[Fox]

Sarcasm is very hard to read online and most INTJ have a sarcastic streak in them. This is either the most funniest topic on the boards or the most offensive.

[Vagrant]

Source? In all seriousness, that is. How is such a thing even defined? I'm not at all doubting that the Jews have faced some f-ing serious, heavy duty persecution through history. But, how does one say that they've been more persecuted than, say, sub-saharan africans? Or the untouchables caste in India? If it's number of people persecuted from each group through history, then the jews lose out to either of those. Is there some other standard you're using?

I'm defining it as length of time and how many different peoples have persecuted them.

	I can go on and on about how they essentially was the active force behind communism in all of Europe

Err...


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Err...?

	being moral destructors

A lovely, if vague term.

	being behind most of the things bad in eastern Europe (russian mafia(jewish mafia)

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	Their success isn't because of hight intelligence (average ashkenazi iq is 103, far to low to explain differences if population is taken into account), but some other reason such as nepotism, inferiority complex, greed...

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These two companies were founded by Jewish people. There are more out there that are also quite successful. Chalk it up to nepotism, inferiority complex, and greed if you want to.

	We were kind enough to let those people into our country after WWII, only to end up bamboozled into their stupid holy war conflict.

"We were kind enough to not let these people get systematically murdered and their entire livelihoods destroyed. It's their fault!"

Let's also not forget that many Jews have contributed to the history of America, and still do.

[zmo]

I was born a jew, but don't consider myself as one, I'm agnostic. All religions have only one purpose, to have control over the masses (that's the only useful thing that we learnt from Marx). However, that is only one aspect. If you attack jewish dogmas, go ahead and attack the christian ones, muslims ones, buddhists ones and every other religion dogma in the world. Assuming that you are a rational being, if you are not judging every religion as it should, you are being inconsistent with rationality itself and shame on you. Assuming you belong to any faith, thus being an irrational being, you are just being xenophobic if you attack any other religion.

Anyways, many of you fail to notice one little detail about this particular situation, some of you (and plenty around the world) blame it all on the jews (orthodox, reformist, hassidic, ashkenazi, sephardi, ethnically born but agnostic, etc...). It's not the talmud with its anti-goyim outdated rules and it's not that because some jews earned fortunes with effort and a lot of hard work through many generations (social determinism) that people hate jews now a days, it's because of the zionists. Being jewish doesn't imply being a zionist, take note of that. They are a political party and as such, they DO have an agenda (probably has something to do with control).

Come on, having a jewish country?!?! WHAT THE FUCK!!! Having an muslim country??!?! WHAT THE FUCK AGAIN!!!! Having a catholic country (vatican)?!?! WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK!!!! These are cradles of xenophobia, ignorance and irrationality; and it's way worst when you mix in politics and religion. Now, you may be wondering about "the human need to believe argument" and why am I dissing on all religions, here is my answer: it is actually, the human need to being manipulated, leaded, to be tranquilized about the unknown through a fairy tale. You may say I'm xenophobic or racist, not really, I'm just someone who likes to rationalize everything and doesn't believe in exogenous dogmas as a rational way of existing.

Some illustrative examples:

You don't choose these initially, you are born within their dogmas; however, you can opt out of them:
-Christians = Religion
-Muslims = Religion
-Jewish = Religion
-etc...

When you mix politics with religion, you get these entities:
-Hamas = Left wing political party with xenophobic tendencies.
-Zionism = Right wing political party with xenophobic tendencies.
-Vatican = Hegemonic political party in the middle ages with xenophobic tendencies, now just a proselitist political party.
-etc...

When you mix politics with nationalism, you get these entities:
Nazism = Extreme right wing political party with xenophobic tendencies.
Communism = Extreme left wing political party with xenophobic tendencies.


tl; dr:

You cannot criticize someone for being something he or she has no choice over it (being born within certain religion or ethnicity for instance); however, you can and should criticize ideas (such as religions or political movements) and conscious decisions.

[Autumnleaf]

	Originally Posted by Nonsuch To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	The strange thing is that while people complain that Jews are overrepresented in the lucrative and power-wielding professions, they don't complain that they are incompetent.

That is debatable. I know plenty of people who think the Chairman of the Fed is grossly incompetent.

---------- Post added 06-09-2011 at 08:17 AM ----------

	Originally Posted by Chr0n0s To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Jews are white predominantly. Are you trying to say that Jewish nepotism is supreme to White Supremacy ? I wish there were such a thing as human supremacy, maybe then we can stop fucking each other over.

Most powerful Jews do not privately identify themselves as white, in public it is often a different story depending on the audience they are speaking with. They identify themselves as Jews. Most white people don't know this and even if they did they still wouldn't understand the full extent of what it means because the public is ignorant about such distinctions.

[Zsych]

Originally Posted by Rudy To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Source? In all seriousness, that is. How is such a thing even defined? I'm not at all doubting that the Jews have faced some f-ing serious, heavy duty persecution through history. But, how does one say that they've been more persecuted than, say, sub-saharan africans? Or the untouchables caste in India? If it's number of people persecuted from each group through history, then the jews lose out to either of those. Is there some other standard you're using?

As far as I can tell, jews have managed to not be well looked upon (as a group) through much of history. Jews also make a bigger deal of the fact that they've been persecuted, something that most other groups don't do.

