[bubbles]

I am bored with my classes and want a change. After thinking a little, I realized that I chose the wrong major (computer science and engineering). I don't like the technical nature of my major and that it deals with technology. It's not that I don't like "technical" things - any subject, including subjects in the humanities, can get quite technical. It's just that I have lost interest in the subject and seek to do something new, and hopefully, something that I can get very interested in for quite a while. I don't really have any interests right now.

I seem to be good at math but haven't found my love for it (though I love probability and predicting future events using math). I lack talent at physics (and basically anything that is "technical" in nature and requires applying mathematics to physical systems). I enjoyed the one and only chemistry course I took because it was something relevant to the real world and not merely an abstract idea. I also like philosophy, literature, though not the social sciences. Right now, I am considering switching to either math, chemistry, statistics, or philosophy. In short, I have no idea. What should I do?

[Tenacious B]

First, I would think carefully about what you want to get out of your education and where you want it to take you.

Engineering will put food on your table, others will vary. How important is a career with fairly good pay and security? How important is passion and excitement?

[bubbles]

The "fairly good pay" aspect of engineering is the thing that is making me reluctant about changing majors. Otherwise, I would have switched without even thinking. But passion and excitement are important too. I have had a history of just not doing things that are not interesting. Right now, I want to take classes that mostly interest me and eventually continue to graduate school in that subject.

[Tenacious B]

I many credits do you have in your current major? I wouldn't want to toss a few years worth of work when you could do a double major or get a minor etc.

[Gloed]

i've had doubts about my studies in the past and i'm currently trying to find out where to go with my career.. it isn't easy figuring it out, but i think it can be done..

Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I am bored with my classes and want a change. After thinking a little, I realized that I chose the wrong major (computer science and engineering). I don't like the technical nature of my major and that it deals with technology. It's not that I don't like "technical" things - any subject, including subjects in the humanities, can get quite technical. It's just that I have lost interest in the subject and seek to do something new, and hopefully, something that I can get very interested in for quite a while. I don't really have any interests right now.

from what you wrote here, i gather that you are dissatisfied with your major, but not a whole lot more. you don't mention any aspects of computer science and engineering of which you are sure that they don't appeal to you. you contradict yourself : you don't like technical things, but it's not that you don't like technical things.

Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I seem to be good at math but haven't found my love for it (though I love probability and predicting future events using math). I lack talent at physics (and basically anything that is "technical" in nature and requires applying mathematics to physical systems). I enjoyed the one and only chemistry course I took because it was something relevant to the real world and not merely an abstract idea. I also like philosophy, literature, though not the social sciences. Right now, I am considering switching to either math, chemistry, statistics, or philosophy. In short, I have no idea. What should I do?

you have found one aspect of math that appeals to you : probability. that's a start. you love predicting events, but the nature of those events stays rather vague : what kind of events ?
both chemistry and physics are relevant to the real world, physics by applying mathematics, so being relevant to the real world isn't a factor to consider. is it the applied mathematics part of physics that bothers you ? then why is this not an issue to predict future events ? is it because the event is more absract than the physical system of physics ? but you said you don't like abstract ideas..


several questions can help :
- what precisely do you want to know ? what irritates you in your current situation ?
- what are your values ?
- what is you personality (not merely your personality type)?
- what are your skills (with data, people and things) ?

these are questions to consider when pondering careers. that implies that not all those questions will be relevant to determine what you will like studying. some things will only become relevant once you will start working, but it is just as important to consider them now in my opinion.

there is information and there are services out there to help you with those questions, to present subquestions to answer those questions. here's an in my opinion helpful tool, "the career navigator", posted by AgentOfGaming in another thread (thanks!) :
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it breaks down jobs into their pertinent aspects. which aspects are most important to you ? which aspects irritate you ? which are neutral ?

sometimes you feel drawn to certain majors or jobs, but you don't know why. here you can compare jobs and see if you notice patterns. then you can search again, with clear criteria..


another site that might be helpful (i haven't really spend much time on it) :

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[bubbles]

I didn't realize that I was contradicting myself so much in my first post. I actually like abstract ideas, but I'm bored with programming and computer science in general. Physics can be abstract, but it is abstract in a way that is counter-intuitive. I just cannot think like a physicist because physical phenomena is just weird sometimes (I'm not talking about the physics we see in everyday life). I'm only in my first year and I'm afraid if I don't switch out of cse right now, it will be too late. Some jobs I might be interested in are professor, chemist, or statistician, and also (not so sure about) are mathematician and actuary.

