[Jgib5328]

I am curious to know, what are the differences between as you are now and as you were during adolescence/college years? I'm interested in what kind of mental and emotional changes you guys underwent between that time period and how you changed overall.

By older I mean 30+. I'm not implying that any of you are old, just older than me (19).

[stuntgp2000]

I'm not there yet, but right now I have strong Te & Ni, a well developed Fi while Se is OK. In other words I resemble to an ENTJ

[Nomad]

I've grown weary of debates with no results. I've learned that logic and rationality has it's place, but it is by no stretch the be all and end all. Semantic arguments are pointless. Being right is less important than getting the job done. I've discovered that while the INTJ type believes it's "right", we should bear in mind that we are a vast minority. If we are so faultless, we would be running things. We don't. The feelers and the sensors do. If evolution is rational, then we serve a purpose, but we are not superior.

It's more important to prove you are correct by your actions, by what you do, then by any verbal rational argument you can make. Actions cannot be refuted. Any idiot can stick his fingers in his ear and make you irrelevant. That same idiot cannot refute success.

-Nomad

[polysylvester]

I got a lot smarter from 19 t0 30 years old. I took a graduate math class when I was 31 and things that seemed difficult at 19 were simple at 31. The biggest change is you get better at learning during those years. Also, most people are more settled in life by then and can focus easier.

[Victor Tango]

My plans for world domination have become much more elaborate.
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I'm more forgiving of everyone's weaknesses, including my own.

I value objective truth more than ever, but I now realize that many people fear and hate it. By extension, if you pursue truth, many people will fear and hate you. I've decided it's worth it, but I've also decided that rubbing other people's faces in it doesn't accomplish very much.

My social skills are more developed. Being with large groups of people still wears me out, but I've learned several techniques to help with that.

I have more wisdom, but I'm not exactly where or how I stepped in it.
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[coffeeloverfreak]

I'm not 30 yet, but I find that there's a world of difference between being a college student and working in the "real world". I find I spend less time debating semantics and arguing with people I have no hope of convincing. It's not that my beliefs are any less strong; I've just come to realize that the efforts spent on those pursuits would be better spent on other things.

I've hit a career wall, gone through the burnout trap, taken time off to re-evaluate, traveled the world, gone back into a new career path with a fresh perspective. I have had time to put things in perspective that were so critically important back then and don't seem to matter anymore, such as grades or perfectionism. I value the people around me a lot more than I did, and I have prioritized experiences over things.

This is me at 27 compared to me at 17. Where will I be at 37? Who knows?

[Jgib5328]

Hmm a lot of you guys are talking about not arguing against people when it's useless. I'm still at that point when I know I'm right and the other person is wrong, and it really bothers me that the other person is wrong, so much so that I want to go out of my way to tell them that. I'm just really bothered by inefficiency and irrationality. When I mean that I know I'm right, I mean that it's like a blatantly obvious thing. Like my roommate left 3 boxes on the ground for several days and would even trip over them, I asked him "Why don't you just throw away these boxes?" and he replies "Because I have three exams this week" and I go "Dude, it'll take 10 seconds". It's just stuff like that, that bother me.

[Wapiti]

Originally Posted by Jgib5328 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Hmm a lot of you guys are talking about not arguing against people when it's useless. I'm still at that point when I know I'm right and the other person is wrong, and it really bothers me that the other person is wrong, so much so that I want to go out of my way to tell them that. I'm just really bothered by inefficiency and irrationality. When I mean that I know I'm right, I mean that it's like a blatantly obvious thing. Like my roommate left 3 boxes on the ground for several days and would even trip over them, I asked him "Why don't you just throw away these boxes?" and he replies "Because I have three exams this week" and I go "Dude, it'll take 10 seconds". It's just stuff like that, that bother me.

And thats what I've learened most. When it is so blatantly obvious. 3 boxes aren't going to make 1 bit of difference in your life, move on.

[coffeeloverfreak]

I think it just becomes a matter of conserving your energy for what's really important.

When I was a student, I became politically active on my campus due to various happenings. I ended up spending many hundreds of hours debating with people I knew I'd never find common ground with, on issues that have been around for centuries and aren't going to be resolved anytime soon. On web forums, newspaper articles, in person, and even in my blog, I would engage, engage, engage because I knew I was right.

Well, I still know I'm right. But I also know that all of this debate was pointless. What was I going to do, convince someone who was as vehemently stuck in their position as I am in mine to change their mind? Not a chance. All the debate might have been educational for a while, but after a time I realized that the arguments were cyclical, the points were being repeated over and over again, and that all the people on my side had started off on my side and all the people on the opposing side had started off on the opposing side. All we'd accomplished was to waste months, years even, of our time yelling at each other, when we could have been doing other things.

