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ESFP + INTJ relationships intj and esfp, relationships
Old 12-20-2010, 11:50 AM   #1
evilfluffy
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Do you know any ESFP and INTJ that worked out? or those that didnt. I read bunch of things from online and this forum. This personality thing is pretty accurate.
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Old 12-20-2010, 11:52 AM   #2
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ESFP/INTJ is hard. Obviously it must work for some people. Its mostly about communication and being able to appreciate the things that the other person appreciates... or being willing to let go of that fact that you're not going to connect well in some areas and appreciating the ways you do connect in.

If you're dealing with an INTJ, you may want to actually discuss that with him. Both the working to understand each other, and accepting what's different between you.

Personally, I find that I hurt the feelings of ESFPs unintentionally because they're trying to find negative emotions where there aren't, or not seeing that I view criticism as something very valuable ("You mean, you don't think I'm awesome?" *sobbing* - sheesh - "I wouldn't be talking to you if I didn't have a decently positive opinion of you, but you're not a goddess, at least not yet")
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Old 12-20-2010, 12:48 PM   #3
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The thing about INTJs is that we have dominant Ni and inferior Se, whereas ESFPs have dominant Se and inferior Ni. IMO this is the main source of conflicts, since it reflects the very way we think, and INTJs (perhaps more so than most people) like to be understood by those select few people we let in.
I know a few ESFPs, and I can't imagine a less compatible type. We just don't click. ENFPs on the other hand, are really interesting and fun to be around, and probably one of my favourite types, despite differing by only a single attribute.
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the best (i.e. most likely to succeed) pairings have partners with inverted versions of their dominant functions. e.g. INTJs (with dominant Ni) would be best off with a partner with dominant Ne.
The F/T thing can also be an issue, but we typically figure it out when the tertiary function develops in our 20s. Inferior develops in the 40s so it's more of an issue.

That said, it's totally possible that a relationship could work if you're both mature and willing to put some effort in. But in practice, it's probably one of the least likely pairings to work out.
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Old 12-20-2010, 01:25 PM   #4
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It`s fun for a while, but getting into a serious relationship would most likely lead to disaster.
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Old 12-20-2010, 02:15 PM   #5
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Unless you're up-front and accepting of the issues. Its not like ESFP aren't plenty likable.
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Old 12-21-2010, 05:09 AM   #6
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I thought I come out of lurking to reply to this topic. I was in a relationship with an ESFP for about 9 months. At first everything was fantastic. It was as if she complemented me in every way simply because she was so different. Where I tended to be more serious, driven, and decisive, she was playful, open-ended, and sociable. Everything I lacked she had and visa versa.

After about two months, however, these differences really became an issue and lead to a rocky 6 more months. I would say the biggest issue was how we dealt with disagreements. I would always want to talk about (admittedly maybe too much and too often) our problems and see if we could find a solution/compromise. She never ever wanted to discuss anything in the slightest that was uncomfortable or "too serious." I was actually dumped or threaten with possibility of being dumped several times during our relationship. This always occurred when we had arguments and she would always come back asking for forgiveness as if it was no big deal.

Looking back I guess I should have known better, but I let very few individuals get so close to me and I did not want to believe that she could be so (in my mind) callous. Throughout the relationship I always felt I was pressured to keep my own grievances to myself but be totally accepting of hers. I know the perception of INTJs is that we are unemotional but in my case this is not true. I may not show it externally like everyone else but I was hurt deeply. We currently trying to be friends, but even now it feels rocky at best.

I am sorry for the wall of text. I could really go on more but I see no point. I would like to end by saying that despite my experience, I believe love is not determined by type and can work out between any two mature adults. Subjectively I would say that in an INTJ/ESFP relationship, the INTJ needs to really focus on letting their guard down and not be so theoretical but more practical in speech and action. An ESFP should learn to not runaway from disagreements and instead see them as opportunities for growth. I am generalizing of course...
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Old 12-21-2010, 06:08 AM   #7
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There have been posters in the past saying they are a married ESFP/INTJ couple...

My experience was scarily similar to Otto. We broke up in the end because I realised in the long term I didn't think I could trust her. Not relationship wise just with everything in general. One month I would think she had things sorted out only to find she would soon decide on something completely different. To be honest I think I might have still been a bit stale for her even though she had matured some what and I don't think she appreciated how much effort it took for me to go along with her sometimes. Essentially I think I preferred things to have a basic order it seems to me she was only happy when things were in flux... I could go on.. but wow, what a ride.
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The final stages of our relationship are
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; for what its worth.