"I was better than them, and they hurt me, they deserve to suffer doubly so for that, and I deserve to get what I want more so for that"

--

Hmmm... kinda like INTJ in a way... bad attitudes.

[SowZ]

Originally Posted by Luthor To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I wouldn't call it prejudice. The jewish people (ethnic) have probably always been to some degree unliked because of their culture and/or genetic disposition. The standard answer when asking why jews most of history have been persecuted is that its because of having another religion/killing Jesus/ability to charge interest/ etc. This might have some bearing, but it doesn't explain all. The truth is it wasn't unusual for them to commit usury against poor and less educated people. Being able to collect interest on loans is fine, however, taking it too far too often doesn't bode well with the native inhabitants. When war broke out in Europe and also during the US civil war, it wasn't unusual for quite a few of them to keep themselves nearby the troops to haggle useless goods. Which perhaps doesn't sound that bad, but was frowned upon because of being opportunistic. Do some research about what the US founding fathers and great generals thought about jews and you'll be amazed of the reasons why they didn't appreciate them. It wasn't only because of them killing Jesus. I can go on and on about how they essentially was the active force behind communism in all of Europe, being moral destructors, being behind most of the things bad in eastern Europe (russian mafia(jewish mafia), trafficking, illegal organ trade, illegal weapons trade, theft of almost all of the russian natural resources)(this is thought to be totally understandable because of them hitting a glass ceiling in "corporate" Sovjet), being hated as Israelis in countries that have no history of anti-semitism, Israelis mistreatment of palestinians(not much better than the up til 1942 nazi treatment of jews)... Its not only because "they look funny and killed Jebus", which is the pc thing to say. Sometimes they have brought what was coming to themselves, sometimes they have been unjustly mistreated like nobody else. Nepotism is usual when it comes to jews and it doesn't take that many to get hold of alot of power since positions of real power are few. Their success isn't because of hight intelligence (average ashkenazi iq is 103, far to low to explain differences if population is taken into account), but some other reason such as nepotism, inferiority complex, greed...

Jewish culture teaches that debt is slavery and being a lendor is a blessing. It values financial stewardship and circulating money within the Jewish community for self-preservation and prosperous living. Being honest but shrewd in business is a virtue. If you see an opportunity, jump on it. Opportunismm may have been frowned upon. I really don't care. That doesn't make it wrong. If something terrible happens that you cause and you profit from it, that is wrong. If something terrible happens and you find a new market niche for it, good for you. You say yourself they haggled useless goods. It is not as if you are arguing they price gouged essential goods and strangled the market during hard times. No. They haggled. How does that hurt anyone?

Traditionally, the Hebrew people value literacy and education. So the families that honor this get good jobs in hard times. That pisses people off when their ethnic group struggles. No ethnic group is smarter or superior. But to say that historically Jews didn't value literacy more than some other groups? Well, I am not going to lie.

One of the Jews biggest 'crimes' is pissing off every other religous group. They have been enemies with the Catholics for a number of reasons. Early in Christian history, Jews persecute them. Later, Christains perescute Jews. And of course Jews and Muslims have been fighting for reasons I don't want to get into. So the Jews know how to make enemies of religous leaders. They are no more at fault for this than Muslims or Catholics. Everyone shares blame. But Judaism is not typically a prostelytizing religion unlike Islam/Christianity. There are fewer Jews than Christains/Muslims by quite a bit.

I have no doubt you can go on and on about how the most destructive ideas were made by Jews. You can probably go on and on about a lot of things. When you have real evidence to back any of this up, I will consider it. But if it is built upon layers and layers of , "if this happened, then this happened, too!" and "Well, assuming this was the case, then..." I will not be surprised.

Originally Posted by INTroJect To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

We were kind enough to let those people into our country after WWII, only to end up bamboozled into their stupid holy war conflict. They are like sleezy snake oil salesmen where they create a problem by fizzing up the middle east, only to make us think we have to give them money and resources to protect ourselves from the very problem that they are causing. They were probably causing similar problems in Germany until the people got fed up with it.

Any real arguments behind this? BTW, you weren't bamboozled into a holy war. You started one up again when you supported creating a Hebrew state on one of the most contested, if not the most fought over, plots of land in history.

The Germans were fed up with severe depression and post WWI debts out their ears. Don't make the cause of historical events about something they never were to support anti-semitism. Jews became the target of anger and frustration. Losing the war and the consequences caused the anger.

[Luthor]

	Originally Posted by Vagrant To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Err... To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

You really have no clue, do you?

	A lovely, if vague term.

Says all about you.

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.....you really have no clue. The Russian mafia have always been a jewish mafia. Fact.

	To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. These two companies were founded by Jewish people. There are more out there that are also quite successful. Chalk it up to nepotism, inferiority complex, and greed if you want to.

Well, it doesn't prove I'm wrong, thats for sure.

	Let's also not forget that many Jews have contributed to the history of America, and still do.

Goldman Sachs? Thank god for them. (Using your kind of arguments)

Originally Posted by zmo To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I was born a jew, but don't consider myself as one, I'm agnostic. All religions have only one purpose, to have control over the masses (that's the only useful thing that we learnt from Marx). ....... You cannot criticize someone for being something he or she has no choice over it (being born within certain religion or ethnicity for instance); however, you can and should criticize ideas (such as religions or political movements) and conscious decisions.

