that it is good or bad - frankly, I am not judgemental about such things. But I am certainly glad that I could ponder such things after I was emotionally mature and scientifically aware of facts - around the age of 17, when we were finally allowed to not wear uniforms anymore.
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I doubt I'd have turned out as grounded as I am now had I been pondering such choices during school - I certainly didn't have the maturity to handle that complication then. Kids today and kids in other countries may be different - but this system worked for us and works to this day.
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P.S. Things have changed in one aspect though - we celebrate Gay/Lesbian/Bi-sexual/Trans days at our workplaces these days, which is a strong departure from tradition and a strong statement about letting go of any judgement around such things. But kids are still protected from these variances.

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Old 11-06-2011, 08:08 AM   #54
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I did junior high and high school where all schools had uniforms. Overwhelming conformity. Not of the modesty-teaching kind, just a general commie-type of enforced conformity.

  Originally Posted by Feral
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It would mean that I GOT TO SAVE HUNDREDS OF DOLLARS! every year, shopping for school clothes. Once I turned 14 and proved that I could hold a job, I always had a job. And because I always had a job (or at least in the summer that first year or so), it was no longer my parents' responsibility to buy my school clothes. Selling one lamb at fair would cover it very well, but I could take that money and whatever I was making at my job and spend it on other things.

I know what you mean. In that country I lived in the blue collar jobs are taken I did junior high and high school in a less developed part of the world where all schools had uniforms. But it didn't stop at uniforms. Overwhelming conformity. Not of the modesty-teaching kind, just a general commie-type of enforced conformity. They controlled everything from the end of your hair to the tip of your finger (like one school even made its students trim their nails a certain way).

  Originally Posted by Feral
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It would mean that I GOT TO SAVE HUNDREDS OF DOLLARS! every year, shopping for school clothes. Once I turned 14 and proved that I could hold a job, I always had a job. And because I always had a job (or at least in the summer that first year or so), it was no longer my parents' responsibility to buy my school clothes. Selling one lamb at fair would cover it very well, but I could take that money and whatever I was making at my job and spend it on other things.

I know what you mean. In that country I lived in the blue collar jobs are taken by adults who actually work those jobs full time, as a 'career' in a way. High school kids didn't have part-time jobs flipping burgers because those jobs were, in a way, 'reserved' for lower-class people who needed those jobs more. The children who did work were in serious child labor (as in, they didn't get any schooling and they worked full time). Children were given allowances to buy lunch, but they rarely used it for anything else.

So anyway, I got a job by accident: I sent a letter to an editor when I was about 15 (I was on the peak of obnoxiousness). But instead of publishing my letter, the editor emails me back and challenges me, basically saying "if you can write a better counter-article, I'll publish it". So I wrote the damn article and it got published, and I made money (which is rare for a 15 year-old). The money just sat there in my bank account for about 2-3 years because I didn't know what to do with it!

Like, I'd want pink socks, but I knew I couldn't get away with them because you've have to wear white and it had to be a particular length. There was no point in getting nail polish because I knew I would get into trouble for wearing them. You could get away with using Chapstick, but if they saw some tint on your lips, they'd send you to the toilets to wash off.

I used to have so many nail polishes. Every single shade of blue (UN blue, NATO blue, royal blue, navy blue, electric blue, baby/sky blue). They all dried out by the time I graduated because I never had a chance to wear them. I only had like 3-4 sets of outfits and a pair of shoes (?) during grades 6-12.

  Originally Posted by Still Standing
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I do believe that it could resolve class tensions and the like, but providing them for free doesn't seem realistic.

In countries where some people still live on USD1.00< per day, you can tell if someone's poor if they don't wear their uniform to school because they can't afford to buy uniforms. The come to school in rags.

I don't believe they would resolve class tensions, though. Unless the bags were uniform too. Because back then, bags were the ultimate status symbols. If you had a branded bag (and the right brand too), you were part of the in crowd. And watches. In junior high they gave you uniform shoes, but in high school they let you wear whatever shoes you wanted as long as they didn't have heels and they were black (LOADS of class tension with shoes).

---------- Post added 11-06-2011 at 02:11 PM ----------

They controlled everything from the end of your hair to the tip of your finger (like one school even made its students trim their nails a certain way). There was just no individuality and I used to get into trouble in the stupidest ways:

Once I got called into the principle's office (during the Shibuya Gals fad) because they accused me of dying my hair (my hair is naturally lighter). It's not as
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and it's understandable to expect a girl with epicanthic fold to have perfectly jet-black hair. But it was annoying. My mother and grandmother have the same kind of hair. I think they had to call my mother or something. I had to swear it was my real hair color.

One teacher in junior high even coudn't stop giving me shit for the way I walked. According to her, I walked "like a boy", so she'd humiliate me and touch me in all the wrong places to make me walk like a girl.
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I still get so angry about it. That bitch.

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Old 11-28-2011, 03:15 AM   #55
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I didn't care about having to wear one, but I hated it because my family couldn't afford the "real" uniform and we had to buy "fakes". Got bullied like hell at times because of it.
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Old 10-12-2012, 12:38 AM   #56
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I also love school uniforms and children look so cute in school uniform.
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Old 10-13-2012, 06:01 AM   #57
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I loved my uniform for aesthetic reasons. It looked great on me, so concerns about homogeneity and conformity were far from my mind.
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Old 10-14-2012, 08:29 AM   #58
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  Originally Posted by OrangeLeland
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Uniforms don't do a damn thing to homogenize populations. I wore a school uniform for years and you could still tell who the rich kids were by what they were wearing and how they were wearing it. You can ALWAYS tell. Uniforms are not an equalizer.

^^ This. Yes. I wore school uniforms for high school, and they did nothing to hide a person's social class. At my (girl's) school, you could always tell the girls with money. They had nicer skin, nicer hair, nicer sweaters (you could wear any sweater you wanted as long as it was gray or dark blue), and most definitely nicer shoes.

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Old 10-14-2012, 08:48 AM   #59
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I would have liked a school uniform in high school. I could count on two hands the amount of clothing i wore on a regular basis in high school. As long as it was comfortable, well-designed, and easy on the eyes i would have loved it.
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Old 10-16-2013, 12:13 AM   #60
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I have mixed feelings about the uniform. I like the idea of mandating one in an environment like highschool where it neutralizes alot of the peer pressure to fit in by dressing in a certain manner. I suppose on paper that should leave more room for expressing yourself in 'less superficial' ways as the OP put it, but I personally wouldn't want to wear one every single day. Although I do think some people need that regulation. Hence the mixed feelings, I guess I like it for others and I might like it myself provided I was in charge of designing it.
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Old 10-18-2013, 09:06 PM   #61
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What a superficial solution to a deep problem.
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