[rara avis]

Well, we had a thread about the ideal for INTPs to settle down with, which was interesting, but I haven't seen one that just addresses simply what INTJs think they need and want, overall. I know I have ideas of my own, some more distinct than others.

Would anyone care to chip in their two cents and make our own list?

Beyond MBTI categories, what individual traits do you think are ideal to you, Mentally, Temperamentally, Physically, Emotionally, Sexually?

What kind of goals do they have? Lifestyle?

What kind of family or household do they want, if any?

How should they interact with you?


Feel free to identify your gender, if you think it's pertinent.




I'd like someone who can be very supportive of me, encouraging in an intelligent and respectful way, without too much fluff or filler, and without even hinting at being controlling.

[BlackOp]

She has to have good shoes...I'm easy.

Maybe I should start a members photo thread for this......

[rara avis]

Can I assume that in "good" you're talking about "pretty little straps around her ankles", not Dansko clogs?


Oh, and also kindness and Paris-resistance?

[ManthaJay]

1. Intelligent and thoughtful. Will actually think about the world around them and come up with good arguments during a debate with me.
2. Supportive without being controlling or possessive.
3. You will pick up after yourself and do your half of the housework. I will not do your laundry. I am your equal, not your servant.
4. No drama. I won't deal with temper tantrums or wild mood swings.
5. I'm easygoing about most things, but if it matters to me suck it up and let me have my way.
6. Understand I need me-time and I won't entertain you 24 hours a day.
7. Have some ambition or goals. I will not support you while you 'find' yourself.

Some of the things that has made a 9+ year relationship work with an ISTP.

[OrrDavey]

Alright here goes nothing. This will be really blunt and to the point, just like you asked!

1. Mentally she is intelligent, but not smarter than me. She has her own opinions and questions the way things are or should be. But isn't completely nuts about it. Then some of the normal things: Loyal, Honest, Trusting - I am probably forgetting a few really obvious ones here.

2. Temperamentally she is very calm, quiet and relaxed.

3. Physically she is in shape and looks like a woman. I am not completely neurotic over physical size, but I wouldn't consider being with someone who was significantly overweight. She likes to wear feminine clothes. She doesn't have a guy's haircut and doesn't have excessive tattoos or piercings.

4. She is not very emotional at all, but is a little bit more emotional than I am (not hard).

5. She has a high sex drive, but is most happy being with one partner. I am.

6. Goals. She is educated and wants to work, but also wants to start a family some day.

7. Lifestyle. She likes to stay in more often than not. Is fairly conservative and traditional. But then again, she'd like to travel to some new place once a year, and go out and do something amazing once or twice a month.

8. Household - She wants to have a more traditional family. She would want one partner to be a stay at home parent and home maker - probably her. By the time we decided to start a family we would already have our own business. This would allow both her and me to be active in it managing it, even if one of us was a stay at home parent.

9. Interaction. We should just mesh well, which is way too hard to describe in a box like this.

Ok there you go. The bold, blunt truth on what my current expectations of a partner are.

Edit: Ok this would be a big plus, too. hahahahaha.

	As much as I like to get dressed up, clothes can also be irritating to me- if I'm going to be really concentrating on some kind of very still work, particularly if I'm drawing or painting - I don't like to sit properly in a chair for long, and clothes can be binding- so I sometimes will start out stripping down to my underwear or just putting on a bathing suit.

[dissident]

hmmm... this is a toughie.. someone who doesn't take the world too seriously, someone who's not a control freak and who knows how to live and let live.. someone who has a strong intuitive side, and likes to speculate about existence, and doesn't mind talking about things that normal people would think you are strange talking about, somebody who notices the little things, and appreciates them rather then taking them for granted. Ideally she would probably have to be extroverted, to lift the burden of trying to start conversation off of me, but not to extroverted she needs every minute of her day filled with activity. Someone who likes to live simple and isn't really ambitious and career driven.. doesn't mind living in an older home, or perhaps a shack in the mountains... someone gentle, and honest. No games, just openness. Someone who knows how to think outside the societal box and is capable of having an open mind.

