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INTJs in fiction. celebrity typing, fictional mbti
Old 09-26-2009, 01:17 PM   #426
EarthBound
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Why is no one mentioning Batman?
No, not Christian Bale, Batman.
(For the best example of him as a character, think of the comics and a bit of the animated series from the 90's.)
As many people have said, INTJ's tend to be the anti-hero, and Batman certainly fits.
Some people have said that his reluctance to kill would make him an F, but they forget that his goal is preserve life without destroying it. However, that doesn't mean he wont bust a few faces in along the way, or at least consider the option.


Commissioner Gordon:
"You and I have seen more than our fair share of tragedies and thirsted for revenge. If Batman wanted to be a killer, he could have started long ago. But it's a line. On one side we believe in the law. On the other....Sometimes the law fails us. Maybe that's why I've understood you... allowed you to help protect this city. Batman, if you cross that line-- If you kill the Joker tonight--I will lead the hunt to bring you to justice. In the eyes of the law. In my eyes you'll be no different from him."

Batman says: "How many more lives are we going to let him ruin?"
(Considering the other option.)

Gordon responds: "I don't care. I wont let him ruin yours."
(Reminding Batman that if Joker gets you to go sour, he wins.)
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Old 09-27-2009, 05:58 AM   #427
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Has anyone seen
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? One of the main characters, Bridgette, was definitely an INTJ. Her INTJness was so prominent, it was fun to watch. I'm sure you'd agree, Thrifty.
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Old 09-29-2009, 11:59 PM   #428
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Now I agree with what a few people have been saying, that fictional characters sometimes cannot be typed. That makes this whole discussion a little harder
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From the first page:

  Originally Posted by Uberfuhrer
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Some non-INTJ villains:
  • Joker, Batman -- ENTP
  • Green Goblin (Norman Osborn), Spider-Man -- ENTJ
  • Venom (Eddie Brock), Spider-Man 3 -- ESTP
  • Howard Saint, The Punisher -- ESTJ
  • Bullseye, Daredevil -- ISTP
  • Gaston, Beauty and the Beast -- ESTP
  • Frollo, The Hunchback of Notre Dame -- ESTJ
  • Biff, Back to the Future series -- ESTP

They're all T's!
Now, obviously, every villain ever isn't going to be a T.

Here's my theory, though. At least in simplified popular perception, T's are more cold/unfeeling than F's. Most villains aren't the touchy-feely type.
I is a good trait for villains, there's just something about being (especially *very*) introverted that is villain-like ... :D ... I think it's that fewer people intimately know them, there's more hidden ... I don't know.

With J & P, I think it could go either way for most villains, because it all depends on the stuff they do and their MO, you know.

For INTJ's specifically, I think that "mastermind" really has a lot to do with it. Not the word specifically, but what makes us "masterminds" ... (I feel like I don't know what I'm trying to say here :D) ... basically, I think what I mean is that our mastermind-like traits make us good evil masterminds or criminal masterminds. When you're writing I think you want an interesting villain and the mastermind-type that takes work to defeat has good potential, and is often used.
That, and we're just darn awesome. And who doesn't want an awesome villain?
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(*Sigh* ... I keep saying "we" referring to INTJ's ... I might just change myself to an xNTJ ... forget this "eNTJ" stuff ...)

