Name your programming languages beyond "normal" ones...

**Synapse** · 06-05-2009, 08:25 AM

I noticed that there's not a lot of "oddball" language threads, only the normal ones like Java and C++. Anyone know anything different than those two?

Certainly, they have their place and are ubiquitous and relatively easy to learn, but variety is always nice. Anyways, I know Python pretty well, Java decently, some rudimentary Perl and some rudimentary Ruby. Python is pretty easy, I know that language the best and Perl is ridiculous. Ruby is okay, but just possesses a weird syntax that makes sense once you use it, but it isn't as intuitive as I would like it to be.

Anyone know any of these not-so-standard programming languages? And feel free to share your source code to show your aptitude if you wish, I'm writing something that I have yet to test in Python right now, so I can't go about that yet.

Chemist · 06-05-2009, 08:51 AM

I know RPG and COBOL...
I have to say that among all of the programming languages I've learned those 2 are at the top of the never gonna actually use it in anything I do ever list....

**JohnDoe** · 06-05-2009, 08:53 AM

x86 machine code? :P Mips..
Edit: Yes I've written an assembler.
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**phej** · 06-05-2009, 08:55 AM

List of things are nice: Lisp, Haskell, Prolog, Scheme, VAX assembly, Alpha assembly, Eiffel, Simula, D, Erlang, VHDL, Verilog, ML

I speak primarily C, C++, Assembly.

I have a passing familiarity with Lisp, Haskell, Scheme, and VHDL...

**Ice Wolf** · 06-05-2009, 09:50 AM

Matlab, C, C++, C#, Mathematica, assebly for couple of architectures (not X86), simscript... G-code, pascal, basic and some more obscure things I don't even remember their names. I even tried fortran once.

I hope soon I'll start with VHDL.

Example of ADSP Assembly (Sorry but code is a bit distorted on forum.):

Code:

.section/pm    program;

start:
    dis int;                              //disable interrupts

    DMPG2 = page(buffer);        //Set Memory Page
    I4 = buffer;                       //Set Current Memory Address
    L4 = 0;                             //Set Length
    M4 = 0;                            //Set Modify
        
    DMPG1 = page(buffer);        //Set Memory Page
    I1 = buffer;                       //Set Current Memory Address
    L1 = length(buffer);            //Set Length
    M1 = -3;                          //Set Modify
    
    ax0 = I1;                    
    reg(B1) = ax0;                   //Set Base Address B1 not in core use reg()
    
    ax0 = Theta;

Main:    
    ax1 = DM (I1 += M1);         //Get previous
    ar = ax1 + 1;            
    DM (I1 += M0) = ar;           //Store current
    ax0 = DM(I1 += M0), 
    ay0 = PM(I4 += M4);          //Multiread DM bus PM bus;
    
    jump Main;                        //Loop
start.end:

**Synapse** · 06-05-2009, 09:59 AM

Originally Posted by Ice Wolf
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Matlab, C, C++, C#, Mathematica, assebly for couple of architectures (not X86), simscript... G-code, pascal, basic and some more obscure things I don't even remember their names. I even tried fortran once.

I hope soon I'll start with VHDL.

Example of ADSP Assembly (Sorry but code is a bit distorted on forum.):

Code:

.section/pm    program;

start:
    dis int;                              //disable interrupts

    DMPG2 = page(buffer);        //Set Memory Page
    I4 = buffer;                       //Set Current Memory Address
    L4 = 0;                             //Set Length
    M4 = 0;                            //Set Modify
        
    DMPG1 = page(buffer);        //Set Memory Page
    I1 = buffer;                       //Set Current Memory Address
    L1 = length(buffer);            //Set Length
    M1 = -3;                          //Set Modify
    
    ax0 = I1;                    
    reg(B1) = ax0;                   //Set Base Address B1 not in core use reg()
    
    ax0 = Theta;

Main:    
    ax1 = DM (I1 += M1);         //Get previous
    ar = ax1 + 1;            
    DM (I1 += M0) = ar;           //Store current
    ax0 = DM(I1 += M0), 
    ay0 = PM(I4 += M4);          //Multiread DM bus PM bus;
    
    jump Main;                        //Loop
start.end:

What does this even do? It looks incredibly complicated, actually. And I guess when I say "odd programming languages", people come out with low-level machine ones. Anyone know FORTRAN? I know someone who knows that language fluently, and they tell me that it's savagely difficult to master, but you can create efficient programs with it that don't' consume a lot of CPU cycles and whatnot.

