[Negativezero]

Look at a site like craigs list and you'll find guy after guy after guy looking for someone either to date, have sex with, or just be friends with. They're lots of adds on there posted by guys.

Of the very few women post most are fake.


My sister leaves the house and gets hit on everyday.
I'm shocked if I'm hit on once a week doing the same things she's doing [you know, going about my day doing important stuff like grocery shopping or laundry or whatever].


When me or my guy friends do talk to girls, often we're ignored and get the cold shoulder. Then There's those girls who try to milk us for drinks or whatever in the bar [kinda shady].



So, why am I so nice? Or anyone really? I'm still single when I'm nice to girls and they still try to use me and all my friends. Why not treat them like trash since that's how I'm treated?


Are there any decent girls out there?

[mieu]

Are you like, the perfect man or something?

[Dru]

maybe if those same guys left the house to meet women more often, instead of posting craigslist ads and scouring online dating sites for suitable women, they'd be more successful.

i'm merely conjecturing. you don't seem to have that problem, so much as it seems the places you go to to meet women are more often populated by the types of women you've been encountering than the types of women you want to meet.

[Winklepicker]

	Originally Posted by Negativezero To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Look at a site like craigs list and you'll find guy after guy after guy looking for someone either to date, have sex with, or just be friends with.

Mmm...how many women do you think who actually (hypothetically) respond to these type of ads end up with "relationship" with said male posters... ?

Not every male poster is truly looking for "relationship" and women know this (vice versa also true).

Maybe a more fair comparison would be looking at male/female numbers from sites that seem to better draw those truly looking for "relationship"--my guess is that numbers might even out, or that numbers of females might actually exceed male numbers.

[davai]

	Originally Posted by Negativezero To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Why not treat them like trash since that's how I'm treated?

Because it makes you sound like a spoilt brat, and no-one wants to go out with a baby.

[Sphinx]

Learn how to flirt, learn how to be (even fake) confidence, and learn how not to seem like a worthless, weak imitation of an archetypal male might be a good place to start.

[Mogura]

	Originally Posted by Negativezero To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Are there any decent girls out there?

Yes, but they're less likely to be found on craigslist looking for anonymous hookups or in bars doing the same.

If you truly are a nice guy, then be proud of what you are and don't bother transforming yourself into some PUA douchebag for the purpose of "getting women".

Just be cool, confident and kind. Pretty soon women will be coming to you...

[Andre20]

I'm sure that there are plenty of the "right" girls out there. We just need to find them in the right environment. I think environment is everything. If you like books...go to a bookstore, like sports...go to a game/store or any event. Personally I don't go out to parties and bars trying to meet women. That would only leave me with a few unsuccessful dates and a complete waste of my time.
I wouldn't stop being the way you are just to give the girl the appearance that you're something else. If you're looking for long term that won't cut it...

I know the feeling.

[Negativezero]

	Originally Posted by mieu To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Are you like, the perfect man or something?

No one is perfect.
There's clearly something wrong with me if more often than not girls are not interested in me while, on average, most guys I know have a lot more success with women. Granted these may be extreme examples, my brother Zach, friends Mike, Doug, John, Kyle, and Real seem to have girls flocking their direction all the time. Then there's "squirrel" who's not getting girls [even getting girls less than me, they just use him for money or a ride].

In this group of 7, I'm ranked 6th. The average guy in the group is getting girls interested in him about 5 or 6 times a week [as in girls who actually go up and talk to him]. I'm surprised if a girl asks me out within a time span of a year.

So, no, I do not think I'm perfect. I think I have some horrible flaw and I'm unaware of what that flaw is or how to fix it. I'm aware of a few things it isn't.

Doug is an asshole to girls, cheats on his girlfriend, treats girls like they're slutty whores and generally shows no respect to them. He's sleeping with a different girl every week.
I'm certain that it's not that I'm an asshole or say mean things [maybe it's that I rarely do say horribly mean things... than again].

