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ENTP/INTJ relationship? intj and entp
Old 05-14-2009, 06:30 PM   #1
Moonwalker
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It's a lot of talk about the enFp/INTJ interaction but not so much about the enTp/INTJ one. Recently I have been headhunted from two of each other independent ENTP girls. One of them are the most fascinating girl I've met so far in my life. The ENTP number two which I just have met is like a copy of ENTP number one. Energetic, intense and full of curiosity and sparkling eyes. These girls never drain me when I have a conversation with them, in fact, one of the girls are the only one I've had a nonstop 14 hours conversation with and still not tired. (Had to stop though as the time was four in the morning.)

These girls are not really seen as that girly from a personality distant look, once you get to know them though, you realize that the hard shell was probably just something they invented in younger years to prevent themselves from being hurt as the two ENTP girls I know are very fragile and soft deep inside.

So my question to all of you out there is if you ever have had a relationship with a ENTP? if yes....how did it work out? Why did it ev. end? Anyone who knows both an ENFP and an ENTP and can see the differences from a perspective? And I mean from a intimate relationship perspective. Would be interesting to hear some stories.
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Old 05-14-2009, 06:48 PM   #2
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I've dated a couple of ENFJ's... it was great except at times the emotional need was a bit overwhelming... I guess because it's difficult for me to express my feelings...
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Old 05-15-2009, 04:20 AM   #3
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I know you asked for first hand experience and I've not dated an INTJ but thought you may be interested in an ENTP (totally-frustrated-by-INTJ-men) sí perspective. Firstly I do think it would be a complimentary match, not as good as a solid INTJ-ENFP or INFJ-ENTP match, but certainly the intellectual curiosity and connection could be stronger than any other match, imo.

My issue with INTJ men is that their guard is generally harder to get through in terms of an emotional connection than mine, when someone withdraws emotionally from me Iíll attempt to draw them back in, but only so many times. You talk about a "hard shell preventing hurt and a very fragile and soft deep inside" I'm not sure I like that description but there is truth to it, we're not the type to let someone hurt us more than once and for me the hot-cold thing you guys can do means I won't allow myself to become too vulnerable, it wears me down till I put my guard up, give up and walk away, regardless of how interested you are.

Get past that and you guys have the ability to keep us interested, boredom in relationships is a big killer for ENTPs, for me that is alleviated discovering more about my partner over time, with the depths and reluctance to reveal all, you guys can keep my attention there.

As for differences between ENTP and ENFP, what do you want to know? Despite those who would claim otherwise around here, I'm not ENFP but may be able to share things from my pov and show how they're different to my ENFP sisters.
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Old 05-15-2009, 04:48 AM   #4
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I live with an ENFP male roommate and an ENTP male roommate.

I am dealing with being "pursued" if you will by two ENTP males right now.
They are both gorgeous, I mean, stunningly so, brilliant, and interesting in a disturbingly nice way. I find both of them incredibly mentally exciting.

ENFPs, I've just not found myself as attracted to.
ENFPs often don't understand why you don't care about everything they care about.
ENFPs can also imagine you as having characteristics you don't and then feeling disillusioned.
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Old 05-15-2009, 06:35 AM   #5
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ENFPs provide a very nice balance to INTJs, one that ENTPs don't provide, if both parties are mature.

That said, I have been terribly attracted to just about all of the ENTP women I've met. Everything about them is, well, admirable it seems. They often excel in many of the same areas that I do (mental labor in general), but then have this amazing ability to act as some kind of wizard in social situations. I have seen ENTPs play groups of people like a fiddle. One of my role models growing up was my ENTP cousin.
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Old 06-23-2009, 09:37 PM   #6
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  Originally Posted by Elfrun
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You talk about a "hard shell preventing hurt and a very fragile and soft deep inside" I'm not sure I like that description but there is truth to it, we're not the type to let someone hurt us more than once and for me the hot-cold thing you guys can do means I won't allow myself to become too vulnerable, it wears me down till I put my guard up, give up and walk away, regardless of how interested you are.