**JohnDoe** · 06-05-2009, 10:03 AM

It doesn't look that nasty to me I'm just not familiar with the syntax. The only thing that looks especially scare is the memory page stuff, and thats just because every chip is different.

**Synchronicity** · 06-05-2009, 10:15 AM

	Originally Posted by Darkness To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Ruby is okay, but just possesses a weird syntax that makes sense once you use it, but it isn't as intuitive as I would like it to be.

Matsumoto would hate to hear you say that. I did a lengthy report on Ruby for a programming class a year ago and intuitive is exactly what its designers intended it to be.

Unfortunately, I agree. Ruby was an interesting language but not something I would care to get my hands dirty in. (To be fair, I am somewhat prejudiced against high-level languages.)

**phej** · 06-05-2009, 10:23 AM

	Originally Posted by Synchronicity To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Matsumoto would hate to hear you say that. I did a lengthy report on Ruby for a programming class a year ago and intuitive is exactly what its designers intended it to be. Unfortunately, I agree. Ruby was an interesting language but not something I would care to get my hands dirty in. (To be fair, I am somewhat prejudiced against high-level languages.)

What does your prejudice say about Lisp? It's one of the oldest languages out there, yet it has been easy to graft programming language de jure on to it. Also, it seems that most modern programming language are converging to have most of its features like automatic memory management, closures, and macros.

**Ice Wolf** · 06-05-2009, 10:31 AM

It is just a test code. It is a couple of years since I've used that chip so it is a little bit blurry.

I basically it uses hardware address generator for circular buffer. Two separate memory buses are used to read data. In one cycle you can write data and generate next address for two circular buffers. I remember I've needed whole day to persuade C to actually compile it.

Memory page is merely a top 8bits of memory address. Core is 16bit but address space is 24 bit.

This DSP is a work of the devil. No real documentation, C compiler barely works. I've only done one project with it and then tossed it away. It seemed at the time that analog devices wanted to sweep it under the carpet. Bloody demo board costed 400Eur, and many kEUROs in lost time.

But I must admit it has the simplest assembly language I've ever seen.

Fortran is also a thing I've only used once. About 15 years ago, so I don't think I can be helpful here. If I remember correctly it was very good with memory management for matrix calculations. I am not 100% but I think Matlab uses lapack now. Same speed as fortran but with a bit better approach. Matlab is useless if you don't translate all the math in matrix operations. However there is still room for improvement. Lots of it.

**JohnDoe** · 06-05-2009, 10:33 AM

	Originally Posted by phej To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	What does your prejudice say about Lisp? It's one of the oldest languages out there, yet it has been easy to graft programming language de jure on to it. Also, it seems that most modern programming language are converging to have most of its features like automatic memory management, closures, and macros.

Evil... pure evil.

**phej** · 06-05-2009, 10:50 AM

	Originally Posted by JohnDoe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Evil... pure evil.

Other than the endless parens, what's wrong with these language constructs? They seem useful and make people more productive, right? I mean we're past the, "I want to micro-optimize everything" phase in software engineering.

**Synchronicity** · 06-05-2009, 11:38 AM

	Originally Posted by phej To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Other than the endless parens, what's wrong with these language constructs? They seem useful and make people more productive, right? I mean we're past the, "I want to micro-optimize everything" phase in software engineering.

That's the sort of thinking that gave us Windows Vista.

**Synapse** · 06-05-2009, 11:45 AM

	Originally Posted by Synchronicity To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	That's the sort of thinking that gave us Windows Vista.

Bingo. While I am not prejudiced against low-level languages, they just have this aura of complexity that I am honestly quite intimidated by. Furthermore, I don't have a suitable computer for most of this (FORTRAN is Windows), unless I wish to delve into UNIX for my Mac (considering I have it's Terminal right on my dock,
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).

