[Minerva]

	Originally Posted by Iota Null To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	You really underestimate how many people hold potential partners to rigid standards that they themselves don't meet. And sex is for most people an audition or performance for the guy, so the girl's experience is irrelevant. Agreed with your third option point.

All I see you doing is trying to use your iN and Te to make grand, sweeping blanket statements about things.

While it is great to see what the "norm" is, that doesn't mean that you have to actually fit into what the majority of society thinks is normal when it comes to sex.

Iota, are you trying to date a woman with these rigid standards? If you don't meet them then you simply move on without breaking a sweat. Are you after one of these people who use sex as an audition or to rate a man's performance? Just accept that people do that, accept that you can't change the world or all the people in it, accept that the world is much less than ideal, accept that there are some really stupid people out there and accept that this is the world you live in. Also stop being so disgruntled about these facts.

We are all very aware of what goes on. What some people in this thread are saying is that there are other points of view (even if it is a small minority) and these other perspectives should also be entertained.
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I am not saying that you are criticizing these points of view, but you seem to be ignoring them because you are hell bent on but your "I am not good enough" crusade. You really should remember that the INTJ is also a small minority of the population. And yes, I know that this makes it even more difficult to find a mate, but INTJs are supposed to like challenges. So step it up! Keep an open mind! And take a leap of faith (faith in yourself, or your God [I know that this doesn't apply to you]) sometimes.

If you don't have faith in at least yourself, you can't ask someone else to have it!

	Originally Posted by zibber To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	3) Stop focusing on sex and just live life.

Great point.

	Originally Posted by Still Standing To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	4) Go "friends with benefits" with someone either understanding or in a similar position and with whom you've previously developed a friendly relationship (that's not random).

Another good suggestion if one is open to the idea. I don't see any problem with a FWB as long as both parties know exaclty what they are getting into.

Did anyone say
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"Have safe sex, get STD tests done before rolling in the hay etc?" There was so much hooker and hooking up suggested!

[zibber]

	Originally Posted by Iota Null To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	You really underestimate how many people hold potential partners to rigid standards that they themselves don't meet. And sex is for most people an audition or performance for the guy, so the girl's experience is irrelevant.

I don't know who these "most people" are, but I'm glad I've never run into them.

[Kratos]

Originally Posted by Minerva To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

As expected with a thread like this there 2 major courses of action: 1) Just have sex with someone "random". 2) Continue waiting for someone more "special" and then do it. Hey, OP, you haven't given us too much feedback (I am not chastising you) although there have been some good discussions/debates here. I am going to respond to the 2 posts you did make. This situation is considered by most to be unattractive and undesirable, but not by all. Billy has committed no crime thus far. A fatalistic attitude, but it is understandable in this case. 30 isn't that old, BUT if you don't do something about this you can easily become a 40 year old virgin. You need to work on your super shyness and awkwardness. There have been some good advice about remedying that already. BUT you need to find out what you are comfortable with trying. In all the posts I read, it didn't seem like anyone asked you what you were ready to do. There was just a lot of advice thrown out including some extreme propositions. He needs to become less love shy. You fear is holding you back. You really should work on this. This response tells me that you're not ready to try hookers or hooking up with strangers. I just want you to realize that perspectives can change as we mature. So while it is easy for strangers on the internet to give advice, you need to realize just what is it that you want and what you need to do. (From the first post) You already know that you need to work on your social skills. You need to get rid of some of that shyness and to get out and meet more people. Okay, so you have a dilemma because your virginity is adding to your shyness. So should you just lose it and get it over with? Or should you try to change your perspective on you being a virgin? The first option has been beaten to death on this thread and based on your second post, I would suggest the second option. Try to realize that being a virgin does not mean that you are automatically undesirable. No matter what IotaNull says: If someone just wants casual sex without an emotional attachment then he/she wants mindblowing sex (which means an experienced partner). If someone wants a long term relationship and love etc, you can safely expect that the person will not mind that you're a virgin even if she isn't. While toys and masturbation can no way in hell replace the real thing, you can at least explore your sexuality with these "tools". These can also help you with things like increasing your stamina, if you know what I mean. Maybe you can become less shy about sex this way. *shrug* Note: I am neither advocating for hooking up nor masturbation because, OP, you haven't told us what is it that you want? What is it that you're comfortable with doing? Do you even know? Find these things out and then proceed.

Thank you for the response. Very insightful.
I'm comfortable with my sexuality. What I want is a deep and meaningful relationship. I think that that, in part, has also held me back. Waiting for the "ultimate" relationship.... turns out I'm not an INTJ but an INFJ. Who knew!?
I'm working on not being so "all or nothing". A friend lined me up a date this Friday. I guess we'll see what happens.

[Lilie]

	Originally Posted by Kratos To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I'm comfortable with my sexuality. What I want is a deep and meaningful relationship. I think that that, in part, has also held me back. Waiting for the "ultimate" relationship.... turns out I'm not an INTJ but an INFJ. Who knew!?

I don't think wanting an "ultimate" relationship excludes you from being INTJ. More the opposite, actually.