[sircockburn]

Any of you guys have bouts of envy? Or jealousy?

I differentiate between the two - envy to me is wanting what someone else has, jealousy to me is more of a possessive relationship-type thing.

I admit I have some serious envy issues. I'll deeply covet a person's looks, fun, accomplishments, wealth, personality, etc. But in a relationship, I don't really get the concept of "jealousy". I don't really care where or who my fiance's with, (and yes, I do love him). I've never been possessive/needy with people or even animals.

Do xNTJs often have problems with envy (or jealousy), or are they all billionaire, 180-IQ, world-travelling, nobel-prize-winning, Rolls-Royce-driving, CEO supermodels?

I don't understand how people can avoid envy. I don't think I could ever stop envying until I'm better at something than everyone else. (That is, besides being mediocre).

[lazarus]

Jealousy can be a reflexive way of hiding an insecurity, or it could also be a learned behavior, something that is 'expected' of you when you're in a certain situation (as dictated by one of the 10 commandments, thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife).

There are always more clear and honest ways to communicate how one feels, or what one wants when one is not geting it, than to say that one is "jealous", which is usually an oversimplification.

Some people are unable to be honest about what they are insecure about, and for those people, jealousy will always be an issue, and there must be clear boundaries in the relationship for it to work.

[BFrost1]

I'm never jealous of anyone, but I can be a little possessive or envious at times (rarely).

[AliTree]

i'm really not a jealous person. i mean, i have low self esteem and worry my boyfriend will leave me for more attractive girls, but i'm not 'jealous' per say.

[Bilbo]

Envy is something that I have worked really hard to get out of my thought process. I like part of the idea behind Envy, striving to become like someone else, but I do not like the morals of Envy. Envy is evil. On the other hand you can look to others as models, and strive to learn from them by watching, etc. to become like that. This is not evil.

The reason I think envy is evil is this: it is impossible to tell how another person really feels, they could have a billion dollars and not have a life as good anyone else. Its almost like you are judging people before you even know them. Only god knows this.
That is not a good life practice to pursue.

Jealousy, I haven't gotten to that yet. I used to be extremely jealous of my girlfriends friends in high school. But that was because of trust. So all of my jealousy has been caused by trust, I have fixed that by improving trust.

Best of luck.

[Tito]

Its one thing to want to better yourself, taking this into an extreme would be considered envy, I guess.

Personally I don't consider myself to be envious or prone to jealousy. I do, however, would like to change certain aspects of my appearance, would like to have certain things, etc.; but more to make me look better to my own self or to live more comfortable, not to get an acceptance from other people, because in the end, I don't really care what people think of me. Also, I have never wished someone lacked whatever they had that I may have found to be nice or appealing. I just don't care about people to the degree that would merit such attention.

I also think that in order to feel jealousy, a person must be possessive and in fear of losing whatever it posses to someone or something that is perceived to be better or capable of causing that loss. I have simply never been attached to something or someone to the degree of feeling such.

And no, I'm not a billionaire, don't have an IQ of 180, have traveled internationally but wouldn't consider it 'world-traveling', am still working on my nobel prize (je je), care little for driving a Rolls Royce, and am not a CEO supermodel.
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[NoStoneUnturned]

Nope, I don't get envious or jealous. Just a couple times in my life. But even in these times it's more of a frustration, because I worked hard to come to an understanding of some material on my own and then the teacher in school just gives that information away in a 2-minute speech... That's about as envious or jealous as I get.


From what I can tell, it's connected to extroversion, egotism and something else...

[Synamon]

	Originally Posted by sircockburn To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I don't understand how people can avoid envy.

If you don't need much external validation then you aren't going to be envious of things or accomplishments of other people. If you do require that then I guess you'll always be measuring your own worth based on external factors and the result is envy.

Those you think "have it all" don't, there are large gaps in some other area of their lives that you can't see. Since you'd have to take the bad with the good, there really isn't anything to be envious of.

[Bilbo]

	Originally Posted by Synamon To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Those you think "have it all" don't, there are large gaps in some other area of their lives that you can't see. Since you'd have to take the bad with the good, there really isn't anything to be envious of.

Maybe they do, money doesn't buy happiness... but that doesn't mean they aren't happy. There has to be at least one billionaire that is still 'grounded.' Right???
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I am starting to realize that the more I become self-actualized, the longer my periods of happiness are. As of right now I feel that if I am able to become 100% self-actualized then money will definitely be a part of it. But for reasons that are too long to explain at the moment.

[NoStoneUnturned]

I think this article is indirectly relevant to your situation.

Link:
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[sircockburn]

It sounds like you guys see envy as negative.

Then again, without envy, how else would people be motivated to wake up and do anything? When I choose to pursue something, I see it as competing to be the best. And that's with everything, whether it's driving the best car, being better at skiing than whoever I'm with, solving the most problems at work, getting the highest exam grade in class.