**JohnDoe** · 06-05-2009, 12:15 PM

	Originally Posted by phej To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Other than the endless parens, what's wrong with these language constructs? They seem useful and make people more productive, right? I mean we're past the, "I want to micro-optimize everything" phase in software engineering.

Not so much that I have against the language itself as I have against the current tools. The interpreters and compilers for lisp are crap compared to any other language.

**Latro** · 06-05-2009, 12:20 PM

	Originally Posted by phej To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	du jour

Fixed. Sorry, de jure means something completely different in another language, which confused the hell out of me.

On-topic: the only language I know (and I don't even know it well) is Python, which isn't all that esoteric really.

**dogwoodlover** · 06-05-2009, 01:03 PM

Perl and x86 assembly were the only languages I ever put some effort into learning besides C.

**Imposcillator** · 06-05-2009, 01:17 PM

I wouldn't call Python or Ruby "oddball" languages. Dynamic, yes.

Java, C, C++, C# and Ruby are languages I've mostly dealt with.

I want to get into Python and other languages like it and I'm also starting to venture into studying the structure of programming languages themselves, possibly creating a DSL on top of Ruby, Python or Thorn (a new language my professor and a few others from Purdue have started working on).

**phej** · 06-05-2009, 01:57 PM

	Originally Posted by JohnDoe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Not so much that I have against the language itself as I have against the current tools. The interpreters and compilers for lisp are crap compared to any other language.

Actually, the thinking that got us Vista was, "TTM! TTM! TTM!" (TTM == Time to market). Ok, so the interpreters for Lisp are crap. What do you think about the ones for Haskell? (Which is a modern functional programming language with most of the Lisp doodads.)

	Originally Posted by Latro To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Fixed. Sorry, de jure means something completely different in another language, which confused the hell out of me. On-topic: the only language I know (and I don't even know it well) is Python, which isn't all that esoteric really.

Ok, I got it wrong. Sorry about the confusion.

Python's pretty esoteric. The fact that it makes format things nicely is a strange innovation. (Yes, I know that there's a free-form mode...)

**cindybear** · 06-05-2009, 04:20 PM

I've never used it, but one friend claims that APL is the best language ever created. Has anyone heard of or know anything about it?

**aku chi** · 06-05-2009, 04:25 PM

Excerpt from my resume:

Very proficient with programming in C++
Proficient in C, C#, Lisp, and Java Programming Languages
Additional Programming Experience in x86, MIPS, Python, Ruby, and OCaml

**Synchronicity** · 06-05-2009, 06:27 PM

I just thought I'd plug this in for anyone who hasn't seen it.

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Of course, I don't know how anyone can consider C to be the "normal" language, but what do I care?

**Monte314** · 06-05-2009, 06:47 PM

BASIC, FORTRAN, Assembler.

**Guildwriter** · 06-05-2009, 07:13 PM

Experience in C, Java, Ruby on Rails, Python, Javascript, MIPS, LISP(Scheme), and some specialized scripting languages. Minor experience in C++.

Python is my favorite language by far though. I love the syntax to death.

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**RBM** · 06-05-2009, 07:16 PM

BasicA, Basic, Assembler, Cobol, MS VB5.0 - all intro course work.