I agree on this, believe it or not. Doesn't take away that the secular jews are the ones that people tend to dislike.

Originally Posted by Autumnleaf To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

That is debatable. I know plenty of people who think the Chairman of the Fed is grossly incompetent. ---------- Post added 06-09-2011 at 08:17 AM ---------- Most powerful Jews do not privately identify themselves as white, in public it is often a different story depending on the audience they are speaking with. They identify themselves as Jews. Most white people don't know this and even if they did they still wouldn't understand the full extent of what it means because the public is ignorant about such distinctions.

This is true, not much else to say.

Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

As far as I can tell, jews have managed to not be well looked upon (as a group) through much of history. Jews also make a bigger deal of the fact that they've been persecuted, something that most other groups don't do. "I was better than them, and they hurt me, they deserve to suffer doubly so for that, and I deserve to get what I want more so for that" -- Hmmm... kinda like INTJ in a way... bad attitudes.

Also true.

Originally Posted by SowZ To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Jewish culture teaches that debt is slavery and being a lendor is a blessing. It values financial stewardship and circulating money within the Jewish community for self-preservation and prosperous living. Being honest but shrewd in business is a virtue. If you see an opportunity, jump on it. Opportunismm may have been frowned upon. I really don't care. That doesn't make it wrong. If something terrible happens that you cause and you profit from it, that is wrong. If something terrible happens and you find a new market niche for it, good for you. You say yourself they haggled useless goods. It is not as if you are arguing they price gouged essential goods and strangled the market during hard times. No. They haggled. How does that hurt anyone?

You've pretty much proven me right by writing this. Thank you.
Well those I was talking about were American jews, see where I'm going?

	Traditionally, the Hebrew people value literacy and education. So the families that honor this get good jobs in hard times. That pisses people off when their ethnic group struggles. No ethnic group is smarter or superior. But to say that historically Jews didn't value literacy more than some other groups? Well, I am not going to lie.

Well, they had no choice but to value literacy. I'm not contending you there.

One of the Jews biggest 'crimes' is pissing off every other religous group. They have been enemies with the Catholics for a number of reasons. Early in Christian history, Jews persecute them. Later, Christains perescute Jews. And of course Jews and Muslims have been fighting for reasons I don't want to get into. So the Jews know how to make enemies of religous leaders. They are no more at fault for this than Muslims or Catholics. Everyone shares blame. But Judaism is not typically a prostelytizing religion unlike Islam/Christianity. There are fewer Jews than Christains/Muslims by quite a bit.

This was a long time ago. Jews aren't disliked because of their religion, but their actions.

	I have no doubt you can go on and on about how the most destructive ideas were made by Jews. You can probably go on and on about a lot of things. When you have real evidence to back any of this up, I will consider it. But if it is built upon layers and layers of , "if this happened, then this happened, too!" and "Well, assuming this was the case, then..." I will not be surprised.

I haven't made any comments like that.
And no, you wouldn't consider it.

	Any real arguments behind this? BTW, you weren't bamboozled into a holy war. You started one up again when you supported creating a Hebrew state on one of the most contested, if not the most fought over, plots of land in history.

Just an observation of reality.

	The Germans were fed up with severe depression and post WWI debts out their ears. Don't make the cause of historical events about something they never were to support anti-semitism. Jews became the target of anger and frustration. Losing the war and the consequences caused the anger.

Loosing the war caused alot of hardship for the germans. It did not cause the anti-semitism.

[SowZ]

Originally Posted by Luthor To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

1.) You've pretty much proven me right by writing this. Thank you. Well those I was talking about were American jews, see where I'm going? 2.) Well, they had no choice but to value literacy. I'm not contending you there. 3.) This was a long time ago. Jews aren't disliked because of their religion, but their actions. 4.) I haven't made any comments like that. And no, you wouldn't consider it. 5.) Just an observation of reality. Loosing the war caused alot of hardship for the germans. It did not cause the anti-semitism.

1.) So the Jews are immoral for knowing how to work well within Capitalism? If the Jews adapted quicker to capitalism than other groups it is because principles of capitalism are part of the culture. Traditionally, Jews respect ambition, as well. This is true of many cultures. You can call this greed if you want to.

2.) So do you think literacy had anything to do with their ability to have good positions in society historically?

3.) What actions? Having a number of successful people and a sense of Hebrew community? Reacting to a Jewish state the exact way any rational person should have expected they would react to it when Israel was founded? What?

4.) You haven't made any comments like that because you haven't provided any real evidence or argumentation for most of your claims. You can think I would not read your sources. (If it is a study done by whitesupremacist.com, no, I won't waste my time. Otherwise, bring it on.) But you are the one making claims. If you say , "X, Y, and Z are all true!" someone responds with, "Any evidence?" and you say, "You wouldn't believe me' anyway." You are being ignorant.

5.) Yeah? Anti-semitism was around in Germany before WWI, sure. But the true anger didn't come until people couldn't eat. And that wasn't the Jews fault. That was the fault of a stupid war.If you disagree with me, show me why. Don't just say, 'It is the truth. You are all too PC to see it.'

[Fox]

Jews aren't the only persecuted people. As a matter of fact they pretty well for themselves all things considered. That's gotta piss off some people. Then the Jews have to complain and whine about everything. That's gotta piss them off even more. Man how dare they have the nerve to over come past hardships. Those Jews are like totally taking over. The other day at the market I saw Mini-Bagel Pizza bites. That was part of the back room deal between the Jew who secretly financed World War 2 with both sides. If the Allied won. The Jews would get total control of Italy. Now their corrupting our youth with they mini-bagel pizza bites.

