[LionsPride]

Originally Posted by Rudy To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Everyone seems certain that this is not a gender issue, but I'm unconvinced. I don't think that an ESFP female is fundamentally more annoying than an ESFP male, however I do think that an ESFP female would feel more connected with, and therefore more likely to bother, a fellow female than she would a male. Similarly, if the OP were living with an ESFP and INFP male, they might be more inclined to leave her alone, or not unload on her, simply because of the perceived gender barrier.

I agree, a male INTJ living with a male ESFP and INFP might have type vs type issues that a woman living with two men of that type might not. It's quite possible for a women to find men that give her a wide berth (and therefore a greater sense of privacy) because they aren't as comfortable walking into her bedroom and farting like they might do to another guy. That might be the case of the OP and many of her previous experiences with living with men. As a woman living with women, the gender divide wouldn't be present and suddenly the previously enjoyed distance is gone.

As to this situation and what is going on with the women, it's possible that they are having a feeling fest that's excessive for a female INTJ and it's also possible, as others have mentioned, that the OP has been negligent with social pleasantries, which her previous male roommates never called her on. If the case is the latter, then moving back in with the guys is just delaying the inevitable. Just because they don't feel the need to point out selfish or self absorbed behaviour doesn't mean that it won't come up sometime in the future.

[Athene]

Originally Posted by Amphorian To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

-blinks- Talking aloud to multiple people helps me solve my problems. First it allows me to continue mulling for a solution while talking aloud and then I might get a new perspective from the person I'm talking to. Now I'm not talking petty problems but major on going ones. It's good to let that emotion free so it doesn't bog you down or your thinking/rational thought down. Writing is another good forum for problem solving. I want talk about what doesn't interest me (I'm definitly not aligned with interests and the norm female) but I wouldn't put talking down so quickly. I use to be so quiet when I was little until I learned talking helps. O_O

With the advent of Dr. Phil, people have bought into the idea that talking solves everything.

It doesn't. There are times when it actually makes things worse.

I understand talking things through and getting several perspectives before making a decision. I don't think that's what the op was referring to, but I could be wrong.





Athene added to this post, 3 minutes and 11 seconds later...

Originally Posted by LionsPride To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

As to this situation and what is going on with the women, it's possible that they are having a feeling fest that's excessive for a female INTJ and it's also possible, as others have mentioned, that the OP has been negligent with social pleasantries, which her previous male roommates never called her on. If the case is the latter, then moving back in with the guys is just delaying the inevitable. Just because they don't feel the need to point out selfish or self absorbed behaviour doesn't mean that it won't come up sometime in the future.

So a woman is simply going to have to play the 'feeling fest" game, or risk being considered selfish and self absorbed?

I object.

[LionsPride]

	Originally Posted by Athene To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	So a woman is simply going to have to play the 'feeling fest" game, or risk being considered selfish and self absorbed? I object.

Nope. The scenarios I painted was that either the situation that the OP is in is exactly as described and the two women are having these feeling fests for no good reason (or a reason that isn't congruent with what an INTJ would consider to be a good reason) OR there might be a reason that the OP is being dragged into the meetings because in classic INTJ fashion she is being disrespectful to others and hiding under the guise of "it's not important to me, so it's their problem that they don't like what I said". Obviously there are all sorts of grey that could occur between those two scenarios and her situation might fit somewhere on that spectrum. Depending on how close she actually is to either pole would determine if her moving out is avoiding the problem or solving it.

[wotsamattaU]

Originally Posted by Asinine To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Forewarning: I'm just extrapolating (somewhat) wildly based on what you have said. Two days later, huh? If I'm reading the situation right, it sounds like the feeling (*cough*) is mutual. And, the meetings are for the most part a pretext to bring you in line without singling you out. My own experiences tell me that ExFx's like to hold such meetings in order to teach IxTx's a lesson in social manners, bring them out of their shells, or likely both. And, judging by your assessment of the INFP, you've already hurt her feelings and the ESFP has noticed. They're reading your irritation combined with your blunt assessment as some kind of secret resentment against one or both. They got tired of trying to coax a resolution out of you after a couple of hours and she figured she would try again after giving you a couple of days to cool off. That's my guess, anyway.

This sounds very much spot on to me. Perhaps you can not live contentedly with these two particular women. I don't see any reason to force yourself to do so, when you have another option readily available which you know suits you better. However, I would suggest you explain to your current roommates your point of view, while keeping an open mind to what they have to say.

At some point you are going to have to learn how to communicate and get along effectively with others of all types. If you turn tail and run now this scenario is only going to be repeated in your life time and time again, at work, socially, personally whatever. It will continue until you face it head on and learn from it.

Writing people off is not the answer; learning how to respect one another's differences while communicating your boundaries and needs, is.

[escapist11]

	Originally Posted by wittykitty To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I would never move in with female roommates. Maybe if they were female INTJs but Ive never met any of those.

Same here. Being in college and living in the dorms, I don't really have a choice but to have female roommates. Luckily I've gotten lucky for the past 3 years and my roommates haven't been all that bad. I don't think I've ever met another female INTJ in person either. I would imagine that one of two things would probably happen. We would probably bicker and not be too fond of each other instantly, or we'd become the best of friends.