To answer the question posed in the thread title, "Are INTJs usually villains in fiction?"
I'd say, probably yes, they are more often villains than not, except in stories written by INTJ's. (Both my current stories, the main character is an INTJ ... and they are *very* different people ... :D)

~~~~~~~~~~~~

  Originally Posted by Valiyn
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The hero must have morals, stand for all that is good and holy.
The hero must have an obstacle to overcome.
The hero must be a role model to the kids, someone who is inspiring.
The hero must overcome great odds, and show virtues like sacrifice and honor.
The hero must not talk about fight club.
The hero must be a beacon of hope for all!

This is a good point ...

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Old 09-30-2009, 12:12 AM   #429
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  Originally Posted by CarenRose
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Here's my theory, though. At least in simplified popular perception, T's are more cold/unfeeling than F's.

The funny thing is that Magneto was typed as an INFJ. Some people didn't really consider him to be a villain, just someone who genuinely wanted to do good but went about it the wrong way. So if a villain's an F they're not really evil, just misunderstood.
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Old 09-30-2009, 10:49 AM   #430
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people love to make INTJ's badguys because they're uncomfortable with our detached nature and our ability to think ahead to the future better than everyone else. The majority of the people in the world are Extroverts(75%), Sensing types, so since they don't understand us...why not cast us as villians?

I'd like to see an INTJ hero type who fixes the world as everyone screams and bitches and tries to stop him, then they realizes what he did was for the best. But lets face it, even my description sounds very 'evil genius'
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Old 10-03-2009, 04:39 AM   #431
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Pretty simple. It's like a stereotype. Bad guys are silent, emotionless. Happens to be INTJ.
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Old 10-04-2009, 10:21 PM   #432
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Logical people make the best villains.

Empathic fools make the best heroes.

...in popular lore.
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Old 10-04-2009, 10:48 PM   #433
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  Originally Posted by DrEast
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Mayor, Season 3 of Buffy: The Vampire Slayer. No?

The Mayor was ENTJ. Season 3 was the best season of Buffy.

Season 8 (the comics) sucks. Its all nostalgia and whining.

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Old 10-05-2009, 07:54 AM   #434
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  Originally Posted by OddFactor
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Howard Roark, the protagonist of Ayn Rand's The Fountainhead, is an INTJ. And how I love that book/that character.

Hey, why has no one picked up on this? I think Roark's an INTJ too, but...he's a touch different, somehow. He doesn't want to make things work; he wants to make this "honest". People have been mentioning INTJ's as heros who see a different "optimal outcome" to the rest of the population, thus making their visions unwelcome. This fits Roark like a glove. I don't know how INTJ's feel about aesthetics as a rule, but his independence and isolation is a giveaway.

That being said, he's meant to be a God. Also, Rand was an INTJ. Why don't we like the Fountainhead? I love the Fountainhead. What's wrong with Rand?

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Old 10-05-2009, 11:49 AM   #435
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  Originally Posted by CarenRose
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They're all T's!

Thinking life out in advance is seen as evil scheming.

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Old 10-09-2009, 07:46 PM   #436
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  Originally Posted by Storm
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Elizabeth from the same book was an INTJ as well, perhaps because Jane Austen was an INTJ.

Maybe Eleanor too, in Sense&Sensibility...

the "sense" one ;-)

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Old 10-12-2009, 04:50 PM   #437
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  Originally Posted by Jezebel
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I can't claim this list is original, but here are a few more alleged fictional INTJs:

Dr House (House)
Frank Pembleton (Homicide: Life on the Street)
Gandalf the Grey/Mithrandir the White (Lord of the Rings)
Ensign Ro (Star Trek--the Next Generation)
Miranda Hobbes (Sex and the City)
Clarice Starling (Silence of the Lambs/Hannibal)
Professor Severus Snape (Harry Potter)

bullshit snape is an asshole/snob who thinks he is better and smarter than everyone else, he is also arrogant, but that doesn't make him an INTJ. For example why would he care if people were pure bloods (just one of many reasons). If anyone in that book is an INTJ it would be the lady that is head of gryfindor mcgonnagal or something or dumbledore.

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Old 10-12-2009, 05:40 PM   #438
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  Originally Posted by dbpeege
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For example why would he care if people were pure bloods (just one of many reasons).

Mostly because of his upbringing. Having an INTJ personality doesn't mean being a perfect and open-minded individual. If anything, it indicates that the person in question may have a hard time changing his or her mind when it comes to his/her core beliefs. Case in point: pretty much any thread on religion on this forum.

 
If anyone in that book is an INTJ it would be the lady that is head of gryfindor mcgonnagal or something or dumbledore.

Hmm... To me, Dumbledore is more of an INFJ-ish individual with a plan. As for Minerva McGonagall, her loyalty and strict adherence to rules and hierarchy makes her seem more like an ISTJ.