[Vagrant]

	You really have no clue, do you?

Oh, you mean MARX? The Jewish guy who philosophized up communism? And whose ideas were totally misconstrued and abused to effectively establish dictatorship instead of what he outlined as communism?

Yep. Definitely his fault.

	Says all about you.

Way to go for the ad hom! Hurraaaa!!!

	.....you really have no clue. The Russian mafia have always been a jewish mafia. Fact.

If you have this "fact," then please cite it.


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In other words, this guy is a dickhead. Not a reason to blame all the Jews.

	Well, it doesn't prove I'm wrong, thats for sure.

That's what happens when your argument is
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.

	Goldman Sachs? Thank god for them. (Using your kind of arguments)

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(technically my mother is in here too)

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(My grandma belongs to this group)

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(My grandpa was a doctor in WWII, and I'm a biologist now. Lots of Nobel Prizes)

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(couple of Nobel prizes here)

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(My brother works for Google, and my uncle is also a computer scientist)

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(including Albert Einstein, I might add. Lots of Nobel Prizewinners)

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Hum-de-dum. Wikipedia is amazing.

Some of the companies I'm seeing founded by American Jews...

Calvin Klein
Levi Strauss
Starbucks
Goldman Sachs
Home Depot
Price Club (merged with Costco)
Google
Oracle Corporation
FullPower and Borland (same guy also invented the cameraphone)
Facebook
Compaq
Columbia Pictures
Dreamworks
Universal Pictures
Metro-Goldwyn-Meyer
CBS
Viacom
NBC
Warner Brothers
Miramax
Paramount Pictures

(I should also point out that Facebook and Google have something of a rivalry)

	Jews aren't disliked because of their religion, but their actions.

So I should dislike all Germans because of Hitler and the Holocaust? I should dislike all Palestinians because of the ongoing conflict? I should should dislike Russians because of the cold war?

Criminal acts and misbehaviors are the result of individuals. Blaming an entire ethnic or religious group for one person's actions is a big misstep.

Jews aren't the only persecuted people. As a matter of fact they pretty well for themselves all things considered. That's gotta piss off some people. Then the Jews have to complain and whine about everything. That's gotta piss them off even more. Man how dare they have the nerve to over come past hardships. Those Jews are like totally taking over. The other day at the market I saw Mini-Bagel Pizza bites. That was part of the back room deal between the Jew who secretly financed World War 2 with both sides. If the Allied won. The Jews would get total control of Italy. Now their corrupting our youth with they mini-bagel pizza bites.

Thanks god I have your earlier post to recognize your sarcasm. >.>

[Luthor]

	Originally Posted by Vagrant To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Oh, you mean MARX? The Jewish guy who philosophized up communism? And whose ideas were totally misconstrued and abused to effectively establish dictatorship instead of what he outlined as communism?

More like these guys:

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	Way to go for the ad hom! Hurraaaa!!!

I'm not totally ignorant, please read again.



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	To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. In other words, this guy is a dickhead. Not a reason to blame all the Jews.

Not just any guy. The guy. Also quite hard to find hard evidence about criminal elements in rotten societies. Russian mafia has had a disproportionate number of jewish leaders (not only in the sense of being the highest leader) just as with communism.

To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. (technically my mother is in here too) To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. (My grandma belongs to this group) To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. (My grandpa was a doctor in WWII, and I'm a biologist now. Lots of Nobel Prizes) To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. (couple of Nobel prizes here) To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. (My brother works for Google, and my uncle is also a computer scientist) To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. (including Albert Einstein, I might add. Lots of Nobel Prizewinners) To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Probably good people. I don't contest you with that. I don't mean to attack all jews, I just believe theres something seriously rotten with their culture which only focus is themselves. Divide and conquer. Always an agenda.

Some of the companies I'm seeing founded by American Jews... Calvin Klein Levi Strauss Starbucks Goldman Sachs Home Depot Price Club (merged with Costco) Google Oracle Corporation FullPower and Borland (same guy also invented the cameraphone) Facebook Compaq Columbia Pictures Dreamworks Universal Pictures Metro-Goldwyn-Meyer CBS Viacom NBC Warner Brothers Miramax Paramount Pictures (I should also point out that Facebook and Google have something of a rivalry)

Alot of media I see(joke aside).

	So I should dislike all Germans because of Hitler and the Holocaust? I should dislike all Palestinians because of the ongoing conflict? I should should dislike Russians because of the cold war?

1.Germans
You should, but then they would dislike you once again.

2.Palestinians
They should dislike the israelis. Not the other way around. Not too many jews/israelis like palestinians/muslims.

3.Russians
No need, what did they actually do to americans?

	Criminal acts and misbehaviors are the result of individuals. Blaming an entire ethnic or religious group for one person's actions is a big misstep.

Well, Israel is pretty much a window to how the average jew thinks, its a democracy.

I dont have time nor interest in continuing on this subject, since I don't have an agenda believe it or not. Unlike some other here. You can call it a forfeit to the supreme jewish culture and minds.

Hope the IDL is paying you good.