I'd say an eNFP would probably fit my bill... the stronger the N, the better.

[dalidaisy]

Here's my list...

He:
*doesn't mind that I'm 6ft tall
*likes kids
*doesn't mind that I don't eat animals
*is intelligent
*loves to laugh
*is honest & open
*is not emotionally needy
*has similar morals as me
*is adventurous
*can keep up with me
*can provide suggestions if I am indecisive or unsure
*will give me my space when I need it
*can tolerate my views, yet challenge me for intelligent discussion
*laughs at my sometimes lame, but always silly jokes
*understands that I am not like most girls
*appreciates my beauty with or without embellishment
*can let me be right when I actually am
*shows me new things
*helps me be a better me

I'm sure this list could get exhaustingly long if I continued. It's really irrelevant what the person does for a living (unless they kill animals for a living, that would be a deal breaker). Physically I prefer tall, dark & handsome, someone strong who can carry me to the bed. Sexually, I need someone who with a healthy libido & no hang ups. Someone who can be soft & gentle at times, but also sick & demented at others. Oh, and he has to like music...

Did I leave anything important out?

[rara avis]

Ooh, these are good!

and @ orrdavey: HEY!
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Smartass!
(geez, did that quote sound that bad in context??)

[Kisai]

The two criteria I used when judging whether or not to marry my wife was that she was:

1)A good person.
2)Sane.

I figured I could do worse.

[Lucid]

Not to completely derail this or anything, but OrrDavey mentioned that he wouldn't want a female who is smarter than he is. Why? Why do most men seem to feel this way?

[Anona Miss]

	Originally Posted by Lucid To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Not to completely derail this or anything, but OrrDavey mentioned that he wouldn't want a female who is smarter than he is. Why? Why do most men seem to feel this way?

I was wondering if I was the only who picked up on that. I am hoping his is the minority view. Surely (hopefully!) most men don't feel that way.

[FLINTJm]

	Originally Posted by Lucid To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Not to completely derail this or anything, but OrrDavey mentioned that he wouldn't want a female who is smarter than he is. Why? Why do most men seem to feel this way?

I don't feel that way, but here's the thing about that. I can give a good guess on the magnitude of how much less intelligent someone is than me. I can't do the same with smarter types. Given that, I might even prefer smarter than me.

I might add to my list later.

[OrrDavey]

I couldn't explain to you why. It is probably not a deal breaker, it is just something I prefer.

Would you prefer a guy who is taller than you, all else being equal?

[Lucid]

	Originally Posted by OrrDavey To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I couldn't explain to you why. It is probably not a deal breaker, it is just something I prefer. Would you prefer a guy who is taller than you, all else being equal?

Most women do. I think it's because socially they think it looks funny otherwise. I prefer men who are about the same size I am (I'm short) because it makes many activities (such as kissing and also arguing) easier.

But requiring that a guy be taller than a female seems kind of silly, and requiring that a female be less intelligent than you are seems strange, especially since intelligence is hard to see and often hard to gauge. The only people likely to know are the two involved in the relationship and probably their close friends.

I require that someone I date is smart, but if he's a little less intelligent than I, or a little more intelligent, it's ok. There plenty of room for variation.

I just picked up on it because you didn't just say intelligent, but qualified it by adding that she should not be more intelligent than you. And it seems that many men share this preference, while most women only require that a male is intelligent and don't add the "but not more intelligent than me" qualifier. So I wondered. I'm not trying to tell you should prefer women to be smarter than you, or equally smart or whatever. I'm just wondering why you prefer them to be less intelligent and why most men do.

For women of above-average intelligence it's kind of difficult and disheartening.

[dalidaisy]

	Originally Posted by OrrDavey To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I couldn't explain to you why. It is probably not a deal breaker, it is just something I prefer. Would you prefer a guy who is taller than you, all else being equal?

I hear you. I prefer someone not smarter than me. I don't know why. Maybe it's a control issue or maybe I don't like feeling inferior. I've never known a man smarter than me, though, so I wouldn't rule it out until I try it, I guess.

