A women asked me if she was attractive, I told her what I thought...

**Vai** · 10-17-2009, 10:19 PM

Tonight, there was this one women who invited me to her home (I was quite reluctant, but played along). We were chilling out and having a little chat about random things but I couldn't shake the feeling that she wanted to know how I thought about her.

Eventually she asked if I thought she was attractive so I give her a direct answer. I told her she would be much more attractive if she lost some weight. (she was quite plump, to put it nicely :embarassed
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... she didn't take it well, telling me I was the first person to tell her that, and what I said was out of line and disrespectful. I tried to make a pitiful excuse that I just give her a honest answer to her question, and someone was bound to tell her condition sooner or later, but you know how you can never win an argument with women.

I'm guessing she is crying to sleep in her bed right now, and I feel bad for sharing a piece of my mind and hurting her feelings.

This is exactly why I rarely ever speak my mind with people in general.
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What do you guys think about my situation?

Originally Posted by Vai
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I have a bit more backstory to share.

From the first time I met her, I had the impression that she was "boy crazy" and she was quite clingy, especially to me. Like grabbing and holding my arms in public for example.

I knew that most guys around her were not interested, so I just played along rather than brush her off so I don't hurt her feelings. That's what led to me visiting her home, I was just thinking about having small talk to keep her company and let her vent steam/frustration/whatever (and definitely not you-know-what)

More information, in my defense.

**Miryr** · 10-17-2009, 10:24 PM

Aye, never speak your mind unless you know the other person can take it and also if you know the other one is an INTJ, we're all categorized as being the most open minded of the 16 personalities.

**Synchronicity** · 10-17-2009, 10:25 PM

If she wasn't prepared for an honest answer, she shouldn't have asked the question.

**CycleBreaker** · 10-17-2009, 10:27 PM

Lol... I could tell where this was going as soon as I saw the title.

If she couldn't handle an honest answer, she shouldn't have asked. How immature.

**Miryr** · 10-17-2009, 10:27 PM

	Originally Posted by Synchronicity To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	If she wasn't prepared for an honest answer, she shouldn't have asked the question.

You're viewing this from a rational point of view, in reality very few people expect an honest answer. Most people expect you to follow their delusions...

**Silverity** · 10-17-2009, 10:28 PM

Huh. I don't think I would've had said something quite so...well, tactless, if I were in someone elses' house. If you were reluctant to go with her you should have said something THEN.

Your comment of never being able to win an argument against women is a bit of an over generalization as well, which I'm sure you know. In that particular argument I think you were both right: you WERE being honest, you were ALSO being a bit rude.

So what do I think of your situation? If you don't like someone, don't go home with them, it sends a mixed message. I mean, why would you go to someone's house if you weren't interested in them?

EDIT: okay so a lot of you replied with "if she couldn't take the answer don't ask" etc, but I think she probably asked because she thought she had a chance, I mean, he did go home with her. Add in the fact that she was probably really embarrassed and hurt, I think she had a fairly typical reaction? The world is not only comprised of INTJs after all.

**Miryr** · 10-17-2009, 10:30 PM

	Originally Posted by Silverity To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I mean, why would you go to someone's house if you weren't interested in them?

1.Free Booze
2.Free Food
3.They have a kick ass entertainment system
4.Fantastic Books
5.They can help you in your career
6.etc...

**Silverity** · 10-17-2009, 10:35 PM

	Originally Posted by Miryr To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	1.Free Booze 2.Free Food 3.They have a kick ass entertainment system 4.Fantastic Books 5.They can help you in your career 6.etc...

I'm trying to think from HER perspective =\

If I met a guy and invited him back to my place I don't think my first thought would be, "he's coming over to see my kick ass entertainment system!!!" Did he know she had one? Or books? (I'm really asking this btw, original poster, was it part of your reasoning?)

**Nikita** · 10-17-2009, 10:38 PM

	Originally Posted by Synchronicity To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	If she wasn't prepared for an honest answer, she shouldn't have asked the question.

	Originally Posted by Miryr To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	You're viewing this from a rational point of view, in reality very few people expect an honest answer. Most people expect you to follow their delusions...

I second these. She was looking for blind admiration, not truth. It may teach her to think before she speaks next time, and to stop seeking approval from others.

	Originally Posted by Miryr To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	and also if you know the other one is an INTJ, we're all categorized as being the most open minded of the 16 personalities.

That doesn't mean that people who have self-typed as INTJs are actually the most open-minded people.

**Miryr** · 10-17-2009, 10:43 PM

	Originally Posted by Nikita To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	That doesn't mean that people who have self-typed as INTJs are actually the most open-minded people.

