[boldbidder]

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As a resident of Chicagoland this is a frakking disgrace. This douche doesn't need jail time or probation he deserves to be drawn and quartered.
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[BryyM]

No wonder you distrust the police when they get away with beating someone like that with no real punishment, with such a clear evidence as a video of it.

[Mader]

I wonder how much this cost hiim???? Or the union????

It IS Chicago, after all. The town has been run this way from the beginning. I am not saying it is right, it absolutely is not right, but this is the way it is.

I have often wondered what was wrong with all those macho Chicago men when they stood by and let a huge man beat on a small woman. In fact, in the video it looks like a couple of men got out of the way of the cop!!!!! Mom would be so proud (she says sarcastically).

I grew up in No. Ill, family living in Chicago, etc.

Old Mayor Daley, yeah he was crooked and dirty, but the streets got plowed
How many governors are in jail?
How many state legislators have been removed from office and/or prosecuted?

It will not change because the people of Chicago don't really want it to change. Al Capone is a much better story than Elliot Ness.

[Night Runner]

	Earlier this month, the judge rejected Abbate's claim he acted in self-defense and convicted him of aggravated battery.

Oh hey - look, it could be worse.
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[boldbidder]

	Originally Posted by Mader To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I have often wondered what was wrong with all those macho Chicago men when they stood by and let a huge man beat on a small woman. In fact, in the video it looks like a couple of men got out of the way of the cop!!!!! Mom would be so proud (she says sarcastically).

Actually this particular point sickens me the most. How can all those patrons sit by and watch this take place? Even if it were two males, I would be remiss to let someone just get the dogshit beat out of them. I'd be that much more motivated to come to the aid of a woman, especially given the circumstances (for the record, not trying to be chauvinistic I have two older sisters and such a scene would be synonymous with one of them being attacked).

Why is it if I'm with someone who happens to randomly rob a liquor store and kills the clerk, and I don't try to stop them, I get prosecuted just the same. However, if I stand by and watch a prolonged beating of someone and don't intervene that somehow carries no penalty?

[rahdam]

I heard about this when it initially happened, and I saw the video at the same time. I'm disgusted that the cop attempted to claim self-defense when the video shows him him punching the shit out of her. And the other guy at the bar...he starts in, then back, then in, then back...it's sickening. I know next to nothing about Chicago politics, but this is definitely corrupt.

[Nonsense]

The Chicago police are downright corrupt to the core. :/

Of course, not every cop is corrupt, but the overall system is that way.

[zippikay]

on the other hand, if it is true that the cop is actually has a clean record and it just happen that that is when he slip (we all had a bad day), would it justify to treat a first offend as if the doer has been doing it back and forth?

if i were in the bar, i wouldn't necessarily states that i would readily defend the lady... maybe i'm a coward, maybe i don't care about other people, maybe i'm too drunk to realize what's going on, or maybe i think that the lady deserve the punching anyway, or maybe i'm too afraid of getting involved which will put me right against the system...

[Mader]

The relationships in a local tavern are a bit unusual.

The bartender is your "friend", but your friend controls how much alcohol you get.

This was a little, blond,non-American (Russian, I think) bartender who told the big man he couldn't have what he wanted. These guys don't usually like that. Good for her for standing up for herself! Is there a civil suit? Is he still a working cop?

When drunk, few will get into a fight against a huge, angry, drunk cop. But they didn't even try to block the cop, they didn't even try to help her get away.

But I am still disgusted by the guys. You know, they were back in that same tavern the next weekend, getting served by the same bartender, acting as if everything was fine and getting beat up by the cop is just part of the business.

Not marriage material for me. Not friend material for me. Probably not employee material for me. 'Cheers' was only a tv show, this is really what drunks do.

Yeah, I love the city and the people, but you must always remember the rules you are playing with. This IS politics in Chicago - which is why I am so concerned about the people surrounding our President - are they writing their own rules just like back home in Chicago? (not meant as a political statement)

[Conservationist]

	Originally Posted by Mader To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	It IS Chicago, after all. The town has been run this way from the beginning. I am not saying it is right, it absolutely is not right, but this is the way it is.

Didn't we just elect a president who was familiar with and succeeded in that political machine?

[Seriously]

That is disgusting. And also why I take self defense.