Even insignificant things, like commuting to work faster than I had before. This kind of attitude has gotten me many stern warnings on the highway.
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Without the human's drive to be the strongest of the species, they will do nothing to get there, and then perish, right?

[NoStoneUnturned]

	Originally Posted by sircockburn To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Without the human's drive to be the strongest of the species, they will do nothing to get there, and then perish, right?

They strive to self-actualize instead.

[cheerbear]

Striving for self-actualization = envy of your full potential? Potayto potahto?

I think envy can be a good thing as a motivating factor (I want that for myself), as long as you don't apply the wrong judgment to it (someone else is better than me for having it).

[daydreamer]

envy is fun. that is to say, when i hear a fantastic singer's voice and i witness how easily her fingers move up and down the frets of a guitar, i might lose myself in a daydream wondering what it must be like to be her in that moment... i'm totally envious. i will never feel that. but it is wonderful to imagine.

i'm not generally envious of accomplishments, they rarely mean the same thing to someone who accomplishes them that they do to everyone else; if they do, then that person is usually defective in some way, shallow or something. i am envious of the experiences others have, but it never seems like a negative thing to feel. jealousy in my mind seems to be related to attention. i get plenty of that so i don't think i am often jealous. sometimes i might be jealous of someone who has a restful vacation planned. i think i will plan one of those soon. *daydreams*

[NoStoneUnturned]

	Originally Posted by cheerbear To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Striving for self-actualization = envy of your full potential? Potayto potahto? I think envy can be a good thing as a motivating factor (I want that for myself), as long as you don't apply the wrong judgment to it (someone else is better than me for having it).

Well, by definition, people who are envious see something in someone else that they want but can never have. Even more, there is a darker side to it: they don't want the other person to have what they have that makes them so good.

[cheerbear]

Mm, I guess I don't think of the darker side much because I just generally don't feel that way. I'm genuinely happy for others, and if it's something I want for myself, just go do it.
I still see a case for the "envy of full potential", though. I'm always wanting, and can't wait, to be that person I see in the future...even if it is me!
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[Kisai]

Envy's ok. I'm not the handsomest, smartest, strongest, healthiest, etc. person on the planet, but I'm very happy with the hand I've been dealt. I'd rather be above average in several qualities than to be the very best in one quality and average/below average in others. I'm not envious of material possessions because there's little that I want that's outside a moderate price range. Mostly what I want is information-based anyways, like books or games.

Jealousy is more relationship based. It really doesn't bother me very much at all, mainly because I've been through so much emotional pain in life already, that being jealous at two people having fun is such a little, absurd thing. I feel little twinges now and again, but those are based on me not spending enough time with my objet d'affection and feeling secure. If my od'a is spending fun time with someone else, I'm happy on her behalf, not a green-eyed monster.

[UrWrongImRit]

I'm rarely envious, if EVER.

When someone has something that I don't have, there is no reason to be envious. If I want it, I'll get it. It's that easy. Nothing is impossible, If I really wanted something, I probably see it as an opportunity/challenge for myself, a positive one.
Usually, I'll smirk and go for it.
This is going to sound a little over-confident, however, If I truly wanted something, I ALWAYS get it.
now.. the matter of keeping it, is a little different :P

Overall, I'm happy with what I have, and at those times that I'm not, and want more, I remind myself that there are people who are worse off, and I should be thankful for what I have in my clutches at that moment.

Jealousy is slightly a different story. I used to be VERY possessive, of things, people, etc. over the years I've become increasingly better at controlling it. I don't get jealous often, but when I feel the twinge coming on, I tell myself " reason, logic, and rationalize". Then I go through the process of convincing myself that I am in control of my self, and that is the most important thing. It's difficult, but it works.

when it doesn't , all hell breaks loose. hahahahah

[JustMel]

I'm envious only in my occasional "oh that's cool looking I wouldn't mind having one of those" or "if I ever hit the lottery I'm going to have......"

Jealousy is something I've only experienced once and the guy and I had a passion between us that I should have known was going to burn. Fortunately we realized we brought out the worst in each other and decided to end the relationship before we hated one another. We were both normally not jealous but together it was like a soap opera only worse. "Where were you" "what were you doing" etc.

I don't ever feel jealous with my husband, perhaps because I'm secure in the fact that he's mine and even if that changed I'd be okay. I'd mourn the relationship as it's been good for me and he's good for me and says the same of me but I also know I can take care of me if I need to. I had a good chuckle because his boss likes to be "funny" and when one of the guys goes out of town he will put a strip of condoms in one of their bags when they aren't around. Sometimes he'll even drop an empty packet in the bag. Neither my husband nor I find this particularly funny but hey it's his thing. The first time they went out of town he came home and was unpacking his bag and there in the suitcase was a strip of four condoms. I called and made sure they wouldn't be having clients in town for a show and I spoke with his wife and explained that I was not mad but I was going to teach her husband a lesson and she thought was fabulous and asked if I needed any money. I called and hired a stripper and sent her to his work on the same day I made lunch for the office and set it up for her to come in during lunch.