[Gloed]

	Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I didn't realize that I was contradicting myself so much in my first post. I actually like abstract ideas, but I'm bored with programming and computer science in general.

generalizing has its dangers. it is coming to a conclusion without analyzing, it's "feeling". if you start analyzing, you will be able to benefit from your experience, even if in the end the conlusion is to change your major. also, there might be less wrong with your major than you think. you could be overdramatising because you are confused by your feelings. feelings wholly affect you. they are or they aren't there. just because they are general, does not mean they have a general cause. rationally, "general" is an abstract idea that does not exist. your feelings are caused by specific thoughts triggered by specific situations, though you may not be aware of them. that is why analyzing can help.

Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Physics can be abstract, but it is abstract in a way that is counter-intuitive. I just cannot think like a physicist because physical phenomena is just weird sometimes (I'm not talking about the physics we see in everyday life). I'm only in my first year and I'm afraid if I don't switch out of cse right now, it will be too late. Some jobs I might be interested in are professor, chemist, or statistician, and also (not so sure about) are mathematician and actuary.

i think that you will initially have to provide the answers to your questions yourself; people are complex, you are probably the least probable to forget pertinent things when contemplating. other people can help you finding out which questions to answer though. when you have most of the answers people can help you logically put the pieces together.


chemistry seems even more counter-intuitive than physics.
maybe you'd like to apply physics to the real world if it isn't in a counter-intuitive way.
to become a professor you must first master a field. what attracts you to this profession besides mastering a certain field ?
pure mathematics are the least empirical, the most logic, theoretically requiring the least memorizing. physics next, then chemistry. this has its consequences for the way you will have to study those subjects. each subject has its own scientific methods to learn and to apply.

[thod]

The other thing I would suggest is law. It too is a complex system and does, mostly, have a logical basis. What could be better for an INTJ than using a system you have mastered to run around terrorizing people with frivolous law suites.

[geonerd]

ok...so you are analytical, as you have mentioned previous interests in engineering, chem, math, etc. Perhaps the sciences are like Lay's potato chips to you - you can't have just one?

Now...do you crave something with a more creative bent? Do you like to use your imagination?

I would recommend taking an intro geology course (physical or historical geology) and see what you think.

Math really is a great field because you get to correlate aspects of the other natural sciences and develop systems; however, it is difficult to find something interesting to do with it after you graduate (unless you *really* want to crunch numbers for insurance companies). Trust me on this.

I started all over with geology, took my leveling courses, and now i'm going to grad school in the fall. hoo-ray!

good luck.

[NewToWorld]

Comment from Chemistry Ph.D married to same: In the basic sciences, jobs are very competitive. If you chose to go this route plan to get your Ph.D from one of the five best schools in whatever field you chose. Also, in Chemistry, Chemical Engineers and Chemists often do the same jobs but Chemical Engineers get paid more.

[cda]

Is this a Bachelor's program? How far along are you? If you are almost done with your Bachelor's program it *may* be wiser to get the piece of paper and then pursue a masters degree in one of the fields you are interested in. You should have no problem going into a Masters Applied Math or Statistics program after receiving a bachelors in computer science or engineering. The reason I say this is because the Bachelors degree is the new high school diploma, if you want a education that gives you an edge, 9/10 you need a post graduate.

[Uytuun]

Hmm...about the money thing...I tend to believe that if you're really good at what you do, you'll get rewarded, even if the area you work in isn't traditionally known as good money-making material. As an INTJ, you're likely to kick ass...so it's a win win situation.
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[bubbles]

Thanks for all the helpful responses. Now I've eliminated physics, chemistry, and any biological science from my choices. I'm considering electrical engineering or applied mathematics right now. I just enrolled in an electrical engineering course to see how it would go since I heard that it seems like mostly applied math and some physics. Pure math also seems interesting and so is Earth Science. Since I'm still in my first year and came in with a good number of units, I can try taking different courses my next term if I find that math or electrical engineering don't suit me.





bubbles added to this post, 3 minutes and 24 seconds later...

