Clever with no focus... typical INTJ?

**Tough Love** · 02-26-2009, 07:03 AM

I have a theory i cant put into words because its not making sense - what are you thoughts?

**More Tea** · 02-26-2009, 07:23 AM

That your avatar may provide some guidance on the question raised.
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No, but I sort of know what you mean. There is being clever for the sake of being clever, without a real destination in mind. Yes, my mind works that way, pretty much constantly. I swear that I even have dreams that are trying to be pointlessly clever, sometimes.

**Synamon** · 02-26-2009, 07:23 AM

If you can't articulate your theory then how are we supposed to comment on it?

If the title itself is a question then for myself I'll have to say no I don't have much trouble focusing when I need to. There is certainly nothing in the profile description of INTJ that describes focus problems for the personality type. We do think abstractly, is that your question? There are learning disabilities unrelated to type that affect focus, perhaps that is really your question? Check out the threads on ADD and ADHD in this sub forum for more information.

**acyckowski** · 02-26-2009, 07:26 AM

Assuming you're theory revolves around the thread title, I both agree and disagree.

In the sense of "focusing" on repetitive tasks, then I'd surmise that we as a group are unfocused.

In the sense of "focusing" on acting towards a long-term goal or vision, then a bunch of us are very focused. Those who aren't just haven't settled on which goal is worth pursuing.

I can shift goals in mid-stream without losing any sleep over it, so that might appear unfocused to somebody else. In reality, it's typically a conscious decision influence by external conditions, so it's not so much a lack of focus as a natural tendency to reassess priorities.

I imagine that age/experience comes into play, as well. When I was a teenager and college age, I switched from goal to goal without pause. Now that I have a few more years under my belt, I'm slower to commit to a course of action because I have a better appreciation of how my personal motivation interacts with the multitude of commitments involved in executing any plan. On the other hand, I'm more likely to follow through when the going gets tough, because I knew what I was getting myself into when I started.

**Tough Love** · 02-26-2009, 07:41 AM

	Originally Posted by More Tea To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	That you avatar may provide some guidance on the question raised. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

good answer :D

abstractly, exactly - although im clever im just all over the place with it, for example i cant verbalise my thoughts on this topic because i dont feel i could put it in a way that anyone would really understand.

**Nikita** · 02-26-2009, 07:57 AM

This sounds so much more like INTP territory than INTJ....

**Trenchant1** · 02-26-2009, 08:16 AM

	Originally Posted by Tough Love To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	good answer :D i cant verbalise my thoughts on this topic because i dont feel i could put it in a way that anyone would really understand.

Give it a try. The only way to do anything is to do it. If you say 'I can't do it', you're right. If you have a go, you may be partially successful and others may be able to help you to clarify your thoughts. So, try. You obviously want to, or you wouldn't have started the thread.

**Sisu** · 02-26-2009, 08:17 AM

Sometimes I have thoughts about things that I can't fully express in language. It's more of a "feeling" deep down in my subconscious that I have trouble bringing up to the frontal lobe. So when I discuss the issue with others, I have to spend an enormous amount of time explaining my thoughts, and when someone restates my thoughts in one or two sentences I wonder, "Why couldn't I say that?"

**Jonathan Brewer** · 02-26-2009, 02:21 PM

I sometimes have trouble expressing abstract ideas in terms that can be understood by "others". I just give it time. Eventually, it will come.
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**sagewolf** · 02-26-2009, 04:09 PM

I have trouble expressing my ideas to people sometimes, when I talk. When I write the words flow from my pen/keyboard as quickly as I can write them down/type them. All I can say is try. If you don't, then you'll never get any better at expressing your ideas, and you won't have expressed any part of your idea whatsoever. So try.

**mel** · 02-26-2009, 09:23 PM

i agree with you...so a certain degree. i tried learning how to program for the first time 2 days ago in a condensed course and i swear i understood it all. Just couldn't make myself focus to actually touch more keys than necessary.

I spent 0.5 h programming and then zoned out in the next 1.5 h.
money well spent i say!

**wise** · 02-26-2009, 10:04 PM

	Originally Posted by Nikita To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	This sounds so much more like INTP territory than INTJ....

I'm thinking INTP also.

**hallucinogen** · 02-27-2009, 12:00 AM

If I didn't have mary jane, I couldn't focus my intellectual and artistic side
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but not smoking between 9-6 helps a lot lol

**NovemberRain** · 02-27-2009, 02:25 AM

I think I am brilliant, but I find it hard to focus on my academics.

With little or no revision I still perform better than the rest.
Of course constant revision is still the best way to excel in academics...
That's what you need in University...
So I will do my best to FOCUS in my academics when I enter University in a few months!