I really agree here, i'm also an ENTP and i can relate quite a bit. The way you worded it here sounds pretty much perfect.
I personally have a barrier that I only allow closer friends inside and if they are in and then hurt me I get alot more upset and I dont let them have the chance to hurt me a second time. But if you were to be outside of this barrier then if you try to hurt me I just brush it off and keep going with what i was doing.

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Old 06-23-2009, 10:07 PM   #7
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I know, you're going to notice my NF status (I swear, I'm gonna change it back to x)... but ENTPs are rare and my cryptonite. Generally, their mental sharpness, wit, suavitude (yes, I'm aware that's my own personal vocab) all send me into a tither.

However, be careful to protect yourself. I've said it before elsewhere, but with many of them, everything is on the bartering table, and they will outwit/strategize you before you know what's happened, MENSA or no. And yes, their somewhat attenuated attention span can be problematic at times- from constant schedule changes and a wandering eye to lack of follow through.

YMMV.
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Old 06-24-2009, 11:08 AM   #8
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My thought is that neither can be overly J or P for this match to work. In general, I think NT women often prefer NT males (I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm wrong) as mates. The trick is finding an NT male who realizes an NT female is great and what he wants for the rare NT female. They aren't often in the same place (this forum aside). I'm married to an INTJ and we gel fantastically and were best of friends prior to anything else. So yeah, I'm a fan of NT/NT pairs.
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Old 06-26-2009, 10:01 AM   #9
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INTJ/ENTP makes a good relationship be it friendship, partners or what ever. There's a lot of mental stimulation and a sense of commonality while at the same time there's originality... it's truly a promising interaction. A relationship could work should both pay more attention toward important details.
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Old 06-26-2009, 04:01 PM   #10
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I'd have to say that in a relationship, especially with an INTJ or INFJ, I effectively become an ENTP in many ways (I already test ENTP half the time anyway), so I think I can speak to the strength of this relationship with some confidence.

Probably one of the biggest issues I've had with INTJ girls is that they operate on an emotional "need to know basis". They want to open up you, they need to open up if they have any hope of carrying on a successful relationship with anyone, but its just not instinctual to them. They seem perpetually paralyzed by the fear that if they show their true self you will be utterly disgusted by their lack of worth and cast them aside. Some times no matter how non-judgemental you may be, or how genuine your reassurances are, they just can't come to grips with themselves.

As Elfrun pointed out, we will only take just so much of this before Ti takes over and we leave you to your own devices entirely (perhaps even more so for myself considering that I am borderline E/I). The relationship definitely works, but it takes a certainly level of emotional maturity on both people's part that isn't always there. Despite their outwardly cold demeanor INTJs are very intense, but it is an inwardly directed intensity. That intensity and vision is very attractive for us, but it is also one of the greatest threats to a successful relationship if it tends towards self destructive behavior. If the INTJ in question has developed a strong enough sense of confidence in their worth as a human being to trust the ENTP, and the ENTP has developed a strong enough sense of confidence to trust in the integrity of the relationship when the INTJ needs him/her to back off, it can be very successful.

INFJs are easier, because their emotional shortcomings are often of the same nature as our own. When they become emotionally unhealthy it is in all the same ways that we become emotionally unhealthy, but all that really means is that we are more inclined to stay in the relationship when it is bad for us. Either way you really need to strive towards an emotionally healthy and mutually beneficial relationship anyway, so in a sense it is kind of a wash between which type is a "better" relationship for an ENTP.
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Old 06-26-2009, 09:48 PM   #11
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Well, I just had an experience with my INTJ guy that might have resulted in a fight if I hadn't been patient and asked questions instead of assuming things.

He's coming down to visit me for the Fourth and then I'm not going to see him again for more than a year after he gets deployed overseas. I even invited some of his buddies from elsewhere in the country to fly in so they would get a chance to spend some time with him before he's gone.