She came in dressed to the nines and asked for "BOB" and he said "Hi, I'm Bob. Did we have an appointment today" at which time she starts her thing and his eyes are goggling out of his head and he's cutting glances at his wife who is laughing so hard I thought she'd pass out and when she was done she dropped the same condoms on is lap.

[sircockburn]

	Originally Posted by UrWrongImRit To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I'm rarely envious, if EVER. When someone has something that I don't have, there is no reason to be envious. If I want it, I'll get it. It's that easy. Nothing is impossible, If I really wanted something, I probably see it as an opportunity/challenge for myself, a positive one. Usually, I'll smirk and go for it.

But what if it's something you can't change, that you're born with(out), like beauty or intelligence? (Unless of course, you're the 180-IQ supermodel.)

[Kisai]

	Originally Posted by sircockburn To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	But what if it's something you can't change, that you're born with(out), like beauty or intelligence? (Unless of course, you're the 180-IQ supermodel.)

There are unfairly intelligent and handsome people out there.

I just cross my fingers and hope they don't notice my od'a. If they do, the gloves are coming off and its war. Didn't I say I wasn't jealous? Well, I'm still going to give my best shot if I really like someone. If I fail, I won't beat myself up too much, though...

[ctclough]

I struggle with many things, but not envy or jealousy. I have no idea why. I seem to be a laid-back content sorta person. My hubby is awesome, and has never given me any reason to feel one bit jealous. I have friends that are rich and poor, plain and beautiful. They all have their struggles, in the end. Once in a while, I get a rude, envious comment from another female about how I look. My response is that after a certain point, looks are a choice. Get to the gym, get out of the sweat pants, and put down the Twinkie! It's really frustrating when people aren't willing to put time and effort into generating income, taking care of their appearance, or whatever, but then they are envious of those who DO the work. What? Perhaps they are really envious of the way some people can stay motivated, stay on track, and refuse to settle, while they themselves expect (and get) little from themselves. I dunno.

[TheBlackKnight]

I don't understand jealousy. If my significant other leaves me for someone else then they weren't all that commited to me begin with, and we'd just have problems later on down the road... there's no sense worrying about it, it's not something I could control even if I wanted to. I'd rather give them free reign and see if they come back to me.

Envy, well. I don't know if I experience it exactly the same way. From what I understand you're talking about "man I wish I had a huge house with two cars like that guy." I get more... I don't know, upset over the injustice of it all? For example, instead of wishing I had the huge house, I'll be asking why the hell that guy needs so much space, there's so many people who need housing and you're just taking up so much land that could just as easily be shared with a reasonable amount of privacy and space for everyone involved. Then I get spiteful.

And worse, people who have the most complain the most. Sometimes I just want to get them in a strangle-hold and tell them to quit whining.

[cheerbear]

	Originally Posted by sircockburn To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	But what if it's something you can't change, that you're born with(out), like beauty or intelligence? (Unless of course, you're the 180-IQ supermodel.)

I don't get envious over things outside my control, there's no point. And everyone has a quality someone else may get envious of, so in the grand scheme of things, it all balances out. And you may think the 180-IQ supermodel might not get envious, but I have a model friend who sometimes wishes she could look more "plain" because people automatically make assumptions based on her looks. Not everything is always as it seems on the other side.

[sircockburn]

Originally Posted by ctclough To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I struggle with many things, but not envy or jealousy. I have no idea why. I seem to be a laid-back content sorta person. My hubby is awesome, and has never given me any reason to feel one bit jealous. I have friends that are rich and poor, plain and beautiful. They all have their struggles, in the end. Once in a while, I get a rude, envious comment from another female about how I look. My response is that after a certain point, looks are a choice. Get to the gym, get out of the sweat pants, and put down the Twinkie! It's really frustrating when people aren't willing to put time and effort into generating income, taking care of their appearance, or whatever, but then they are envious of those who DO the work. What? Perhaps they are really envious of the way some people can stay motivated, stay on track, and refuse to settle, while they themselves expect (and get) little from themselves. I dunno.

If that's you in the avatar, which I'm assuming from the way people are envious of your body, you obviously have a genetically fast metabolism, like I do. I eat 3000+ calories a day (I have to, or I get weak and hungry) and my BMI's 17.5. Why does everyone assume fat people are lazy? They're the ones I see eating healthy, exercising and all that.

So the fat people with bad metabolisms due to genetics can't change that, so they have a right to be envious of you.