She was the most kind hearted person I've ever gotten along with and I still miss her despite it all.
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Old 12-29-2010, 03:49 PM   #8
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I'm married to an ESFP man and it has been a struggle. I posted elsewhere that he doesn't understand me. I admit I've hurt his feelings without meaning to. We are working on it now. I was set to leave this past summer and he was SHOCKED at the news! I thought, how can you be shocked? Things haven't been good in ages. He got very clingly and very needy in response to my announcement that we were done. He has some other issues, some depression thrown into the mix so although he is very charming and fun he can be very negative as well.
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Old 12-30-2010, 03:41 AM   #9
JulietCapulet
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I have know of one INTJ woman who likes an ESFP man. They may get married in the future because the INTJ won't give up on him. She is patient. Waiting now four years for interest to kindle and be reciprocated. Therefore she may find success in her romantic endeavor.
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Old 12-30-2010, 01:22 PM   #10
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  Originally Posted by evilfluffy
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Do you know any ESFP and INTJ that worked out? or those that didnt. I read bunch of things from online and this forum. This personality thing is pretty accurate.

I have friends that I believe are ESFP and I believe that my father is ESFP. I like ESFP's for about the first hour and then I need to get away. I believe that a marriage with an ESFP would be very difficult.

If anyone is going to pay attention to anything socionics has to say...please pay attention to what they say about conflicting relations INTj+ESFp=blood, sweat and tears. I realize that INTJ in MBTI might be INTp in socionics so....disregard if necessary.

I've been married to an ESFJ for 9 years and its been very satisfying and rewarding but the ESFP is a different creature, I would strongly advise any INTJ/INTj to not go there.

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Old 12-30-2010, 02:58 PM   #11
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I'd imagine this to be very hard. A lot of basic needs are different (e.g. INTJs require people are very literal and reliable, where as ESFPs tend to be far more "unbound" and spontatneous).

It could, of course, work, but it's going to be a bit harder.
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Old 12-30-2010, 06:15 PM   #12
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  Originally Posted by JulietCapulet
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I have know of one INTJ woman who likes an ESFP man. They may get married in the future because the INTJ won't give up on him. She is patient. Waiting now four years for interest to kindle and be reciprocated. Therefore she may find success in her romantic endeavor.


Tell her to give up. There's pain just reading this. After 4 years he hasn't reciprocated? Get her to a therapist.

If I found out someone's type was ESFP, I would seriously consider not dating. This may sound silly, but I had an ltr with an ESFP. Not sure how much is type and how much is due to personal problems, but I'm still trying to recover.

Is it my imagination or do they have a way of turning problems back around to you? Something like, even if they are the source of the problem, don't complain because you'll mess up their day. Have a nice day-ay! *said sarcastically of course*

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Old 12-30-2010, 08:33 PM   #13
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  Originally Posted by GettingBetter
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Is it my imagination or do they have a way of turning problems back around to you? Something like, even if they are the source of the problem, don't complain because you'll mess up their day. Have a nice day-ay! *said sarcastically of course*

You can't be blunt or critical when you think you need to be because yeah, you will spoil what ever moment they are in. Instead you're supposed to sugar coat it and address it when the time is 'right'. They often think the best time is in a heated argument when everything gets aired into some kind of emotional confusion and someone either ends up storming off or crying. The more public this display is, the better.

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Old 12-30-2010, 08:33 PM   #14
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  Originally Posted by GettingBetter
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Tell her to give up. There's pain just reading this. After 4 years he hasn't reciprocated? Get her to a therapist.

Indeed. 4 years?! That INTJ has serious issues to work out. Or else she is 15 and still needs to grow up.

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Old 12-30-2010, 10:21 PM   #15
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hrmmm.....in a 2 year relationship with an ESFP male (i'm INTJ female) RUN FOR THE WIND. our relationship broke up a few months ago over major miscommunication. the idiot had absolutely no clue to my unhappiness (yes, that he caused, and yes-that i put up with for too long) Otto said "Throughout the relationship I always felt I was pressured to keep my own grievances to myself but be totally accepting of hers." and JC did that hit home. this was the entire 2nd year of our relationship. my ESFP is like a puppy who is whining at night and you want to teach them discipline and keep them in their kennel but they are so cute and sad (and annoying) that you let them on the bed with you and youre screwed for the next 15 years because you have a 90lb dog taking over your bed. we broke up, realized we 'loved' one another a couple months later, and have been currently trying to work things out. do you have any possible idea how HARD it is to try and get back together with someone who doesnt want to discuss it? who gets anxious and annoyed after 15 minutes of 'deep discussion'? someone who goes with their feelings and the here and now rather than the system of building a proper foundation for the future along with dealing with recongnition and forgiveness of the past? if you want to find out-date an ESFP. perhaps it's better to just buy them a pretty dog collar and let them up on the bed with you. pretty sure if you're an INTJ-that wont be ok.
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Old 12-30-2010, 10:39 PM   #16
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Here's an idea; get the dog collar and put it to a kinky use. Maybe make that kink an entire lifestyle. Otherwise (or even so), run to the hills! Run for your life!