True, but it's one of the more common traits associated with INTJs

**Vai** · 10-17-2009, 11:14 PM

I have a bit more backstory to share.

From the first time I met her, I had the impression that she was "boy crazy" and she was quite clingy, especially to me. Like grabbing and holding my arms in public for example.

I knew that most guys around her were not interested, so I just played along rather than brush her off so I don't hurt her feelings. That's what led to me visiting her home, I was just thinking about having small talk to keep her company and let her vent steam/frustration/whatever (and definitely not you-know-what)

Turns out I ended up hurting her feelings anyway. Now I feel so ashamed.

*sits in corner*

**Silverity** · 10-17-2009, 11:21 PM

Originally Posted by Vai
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I have a bit more backstory to share.

From the first time I met her, I had the impression that she was "boy crazy" and she was quite clingy, especially to me. Like grabbing and holding my arms in public for example.

I knew that most guys around her were not interested, so I just played along rather than brush her off so I don't hurt her feelings. That's what led to me visiting her home, I was just thinking about having small talk to keep her company and let her vent steam/frustration/whatever (and definitely not you-know-what)

Turns out I ended up hurting her feelings anyway. Now I feel so ashamed.

*sits in corner*

Ah. I think I understand a bit better now. Oh dear.

Well. You had good intentions. How about 'A' for effort and 'F' for fail =P

I'm not sure you can win in a situation like that, but I will stick to my opinion that it's better to be upfront and honest right from the get go.

It's not the end of the world and you possibly learnt something from the experience, and likely so did she, so...cheer up
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*adds cushions and mug of tea to corner*

**JohnDoe** · 10-17-2009, 11:21 PM

Yeah see this is why you have to make it clear to people who are hitting on you that your not interested as opposed to going along out of pity.

**cruiseingheart** · 10-18-2009, 01:12 AM

Fair enougth you have good intentions. I think I would have lied and something like yeah I alright which not the same as being attractive. I probally would have not been so good at it.

Talking about someones wheight is a touchy subject is it?... especiallty to woman. Correct me if I am wrong.

Anyway I would probally take it as a learning curve and move on.


	This is exactly why I rarely ever speak my mind with people in general.

I think it is ok to do that. The best way you can and consider others thoughts and feelings. Thing is you cannot please everyone because the truth can hurt!

**alrightgame** · 10-18-2009, 01:25 AM

I would have told her that she wasn't attractive to me (if she wasn't attractive, as I do find heavyset woman with a beautiful face attractive), and that if you scale yourself by looks, it is unfortunate as there are so many other qualities that would outweigh looks.

I recall getting asked a question from a woman at a gas station, "Would you fuck me?". Her friends just told her she looked ugly, even though she looked respectable to me. I told her the truth. I told her that I would have to know her and care for her, and that it would no longer be fucking. She kept telling me to say yes or no. I finally said no, then told her that "you are someone that I probably couldn't care for as you invalidated my overly truthful answer."

I really had wished I asked her the same question, as I probably would have gotten a no.

**NoStoneUnturned** · 10-18-2009, 01:56 AM

Maybe she will take this and lose some weight now and live a healthier life...

**Causa Mortis** · 10-18-2009, 02:17 AM

Originally Posted by Vai
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Tonight, there was this one women who invited me to her home (I was quite reluctant, but played along). We were chilling out and having a little chat about random things but I couldn't shake the feeling that she wanted to know how I thought about her.

Eventually she asked if I thought she was attractive so I give her a direct answer. I told her she would be much more attractive if she lost some weight. (she was quite plump, to put it nicely :embarassed
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

... she didn't take it well, telling me I was the first person to tell her that, and what I said was out of line and disrespectful. I tried to make a pitiful excuse that I just give her a honest answer to her question, and someone was bound to tell her condition sooner or later, but you know how you can never win an argument with women.

I'm guessing she is crying to sleep in her bed right now, and I feel bad for sharing a piece of my mind and hurting her feelings.

This is exactly why I rarely ever speak my mind with people in general.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

What do you guys think about my situation?

She's obviously romantically attracted to you and shot her down in a way that's not very nice. I'm sure the comment was gratifying on some level ("I'm not like all those other idiots who don't say what they think), but it could have been clearly expressed much more delicately.

Use tact. A failure to do so in this situation resulted in the end of an easily renewable friendship. A failure to do so in other situations can kill careers and meaningful relationships. This is a lesson I've learned very painfully.