	Originally Posted by geonerd To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Math really is a great field because you get to correlate aspects of the other natural sciences and develop systems; however, it is difficult to find something interesting to do with it after you graduate (unless you *really* want to crunch numbers for insurance companies). Trust me on this.good luck.

Is actuarial work really that bad? I heard it pays well and the hours aren't too bad.

[TehBeefah]

Have you considered Psychology? You do seem to have an interest in it, coming to a forum intrinsically geared toward the field. People are complex systems within themselves, you know.

I felt the same way a few years ago--I was accepted into NCSU school of engineering, but decided to head to UNC because.. well... I decided that engineering was too small and tedious for my tastes. I struggled finding anything I excelled at my first two years and ended up settling for psychology basically because I couldn't find anything wrong with it. I'm still not sure if it's the right choice, but nothing else looks better at this point, and it's starting to grow on me.

[geonerd]

	bubbles added to this post, 3 minutes and 24 seconds later... Is actuarial work really that bad? I heard it pays well and the hours aren't too bad.

Well...I know one actuary (she was a math major too) who likes her work ok. She busted her butt taking all the qualifying tests, etc but she decided it was worth it. It pays the bills and she lives well.

And while the field is very pattern/trend-oriented (which is cool), they're just patterns that I don't particularly care about :P The work also *seems* a bit monotonous and static - also not really my thing. But these, of course, are my personal preferences.

[Rei]

	Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Is actuarial work really that bad? I heard it pays well and the hours aren't too bad.

My sister wanted to go into actuarial sci. I heard it pays great and you only have to work half the year. Of course that half the year you're working may kill you
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What courses have you taken that interest you?

I do recommend an applied math (maybe an economics minor?). It's competitive, but it's good pay and fast paced.
Of course you might end up like this:
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It's not too big an exaggeration either
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[thegnat]

Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Thanks for all the helpful responses. Now I've eliminated physics, chemistry, and any biological science from my choices. I'm considering electrical engineering or applied mathematics right now. I just enrolled in an electrical engineering course to see how it would go since I heard that it seems like mostly applied math and some physics. Pure math also seems interesting and so is Earth Science. Since I'm still in my first year and came in with a good number of units, I can try taking different courses my next term if I find that math or electrical engineering don't suit me. bubbles added to this post, 3 minutes and 24 seconds later... Is actuarial work really that bad? I heard it pays well and the hours aren't too bad.

So wait...why exactly are you eliminating physics, chemistry, and biology from your choices? I'm just curious. I'm happy with my chemistry major, but that's just me. If you're interested in earth science, then having a base in chem, bio, physics is a good thing. I also know chem majors who have minored in math.

NTW: Do you work in industry or as a professor? Or neither? I'm planning on heading the Chem. Ph.D route myself and looking at the grad school stuff myself now (junior in college).

[bubbles]

Originally Posted by thegnat To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

So wait...why exactly are you eliminating physics, chemistry, and biology from your choices? I'm just curious. I'm happy with my chemistry major, but that's just me. If you're interested in earth science, then having a base in chem, bio, physics is a good thing. I also know chem majors who have minored in math. NTW: Do you work in industry or as a professor? Or neither? I'm planning on heading the Chem. Ph.D route myself and looking at the grad school stuff myself now (junior in college).

I am not very good at physics and biology seems boring to me. I had the physics lab course where all we did was compute partial derivatives and calculate errors. Lab reports were so boring... In all the biology classes I have taken, we had to memorize trivial facts and take multiple choice exams. I enjoyed the first and only chemistry course I have taken. It was a first semester general chemistry class that I took at a local college during high school. I don't know why I didn't continue in chemistry... I was told that chemists don't get paid much and jobs openings for new PhDs are extremely competitive, and if you only have a undergraduate degree, you can only work as a science teacher or a chemistry technician if you want a job related in your field.

[thegnat]

Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I am not very good at physics and biology seems boring to me. I had the physics lab course where all we did was compute partial derivatives and calculate errors. Lab reports were so boring... In all the biology classes I have taken, we had to memorize trivial facts and take multiple choice exams. I enjoyed the first and only chemistry course I have taken. It was a first semester general chemistry class that I took at a local college during high school. I don't know why I didn't continue in chemistry... I was told that chemists don't get paid much and jobs openings for new PhDs are extremely competitive, and if you only have a undergraduate degree, you can only work as a science teacher or a chemistry technician if you want a job related in your field.