Plans were going fairly well, I thought, but then it turns out some relatives in the area he wants to spend time with as well, so we start folding them into the plans. Well, things kind of evolved a bit and eventually he comes to me and says he was thinking about skipping one major event we were going to do with his buddies so that he could spend more time with his family.

I started getting a little upset on my own because I had planned the buddies' visit and he approved of it long before family got folded in. I didn't tell him I was upset though. I figured he had a logical reason for what he was doing, even if I didn't know what it was. So I chatted with him a bit and simply asked him what his thinking was and why he was doing it. He did have what he thought was a perfectly rational explanation for his idea. I, though, (being an extroverted feeler) was worried his buddies would be upset and explained this to him. So I got back in touch with the buddies and they're fine. They'll be seeing him plenty the night before and possibly the day after.

So the big thing about an ENTP-INTJ partnership is remembering that functions are completely reversed. What's extroverted about us is introverted about them and vice-versa. It works because we intellectually complement each other, but the ENTP needs to learn to be patient when it comes to resolving issues and an INTJ needs to learn to sometimes explain where he/she is coming from.
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Old 06-26-2009, 10:06 PM   #12
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good friend of mine is an entp.

we bounce off ideas from each other like crazy. really wonderful rapport.
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Old 06-27-2009, 06:00 PM   #13
Richard Mongler
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Just got out of one of these relationships a little over a month ago.

You will have a great rapport with the person and you will find yourself having similar viewpoints on many topics, but those that you disagree on will be irreconcilable to the point of having violent arguments over them; the ENTP will have certain personal habits that irritate the INTJ, and the INTJ's [even accidental] superiority complex will drive the ENTP insane. The INTJ will find many of the ENTP's thought processes to be inefficient, and if it's ever brought up to the ENTP... well. Don't bring it up to the ENTP.

Better off staying friends than attempting to start a relationship with this pairing. It works out great in the beginning, and quickly becomes a war of intellectual attrition.
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Old 06-27-2009, 07:39 PM   #14
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  Originally Posted by Richard Mongler
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Just got out of one of these relationships a little over a month ago.

You will have a great rapport with the person and you will find yourself having similar viewpoints on many topics, but those that you disagree on will be irreconcilable to the point of having violent arguments over them; the ENTP will have certain personal habits that irritate the INTJ, and the INTJ's [even accidental] superiority complex will drive the ENTP insane. The INTJ will find many of the ENTP's thought processes to be inefficient, and if it's ever brought up to the ENTP... well. Don't bring it up to the ENTP.

Better off staying friends than attempting to start a relationship with this pairing. It works out great in the beginning, and quickly becomes a war of intellectual attrition.

Do you actually think that a single relationship experience of one person of a given type is a manifestation of your destiny with all others of that type?

Ah, judgers. Sometimes an experience is not an expression of a universal law.

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Old 06-28-2009, 03:52 PM   #15
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  Originally Posted by SShack
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Ah, judgers. Sometimes an experience is not an expression of a universal law.

Yeah, we understand that. We just think it really sucks.

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Old 06-28-2009, 04:14 PM   #16
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Richard Mongler said a lot of truth tbh. It's pretty much awesome in the start, then it becomes really hard when it comes to some errors in their heads.

I've had a relationship with ENTP for 3 months, we broke up just a week ago. Well.. The relationship was quite an awesome one for like 2 months. Until she started to open up. From what I've seen - That type is so freaken fragile.. It stops me at all moments as it comes to a point where my philosophical talk makes her angry or something and it goes like this: She says some stupid abstract thingies, that I don't really understand how to understand. And know one thing - if she will ever try talking something in abstract - that's a bad sign. Then there's something that needs fixing. From intimate perspective - they are pretty creative if you can light them up.. Just like a match, that needs a thunder box to light it up
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And you can just relax and they will take an initiative after knowing that you want it and usually knowing what you want.
Well, in a way, conversations with that type go really well, another thing is if that girl has problems inside. Mine had.. That's what made the relationship to break up. I've tried to help, but I didn't find a way how to get in. There's really a big shell in that type. And I'd say they can sometimes be very unpredictable. And, one thing is awesome about that type - they show signs of liking you, and if they like you - you can start a relationship with them.
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Well hope it helped you, if you want anything specific, just ask.. I'll be glad to help.