06-05-2009, 08:25 AM	#1
Synapse Core Member [116%] MBTI: ENTJ Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 4,660	I noticed that there's not a lot of "oddball" language threads, only the normal ones like Java and C++. Anyone know anything different than those two? Certainly, they have their place and are ubiquitous and relatively easy to learn, but variety is always nice. Anyways, I know Python pretty well, Java decently, some rudimentary Perl and some rudimentary Ruby. Python is pretty easy, I know that language the best and Perl is ridiculous. Ruby is okay, but just possesses a weird syntax that makes sense once you use it, but it isn't as intuitive as I would like it to be. Anyone know any of these not-so-standard programming languages? And feel free to share your source code to show your aptitude if you wish, I'm writing something that I have yet to test in Python right now, so I can't go about that yet.
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06-05-2009, 08:51 AM	#2
Chemist Member [05%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 206	I know RPG and COBOL... I have to say that among all of the programming languages I've learned those 2 are at the top of the never gonna actually use it in anything I do ever list....
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06-05-2009, 08:53 AM	#3
JohnDoe Core Member [130%] MBTI: INFJ Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 5,203	x86 machine code? :P Mips.. Edit: Yes I've written an assembler. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
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06-05-2009, 08:55 AM	#4
phej Core Member [144%] MBTI: InTj Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 5,799	List of things are nice: Lisp, Haskell, Prolog, Scheme, VAX assembly, Alpha assembly, Eiffel, Simula, D, Erlang, VHDL, Verilog, ML I speak primarily C, C++, Assembly. I have a passing familiarity with Lisp, Haskell, Scheme, and VHDL...
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06-05-2009, 10:03 AM	#7
JohnDoe Core Member [130%] MBTI: INFJ Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 5,203	It doesn't look that nasty to me I'm just not familiar with the syntax. The only thing that looks especially scare is the memory page stuff, and thats just because every chip is different.
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06-05-2009, 10:31 AM	#10
Ice Wolf Member [09%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 371	It is just a test code. It is a couple of years since I've used that chip so it is a little bit blurry. I basically it uses hardware address generator for circular buffer. Two separate memory buses are used to read data. In one cycle you can write data and generate next address for two circular buffers. I remember I've needed whole day to persuade C to actually compile it. Memory page is merely a top 8bits of memory address. Core is 16bit but address space is 24 bit. This DSP is a work of the devil. No real documentation, C compiler barely works. I've only done one project with it and then tossed it away. It seemed at the time that analog devices wanted to sweep it under the carpet. Bloody demo board costed 400Eur, and many kEUROs in lost time. But I must admit it has the simplest assembly language I've ever seen. Fortran is also a thing I've only used once. About 15 years ago, so I don't think I can be helpful here. If I remember correctly it was very good with memory management for matrix calculations. I am not 100% but I think Matlab uses lapack now. Same speed as fortran but with a bit better approach. Matlab is useless if you don't translate all the math in matrix operations. However there is still room for improvement. Lots of it.
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06-05-2009, 01:03 PM	#17
dogwoodlover Member [47%] MBTI: ISTP Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 1,913	Perl and x86 assembly were the only languages I ever put some effort into learning besides C.
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06-05-2009, 01:17 PM	#18
Imposcillator Member [16%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 659	I wouldn't call Python or Ruby "oddball" languages. Dynamic, yes. Java, C, C++, C# and Ruby are languages I've mostly dealt with. I want to get into Python and other languages like it and I'm also starting to venture into studying the structure of programming languages themselves, possibly creating a DSL on top of Ruby, Python or Thorn (a new language my professor and a few others from Purdue have started working on).
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06-05-2009, 04:20 PM	#20
cindybear Member [04%] MBTI: INFP Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 196	I've never used it, but one friend claims that APL is the best language ever created. Has anyone heard of or know anything about it?
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06-05-2009, 04:25 PM	#21
aku chi Member [12%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 487	Excerpt from my resume: Very proficient with programming in C++ Proficient in C, C#, Lisp, and Java Programming Languages Additional Programming Experience in x86, MIPS, Python, Ruby, and OCaml
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06-05-2009, 06:27 PM	#22
Synchronicity Core Member [366%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 14,657	I just thought I'd plug this in for anyone who hasn't seen it. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Of course, I don't know how anyone can consider C to be the "normal" language, but what do I care?
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06-05-2009, 06:47 PM	#23
Monte314 Core Member [407%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 16,311	BASIC, FORTRAN, Assembler.
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06-05-2009, 07:13 PM	#24
Guildwriter Member [03%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 150	Experience in C, Java, Ruby on Rails, Python, Javascript, MIPS, LISP(Scheme), and some specialized scripting languages. Minor experience in C++. Python is my favorite language by far though. I love the syntax to death. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
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06-05-2009, 07:16 PM	#25
RBM Core Member [162%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 6,500	BasicA, Basic, Assembler, Cobol, MS VB5.0 - all intro course work.
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