[Vagrant]

	More like these guys: To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Control + F + "Jew" = 1 Result

"right-wing extremists (especially certain members of the former officer corps) used the Dolchstoßlegende for blaming an alleged conspiracy of Socialists and Jews for Germany's defeat in World War I."

	I'm not totally ignorant, please read again. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Oh? Do explain?

	I just believe theres something seriously rotten with their culture which only focus is themselves. Divide and conquer. Always an agenda.

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!
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.

	1.Germans You should, but then they would dislike you once again. 2.Palestinians They should dislike the israelis. Not the other way around. Not too many jews/israelis like palestinians/muslims. 3.Russians No need, what did they actually do to americans?

You missed the point entirely. I do not judge people based on their birth or origin. I judge them based on how they treat me. And yes, I have German, Palestinian, and Russian friends. They also recognize me as an individual.

	Well, Israel is pretty much a window to how the average jew thinks, its a democracy.

Are you daft? Germany was a democracy until Hitler. He got voted in, but not by a simple majority. That doesn't represent the average German's thinking at the time.

Israel is a state governed by people with a
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. Many Jews disagree with this train of thought. Not to mention, a government's actions do not display how an average Jew thinks. Because if that's the case,
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.
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.

	I dont have time nor interest in continuing on this subject, since I don't have an agenda believe it or not. Unlike some other here. You can call it a forfeit to the supreme jewish culture and minds. Hope the IDL is paying you good.

When all else fails, resort to the ad hominem!

Protip: Wanna know my "secret agenda"? I don't want people to insult me or my family for simply being Jewish. I'd rather be insulted on my own merits.

[SowZ]

Originally Posted by Luthor To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

More like these guys: To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. I'm not totally ignorant, please read again. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Not just any guy. The guy. Also quite hard to find hard evidence about criminal elements in rotten societies. Russian mafia has had a disproportionate number of jewish leaders (not only in the sense of being the highest leader) just as with communism. Probably good people. I don't contest you with that. I don't mean to attack all jews, I just believe theres something seriously rotten with their culture which only focus is themselves. Divide and conquer. Always an agenda. Alot of media I see(joke aside). 1.Germans You should, but then they would dislike you once again. 2.Palestinians They should dislike the israelis. Not the other way around. Not too many jews/israelis like palestinians/muslims. 3.Russians No need, what did they actually do to americans? Well, Israel is pretty much a window to how the average jew thinks, its a democracy. I dont have time nor interest in continuing on this subject, since I don't have an agenda believe it or not. Unlike some other here. You can call it a forfeit to the supreme jewish culture and minds. Hope the IDL is paying you good.

So I should hate Germans, but then they are justified in hating me back. Blacks should hate whites for the oppression, but of course that would mean whites are justified in hating back. Japanese should hate Americans, but then that would mean... etc. etc. etc.

What does all this hate do? What good does it serve to hate a country or an ethnic group, rather than blame individuals? What will any of this accomplish? And how is it justified to hate someone for something that they didn't do?

[esperanza]

	Originally Posted by Luthor To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Well, Israel is pretty much a window to how the average jew thinks, its a democracy.

Reading the diverse range of high quality opinion and literature that comes out of Israel would suggest otherwise. Leaving aside the millions of Jewish people who live outside of Israel and don't participate in its democracy.

No, I'm not Jewish, and I'm not a particular fan of the Israeli government. Or of Hamas, for that matter.

[Luthor]

	Originally Posted by Vagrant To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Control + F + "Jew" = 1 Result "right-wing extremists (especially certain members of the former officer corps) used the Dolchstoßlegende for blaming an alleged conspiracy of Socialists and Jews for Germany's defeat in World War I."

Trying not to offend you, but did you read the names and bio of the communist leaders? Or did that just slip by?

Read again:

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	Oh? Do explain?

The link wasn't meant to be related to that comment. That comment was about my sarcastic remark of Goldman Sachs. I'm fully aware of that people of jewish decent have started alot of successful companies.

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So, since when is wikipedia a source of the truth and the whole truth? In the afghan culture page, does it say that pedofilia is a part of their culture?

	To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. ! To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. .

This isn't the first time youre on the defence is it? You sure know alot about argument techniques. Are you sure youre just not another rampant JDL:er.

	You missed the point entirely. I do not judge people based on their birth or origin. I judge them based on how they treat me. And yes, I have German, Palestinian, and Russian friends. They also recognize me as an individual.

I recognize you as an individual too. You just seem to be one of those that have to defend or marginalize whatever critique or observation that has been made about Israel/jewish culture. The holocaust was probably the worst thing to ever have happened in Europe, but you don't see any german worthwhile denying it or marginalizing it. Whats happening in Gaza is comparable to Warsaw. But the terrorist palestinians should blame themselves, right? Shame on them for being oppressed.

	Are you daft? Germany was a democracy until Hitler. He got voted in, but not by a simple majority. That doesn't represent the average German's thinking at the time.

True, they didn't know what monster he was. Israelis do know what kind of person Lieberman is. Still he is your deputy prime minister.

And this is your prime minister Netanyahu:

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And for example, isn't this something that has an resemblance to something else:

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Israel is a state governed by people with a To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. . Many Jews disagree with this train of thought. Not to mention, a government's actions do not display how an average Jew thinks. Because if that's the case, To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. . To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. .

I do believe that a majority of jews are zionists. "Many" is a subjective word, something youre accusing me for being, and I am in a way. At least I'm not denying it. You can always find a rationality behind everything.