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Old 10-12-2009, 06:42 PM   #439
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  Originally Posted by dbpeege
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bullshit snape is an asshole/snob who thinks he is better and smarter than everyone else, he is also arrogant, but that doesn't make him an INTJ. For example why would he care if people were pure bloods (just one of many reasons).

Because he gets to be socially accepted and rewarded by people in the cool club of Taking Over the World instead of just being a dorky kid in a smock who can't get the girl of his dreams. Being INTJ doesn't give one an exemption from error. Snape realized, far too late, how wrong he was.

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Old 10-12-2009, 07:05 PM   #440
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Good point. My bad for discussing Harry Potter I always mess up that book. But never the less very good point.
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Old 10-13-2009, 09:21 AM   #441
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  Originally Posted by Night Runner
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Mostly because of his upbringing. Having an INTJ personality doesn't mean being a perfect and open-minded individual. If anything, it indicates that the person in question may have a hard time changing his or her mind when it comes to his/her core beliefs. Case in point: pretty much any thread on religion on this forum.

Hmm... To me, Dumbledore is more of an INFJ-ish individual with a plan. As for Minerva McGonagall, her loyalty and strict adherence to rules and hierarchy makes her seem more like an ISTJ.

Agreed. Though I think it's possible that Snape would be better typed as an ISTJ. Potions is certainly portrayed as a very linear discipline and it just so happens to be Snape's specialty. Snape's favoritism of Slytherins would also be more consistent with an ISTJ than an INTJ. Of course, this could just be an exagerration from Harry's biased perspective. Snape as an INTJ, however, gets a lot of support from the Half-Blood Prince with

displays of Snape deviating from Potions instructions and creating his own spells.
I think it's clear, at any rate, that Snape has a strong Te and a strong but not prominent Fi.

And I could see McGonagall as an ENTJ or an ISTJ. A case could be made for Dumbledore being an INTJ or INTP but I agree that INFJ fits best.

  Originally Posted by UserName
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Neo is totally an INTJ

Ha! Neo allows everybody else to plan his actions; he lives in the moment. There is no way Neo is an INTJ. In my opinion, an INTJ would never allow themselves to be dragged along for so long (most of the first movie) without any clear plan or understanding of the situation. I suspect he would be better typed as an ISTP. Strong Ti and Se along with some Ni.

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Old 10-13-2009, 08:02 PM   #442
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Snape an ISTJ and a double agent? And an expert in Occulmency, concealing one's mind from probing? I think Snape projects ISTJ to Voldemort and others, to be certain.
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Old 10-13-2009, 10:36 PM   #443
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Is Spock and ISTP or a INTP? I can't help but think of him as ISTP, but he also follows the N when he begins to understand humanity. What do you all think?
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Old 10-14-2009, 03:42 PM   #444
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Classic Spock is INTP and could be considered the poster child for Rational behavior (when he's not Pon-Farring).

New Sylar Spock is ISTJ. He's more of an uptight Guardian of rule structure.
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Old 10-15-2009, 11:02 PM   #445
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  Originally Posted by JCrow
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people love to make INTJ's badguys because they're uncomfortable with our detached nature and our ability to think ahead to the future better than everyone else. The majority of the people in the world are Extroverts(75%), Sensing types, so since they don't understand us...why not cast us as villians?

I'd like to see an INTJ hero type who fixes the world as everyone screams and bitches and tries to stop him, then they realizes what he did was for the best. But lets face it, even my description sounds very 'evil genius'

Read The General Series by S.M. Stirling/David Drake. Raj Whitehall is based on the Byzantine general Belisarius (who, among other accomplishments, really brought the stirrup into usage in the Western World). Incidentally, this series is FAR superior to the Belisarius series by Drake and Eric Flint.

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Old 10-16-2009, 01:53 AM   #446
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  Originally Posted by Kisai
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Snape an ISTJ and a double agent? And an expert in Occulmency, concealing one's mind from probing? I think Snape projects ISTJ to Voldemort and others, to be certain.

Good point... So how about this: Snape is an INTJ who pretends to be an ISTJ, but is secretly an ESFP.
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Old 10-16-2009, 02:05 AM   #447
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Dr. Eldon Tyrell from Blade Runner. Genetic engineer and super rich businessman.


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Old 10-17-2009, 08:19 AM   #448
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Edgar from King Lear is an INTJ.
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Old 10-17-2009, 08:44 AM   #449
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DeNiro's INTJ McCauley vs. Pacino's ENTP Hanna.

I'm pretty sure DeNiro's range is more than just his counter-shadow and opposite.
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Old 10-18-2009, 04:40 PM   #450
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Has anyone read the Stieg Larson books 'Girl With the Dragon Tattoo' and 'Girl Who Played With Fire'

I want to know what you fellow INTJs think of the heroine Lisbeth Salander??
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