Zach is nice to girls all the time, doesn't cheat on his girlfriends and has girls trying to sleep with him all the time. He could potentially sleep with a different girl every week, he doesn't though. So, it couldn't be that I'm too nice.

I'm certainly not perfect, nor is anyone. I don't know why girls aren't interested in me. I know a few things that don't seem to matter [like if you're an asshole or a nice guy apparently].

Originally Posted by Dru To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

maybe if those same guys left the house to meet women more often, instead of posting craigslist ads and scouring online dating sites for suitable women, they'd be more successful. i'm merely conjecturing. you don't seem to have that problem, so much as it seems the places you go to to meet women are more often populated by the types of women you've been encountering than the types of women you want to meet.

Could be.
Then again I have no idea where to go to meet the "right" women. Just that at a charity drive I went to, the karaoke night at the bar, a soccer game, the library, a park downtown, a festival, and out at the skating rink [as well as online] none of the women I met seemed to be interested in me. They asked for me information, gave me theirs, then never respond when I talk to them again.

	Originally Posted by Mogura To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Yes, but they're less likely to be found on craigslist looking for anonymous hookups or in bars doing the same. If you truly are a nice guy, then be proud of what you are and don't bother transforming yourself into some PUA douchebag for the purpose of "getting women". Just be cool, confident and kind. Pretty soon women will be coming to you...

I wouldn't be a "PUA douchebag".
Being nice to people all the time, then having people attempt to walk all over you ever day anytime your nice makes you not want to be so nice anymore.
Wouldn't go out of my way to treat girls like trash, I'm just not seeing any point in being nice to them anymore if they continuously treat me like trash then run off to be with some pua douchebag.



Anyway, this post was mostly made out of frustration and anger. I don't think it serves much purpose. I'm not really learning here, maybe I have some learning defect. I'm 27, have tried to figure out why girls don't like me since I was 17 and still have the same success with women that I had when I was 17.

I still care very much to know what the hell is up with this and what is wrong with me. I just don't have much hope that anyone knows that answer or that I'll ever find it and think I'll gradually become more and more bitter and frustrated that every relationship I have ends quickly and I'm left confused about why and lonely for months and months with no one else who cares to have anything to do with me until law of averages jumps in and throws me a new girlfriend.

So, thanks for trying, I just don't think there's much hope for me anymore.

[rahdam]

Originally Posted by Negativezero To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Look at a site like craigs list and you'll find guy after guy after guy looking for someone either to date, have sex with, or just be friends with. They're lots of adds on there posted by guys. Of the very few women post most are fake. My sister leaves the house and gets hit on everyday. I'm shocked if I'm hit on once a week doing the same things she's doing [you know, going about my day doing important stuff like grocery shopping or laundry or whatever]. When me or my guy friends do talk to girls, often we're ignored and get the cold shoulder. Then There's those girls who try to milk us for drinks or whatever in the bar [kinda shady]. So, why am I so nice? Or anyone really? I'm still single when I'm nice to girls and they still try to use me and all my friends. Why not treat them like trash since that's how I'm treated? Are there any decent girls out there?

one must consider quality

[vampyroteuthis]

The ease of getting them says nothing about their worth.

[Fubudis]

Relevant:


To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

[TylerRDA]

Sociology provides interesting insights into this topic. In terms of reproductive success, the distribution of women are grouped close together, whereas males are more hit or miss. Take Genghis Khan for example. He was so reproductively successful that there's a half percent chance you're related to him. In order to facilitate that, countless men had to utterly fail. It's interesting to note that polygamy actually favors women more than men- women get to share the best man. Men can't ever 'share' the best women in the same way.

[Dru]

Sharing your boyfriend is a privilege?

[Nikonman]

At your age in particular, women hold the power. Based on my own experience, I believe that flips at some point and the shorter supply of men tends to give us many more opportunities as we get older. It was not hard at all to find dates when I got divorced, there were plenty of divorced women around looking for a decent guy. And by that age, most of them who had been attracted to arrogant assholes have learned that there is usually a price to pay for getting involved with an asshole because, while they can mask their nature for a while when dating, it will eventually come out.