	When all else fails, resort to the ad hominem!

After looking at wikipedia what that terribly difficult word meant, I couldn't agree more:

	The ad hominem is normally described as a logical fallacy,[2] but it is not always fallacious; in some instances, questions of personal conduct, character, motives, etc., are legitimate and relevant to the issue.[3]

Originally Posted by SowZ To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

So I should hate Germans, but then they are justified in hating me back. Blacks should hate whites for the oppression, but of course that would mean whites are justified in hating back. Japanese should hate Americans, but then that would mean... etc. etc. etc. What does all this hate do? What good does it serve to hate a country or an ethnic group, rather than blame individuals? What will any of this accomplish? And how is it justified to hate someone for something that they didn't do?

Of course its better if people could get along on equal terms. But some just don't see it that way.

	Reading the diverse range of high quality opinion and literature that comes out of Israel would suggest otherwise. Leaving aside the millions of Jewish people who live outside of Israel and don't participate in its democracy. No, I'm not Jewish, and I'm not a particular fan of the Israeli government. Or of Hamas, for that matter.

Any jew can almost immediately become an Israeli citizen (don't recognize this in any other christian western country). And allot of jews that don't live in Israel are Israeli citizens. And concerning the opinions and literature, how come they always seem to elect warmongers and likes?

I don't want to continue discussing this, since I really have no interest in it. But if you continue to quote me I will feel obliged to. I don't dislike all jews and I sure as hell don't like to dislike. I wouldn't discriminate, act disrespectful or look down upon a jew for being a jew. But nothing has ever proven my general prejudice wrong. That most of them are self-righteous, self-serving, ethnocentric, manipulating and hypocritical.

If I'm wrong about this, I'm the only one who looses.

[SowZ]

Originally Posted by Luthor To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Trying not to offend you, but did you read the names and bio of the communist leaders? Or did that just slip by? Read again: To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. The link wasn't meant to be related to that comment. That comment was about my sarcastic remark of Goldman Sachs. I'm fully aware of that people of jewish decent have started alot of successful companies. So, since when is wikipedia a source of the truth and the whole truth? In the afghan culture page, does it say that pedofilia is a part of their culture? This isn't the first time youre on the defence is it? You sure know alot about argument techniques. Are you sure youre just not another rampant JDL:er. I recognize you as an individual too. You just seem to be one of those that have to defend or marginalize whatever critique or observation that has been made about Israel/jewish culture. The holocaust was probably the worst thing to ever have happened in Europe, but you don't see any german worthwhile denying it or marginalizing it. Whats happening in Gaza is comparable to Warsaw. But the terrorist palestinians should blame themselves, right? Shame on them for being oppressed. True, they didn't know what monster he was. Israelis do know what kind of person Lieberman is. Still he is your deputy prime minister. And this is your prime minister Netanyahu: To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. And for example, isn't this something that has an resemblance to something else: To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. I do believe that a majority of jews are zionists. "Many" is a subjective word, something youre accusing me for being, and I am in a way. At least I'm not denying it. You can always find a rationality behind everything. After looking at wikipedia what that terribly difficult word meant, I couldn't agree more: Of course its better if people could get along on equal terms. But some just don't see it that way. Any jew can almost immediately become an Israeli citizen (don't recognize this in any other christian western country). And allot of jews that don't live in Israel are Israeli citizens. And concerning the opinions and literature, how come they always seem to elect warmongers and likes? I don't want to continue discussing this, since I really have no interest in it. But if you continue to quote me I will feel obliged to. I don't dislike all jews and I sure as hell don't like to dislike. I wouldn't discriminate, act disrespectful or look down upon a jew for being a jew. But nothing has ever proven my general prejudice wrong. That most of them are self-righteous, self-serving, ethnocentric, manipulating and hypocritical. If I'm wrong about this, I'm the only one who looses.

Hitler was elected after staging a military coupe and one of his primary platforms was his hatred of Jews. Would most Germans have supported the extent to which Hitler persecuted Jews? No, of course not. Did they enable it and openly support lesser levels of perescution, including eviction from homes/businesses?

	Of course its better if people could get along on equal terms. But some just don't see it that way.

Apparently you don't see it that way either if you think it is justified to hate modern Germans for WWII.

Yes, the Israeli government persecutes its neighbors. It is wrong. It should also have been expected. There is a rivalry that has gone on for a very long time there and were Jews on the other end of it, Palestinians would likely be just as brutal. All parties stirring up the conflict, whether Jewish or Muslim or neither, are displaying ignorance. But that doesn't mean the Jews that support it are evil any more than the Palestinians who fight Jews are evil. Ignorant and possibly slighly brainwashed.

[Luthor]

First of all, thank you for asking questions in a civil manner. I like when people try to prove me wrong or at least that my trail of thought is wrong and I'm open for changing my mind. Discussing without being on a rampage at least makes me listen.

	Originally Posted by SowZ To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Hitler was elected after staging a military coupe and one of his primary platforms was his hatred of Jews. Would most Germans have supported the extent to which Hitler persecuted Jews? No, of course not. Did they enable it and openly support lesser levels of perescution, including eviction from homes/businesses?