Then I started thinking about all the other things I could be doing with that time. Should I continue to spend it arguing against people who would never be convinced, ever, no matter what? Or should I spend it on more productive, interesting pursuits? Rationally, it was no contest.

[Jgib5328]

Originally Posted by coffeeloverfreak To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I think it just becomes a matter of conserving your energy for what's really important. When I was a student, I became politically active on my campus due to various happenings. I ended up spending many hundreds of hours debating with people I knew I'd never find common ground with, on issues that have been around for centuries and aren't going to be resolved anytime soon. On web forums, newspaper articles, in person, and even in my blog, I would engage, engage, engage because I knew I was right. Well, I still know I'm right. But I also know that all of this debate was pointless. What was I going to do, convince someone who was as vehemently stuck in their position as I am in mine to change their mind? Not a chance. All the debate might have been educational for a while, but after a time I realized that the arguments were cyclical, the points were being repeated over and over again, and that all the people on my side had started off on my side and all the people on the opposing side had started off on the opposing side. All we'd accomplished was to waste months, years even, of our time yelling at each other, when we could have been doing other things. Then I started thinking about all the other things I could be doing with that time. Should I continue to spend it arguing against people who would never be convinced, ever, no matter what? Or should I spend it on more productive, interesting pursuits? Rationally, it was no contest.

See with me, I usually don't argue that much with people. I usually just observe them doing irrational things and then I just think to myself how stupid it is. I think I just need to learn how to deal with it and learn to accept that people won't always be as rational or efficient as me, but that's easier said than done.

[Max T]

	Originally Posted by Jgib5328 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I am curious to know, what are the differences between as you are now and as you were during adolescence/college years?

At 31 yrs:
-Now treasure learning and thinking independently more than ever, since many peers have largely stopped thinking as individuals a decade after college- many are living on a 'thought autopilot'.
-At 20 yrs, plans used to be of a 5 yr horizon, 30 onwards they're on more 10-15 yr horizons (perhaps a function of realising we have a lot of time on earth and that things take longer to achieve than originally thought!).
-The number of own errors clocked up are comically numerous= more willing to forgive others AND not too emotionally brittle to break apart personal failings and really examine interconnections.

-As Nomad and others say, increasingly the only truth that sadly matters to others is their own perspective. Be happy to go with the flow until a situation arises where it is in their interests and yours that they understand the other perspective- then it's 100% commitment to the cause.
-Less competitive, less serious and more relaxed in own skin but still with the urge to make a major contribution. You start to consider that the first 30 years of life have been largely selfish take, take, take and that now we should be giving a whole lot more- a 'taking' mentality is unsustainable.
-Learning has moved away from education foundations and work learnings and more to personal development, as it slowly dawns that we could be knowledgeable on a subject, but until we apply it through interacting with others, the knowledge is largely wasted and meaningless.

-Appreciate the importance of having a mentor, but have stupidly never settled with one for a few years. So now I just read books on what successful old/dead people in my field have learnt.
-Fi is developing more but in an unusual way by analysing specific people. The result is still slight social awkwardness with occasional deep insightfulness. Sensory stuff (cooking, sport, dog walking) is very relaxing.

-... and musicial tastes really do get trapped in a time warp (80s & 90s here)!

[Jgib5328]

I've noticed some characteristics that are probably a result of my age and combination of my personality type.

As a young INTJ I'm overly focused on success and achieving my goals and fear failure, think less of people especially the ones who aren't as rational or efficient, I tend to treat and think of people as objects, I push people away too, and I'm also less tolerant of others.

I assume that I'll probably grow out of a lot of these as I get older and become less hasty.

[vaguely dissatisfied]

I think that as I progressed from a young person to an old person.......I became more open to looking at things through perspectives other than my own (not better at it... just more open to it) and I rewrote the rules of engagement to suit my own sensibilities.

[Zilal]

I have more self-esteem, a lot more discipline, I don't view things as much in black & white, and I'm much more interested in people than I used to be. I also shifted from being really interested in computer stuff to being really interested in nature and not inclined to want to sit at a computer for long periods.