EDIT: In a way - I was pretty much dumped.
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Old 06-28-2009, 05:54 PM   #17
Richard Mongler
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  Originally Posted by SShack
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Do you actually think that a single relationship experience of one person of a given type is a manifestation of your destiny with all others of that type?

Considering the conflicts were generally conflicts of personality, it doesn't hurt to use it as a guideline in the future.

 
Ah, judgers. Sometimes an experience is not an expression of a universal law.

Ah, perceivers. Sometimes an experience is an excellent predictor of future patterns.

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Old 06-28-2009, 06:02 PM   #18
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One of my good friends is entp. She is a lot of fun, and there are many good things in are interaction; especially insane nerdy conversations.

My main difficulties:
  • Her Ne; she's convinced she knows things about me that I know are wrong, and makes assumptions about others that she never bothers to test but still believes in.
  • If she fucks up, she won't talk about it; no forgiveness, no problem-solving; she just wants to get away with it. She's extremely conflict-avoidant and rather emotional, even though she doesn't show that side to everyone.
  • She has a tendency to assume I'm being closed-minded whenever I have an opinion or make a decision - I think that's P vs J. (She'll then get angry at me and won't explain why.)
  • She's constantly showing off and doesn't realise it or like to have it pointed out.
  • She treats everything I say as an assertion to be defended (How are you - I'm fine -Prove it!) and interprets what I say as absolutes, I think as a debate strategy. I'm pretty sure she's wilfully misunderstanding me most of the time because she thinks it's funny.
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Old 06-28-2009, 07:51 PM   #19
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wow.

my highschool sweetie is an entp. we never dated in highschool, he found me on the internet in 2003 and we've dated on and off since then.

his ability to see vast opportunities and intellectual curiosity keeps me in contact with him on a regular basis.

his ability to talk me into sheer hysteria makes me want to smash his face in. the man can't go a moment without making some form of noise. humming, singing... talking... funny voices. oh god! save me from the constancy of his boisterousness!!! this is what keeps me running the hell away from him.

plus he needs to feel comfortable about everything. how can you improve yourself if you stay in the comfy zone forever?
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Old 06-29-2009, 04:07 AM   #20
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  Originally Posted by eidetic motion
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plus he needs to feel comfortable about everything. how can you improve yourself if you stay in the comfy zone forever?

Yea, that is really a bad sign of ENTP. They like to be everything perfect. That is, even if not everything is perfect, they think it's perfect. But with time they change their opinion about their perfectness and it comes to a point where they go wild (not like animals, but still quite wild).

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Old 06-29-2009, 05:03 AM   #21
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  Originally Posted by Prunesquallor
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One of my good friends is entp. She is a lot of fun, and there are many good things in are interaction; especially insane nerdy conversations.

My main difficulties:
  • Her Ne; she's convinced she knows things about me that I know are wrong, and makes assumptions about others that she never bothers to test but still believes in.
  • If she fucks up, she won't talk about it; no forgiveness, no problem-solving; she just wants to get away with it. She's extremely conflict-avoidant and rather emotional, even though she doesn't show that side to everyone.
  • She has a tendency to assume I'm being closed-minded whenever I have an opinion or make a decision - I think that's P vs J. (She'll then get angry at me and won't explain why.)
  • She's constantly showing off and doesn't realise it or like to have it pointed out.
  • She treats everything I say as an assertion to be defended (How are you - I'm fine -Prove it!) and interprets what I say as absolutes, I think as a debate strategy. I'm pretty sure she's wilfully misunderstanding me most of the time because she thinks it's funny.