**Obsidean** · 10-18-2009, 04:54 AM

Originally Posted by Vai
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Eventually she asked if I thought she was attractive so I give her a direct answer. I told her she would be much more attractive if she lost some weight. (she was quite plump, to put it nicely :embarassed
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

... she didn't take it well, telling me I was the first person to tell her that, and what I said was out of line and disrespectful. I tried to make a pitiful excuse that I just give her a honest answer to her question, and someone was bound to tell her condition sooner or later, but you know how you can never win an argument with women.

Dude, most women don't want to hear the truth. They want to hear lies. They want to be convinced they are attractive. Even though they're not lol

**Aristocrat Porn** · 10-18-2009, 05:54 AM

Hey, maybe you weren't nice to her, but you can't be blamed for not wanting to roleplay with her. It was tactless, but at least you didn't complicate yourself any further by giving a less truthful answer and potentially leading her to believe you were into her.

**9 Guillotines** · 10-18-2009, 06:35 AM

	Originally Posted by Miryr To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	You're viewing this from a rational point of view, in reality very few people expect an honest answer. Most people expect you to follow their delusions...

Agreed.

I'm sure it could have been done more subtly, but most people are generally only interested in what they WANT to hear. Sad, really...

The world needs a little more honesty; maybe then, people will step out from their fictional little world, swallow some reality, and act accordingly.

Sinequanon · 10-18-2009, 06:37 AM

This isn't a case of a random person not being able to handle a dose of truth. You led her on (to some degree) by agreeing to come to her house, by not rejecting her sooner, etc. Her question wasn't one of affirmation but of confirmation that you were attracted to her, so that she could close that door (in her mind) and move on. Your answer lacked tact and also invalidated the hope she'd built up through your positive actions.

Yes, on some level one shouldn't ask a question one is not prepared to hear the answer to, but it's also not out of the realm of reason to suggest that a guy who has talked to you a couple of times and actually came over to your house is attracted to you on some level. Many times, people just need to actually hear that, as well.

**LaoTzu** · 10-18-2009, 06:44 AM

	Originally Posted by Silverity To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	If you don't like someone, don't go home with them, it sends a mixed message. I mean, why would you go to someone's house if you weren't interested in them?

Im going to go along with this response.

The question wasn't "do you find me attractive"...
the question was "do you want to 'date' me".

Your answer in this light was a brutal "NO eff-in' way".

I'd have probably said the same thing as you.... in fact I'm in a similar situation and haven't thought of the right thing to say for almost a week now.
It's never easy, but at least you've got it out there plain as day, and the damage is done and over with. Like ripping off a band-aid.... Don't fret about it.

**Deerhunter** · 10-18-2009, 07:16 AM

When I read this story, I had to wonder if I would do the same thing but I guess I am like Dexter from the TV Show, I pretend to act like they want me to, as this seems to be the less harmful way...

**Prunesquallor** · 10-18-2009, 07:33 AM

Truth can come with tact, you know. They are not mutually exclusive.

Coralaisly · 10-18-2009, 07:58 AM

Just for future reference, INTJ guys, when a woman asks you about appearance, whether she looks fat, whether her feet look big, whether or not she looks old, etc etc etc, it's probably this baffling feminine behaviour called "compliment fishing." She's feeling insecure, and is asking you to reassure her. She's letting you in, and effectively trying to tell you how to get and stay on her good side.

The usual answers she wants to these questions, this won't work on all, mind:
"no, your feet don't look big"
"no, you don't look fat"
"of corse you don't look old, why would you think that?"

Unless you know this woman really well, and you know she likes you to be blunt with her, sugar coat, sugar coat, sugar coat. Unless, of corse your goal is to have her blow up at you in an attempt to recover some of the damage by injuring you and attempting to bring you to her level.