Everything else that I set my mind to do, I am a perfectionist.

**Tough Love** · 02-27-2009, 02:57 AM

Im quite new to all this - but the overall impression i get from intj's is that they are ''selfish learners'' as i myself am - i learn for the sake of learning without any real purpose or point - unless it is for selfish reasons - i find this with other intj's as well. On being forced or manipulated into furthering my education i couldnt learn ide get blocks... but thats just me, although I was wondering whether this was a phenomena amongst a higher percentage of intj's.

the type of intellect i find amongst intj's i would class as wisdom - the capacity to see beyond the obvious and create idea's on what they learn between the lines rather than from the fact - could it be the fact is not of interest to the intj unless it fits in to their idea of what the world is and 'should be'?
thats what i find. hope that was understandable. :P

**The Fury** · 02-27-2009, 03:39 AM

Originally Posted by Tough Love
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Im quite new to all this - but the overall impression i get from intj's is that they are ''selfish learners'' as i myself am - i learn for the sake of learning without any real purpose or point - unless it is for selfish reasons - i find this with other intj's as well. On being forced or manipulated into furthering my education i couldnt learn ide get blocks... but thats just me, although I was wondering whether this was a phenomena amongst a higher percentage of intj's.

I find that to be very true regarding myself also. I've been thinking of going back to college to do something in genetics but only because I find the subject interesting. Fortunately I can't justify spending up to six years in college, acquiring a huge loan and putting my entire life on hold just for something i find vaguely interesting.

**Synamon** · 02-27-2009, 07:02 AM

Originally Posted by Tough Love
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Im quite new to all this - but the overall impression i get from intj's is that they are ''selfish learners'' as i myself am - i learn for the sake of learning without any real purpose or point - unless it is for selfish reasons - i find this with other intj's as well. On being forced or manipulated into furthering my education i couldnt learn ide get blocks... but thats just me, although I was wondering whether this was a phenomena amongst a higher percentage of intj's.

What you described applies more to INTPs actually, INTJs would resist learning something if there is no point to it. INTJs are more goal oriented than INTPs. All types find it easier to learn something if it's interesting to them, so that's not an INTJ specific trait.

**thiagofralves** · 02-27-2009, 08:37 AM

	Originally Posted by Tough Love To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I have a theory i cant put into words because its not making sense - what are you thoughts?

I completely understand you. I have a very well defined theory in my head about this one thing, but I was never able to explain it in words, which is very frustrating.

**Prunesquallor** · 02-27-2009, 08:53 AM

Originally Posted by Tough Love
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Im quite new to all this - but the overall impression i get from intj's is that they are ''selfish learners'' as i myself am - i learn for the sake of learning without any real purpose or point - unless it is for selfish reasons - i find this with other intj's as well. On being forced or manipulated into furthering my education i couldnt learn ide get blocks... but thats just me, although I was wondering whether this was a phenomena amongst a higher percentage of intj's.

I agree with the previous posters that this is often more characteristic of intp.
However, I do this a lot - basically, because to me learning IS a purpose and a point. Even so, I often feel a need to justify it to myself - at present my rationalisation is that I'm a librarian - I might potentially need to know any of this. And this makes it nicer. So if you love learning - but still need to rationalise the time spent doing so if it's not your field - that could be more intj.

I do think having a hard time learning really boring things is intj though. At least, that's the impression I get.

**Kisai** · 02-27-2009, 08:53 AM

A 'well-defined' theory that you are 'never able to explain [...] in words' is an oxymoron[1].

[1] Much like the word 'ambidominant', which I'm never going to let Nikita live down.

**Homini Lupus** · 02-27-2009, 09:01 AM

I have sometimes problems like that, but generally using a good example or mental experiment may help to explain to others (but also to ourselves) what intuition is suggesting. Besides, putting things in a mora formal way may help to notice when intuition is on a false track.