[rahdam]

	Originally Posted by Seriously To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	That is disgusting. And also why I take self defense.

What kind of self-defense do you take? Just curious.
Would you feel comfortable using it against someone with a large size differential?

[Mader]

Why yes, our President did rise in that environment. As did some in his White House. Have you noticed the number of Czars we have, who report only to the President? The census now falls under the authority of the White House.

Congress is working on yet another bill today that noone read.

Just like home.

[Tristan]

That sentence is absolute rubbish! The good-ol'-boy network definitely let that cop off the hook, but sweet.

	Originally Posted by Conservationist To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Didn't we just elect a president who was familiar with and succeeded in that political machine?

Yep. Voters felt that Washington politics wasn't dirty enough, so it needed a dose of Chicago politics. People need to look past who they vote for and carefully consider what they vote for.

[JCFolsom]

	Originally Posted by rahdam To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	What kind of self-defense do you take? Just curious. Would you feel comfortable using it against someone with a large size differential?

I don't mean to be sexist, and maybe you'll do better against an average man, but against a large man with training, a woman of any normal size would have to be trained by freakin' Pai Mei to have any chance in hand-to-hand combat, or be really lucky. The strength and mass differential, especially if the guy works out at all, is just too great. It actually makes me worry for the women in my life, sometimes.

I say this as a person who has studied martial arts for years and lifts weights on a regular basis. I am four times stronger than your average woman, three times stronger than your average fit one (I do 20 reps of 310 on the bench press machine to work out [yeah, I know it's not the same as free weights, give me a break, will ya]). I am stronger than most men, too, but the fact remains that the differences of power men can reach will simply overwhelm even a great degree of technique.

It makes me wish more women would arm themselves. "Have no fear of any man, no matter what his size. When danger threatens, call on me, and I will equalize," was an old Colt slogan, and it is as true today as ever. Women miss out on a great opportunity to negate much of the power men have held over them for all of history when they do not arm themselves. A gun is the ultimate tool of women's liberation.

[thod]

The guy did wrong but we have to put that in perspective. Common assault is not the worse offence out there and should not attract the severest punishment. We reserve maximal sentences for repeat offenders. Since it was a first offence we go easier on him. If he has learned his lesson, nothing further will be achieved by keeping him behind bars except cost to us.

Bar room fights happen every day in the US. Everybody accepts its just guys letting off steam, a few cuts and bruises are the only result. What is getting the goat here is the fact a woman was involved. It seems sexual equality only applies one way.

	A gun is the ultimate tool of women's liberation.

Like some of the primitive societies, they had only two verdicts, not guilty or death. A gun is simply not an appropriate response to most altercations. What's more it relies on people having good enough judgement to know when to use a gun. IMHO most gun carriers have a paranoid streak and this mental imbalance makes them the worse people to make such a judgement.

[zibber]

	Originally Posted by BryyM To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	No wonder you distrust the police when they get away with beating someone like that with no real punishment, with such a clear evidence as a video of it.

He got fired, though.

It's bullshit that this guy got off so lightly (especially considering the existence of video footage of him beating a woman half his fucking size), but he's not a cop anymore.

	Originally Posted by JCFolsom To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	A gun is the ultimate tool of women's liberation.

People not beating people half their size (or anyone else) is the ultimate tool of everyone's liberation. Shooting someone is a good way to lose your freedom.

[boldbidder]

	Originally Posted by thod To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	The guy did wrong but we have to put that in perspective. Common assault is not the worse offence out there and should not attract the severest punishment. We reserve maximal sentences for repeat offenders. Since it was a first offence we go easier on him. If he has learned his lesson, nothing further will be achieved by keeping him behind bars except cost to us.

Seems to me that someone charged with upholding the law should be subject to more severe penalties when breaking it, as opposed to average Joe citizen. Kinda like giving a slap on the wrist to an accountant busted for embezzlement. A cop should be the one breaking up the bar fight, not instigating one, especially for the reason of not being served more liquor. He deserves what the average citizen without the benefit of a union funded defense would've gotten; a minimum of 18 months jail time, a conviction and subsequently a ruined life.





boldbidder added to this post, 4 minutes and 25 seconds later...

	Originally Posted by thod To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	It seems sexual equality only applies one way.