10-17-2009, 10:24 PM	#2
Miryr Member [18%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 749	Aye, never speak your mind unless you know the other person can take it and also if you know the other one is an INTJ, we're all categorized as being the most open minded of the 16 personalities.
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10-17-2009, 10:25 PM	#3
Synchronicity Core Member [366%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 14,657	If she wasn't prepared for an honest answer, she shouldn't have asked the question.
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10-17-2009, 10:27 PM	#4
CycleBreaker Member [08%] MBTI: inxj Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 337	Lol... I could tell where this was going as soon as I saw the title. If she couldn't handle an honest answer, she shouldn't have asked. How immature.
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10-17-2009, 10:28 PM	#6
Silverity Core Member [274%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 10,995	Huh. I don't think I would've had said something quite so...well, tactless, if I were in someone elses' house. If you were reluctant to go with her you should have said something THEN. Your comment of never being able to win an argument against women is a bit of an over generalization as well, which I'm sure you know. In that particular argument I think you were both right: you WERE being honest, you were ALSO being a bit rude. So what do I think of your situation? If you don't like someone, don't go home with them, it sends a mixed message. I mean, why would you go to someone's house if you weren't interested in them? EDIT: okay so a lot of you replied with "if she couldn't take the answer don't ask" etc, but I think she probably asked because she thought she had a chance, I mean, he did go home with her. Add in the fact that she was probably really embarrassed and hurt, I think she had a fairly typical reaction? The world is not only comprised of INTJs after all.
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10-17-2009, 11:14 PM	#11
Vai Member [04%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 193	I have a bit more backstory to share. From the first time I met her, I had the impression that she was "boy crazy" and she was quite clingy, especially to me. Like grabbing and holding my arms in public for example. I knew that most guys around her were not interested, so I just played along rather than brush her off so I don't hurt her feelings. That's what led to me visiting her home, I was just thinking about having small talk to keep her company and let her vent steam/frustration/whatever (and definitely not you-know-what) Turns out I ended up hurting her feelings anyway. Now I feel so ashamed. sits in corner
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10-17-2009, 11:21 PM	#13
JohnDoe Core Member [130%] MBTI: INFJ Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 5,203	Yeah see this is why you have to make it clear to people who are hitting on you that your not interested as opposed to going along out of pity.
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10-18-2009, 01:25 AM	#15
alrightgame Member [20%] MBTI: IXTJ Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 801	I would have told her that she wasn't attractive to me (if she wasn't attractive, as I do find heavyset woman with a beautiful face attractive), and that if you scale yourself by looks, it is unfortunate as there are so many other qualities that would outweigh looks. I recall getting asked a question from a woman at a gas station, "Would you fuck me?". Her friends just told her she looked ugly, even though she looked respectable to me. I told her the truth. I told her that I would have to know her and care for her, and that it would no longer be fucking. She kept telling me to say yes or no. I finally said no, then told her that "you are someone that I probably couldn't care for as you invalidated my overly truthful answer." I really had wished I asked her the same question, as I probably would have gotten a no.
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10-18-2009, 01:56 AM	#16
NoStoneUnturned Banned MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 1,917	Maybe she will take this and lose some weight now and live a healthier life...
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10-18-2009, 05:54 AM	#19
Aristocrat Porn Member [10%] MBTI: ESFP Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 400	Hey, maybe you weren't nice to her, but you can't be blamed for not wanting to roleplay with her. It was tactless, but at least you didn't complicate yourself any further by giving a less truthful answer and potentially leading her to believe you were into her.
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10-18-2009, 06:37 AM	#21
Sinequanon Veteran Member [96%] MBTI: INFJ Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,879	This isn't a case of a random person not being able to handle a dose of truth. You led her on (to some degree) by agreeing to come to her house, by not rejecting her sooner, etc. Her question wasn't one of affirmation but of confirmation that you were attracted to her, so that she could close that door (in her mind) and move on. Your answer lacked tact and also invalidated the hope she'd built up through your positive actions. Yes, on some level one shouldn't ask a question one is not prepared to hear the answer to, but it's also not out of the realm of reason to suggest that a guy who has talked to you a couple of times and actually came over to your house is attracted to you on some level. Many times, people just need to actually hear that, as well.
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10-18-2009, 07:16 AM	#23
Deerhunter New Member [01%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 16	When I read this story, I had to wonder if I would do the same thing but I guess I am like Dexter from the TV Show, I pretend to act like they want me to, as this seems to be the less harmful way...
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10-18-2009, 07:33 AM	#24
Prunesquallor Veteran Member [66%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 2,647	Truth can come with tact, you know. They are not mutually exclusive. Last edited by Synamon; 10-18-2009 at 07:47 AM. Reason: removed personal attack
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10-18-2009, 07:58 AM	#25
Coralaisly Veteran Member [79%] MBTI: XXXX Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 3,183	Just for future reference, INTJ guys, when a woman asks you about appearance, whether she looks fat, whether her feet look big, whether or not she looks old, etc etc etc, it's probably this baffling feminine behaviour called "compliment fishing." She's feeling insecure, and is asking you to reassure her. She's letting you in, and effectively trying to tell you how to get and stay on her good side. The usual answers she wants to these questions, this won't work on all, mind: "no, your feet don't look big" "no, you don't look fat" "of corse you don't look old, why would you think that?" Unless you know this woman really well, and you know she likes you to be blunt with her, sugar coat, sugar coat, sugar coat. Unless, of corse your goal is to have her blow up at you in an attempt to recover some of the damage by injuring you and attempting to bring you to her level.
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