Thanks for making me feel good about my career choice :P Yeah it does seem like jobs are pretty competitive for new PhDs from what I've heard and that it's stressful trying to get tenure. But also, I'm not sure what degree that you'd get that you could just find a well-paying job immediately and have it not be competitive. So if you really like the subject I wouldn't totally give up on it.

[Rei]

	Originally Posted by thegnat To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Thanks for making me feel good about my career choice :P Yeah it does seem like jobs are pretty competitive for new PhDs from what I've heard and that it's stressful trying to get tenure. But also, I'm not sure what degree that you'd get that you could just find a well-paying job immediately and have it not be competitive. So if you really like the subject I wouldn't totally give up on it.

I agree...
I think everything at a basic level is boring... but if there's something you really want to do, and you have to get past the boringness to do it... just do it.
How much money you make depends on how good you are. Not to mention investing with the money you do make. You don't have to have a spectacular job to get rich.

[bubbles]

So after being in an electrical engineering course for half a quarter, I found that it is not for me (it is extremely boring and I suck at it). I think I don't want to do the math major anymore since it gets old after a while. I'm only interested in the applications and not the math itself. I kind of regret not taking any chemistry courses this year. I might have to take a chemistry class in the summer (which is kind of fun, actually)... Right now, I'm considering chemistry, chemical engineering, and materials science/engineering. I seriously have no idea how much chemistry/math/physics these majors require. Though I looked over the curriculum, I still have no idea what they're about. NewToWorld, thegnat, and anyone into chemistry here, can you give me some advice? Thanks in advance.

[Mogura]

The thing about majoring in chemistry is that no 2 years are alike.

Maybe you enjoyed first-year chemistry (or not). Doesn't matter, second-year chemistry (organic chemistry) is a whole different animal. Was organic chemistry a nightmare? Don't worry, third-year chemistry (physical chemistry) is math-based so you can derive equations instead of memorizing reaction mechanisms. Did P-chem kick your ass? Well fourth-year chemistry has you doing inorganic chemistry and instrumental analysis (you get to play with a lot of really cool expensive machines) plus directed research to boot. Throw in quantitative analysis, organic qualitative analysis, and perhaps biochemistry to finish out the party, and bam! You've graduated before you know it.

For the record, organic chemistry absolutely rocks...

[bubbles]

I have only taken first year chemistry. I have no idea what organic chemistry is like, except that I have seen an organic chemistry textbook with diagrams of molecules (much more than the first year chemistry textbook). I have taken a career test and "Astronomer," "Chemist," "Materials Scientist," were at the top of the list of careers that I will most likely enjoy.

[searcheagle]

	Originally Posted by Uytuun To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Hmm...about the money thing...I tend to believe that if you're really good at what you do, you'll get rewarded, even if the area you work in isn't traditionally known as good money-making material. As an INTJ, you're likely to kick ass...so it's a win win situation. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

True, if you are good in most fields, you will get more money than someone average in the field. Some fields, especially those controlled by unions make it difficult to get paid more. Fields with unions go more off seniority than other factors, like skill.

Still, success in one field may not pay as much as being mediocre in another higher paying field.





searcheagle added to this post, 7 minutes and 13 seconds later...

	Originally Posted by bubbles To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Is actuarial work really that bad? I heard it pays well and the hours aren't too bad.

Actuaries seem to enjoy the constant education the profession requires, regardless of the personal cost. These exams provide good indicators of progress as an actuary; full passage of the exams take between five and ten years.

...

Becoming an actuary requires some of the skills of a gambler and some of the skills of a marathoner. You need a gambler’s understanding of statistics, probability, and risk analysis. Most actuaries graduate college with a degree in mathematics or a business-related field, although the industry trend of late is to hire more liberal arts students who can demonstrate a high mathematical aptitude. The endurance of a marathoner is required not for the hours, which are fairly acceptable, but to make it through the actuarial examinations, which can take as long as ten years to pass. These tests are administered biannually by three associations: The Society of Actuaries, the Casualty Actuarial Society (for casualty actuaries), and the American Society of Pension Actuaries. While each agency provides certification for a certain specialization, the first few tests are general enough that they may be taken without regard to any specific career path.

Source:
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