Yes, he didn't try to hide that he was an anti-semite. Alot of Germans were probably anti-semites too and supported some levels of persecution.
This paved the way for what you probably call "capitalism", I call it opportunism, where average Germans (some of them didn't probably even vote on the NS-party, correct me if I'm wrong) saw their chance to get a nice apartment or factory for a minimal price, even if they had nothing to do with the eviction.
I for one don't think this is acceptable.
Some of you perhaps believes that this is a case of if I don't someone else will, but this is what morals are for and jews have usually been destuctors of morals. This is the equivalent of what Israel does to Palestinans with the settlements and everyone with more than half a brain knows this.
And if that many jews dislikes this, why don't you get your asses off your couches and become citizens and change Israel to a respectable country, so that you don't have to make excuses like "but look at our neighbors, they are worse than us".
Well you give democracy a bad name.
Keyword here is democracy, and a democracy usually reflects the opinions of its citizens.

	Apparently you don't see it that way either if you think it is justified to hate modern Germans for WWII.

I was mostly just upset of your unwillingness to understand that the ability to be a successful capitalist/opportunist (capitalism is good, however it should be coupled with a social responsibility and morals) isn't always a positive trait. Well, you didn't exactly crush my prejudices about jews there, rather you cemented it.

The difference here is that the Germans have stopped, while the jews continue to behave like assholes.

Yes, the Israeli government persecutes its neighbors. It is wrong. It should also have been expected. There is a rivalry that has gone on for a very long time there and were Jews on the other end of it, Palestinians would likely be just as brutal. All parties stirring up the conflict, whether Jewish or Muslim or neither, are displaying ignorance. But that doesn't mean the Jews that support it are evil any more than the Palestinians who fight Jews are evil. Ignorant and possibly slighly brainwashed.

Well, thats wrong, just look how it was there before 1948. There might have been some kind of tensions, but nothing thats comparable to what is happening today. The difference is that the jews are the occupiers and the Palestinians are robbed of their lands. So in a way the jews that are defending it are way worse than the palestinians that defend what was once theirs.

[Haumea]

	average ashkenazi iq is 103, far to low to explain differences if population is taken into account

You're kidding, right?

Average Ashkenazi IQ may be 103 in Israel. In the US (and probably the West in general) it's closer to 111.

There's no "nepotism" or affirmative action for Jews in American higher education.

[phoboser]

	Originally Posted by Luthor To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	That most of them are self-righteous, self-serving, ethnocentric, manipulating and hypocritical.

How ethnocentric can most of them be with a Jewish-Gentile intermarriage rate of 52% in America?


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[Luthor]

	Originally Posted by Haumea To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	You're kidding, right? Average Ashkenazi IQ may be 103 in Israel. In the US (and probably the West in general) it's probably closer to 111. There's no "nepotism" or affirmative action for Jews in American higher education.

Seriously, after all I've written you choose to comment this.

Did I poke a hole in your bloated jewish ego? I don't give any of those research studies much validity but it seems the one with 103 is the most comprehensive one. I bet you're one of those who base your existence on superior Ashkenazi intelligence, genetic of course. Even your beloved somali jews did quite a jump in IQ after living in Israel for a while.

Where have I stated that theres nepotism in American higher education? I have no idea if there is. However, theres nothing new with jewish nepotism otherwise.

	How ethnocentric can most of them be with a Jewish-Gentile intermarriage rate of 52% in America? To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Compared to others they do seem ethnocentric, they always point out that they are jewish (in a ethnic sense(see quote above yours)), right?

[Haumea]

	Did I poke a hole in your bloated jewish ego? I don't give any of those research studies much validity but it seems the one with 103 is the most comprehensive one.

In other words: you believe whichever study confirms your prejudices. My "ego" is offended whenever I read blatant bullshit about many things, those completely unrelated to Jews as well.

	Where have I stated that theres nepotism in American higher education?

If there isn't, then how do you explain the significant overrepresentation of Jews at all levels of American academia? IQ has something to do with that, no?

	Even your beloved somali jews did quite a jump in IQ after living in Israel for a while.

Your point is...?

What exactly is your IQ? I'm unimpressed.

[Luthor]

	Originally Posted by Haumea To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	In other words: you believe whichever study confirms your prejudices. My "ego" is offended whenever I read blatant bullshit about many things, those completely unrelated to Jews as well.

From wikipedia:

	Cochran et al. write that according to some studies from the 1970s Ashkenazi Jews score 0.75 to 1.0 standard deviations above the general European average.

"some studies in the 70s", yeah that seems carved in stone.

	Lynn and Longley in a 2006 review write that the best reading of Jews in Britain is 110 and in the US is 109.5.[5] Brian Ferguson writes that 90% of US Jews are Ashkenazi and that US data usually do not discriminate origin.[6]

If I used someone like Lynn as a source, I would have gotten shit for it, but you can?

At least the last one showing an IQ of 103 of ashkenazi jews in Israel show in my view a more probable result since its probably made in a less environment affected way. Just like any other country.

	If there isn't, then how do you explain the significant overrepresentation of Jews at all levels of American academia? IQ has something to do with that, no?

Its a part of your culture?

	Your point is...?

IQ probably isn't as effected by genetics as you might think. Also that you "real"(ashkenazi is thought to be of 35-55% european decent, perhaps thats where you got your IQ from) jews doesn't seem to appreciate your black brothers that much.

	What exactly is your IQ? I'm unimpressed.

I bet its higher than yours, for sure.