According to Socionics, ESFp-INTj is a Conflicting relationship. That said, MBTI --> Socionics type equivalency is as follows...

Extraverts are usually the same in MBTI as in Socionics, but Introverts may have their orientation (___X) swapped.

So...
ENTJ = ENTj
ESFP = ESFp
but
INTJ = either INTj or INTp
ISFP = either ISFp or ISFj

Again, according to Socionics, the most lasting relationship types are Duality, Identity, Activity, and Mirror. An INTj's Duality is with ESFj, our Identity is another INTj, our Activity partner is an ISFp, and our Mirror is an ENTp.
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Old 12-31-2010, 03:08 AM   #17
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  Originally Posted by Bobsama
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Here's an idea; get the dog collar and put it to a kinky use. Maybe make that kink an entire lifestyle. Otherwise (or even so), run to the hills! Run for your life!

According to Socionics, ESFp-INTj is a Conflicting relationship. That said, MBTI --> Socionics type equivalency is as follows...

Extraverts are usually the same in MBTI as in Socionics, but Introverts may have their orientation (___X) swapped.

So...
ENTJ = ENTj
ESFP = ESFp
but
INTJ = either INTj or INTp
ISFP = either ISFp or ISFj

Again, according to Socionics, the most lasting relationship types are Duality, Identity, Activity, and Mirror. An INTj's Duality is with ESFj, our Identity is another INTj, our Activity partner is an ISFp, and our Mirror is an ENTp.


Its nice to see someone else on this forum who has some resepct for socioncs. I think they are on to something very important. I would love to see more research done on intertype relations. I have enjoyed 9 years of marriage with a duel and I think socionics is very accurate. I think they might be sugar coating duality just a little and not putting enough emphasis on the need for common values and goals and also not letting people know that it takes effort. However, with common values and goals and effort, its good, really good. The love blossoms and grows richer over time.

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Old 12-31-2010, 03:14 AM   #18
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  Originally Posted by JulietCapulet
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I have know of one INTJ woman who likes an ESFP man. They may get married in the future because the INTJ won't give up on him. She is patient. Waiting now four years for interest to kindle and be reciprocated. Therefore she may find success in her romantic endeavor.

How sad, she must have such low self esteem.

OP, ESFP and INTJ are like oil and water. I have an ESFP brother and don't even get me started. Baaaaad idea, to say the least.

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Old 01-04-2011, 09:58 AM   #19
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  Originally Posted by Zelder
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Its nice to see someone else on this forum who has some resepct for socioncs. I think they are on to something very important. I would love to see more research done on intertype relations. I have enjoyed 9 years of marriage with a duel and I think socionics is very accurate. I think they might be sugar coating duality just a little and not putting enough emphasis on the need for common values and goals and also not letting people know that it takes effort. However, with common values and goals and effort, its good, really good. The love blossoms and grows richer over time.

Socionics has a reasonable theory to it and, in practice, the relationship type needs to be matched with compatible interests and long-term goals. That doesn't mean they have to be the same, but in practice they shouldn't be mutually exclusive.

Just to introduce some skepticism; Socionics has the same flaw as the MBTI. Both are trying to lump too many people into too few categories. MBTI at least would be helped by a fifth portion classifying maturity, optimism, mental & emotional stability, or something similar. MBTI is a rough guide to yourself and Socionics is a rough guide to relationships.

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Old 01-04-2011, 05:56 PM   #20
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  Originally Posted by elsdfr
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You can't be blunt or critical when you think you need to be because yeah, you will spoil what ever moment they are in. Instead you're supposed to sugar coat it and address it when the time is 'right'.

ESFPs are direct and to the point, and they like others to be like that as well. Read the MBTI profile. Even if it's criticism. And believe me they can be critical too. It's guardians who are usually sensitive to criticism.

Everyone's different. SFJ types usually piss me off, yet some INTJs here absolutely get along with them! ESFPs are good, because you can zone out on them and they don't care too much. Zone out on a guardian and you're in deep..