But, you don't need a bunch of girls, you can have a fabulous time with just a single one. Others might attract girls more easily, but that doesn't mean that there is not one out there who'd be a great match for you. It is up to you to find her. I dated all kinds of women after the ex wife and I split up, from teachers, a lawyer, a nurse, a banker, a social workers a PhD chemical engineer and PhD economist. I ended up falling for someone with an almost opposite personality type, but with very similar core values. I'd have never guessed that I'd fall for someone so different from me, but I did and it has worked out well. The ones I thought looked best on paper as a match for me turned out not to be even close to a good match. So keep an open mind and keep your eyes open.

[TylerRDA]

	Originally Posted by Dru To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Sharing your boyfriend is a privilege?

Yes, if the alternative is a loser boyfriend. From a sociological and anthropological perspective.

[Weltschmerzer]

Originally Posted by Negativezero To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Look at a site like craigs list and you'll find guy after guy after guy looking for someone either to date, have sex with, or just be friends with. They're lots of adds on there posted by guys. Of the very few women post most are fake. My sister leaves the house and gets hit on everyday. I'm shocked if I'm hit on once a week doing the same things she's doing [you know, going about my day doing important stuff like grocery shopping or laundry or whatever]. When me or my guy friends do talk to girls, often we're ignored and get the cold shoulder. Then There's those girls who try to milk us for drinks or whatever in the bar [kinda shady]. So, why am I so nice? Or anyone really? I'm still single when I'm nice to girls and they still try to use me and all my friends. Why not treat them like trash since that's how I'm treated? Are there any decent girls out there?

Every positive side has its negative. For women, this takes the form of physical danger at the hands of guys who can't take a hint or don't care. I can't say I'd be too eager to trade places on this issue. The draft and lifeboat prioritization policies, on the other hand...

If you're nice to girls so they'll do something to reciprocate, and if that something isn't happening, logic dictates you should adjust. Whether this means making your niceness more effective or abandoning it altogether is up to you. If you are nice to them to feel good, you should feel even better when it yields no result--it makes you more self-sacrificing.

[Arcanist]

I've read a lot of your posts and I'm left wondering why you're so obsessed with women? You're blessed! Chasing tail or "being with someone" is an utter waste of time. Love is a farce! If you're in it for love or companionship, you've already lost since marriage is a strategic partnership. It's for children, merging families and consolidating assets. Liking the person you're with is a luxury. A few people find it, but most people don't. What you have to ask yourself, is: Am I willing to dig through tons of trash to find that diamond?

Most people are crap and that time could be spent improving yourself.

[JTG]

	Originally Posted by Negativezero To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	So, why am I so nice? Or anyone really? I'm still single when I'm nice to girls and they still try to use me and all my friends. Why not treat them like trash since that's how I'm treated? Are there any decent girls out there?

I realize the temptation to "do what works" is powerful, but i don't think women are necessarily attracted to men who are jerks. Instead, i think they're attracted to men who don't come across as needy and desperate. Most jerks don't, while most "nice guys" do.

	Originally Posted by Dru To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	maybe if those same guys left the house to meet women more often, instead of posting craigslist ads and scouring online dating sites for suitable women, they'd be more successful.

For what it's worth, i've found a lot more attraction and romance online than i have in person. If the OP is looking for connections with women, i wouldn't discount the possibility of looking online.

Of course, i'm not sure how great craigslist is for that. Meeting people on craigslist conjures images in my mind of meeting people in a dark alley, or a public bathroom, or a filthy bar in the wrong part of town

[vampyroteuthis]

	Originally Posted by Arcanist To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Most people are crap and that time could be spent improving yourself.

It's true I've met very few people who made me want to work at a relationship with them, but when I do, love and companionship become avenues for self improvement. Having a trusted, perspicacious and non-crappy second pair of eyes helps me see past my own unique set of cliches.