Sounds annoying but less like ENTP problems and more like problems with this specific ENTP, nothing there sounds familiar to me.

  Originally Posted by StN
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Yea, that is really a bad sign of ENTP. They like to be everything perfect. That is, even if not everything is perfect, they think it's perfect. But with time they change their opinion about their perfectness and it comes to a point where they go wild (not like animals, but still quite wild).

Huh?

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Old 06-29-2009, 08:50 AM   #22
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  Originally Posted by Elfrun
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Sounds annoying but less like ENTP problems and more like problems with this specific ENTP, nothing there sounds familiar to me.

Some definately fit the entp patterns, as I've seen them described - the constant arguing, for one - the conflict-avoidant may be more personal, but I've heard an enfp claim it typical (ish) of her type, so I don't know if its related. I'd have to do more research, but I'm sensing a link with E&P together - not an absolute of course, etc. I'm sure the same patterns can be directed in more healthy directions, and none of this will be true of all entps, obviously, but I think her basic character traits do form an important part of these difficulties.


--She's definately T, though closer to the middle of the spectrum than I. I didn't list all the awesomeness of her, but it comes out more in that.
Honestly, when I say conflict avoidant, this is what it seems to me. To her, it's probably something more like - 'why are you going on about what happened yesterday; it's today already.' And she'll see me as 'unforgiving' or 'holding a grudge' since I won't let it go until it's dealt with - time is meaningless, problem-solving isn't. I think some of it to her may be seeing it as 'ok, mistake, let's move on now - what matters is that we're still friends, and the way I know that is if you act friendly.' And also, she argues when I point this out, which can go downhill - her way of avoiding it is not to discuss it at all, where I just want her not to argue so much.

Probably also she goes more F when she is stressed. But our shadow selves are related to the main types, too.

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Old 06-29-2009, 09:17 AM   #23
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  Originally Posted by Elfrun
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Huh?

It's like this: I've known 2 ENTP's. They're both good with the friends, though their values are so messed up, that I can't tell you... If they think it's perfect at that time, they would most likely stay at that stage while I see what will happen after some time and I try to say it, though then he negates it and I say: Ok.. Whatever.. Time comes and guess what, then it happens and WHOA!!! SHIT HAPPENED. I'm telling it in an abstract way, but I don't wanna go into details. I'm telling that they will always try to be in the comfort zone and even when it's easy to see the problem coming - they will usually wait for the last second to do it, and sometimes it's just too late...

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Old 06-29-2009, 09:35 AM   #24
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Do you mean in regards to delaying responsibilities and things like waiting till the last minute in deadlines? If so, yeah, I'm totally with you. Many ENTPs will wait till the last minute there but it will get done if it has to. Nothing motivates better than an impossible deadline. 99.9% of all my school projects were started and completed in the period before they were due, I perform better under pressure and got good marks as a result.

It is one area that causes conflict between P vs J for me and an area of potential friction between ENxP and INxJ.
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Old 06-29-2009, 10:53 AM   #25
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  Originally Posted by Elfrun
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Do you mean in regards to delaying responsibilities and things like waiting till the last minute in deadlines? If so, yeah, I'm totally with you. Many ENTPs will wait till the last minute there but it will get done if it has to. Nothing motivates better than an impossible deadline. 99.9% of all my school projects were started and completed in the period before they were due, I perform better under pressure and got good marks as a result.

It is one area that causes conflict between P vs J for me and an area of potential friction between ENxP and INxJ.

Well, you see.. I agree that at most of the cases they get out with those deadline delays. But in relationship.. I don't think it should be so. Wait for the hottest point to blow it all up. Well that might just been a failure in my partners thinking. I don't know.. Yet it seemed that another ENTP that I know does like to do that too.

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