Under different circumstances I would agree with you. If a woman wants to jump into my personal space with a swelled up chest looking me up and down like a man would then she should be prepared to brawl like a man. This wasn't that sort of situation, this woman obviously wasn't trying to start a physical confrontation, she was trying to do her job as a bartender; cutoff the obviously uber-drunk people. I'll admit that I'm particularly upset that this guy would be beat on a woman like that, but even if it had been a male that wouldn't change the facts of the situation, he'd still deserve some jail time. If for no other reason than officers of the law should not be afforded the luxury of even a single slip up of this kind, it's not like he was roughing up a perp, he was beating the shit out of a bartender who told him he couldn't have anymore drinks. There are ZERO mitigating circumstances in this case, lapses of judgement of that order of magnitude don't deserve second chances or leniency for even first time dumb asses.

[JCFolsom]

	Originally Posted by zibber To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	He got fired, though. It's bullshit that this guy got off so lightly (especially considering the existence of video footage of him beating a woman half his fucking size), but he's not a cop anymore. People not beating people half their size (or anyone else) is the ultimate tool of everyone's liberation. Shooting someone is a good way to lose your freedom.

I will turn to a quote from Dallas for my response:

"If I did give you power then you've got nothing. Nobody gives you power. Real power is something you take." -"Jock" Ewing

To rely on the forbearance of others is to rely on their power. You will never, never, never cleanse the violence from the hearts of men, and there will always be some who act upon it.

[Conservationist]

	Originally Posted by JCFolsom To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	You will never, never, never cleanse the violence from the hearts of men, and there will always be some who act upon it.

I hope that it is never cleansed.

Violence is a purifier.

When someone is an unreasonable idiot, murder is appropriate.

Otherwise, idiocy spreads like a cancer.

[timetraveler]

	Originally Posted by boldbidder To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. As a resident of Chicagoland this is a frakking disgrace. This douche doesn't need jail time or probation he deserves to be drawn and quartered. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

If you think the cops are corrupt, become a cop.

[boldbidder]

	Originally Posted by timetraveler To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	If you think the cops are corrupt, become a cop.

Where in my post did I make the generalization that COPS (as in all of them) are corrupt? Also, how would ME becoming a Cop give justice to the woman in the video who got the shit kicked out of her? Please explain how that computes.

[Ray9]

	Where in my post did I make the generalization that COPS (as in all of them) are corrupt? Also, how would ME becoming a Cop give justice to the woman in the video who got the shit kicked out of her? Please explain how that computes.

First of all the video came from the Huffington Post, a publication ony slightly to the right of the Communist manifesto. Ok, I'll struggle to get beyond that. I think I saw this video some time ago and was just as outraged as anyone else. My outrage was multiplied by the inaction and apparent cowardice of the onlookers. I can't explain the court findings. My guess is that he had a good lawyer. She can still sue him in civil court. Why didn't this bar have a bouncer? She may be able to sue the management here. My last point is that she should have a had a gun behind the bar to blow this bastard's head off.

[boldbidder]

Originally Posted by Ray9 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

First of all the video came from the Huffington Post, a publication ony slightly to the right of the Communist manifesto. Ok, I'll struggle to get beyond that. I think I saw this video some time ago and was just as outraged as anyone else. My outrage was multiplied by the inaction and apparent cowardice of the onlookers. I can't explain the court findings. My guess is that he had a good lawyer. She can still sue him in civil court. Why didn't this bar have a bouncer? She may be able to sue the management here. My last point is that she should have a had a gun behind the bar to blow this bastard's head off.

Guilty as charged, I read huffington post, so you got me Ray
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The whole scene was crazy, none of the bar patrons came to her aid, but I'm upset because if it was an ordinary citizen and not a cop I have a hard time believing he doesn't get jail time. This wasn't a bar fight after the Bears/Packers game, this was an off duty cop beating the crap out of a woman who he had 150lbs on. Yeah, she can sue and probably will get some good coin, but I don't personally care that much for monetary rewards in these instances above medical care and loss of wages. The bastard needs jail time. Period.

[Ray9]

	The bastard needs jail time. Period.

Agreed. The only logic I can find in the judge's decision is that this moron probably wouldn't last long behind behind bars before somebody took him out. I'm sure there would have been a long line of "real" tough people just waiting to get a crack at him.