Kashmir is all about "control"

**alrightgame** · 08-17-2012, 01:26 PM

I'm convinced that Kashmir is about controlling the audience. In other words, Led Zeppelin has forced hypnosis in their drug infused audience, similar to Illuminati manipulation.

This manipulation effect only works in live performances, where you get bass and lights, and Robert Plant's auditory cues (or whoever is performing). Just watch the audience around you. They are all moving in a sheep state, back and forth. There isn't much dancing, just a zombie effect.

This is possibly the scariest moments in my life I have ever experienced, because even I fall into that trance when I'm not forcing myself to stay away from it. It literally feels like I've lost control.

Here is a synopsis of this song, and what I think Led Zeppelin is try to warn us of, at least for those who observe the audience first hand. (note: I put this in the the psychology thread, because I feel it is a form of hypnosis; feel free to move it moderators)

“Oh let the sun beat down upon my face, stars to fill my dream”

Here, Zeppelin is telling their audience to let the stage lights and and performance take them. They are telling them to relax.

“I am a traveler of both time and space, to be where I have been”

They are taking your trust in this lyric, once again, coaxing the audience into paying attention.

“To sit with elders of the gentle race, this world has seldom seen”

At this point, the music has moved you into a trance, and into their world of control. They are saying they are in control of you, but there is nothing to fear.

“They talk of days for which they sit and wait and all will be revealed”

They are talking about the length of the trance, and that it will break at the end.

“Talk and song from tongues of lilting grace, whose sounds caress my ear”

Led Zeppelin is asking you to focus more and more on their voice and the instruments.

“But not a word I heard could I relate, the story was quite clear
Oh, oh.”

Meaning Led Zeppelin is not in the trance, but they can relate to it. This moment is iterated a bit later.

“Oh, I been flying... mama, there ain't no denyin'
I've been flying, ain't no denyin', no denyin'”

Obviously drugs help the audience go deeper into the trance. This is highly subjective due to altered states of an individual's mind.

“All I see turns to brown, as the sun burns the ground
And my eyes fill with sand, as I scan this wasted land
Trying to find, trying to find where I've been.”

Led Zeppelin is talking about what the audience looks like to them. A baron wasteland of uselessness. They also are stating that they understand this effect, and that you are nearly powerless to control your human social natures. This is the part where you are in the deepest part of the trance, around 4:00.

“Oh, pilot of the storm who leaves no trace, like thoughts inside a dream”

At this point, the audience does not know they are in a trance, but Zeppelin knows. They are also in complete control.

“Heed the path that led me to that place, yellow desert stream
My Shangri-La beneath the summer moon, I will return again
Sure as the dust that floats high in June, when movin' through Kashmir.”

They are closing the trance, stating that they will take you again because of your weak mind. You are mindless drivel, wasted potential, and entirely too easy to control.

“Oh, father of the four winds, fill my sails, across the sea of years
With no provision but an open face, along the straits of fear
Ohh.”

They fear the hypnotic effect their music can have on their audience, and realize the potential that it could become a serious weapon against the masses. They are actually trying to warn us of what we have become during the song.

“When I'm on, when I'm on my way, yeah
When I see, when I see the way, you stay-yeah”

This is them noticing that people stay in the trance until the song is over.

“Ooh, yeah-yeah, ooh, yeah-yeah, when I'm down...
Ooh, yeah-yeah, ooh, yeah-yeah, well I'm down, so down
Ooh, my baby, oooh, my baby, let me take you there

Let me take you there. Let me take you there”

Continuation of the song, and closing it off. The audience is released from the instrumental hypnosis, then nearly everyone turns and look at each other, as if shaken out of a stupor and they are witnessing their surroundings for the first time. Before they were not doing this.

This is my observation after seeing it a couple of times by cover bands (good ones, might I add). It really is the strangest effect I’ve ever seen a song have on an audience. People are practically line dancing back and forth, heads nodding, and they keep doing it until the song is over. And yes, I know it is possible to not fall into this trance, but when you are at this kind of concert, you tend to go with the flow.