02-26-2009, 07:03 AM	#1
Tough Love Veteran Member [95%] MBTI: eNTj Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 3,828	I have a theory i cant put into words because its not making sense - what are you thoughts?
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02-26-2009, 07:23 AM	#2
More Tea Member [05%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 204	That your avatar may provide some guidance on the question raised. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. No, but I sort of know what you mean. There is being clever for the sake of being clever, without a real destination in mind. Yes, my mind works that way, pretty much constantly. I swear that I even have dreams that are trying to be pointlessly clever, sometimes. Last edited by More Tea; 02-26-2009 at 07:40 AM.
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02-26-2009, 07:23 AM	#3
Synamon Core Member [465%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 18,616	If you can't articulate your theory then how are we supposed to comment on it? If the title itself is a question then for myself I'll have to say no I don't have much trouble focusing when I need to. There is certainly nothing in the profile description of INTJ that describes focus problems for the personality type. We do think abstractly, is that your question? There are learning disabilities unrelated to type that affect focus, perhaps that is really your question? Check out the threads on ADD and ADHD in this sub forum for more information.
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02-26-2009, 07:26 AM	#4
acyckowski Member [37%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 1,485	Assuming you're theory revolves around the thread title, I both agree and disagree. In the sense of "focusing" on repetitive tasks, then I'd surmise that we as a group are unfocused. In the sense of "focusing" on acting towards a long-term goal or vision, then a bunch of us are very focused. Those who aren't just haven't settled on which goal is worth pursuing. I can shift goals in mid-stream without losing any sleep over it, so that might appear unfocused to somebody else. In reality, it's typically a conscious decision influence by external conditions, so it's not so much a lack of focus as a natural tendency to reassess priorities. I imagine that age/experience comes into play, as well. When I was a teenager and college age, I switched from goal to goal without pause. Now that I have a few more years under my belt, I'm slower to commit to a course of action because I have a better appreciation of how my personal motivation interacts with the multitude of commitments involved in executing any plan. On the other hand, I'm more likely to follow through when the going gets tough, because I knew what I was getting myself into when I started.
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02-26-2009, 07:57 AM	#6
Nikita Core Member [555%] MBTI: INTP Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 22,213	This sounds so much more like INTP territory than INTJ....
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02-26-2009, 08:17 AM	#8
Sisu New Member [01%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 59	Sometimes I have thoughts about things that I can't fully express in language. It's more of a "feeling" deep down in my subconscious that I have trouble bringing up to the frontal lobe. So when I discuss the issue with others, I have to spend an enormous amount of time explaining my thoughts, and when someone restates my thoughts in one or two sentences I wonder, "Why couldn't I say that?"
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02-26-2009, 02:21 PM	#9
Jonathan Brewer Core Member [135%] MBTI: xxxx Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 5,411	I sometimes have trouble expressing abstract ideas in terms that can be understood by "others". I just give it time. Eventually, it will come. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
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02-26-2009, 04:09 PM	#10
sagewolf Member [02%] MBTI: INTP Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 115	I have trouble expressing my ideas to people sometimes, when I talk. When I write the words flow from my pen/keyboard as quickly as I can write them down/type them. All I can say is try. If you don't, then you'll never get any better at expressing your ideas, and you won't have expressed any part of your idea whatsoever. So try.
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02-26-2009, 09:23 PM	#11
mel New Member [01%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 73	i agree with you...so a certain degree. i tried learning how to program for the first time 2 days ago in a condensed course and i swear i understood it all. Just couldn't make myself focus to actually touch more keys than necessary. I spent 0.5 h programming and then zoned out in the next 1.5 h. money well spent i say!
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02-27-2009, 12:00 AM	#13
hallucinogen New Member [01%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 25	If I didn't have mary jane, I couldn't focus my intellectual and artistic side To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. but not smoking between 9-6 helps a lot lol
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02-27-2009, 02:25 AM	#14
NovemberRain Member [03%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 135	I think I am brilliant, but I find it hard to focus on my academics. With little or no revision I still perform better than the rest. Of course constant revision is still the best way to excel in academics... That's what you need in University... So I will do my best to FOCUS in my academics when I enter University in a few months! Everything else that I set my mind to do, I am a perfectionist.
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02-27-2009, 02:57 AM	#15
Tough Love Veteran Member [95%] MBTI: eNTj Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 3,828	Im quite new to all this - but the overall impression i get from intj's is that they are ''selfish learners'' as i myself am - i learn for the sake of learning without any real purpose or point - unless it is for selfish reasons - i find this with other intj's as well. On being forced or manipulated into furthering my education i couldnt learn ide get blocks... but thats just me, although I was wondering whether this was a phenomena amongst a higher percentage of intj's. the type of intellect i find amongst intj's i would class as wisdom - the capacity to see beyond the obvious and create idea's on what they learn between the lines rather than from the fact - could it be the fact is not of interest to the intj unless it fits in to their idea of what the world is and 'should be'? thats what i find. hope that was understandable. :P
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02-27-2009, 08:53 AM	#20
Kisai Core Member [354%] MBTI: XXXX Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 14,169	A 'well-defined' theory that you are 'never able to explain [...] in words' is an oxymoron[1]. [1] Much like the word 'ambidominant', which I'm never going to let Nikita live down.
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02-27-2009, 09:01 AM	#21
Homini Lupus Member [30%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,228	I have sometimes problems like that, but generally using a good example or mental experiment may help to explain to others (but also to ourselves) what intuition is suggesting. Besides, putting things in a mora formal way may help to notice when intuition is on a false track.
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