It is hard for me to find men taller than me. At 6ft tall, most men look me in the eye. Most men who are taller than me, strangely enough, like tiny girls. I would LOVE to date a man taller than me for a change. I'd just like to look up at him and have him look down at me.

[noueux]

I think I kind of get where OrrDavey's coming from. If I went for a mathematician, I'd want him or her to be in a completely different research area then wherever I wind up. It's part of me keeping some intellectual space for myself. It's too easy to fall into competition with your peers, and I can't see that I'd be good at leaving that at the office when we went home.

That said, I think whoever I'd wind up with would have his or her area of expertise as well, because I'm selfish and would want to learn from my partner at least as much as I'm willing to offer, knowledge-wise. I don't think I could be with someone I thought was, all around, less intelligent than I was, because while I try very hard to give a certain measure of respect to everyone, I have to have a LOT of respect for someone in order to open to him or her emotionally, and for that I'd have to respect someone's intellect.

And Lucid- Definitely hear you on that general attitude being rather disheartening, but I have met some men who like strong, smart women, no qualifications. And while I love them to death, and think they're awesome, I can't pass any kind of judgment on other people's preferences. Lord knows I have enough of my own.

My prospective future partner would have to be pretty evenly tempered, and would have to learn how to calm me down quickly when I get angry. My best friend Kevin can stop me from yelling and have me discussing my anger rationally in two minutes flat. Oh, yeah. He or she would also have to be cool with Kevin. He's kind of part of the package.

They'd have to be able to get me down off of my high horse. But we'd probably wind up establishing boundaries and rules about appropriate and relevant criticism, because I can get pretty biting sometimes, and it's not always constructive.

Physical appearance is almost completely irrelevant. I don't know why, but somehow my opinion of a particular person's attractiveness is subjective, at the whim of how attractive I find their personality. I've thought people were pretty hideous before, and completely changed my mind when I got to know them, and, similarly, I've been attracted to people, found out they're assholes, and wondered what it is I liked about their appearance at all.

As for sex, I wouldn't want someone with an extremely high sex drive, been there, done that, had too much other stuff to do to have sex all the time. Would have to be willing to try new things, and to leave all their rote notions of This Is How People Have Sex at the door.

Ideally, I'd like someone more emotionally in touch than I am. But not too emotional, that would just aggravate me. I have very little patience for emotional displays, I'd need someone who could explain well what they were feeling and why. Maybe this will change with age (I don't really think so).

In addition, I have some pretty strong moral positions when it comes to equality, diversity, and respect, and I couldn't see myself having too good a relationship with someone who wasn't on the same page with me.

Sometimes I think my standards are too high and I'll end up alone. Then I shrug it off, because I'd rather be alone and happy than with someone who I didn't actually like very much.

[rara avis]

I think I may have a different version of gender double standard than OrrDavey- I'm not sure I'd want a man to be more emotional than I am, largely because it just doesn't seem masculine to me.
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Maybe not a deal breaker- I can imagine slight exceptions- I just want a man who's a tough nut to crack, that way. (Though of course I do want him to crack for me...)

As for intelligence, I certainly wouldn't want him to be any dumber than I. I need to be wowed that way. A different brand of intelligence than mine might appeal to me, though- more math/science oriented.

[dalidaisy]

Originally Posted by rara avis To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I think I may have a different version of gender double standard than OrrDavey- I'm not sure I'd want a man to be more emotional than I am, largely because it just doesn't seem masculine to me. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Maybe not a deal breaker- I can imagine slight exceptions- I just want a man who's a tough nut to crack, that way. (Though of course I do want him to crack for me...) As for intelligence, I certainly wouldn't want him to be any dumber than I. I need to be wowed that way. A different brand of intelligence than mine might appeal to me, though- more math/science oriented.

I agree with you on both points. I don't like emotional, needy men. I want a man to be a MAN!