I have a hard time making female friends. It's easier for met to make guy friends (although that rarely happens because guys don't really talk to me in the first place). I think the best thing in my experience is gay guys. It's a little bit of both worlds and I get along the best with them.

[liquidzilla]

	Originally Posted by wittykitty To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I would never move in with female roommates. Maybe if they were female INTJs but Ive never met any of those.

I agree, I couldn't stand to be with other females unless they were INTJs or INFJs (I know an INFJ female who understands me very well).

[Athene]

Originally Posted by LionsPride To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Nope. The scenarios I painted was that either the situation that the OP is in is exactly as described and the two women are having these feeling fests for no good reason (or a reason that isn't congruent with what an INTJ would consider to be a good reason) OR there might be a reason that the OP is being dragged into the meetings because in classic INTJ fashion she is being disrespectful to others and hiding under the guise of "it's not important to me, so it's their problem that they don't like what I said". Obviously there are all sorts of grey that could occur between those two scenarios and her situation might fit somewhere on that spectrum. Depending on how close she actually is to either pole would determine if her moving out is avoiding the problem or solving it.

Ok, point taken.

I can identify with both scenarios. I try very, very hard to get along with people and usually end up with the short end of things... right up to the point where I hit the wall and decide I've had enough. That's usually the end of it, and if I can leave, that is the point where I turn and never look back.

Many things other women (in particular) think are important AREN'T important to me. In fact, I think they're silly and a huge waste of time and energy. But I usually am polite.

The thing is, most women aren't content to make their point and move on with their lives. It's been my experience that most women want to re-count their experiences over and over and over. I'm a pretty good sounding board, and I usually offer pretty good advice.

But it's rarely taken. The next time I see them, they pick up where they left off. They haven't made any changes, haven't taken steps, just start telling me exactly the same things again...

It's tedious and eventually you'll find me heading out the back door when I see them coming, or not picking up when I see their number on caller id.

It's more of a female thing to ruminate aloud to anyone who will listen, and of course an INTJ is more likely to get fed up and spout off... eventually.

Men (in general) don't have the same desire to share their feelings with anyone who will listen.

[fatkattykat]

House meetings...? It sounds like you are living in The Real World.

I have never lived with male roommates. I don't feel as comfortable living with males because I am very private and want to avoid any sexual awkwardness. I can only think of one serious problem I had with female roommates was my freshman year of college. Both of my roommates were very introverted and only hung out with each other (some people thought they were lesbians and I wondered about one of them). One of them, who was not assigned to live with us in our small dorm, , slept on our floor and had horrible housekeeping habits. But I felt if I said anything, I knew they would make my life miserable. Other than that, I have lived with female roommates of varying personality types and I have never had a problem. As long as they stay out of my business, are not horribly messy, don't "party" excessively, I am OK.

[Amphorian]

	Originally Posted by Athene To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	With the advent of Dr. Phil, people have bought into the idea that talking solves everything. It doesn't. There are times when it actually makes things worse. I understand talking things through and getting several perspectives before making a decision. I don't think that's what the op was referring to, but I could be wrong.

Why are you talking about Dr. Phil and where did I say talking solved everything? I did say talking helps, but I didn't say actually solve.

But the OP stated that they had the meetings only when something happened between them. In other words meetings to express their feelings and thoughts to the situation. Meetings like that are meant for understanding each other's point of view, becoming open-minded and finding a solution.

I'm wondering why the OP is running away from these meetings or distancing herself during them. Perhaps things aren't moving forward or being solved, but that doesn't mean the other females are the problem. It could be just as well the OP is balking and believes the talks are worthless; thus having a close mind and the issue not being solved. It coud be a combination of each too.

[Athene]

	Originally Posted by Amphorian To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Why are you talking about Dr. Phil and where did I say talking solved everything? I did say talking helps, but I didn't say actually solve.

I mentioned Dr. Phil because many people have bought into the idea that talking/communication solves everything, and I disagree. As I stated, talking about some things actually make the situation worse.

I don't remember directing this AT you in particular, just stating my opinion about current beliefs that communication will solve most problems.

I'll go back and read the posts and try to figure out what you're angry about. If it seemed I was directing it at you, I apologize. It's my observation that this current culture believes strongly that talk solves everything, and certainly not a comment meant to antagonize you. I don't even know you.

15 seconds later: I read my post. I think this makes my point.

[Deliberator]

	Originally Posted by Nyura To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I'm running, not walking, back to male roommates. The same seven bedroom household I happily lived in a while back...whom luckily have a room coming open in 3 days...full of maintenance-free people.

Good for you. I wouldn't have gotten to the point of knawing my arm off; I'd probably have told them to soak their heads in battery acid by then.

I used to have the patience of a saint with my teenage girlfriends, until I snapped. Really snapped. Said very, very mean things, told everyone to leave me the f*** alone. God I was so happy, and I've been happy ever since. It's like I was an INTJ pretending to be an INFP for so long, wondering why being such a good friend made me so miserable.

By the way, my best college dorm roommate I ever had was an ESTP rugby player. Female yes, but I may as well have been living with a dude.

[smabers]

I remember I had a male roommate who wanted to have house meetings with everyone about everything. I always thought he was kinda girly.

Basically women with an INTJ mind have a male mind in a female body, which is pretty rare in society.