[thesorehead]

I agree with the OP proposition, that is that relationships are easier for girls to get. Generally, girls are just more social creatures than boys. When it comes to romantic pair-bonded type relationships, in our culture eligibility prerequisites for women are lower than for men and there is an expectation that men will make the move that escalates a relationship into that "beyond friendship" state.

To answer the question: yes, there are decent girls everywhere! The question really is how do you find the ones that you want to date?

Had a wall o' text, but suffice to say: doing the things that make you happy automatically makes you more attractive, and gives you better chances with women than doing otherwise, for a whole host of reasons.

[LifesEcstasy]

Yes there are good women out there but unfortunately in your extremely negative stance towards women (I smell envy, digust, injustice etc...in your post) you are unlikely to meet any of them. Further I predict you are likely to be single until such time as you find a more mature attitude towards the opposite sex. I am always highly amused by 'good guy's who complain life is rigged in favour of women. Now seriously, would any woman hearing this kind of rant really classify you as a nice guy?

[Negativezero]

Originally Posted by Nikonman To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

At your age in particular, women hold the power. Based on my own experience, I believe that flips at some point and the shorter supply of men tends to give us many more opportunities as we get older. It was not hard at all to find dates when I got divorced, there were plenty of divorced women around looking for a decent guy. And by that age, most of them who had been attracted to arrogant assholes have learned that there is usually a price to pay for getting involved with an asshole because, while they can mask their nature for a while when dating, it will eventually come out. But, you don't need a bunch of girls, you can have a fabulous time with just a single one. Others might attract girls more easily, but that doesn't mean that there is not one out there who'd be a great match for you. It is up to you to find her. I dated all kinds of women after the ex wife and I split up, from teachers, a lawyer, a nurse, a banker, a social workers a PhD chemical engineer and PhD economist. I ended up falling for someone with an almost opposite personality type, but with very similar core values. I'd have never guessed that I'd fall for someone so different from me, but I did and it has worked out well. The ones I thought looked best on paper as a match for me turned out not to be even close to a good match. So keep an open mind and keep your eyes open.

yeah...
If they picked the asshole first while they were younger and are picking me when they're older because they know the asshole is going to give a doomed relationship I don't want that girl for a variety of reasons.

Mostly cause it's unfair and I'm childish about things like that. If I wasn't picked first and have to wait, then she's never going to get me. Then she's only picking me because she knows I'll be good to her, not cause she's actually interested in me. I don't want that. That's a selfish shady girl who'll drop you in a heartbeat for "the next best thing".

Originally Posted by Weltschmerzer To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Every positive side has its negative. For women, this takes the form of physical danger at the hands of guys who can't take a hint or don't care. I can't say I'd be too eager to trade places on this issue. The draft and lifeboat prioritization policies, on the other hand... If you're nice to girls so they'll do something to reciprocate, and if that something isn't happening, logic dictates you should adjust. Whether this means making your niceness more effective or abandoning it altogether is up to you. If you are nice to them to feel good, you should feel even better when it yields no result--it makes you more self-sacrificing.

I'm nice to people because I'm nice. I hold doors open for strangers and help people move in their furniture or give homeless people food or whatever not because I expect to gain from these actions [unless you count the emotional satisfaction a nice person gets from doing nice things to people as gain] but because it's who I am and what I want to do.

I share my food and help out and treat others how I like to be treated. When people start using me because of this it's very upsetting, especially when girls do it. I'm aware being nice to a girl or being an asshole doesn't seem to effect if she likes you or not. If she didn't like you while you were nice then if you're an asshole she'll claim that's why she doesn't like you. I've seen it happen to a lot of guys in the past. They're nice and get rejected, so they act like an ass because they see the ass getting girls, then the girls say they don't like that part of them. Then they act nice again and still get rejected. Logic says it had nothing to do with them being nice or an asshole.