As for intelligence, I think you say it best. Not dumber, but maybe smart where I'm not. I definitely want someone who I can have conversations with. I would like someone who I can learn things from & who wants to learn things from me...

[Lucid]

	Originally Posted by rara avis To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I think I may have a different version of gender double standard than OrrDavey- I'm not sure I'd want a man to be more emotional than I am, largely because it just doesn't seem masculine to me. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

I hesitantly agree... but I'm not sure why being smart would be considered unfeminine? I didn't realize that it was.
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[noueux]

From my totally subjective perspective, being smart is as unfeminine as being emotional is unmasculine. Women are supposed to be weak of mind and body, so they can be protected by men, just as men are supposed to be too strong and powerful to care that much about the children.

Which brings me to something I forgot on my list- Complete and utter disdain for predetermined gender roles.

[OrrDavey]

Another thing to think about is that when you say, "I'd want my man to be at least as smart as me." you are basically fulfilling what I said about intelligence, just from the other side of the fence.

[rara avis]

Well... I am not exactly in the habit of defending OrrDavey's views on the laydees...
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...but I'm not sure I'd be comfortable dating someone who's much better looking than I am. It'd make me feel a little insecure, I think, and it's an area I would really love to be appreciated for. I want to be someone's hot wife, not have anyone (especially him) ever wonder what he's doing with me in that respect, and I really don't want to have to struggle to hold my own, there. (The grooming BS is hard enough work as it is- yet important to me.)

Could be the same for him, with the smarts.

[Undead Bonzi]

	Originally Posted by Lucid To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Not to completely derail this or anything, but OrrDavey mentioned that he wouldn't want a female who is smarter than he is. Why? Why do most men seem to feel this way?

I'm an INTP so my opinion really doesn't count on an INTJ Perfect mate thread but my goal is to find a girl smarter than me. Why? Because every relationship I see ends up with the girl having a lot of 'pussy whipping' control over decisions. If this is the case why would I want some airhead bimbo making the calls? If the girl is going to have some form of shared command decision control then she better be more qualified than me to make them.

Also on a practical note if I eliminated the girls who were smarter than me from contention my only viable population groups left to chose from would be the mentally retarded and sorority ho's...and since I don't want any VD's that just leaves the mentally retarded.

[Anona Miss]

	Originally Posted by dalidaisy To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	It is hard for me to find men taller than me. At 6ft tall, most men look me in the eye. Most men who are taller than me, strangely enough, like tiny girls. I would LOVE to date a man taller than me for a change. I'd just like to look up at him and have him look down at me.

I've noticed this too. I'm 5'2" and with one exception, I have never dated anyone less than 6 feet tall. It's not like I prefer tall men. I realy have no preference in that department. It just seems to be taller men that ask me out.

As for the intelligence thing, I never thought of intelligence as a masculine nor a feminine trait, simply a desirable one. As long as a man meets a certain threshold, that works for me. He and I may be of a similar level of intelligence, or he may somewhat higher or lower...as long as he is not significantly lower. What that level is, however, I can't quantify. It's like Justice Stewart said about pornography, "I know it when I see it."

Now as for the overly emotional man....I was in a relationship with one once. I ended up feeling like I was the man a lot of the time. That's not a good feeling.

[BlackOp]

	Originally Posted by rara avis To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Can I assume that in "good" you're talking about "pretty little straps around her ankles", not Dansko clogs? Oh, and also kindness and Paris-resistance?

I like a cool set of sneakers....clogs..not so much. I have a thing for red toenails.....beat up levis and smart kicks. I'd love to date a woman smarter than me...but being thrifty with the numbers, the odds are against it. They hide under the couch and dont come out when you call them.. My intuition comes from dark alleys...so a bookworm would be interesting. The scumbag, corrupted artist/drunkard and the uptight, repressed intellectual....sounds like a sitcom.

Am I the only intj that doesnt particually like to read...I've had "The Spirit in Man, Art, and Literature"-Jung on my night stand for a month. Its only 148 pages.
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I have enough things to think about already...the answers I'm looking for have never been written.