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Old 01-04-2011, 06:09 PM   #21
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i like ESFPs. I reckon that, if both parties are relatively mature, an ESFP is the best partner for an INTJ. INTJs have a natural tendency to continuously erect barriers between themselves and everyone else. Close friends, relatives, other loved ones..it doesn't matter. The INTJ will always tend to drift away from relationships. The ESFP, with his directness, energy and child-like enthousiasm is the only type who is able to ceaselessly attack and tear down the INTJ's defences as effortlessly as the INTJ puts them up. Other types who also match up well with INTJs, namely ENTPs, ENFPs etc, may also have the energy to initially approach the INTJ and maintain that closeness for a while. However, sooner or later, they are likely to start having second thoughts and doubts about the INTJ's true feelings, intentions, willingness to keep them close to him etc. The momentum of their attack slows down. You see it here all the time with all those threads in which other types go "I met this INTJ and everything went great at first, however now I am getting increasingly confused at his tendency to keep distance/occasionaly vanish etc...what should I do?".

The ESFP, on the other hand, will not sit there and ponder what to do. He will just attack again, and approach the INTJ, directly, fearlessly (is that even a word? lol). INTJs are reactive creatures, not proactive. They need someone who finds it natural to always be the initiator. That someone is the ESFP.
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Old 01-04-2011, 06:29 PM   #22
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  Originally Posted by emw1981
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do you have any possible idea how HARD it is to try and get back together with someone who doesnt want to discuss it? who gets anxious and annoyed after 15 minutes of 'deep discussion'? someone who goes with their feelings and the here and now rather than the system of building a proper foundation for the future along with dealing with recongnition and forgiveness of the past?

I don't know what everyone is going on about here. ESFPs always want to talk about relationships, how boring.

Trouble comes, when topics such as quantum physics or global economics pop up.

  Originally Posted by strangeronabus
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Other types who also match up well with INTJs, namely ENTPs, ENFPs etc, may also have the energy to initially approach the INTJ and maintain that closeness for a while. However, sooner or later, they are likely to start having second thoughts and doubts about the INTJ's true feelings, intentions, willingness to keep them close to him etc. The momentum of their attack slows down. You see it here all the time with all those threads in which other types go "I met this INTJ and everything went great at first, however now I am getting increasingly confused at his tendency to keep distance/occasionaly vanish etc...what should I do?".

The ESFP, on the other hand, will not sit there and ponder what to do. He will just attack again, and approach the INTJ, directly, fearlessly (is that even a word? lol). INTJs are reactive creatures, not proactive. They need someone who finds it natural to always be the initiator. That someone is the ESFP.

Spot on in my experience.

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Old 01-12-2011, 06:55 AM   #23
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  Originally Posted by strangeronabus
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The ESFP, on the other hand, will not sit there and ponder what to do. He will just attack again, and approach the INTJ, directly, fearlessly (is that even a word? lol). INTJs are reactive creatures, not proactive. They need someone who finds it natural to always be the initiator. That someone is the ESFP.

To say an INTJ is reactive? yikes, if they are then I've got the wrong type because I'll move a mountain to fix a foreseen issue. If you are saying most INTJs are reactive and need an initiator socially then I would probably agree.

  Originally Posted by timatron
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ESFPs are direct and to the point, and they like others to be like that as well. Read the MBTI profile. Even if it's criticism. And believe me they can be critical too. It's guardians who are usually sensitive to criticism.

And where does it say ESFPs are direct? I agree they can be critical, very critical of other people, but for someone else to be critical in a way that points out flaws in their actions or to be direct in making uncomfortable thrust be known... then it is very hard for them to take.

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Old 01-14-2011, 09:36 PM   #24
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I am an INTJ female married to an ESFP for almost 8 years. I have gathered this much: We have a lot of interests in common, but we have profound differences out of common. My husband and I enjoy the same music, foods, fun, etc. for the most part. The biggies, though are decision-making, communication, and values. We are polar opposites. This leads to significant frustrations, and feelings of resentment...more so on the part of the ESFP I find. I think that things are more "acute" when the INTJ is the female in the relationship, so you may find a different shade of gray with your relationship. Deffinitely take your time, and be alert to pick up on the fundamentals of the relationship, and try not to focus purely on the similar interests.
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Old 01-15-2011, 03:43 AM   #25
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  Originally Posted by elsdfr
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To say an INTJ is reactive? yikes, if they are then I've got the wrong type because I'll move a mountain to fix a foreseen issue. If you are saying most INTJs are reactive and need an initiator socially then I would probably agree.



And where does it say ESFPs are direct? I agree they can be critical, very critical of other people, but for someone else to be critical in a way that points out flaws in their actions or to be direct in making uncomfortable thrust be known... then it is very hard for them to take.

yes of course i meant socially, since we are talking about relationships here. We will move mountains to make things happen in all other fields. When it comes to social /love life, we cower and wait..and wait..

and wait some more, for someone else to make the moves

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