Originally Posted by Arcanist To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I've read a lot of your posts and I'm left wondering why you're so obsessed with women? You're blessed! Chasing tail or "being with someone" is an utter waste of time. Love is a farce! If you're in it for love or companionship, you've already lost since marriage is a strategic partnership. It's for children, merging families and consolidating assets. Liking the person you're with is a luxury. A few people find it, but most people don't. What you have to ask yourself, is: Am I willing to dig through tons of trash to find that diamond? Most people are crap and that time could be spent improving yourself.

I'm obsessed with everything I'm not good at. Spent a good 2.5 years playing soccer everyday. I worked on kicking shots first. I had the worst shot on the team. 5 months of working on it I was the most accurate and fastest kicker. I worked on throw-ins after that. I was the 3rd worst at throw-ins. I ended up being the go-to guy anytime the ball was out of bounds and needed to be thrown in. Dribbling the ball, headers, all skills I was bad at. Worked on it till I was the best on the team, well except dribbling, I was only 3rd for that.

Running speed and stamina? Never did anything special to improve those things. I was always faster than the rest of the team and could play the whole game with only a break at halftime and still maintain enough stamina to ALWAYS be the faster player on the field. Those were my natural strengths, I worked on the weak area's.

This is applied to everything and so far works with everything. Take my weakness and work on those points to be more balanced.

Girls. I don't get it. I don't have success with it. I can't stop caring about girls or stop wanting relationships [and not for lack of trying] so I try to learn what does work. If I never figure it out I'll be constantly frustrated in my life. I'd rather not go in and out of depression till the day I die because I'm horrible at something I can't stop caring about.

Originally Posted by LifesEcstasy To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Yes there are good women out there but unfortunately in your extremely negative stance towards women (I smell envy, digust, injustice etc...in your post) you are unlikely to meet any of them. Further I predict you are likely to be single until such time as you find a more mature attitude towards the opposite sex. I am always highly amused by 'good guy's who complain life is rigged in favour of women. Now seriously, would any woman hearing this kind of rant really classify you as a nice guy?

I don't think you understand where I'm coming from.
I see a girl I like or have a friend I like and am nice, because I'm always being nice to people. When I want to be more than just friends or get to know someone I'm given the cold shoulder and treated like shit because I liked someone.

What do you think that does to a person. My last girlfriend dumped me cause her dad was racist, then stopped talking to me completely and dated some guy who treats her like shit less that a week after she dumped me. I met other girls in that time, they all are conveniently busy whenever I ask if they want to hang out.

It's not like I started off being bitter and angry about girls. Or like I angrily talk to them. When you see an angry upset sad person there's usually a reason. My mom's always upset because of some stuff that happened when she was a kid. People always talked down to her and said she was worthless. She lived with these people and grew up in that and despite her many efforts to feel as if she's worth something she remains sad.

I'm sure there might be some nice girls out there. I've met a few, they all have boyfriends or are uninterested in me. I don't know what the hell's wrong with me and am highly upset so I vented out frustration in the form of this thread. It's very true that the dating life is easier for women, that doesn't help my or anyone else's situation out anymore by posting it.

Personally I don't see what the point of your post was, other than to put someone down.

[Myth]

That is only true if the girls are considered to be attractive.

But you also have to take into consideration that the quality of most of the so-called "relationship" offers is not so great. Every idiot is going to give those girls extra attention, and they will have a harder time sorting through them to find a decent person.

[SteamViking]

Women don't post on sites like Craigslist because they know that there are a dozen desperate horny guys out there that are okay with buying them dinner and flowers in order to get laid. True facts.

It sounds to me like you're looking at it the wrong way. Honestly, most women (ones that aren't looking for a one night stand anyway) are not comfortable just chatting up a guy. I know I'm not. (They will, however, often signal that they are approachable by smiling at you/linking eyes.) Maybe you should stop waiting for women to approach you and try approaching them?

You may even try going to events/places that interest you to try and meet a woman there with similar interests. Maybe you really love writing so you take a writing class at the public college and meet a nice girl there. And now you have something to talk to her about. If you don't meet anyone, at least you learned something.