[DeadSpace]

at 42, Heh, feel like i'm just repeating what others have said...there's a calmness, alot less tolerant of stupidity, much more patient with ignorance. Ability to distinguish between the two is easier. Patience overall is easier to come by. Social interaction is much easier. Thought streams are as bubbly as ever...but more controlled. Can pull all threads into focus easily and maintain that. More side threads (semi-automatic) for routine stuff, time keepers, to do lists, social analysis, etc. Adaptation to new circumstances is a breeze. it really does get better with age :D

[yondyr]

I'm a lot more sure of my opinions, much more self confident. I've now got the luxury of not having to deal with the world, so I can ignore most that might have disturbed me in the past. People, events, the political pendulum... And a healthy awareness that nothing I say or do can affect the outcome of anything but my own little sphere. Finally a self indulgent lifestyle...yayyyy

[iamnotspock]

In youth: Passionate and smart
In middle-age: Dispassionate and wise

I learned how to take the emotion out, study the board, and lose a fight. I learned that it pays to play the fool. I learned to sell with my ears, steal with my lips, and kiss with my eyes. I learned to sacrafice pride. I learned to survive.

[yondyr]

Beautifully, even poetically said, iamnotspock. Yours or a quote?

[INTroJect]

This is very interesting that we are all kind of experiencing the same change in mental temperment.

Im 27 and it really seems that some time over the past 2 years my mind/thinking has been going through some kind of shift. Interestingly, all along the lines of our elder INTJers. For example: the arguing has just stopped and started to seem pointless (and it really is). I don't get worked up over things or stressed out, somehow I just started noticing that everything became exponentially better once I learned, although I am not yet near perfect at it, to get those negative emotions under control.

[Max T]

Based on the above, perhaps we're all just 'converging to the mean' as we get older.
The mean being the attitude, behaviour and outlook of the average guy.

If INTJs are 1% of the population and MBTI types are believed to develop more rounded personalities as they age, this approximate convergence would be understandable.

'Approximate' since the population surely don't have v. similar personalities by 80yrs!

[The Many]

Originally Posted by TheLoneINTJ To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

This is very interesting that we are all kind of experiencing the same change in mental temperment. Im 27 and it really seems that some time over the past 2 years my mind/thinking has been going through some kind of shift. Interestingly, all along the lines of our elder INTJers. For example: the arguing has just stopped and started to seem pointless (and it really is). I don't get worked up over things or stressed out, somehow I just started noticing that everything became exponentially better once I learned, although I am not yet near perfect at it, to get those negative emotions under control.

Fascinating, since this applies to me as well. I'm 19, but I consider myself having gotten ten years older than my physical age after having gone through my teenage years, full of depression, melancholy, misanthropy, self-loathing and suicidal tendencies. This thread really confirms my thoughts, since I can relate to the thinking of older posters in this thread than to the younger ones.

[PortInStorm]

Yes, at 31 I see myself in almost all these descriptions. Learned from my disastrous third year in school (I went back after 7 years in a previous career) that I did need certain people to be happy and content, that you need to accept care from wherever it comes and value it immensely, to forgive (I still have a lot of work here), to accept whatever people can give to you and not demand more, not to push and engage so much (as CoffeeLover says), my own helplessness (as Yondyr said), a keen appreciation of others' strengths that I lack, a keen appreciation of my own weaknesses, some humility (have a long way to go there too, haha). That you get more flies with honey, to draw people rather than push them. To not apologize for my legitimate needs, but be courteous in getting those met. Be thankful for all the things I take for granted: a hot shower, clean water, healthy food, being able to walk/think straight, stable government, knowing that in a short time that all could be taken away.

[E148]

I am 51.

I was taught long ago that there are 3 things you never talk about.

Religion
Politics
Weather

Because you can't change/control them.

Basically, the first two are so intertwined that they are almost equivalent. Your religious upbringing or lack thereof, affects your political beliefs, whether it is realized or not.

Most of us have had some exposure to some religious practices. Even athiests must know something about religion, in general, to be against it.

Our freedoms are being taken away from us slowly over time, but a little quicker and more openly, now.

[Jgib5328]

Originally Posted by E148 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I am 51. I was taught long ago that there are 3 things you never talk about. Religion Politics Weather Because you can't change/control them. Basically, the first two are so intertwined that they are almost equivalent. Your religious upbringing or lack thereof, affects your political beliefs, whether it is realized or not. Most of us have had some exposure to some religious practices. Even athiests must know something about religion, in general, to be against it. Our freedoms are being taken away from us slowly over time, but a little quicker and more openly, now.

I hate restricting what I speak about. I don't let political correctness or other people's feelings get in the way. I'm not going to shy away from a topic, even if it is sensitive. I mean obviously I wouldn't try to offend anyone, and would be sure to not offend people who mattered, but I still repudiate any form of social constriction on my expression.

[iamnotspock]

	Originally Posted by yondyr To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Beautifully, even poetically said, iamnotspock. Yours or a quote?

Mine... And you sure do know how to give a fine compliment, Yondyr. Much appreciated ;-)