[Vagrant]

	Trying not to offend you, but did you read the names and bio of the communist leaders? Or did that just slip by?

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-- In revolution against the Weimar Republic (which was pretty crappy to be honest). Murdered.

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-- Social democrat (SPD, oldest party still in germany), pacifist. Got the boot from the party, created another one (disagreed with Rosa's). Lost in the election. Killed by a mentally ill leather worker.

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-- Joined Hugo Haase's party. Disagreed with Marx on several things. Died of age.

Really? Three people? Clearly a Jewish conspiracy.

	So, since when is wikipedia a source of the truth and the whole truth? In the afghan culture page, does it say that pedofilia is a part of their culture?

Uhh no?

Wikipedia is useful as a quick and objective source of information on the internet. It's not always the most accurate, and is subject to change. But your generalizations have no source to back them up, and I'm using wikipedia which is still disproving your point. I can get more sources, but I'm not gonna put in the effort until you do.

	This isn't the first time youre on the defence is it? You sure know alot about argument techniques. Are you sure youre just not another rampant JDL:er.

Ignoring the grammar glitches here, I'm pointing out how fallacious your arguments are. And no, I don't belong to the JDL, or any other Jewish association for that matter.

	You just seem to be one of those that have to defend or marginalize whatever critique or observation that has been made about Israel/jewish culture.

Uhhh... because these critiques are fallacious. Jewish culture is not the same as Israeli culture. Israeli culture is not unified. Jewish culture is not unified. You seem to assume that they're all similar. It's like saying American culture is all cowboys shooting guns and going out and killing people. That's a minor fraction of American culture.

	Whats happening in Gaza is comparable to Warsaw. But the terrorist palestinians should blame themselves, right? Shame on them for being oppressed.

Again, the issue is more complex than that, and is rooted in history as well.

	Still he is your deputy prime minister.

My "prime minister" is Obama. I live in America.

	After looking at wikipedia what that terribly difficult word meant, I couldn't agree more:

And I've already told you my motives. And my background. Do you really want me to start handing out my personal information now?

	And concerning the opinions and literature, how come they always seem to elect warmongers and likes?

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That's why.

	But nothing has ever proven my general prejudice wrong. That most of them are self-righteous, self-serving, ethnocentric, manipulating and hypocritical.

Really? Do you need me to say anything else?

[Luthor]

Originally Posted by Vagrant To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. -- In revolution against the Weimar Republic (which was pretty crappy to be honest). Murdered. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. -- Social democrat (SPD, oldest party still in germany), pacifist. Got the boot from the party, created another one (disagreed with Rosa's). Lost in the election. Killed by a mentally ill leather worker. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. -- Joined Hugo Haase's party. Disagreed with Marx on several things. Died of age. Really? Three people? Clearly a Jewish conspiracy.

And you are calling me daft? 7 out of 7 leaders in that revolution were jewish. And yes the Weimar Republic was pretty bad, but at least it wasn't communist. Why did you leave out these, this was how the general european communist party looked like. Grossly overrepresented by jews:


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	Wikipedia is useful as a quick and objective source of information on the internet. It's not always the most accurate, and is subject to change. But your generalizations have no source to back them up, and I'm using wikipedia which is still disproving your point. I can get more sources, but I'm not gonna put in the effort until you do.

Where does it disprove my point, you're using glorifying wiki-articles about the torah secular jewish culture etc. Wheres is everything in those articles that says that jews should marry their nieces, ok to rob goys of their possessions etc.

	Ignoring the grammar glitches here, I'm pointing out how fallacious your arguments are. And no, I don't belong to the JDL, or any other Jewish association for that matter.

Then you're just ignorant.

	Uhhh... because these critiques are fallacious. Jewish culture is not the same as Israeli culture. Israeli culture is not unified. Jewish culture is not unified. You seem to assume that they're all similar. It's like saying American culture is all cowboys shooting guns and going out and killing people. That's a minor fraction of American culture.

Well, again you are marginalizing. You can't compare Israel and America. America is by no means the perfect country, but ages ahead of Israel. America doesn't cage half a million people and use excessive violence against them.

	Again, the issue is more complex than that, and is rooted in history as well.

Please tell me then. And don't dig up that book of yours that states that Israel only belongs to the chosen people.

And I've already told you my motives. And my background. Do you really want me to start handing out my personal information now? To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. That's why.

You pretty much left out the massacres of civilian Palestinans,
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(another prime minister), why do you only leave out information that doesn't further your goal, even when you know about them and hope I'm too lazy to get the sources, I don't have time to get sources about everything, but atleast try to get some.
Israels philosophy seems to be that if you kill one of ours we'll kill your civilians in a ratio of 1:500.

	Really? Do you need me to say anything else?

No, please don't. Just don't leave out information that is right under your nose. Thats worse than not finding explicit sources for everything. You're purposely manipulating.

[thod]

I kinda like Jews but I wish they would quit with all the "oppressed throughout history" line. Like the Jews were some kind of saints that never did anything to deserve it. I have read comments of the time and they were regarded as rascals. We have all met those shady characters, with uncertain income sources, who always seem to have some scheme on the go. Hardly surprising the good citizens of the county got upset about them and decided to kick them out.

Shylock reflects the image as seen by the gentiles of the time. If you read the Magna Carta you will find Jews are specifically referenced and not favourably.

The question is: Did the Jews deserve it?