I seriously believe Led Zeppelin has touched the roots of what music allows humanity to do to each other. The purpose of music is to allow one to let go, even dangerously so. I think they were also warning us about propaganda and to be careful, as these are the same techniques governments use to control the people. Pink Floyd might have the best album ever, but I think Kashmir touches on the very nature of the relationship between humans and music.

Do you guys see this? What is your take?

(And yes, I was on shrooms and pot when I observed this IRL)

**Kearley65** · 08-17-2012, 01:33 PM

When ever I hear this song I lose control anyways. Led Zeppelin has always done that to me and that is why I love their music.

**Kisai** · 08-17-2012, 01:45 PM


	controlling the audience

All media seeks to control the audience in order to convince them that it is an excellent economic decision to exchange currency for the media itself (or at least indirectly, by presenting room for advertisers).


	What is your take?


	This is highly subjective

^^^

The notion of control means that there is a desired effect that you wish to attain. If there's any other directive than "I want to buy Led Zeppelin merchandise" that is shared in common with the fans, please let me know. I am genuinely interested in mind control.

**Lolwut** · 08-17-2012, 02:07 PM

Never heard this song... I'll listen to it in the morning cause i'm kinda scared after reading your post at midnight in my bedroom with the lights off.

**Kearley65** · 08-17-2012, 02:13 PM

	Originally Posted by Lolwut To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Never heard this song... I'll listen to it in the morning cause i'm kinda scared after reading your post at midnight in my bedroom with the lights off.

Song is awesome. I can fall asleep to it.

**clumsywordsmith** · 08-17-2012, 02:21 PM

Doubtful. In fact, I've never been all that certain as to why people seem to rave so much about this particular song; plenty of other stuff they do that is head and shoulders above it.

That said, any decent music tends to have a hypnotic effect on anyone under the influence. Not just decent music, but crappy music too.

**Kearley65** · 08-17-2012, 02:29 PM

	Originally Posted by clumsywordsmith To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Doubtful. In fact, I've never been all that certain as to why people seem to rave so much about this particular song; plenty of other stuff they do that is head and shoulders above it. That said, any decent music tends to have a hypnotic effect on anyone under the influence. Not just decent music, but crappy music too.

I agree. if the music did not suck the audience in, how would the musician make a living. The music has to draw people to it or they will be a broke musician.

**alrightgame** · 08-17-2012, 02:37 PM

See, the thing is that I think a majority of you are missing, is it has to be played live for it to have this effect. You cannot get the effect from a Youtube video. I need some input from someone who has seen it live, from a coverband or the source.

**Kearley65** · 08-17-2012, 02:50 PM

No, Page on the guitar, Paul Jones on bass, Bonham on drums and Plant's voice pulls my mind away every time by just listening to the music. Great Music should do this whether you are at a live concert or listening to the song on the radio. I understand what you are saying about their music but I think it has more to do with my love for the music than some mental mind game. When I listen to music I try to find all the different sounds form the different instruments and I fall into a musical trance.

**SarcasticVlad** · 08-18-2012, 03:51 AM

So Led Zeppelin is a good band. What else is new? Good music is supposed to have a strong positive effect on the listener.

**gypsy stardust** · 08-18-2012, 04:24 AM

Beware of the Beatles too!
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I hear if you listen to them backwards you'll discover a sudden urge to ...

Buy Beatles albums...

And satan will get you if you listen to heavy metal.
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Of course you get sucked in with Kashmir it has a very simple, repetitive theme that draws you in and then is built up to epic proportions. Music is supposed to affect you, that's the point. If it isn't touching your emotions it isn't very good.

Mozart's Requiem, Ravel's Bolero, Wagner's Siegfried Idyll, Mussorgsky's Night on Bald Mountain, Saint Saens Danse Macbre, etc also have the same effect, what was the powdered wig crowd trying to hypnotize you to do? Cluck like a chicken?

I had the great pleasure of experiencing an Orchestral Jethro Tull concert a few years ago with Lucia Micarelli (an excellent young violinist) where they blew the roof off with a performance of Kashmir that put the recording to shame. I can't listen to the original without mourning the loss of that live performance.

**John F Kennedy** · 08-18-2012, 09:20 AM

You might want to do some research into anthropology of music and partly aesthetics of music. Music in various cultures has been perceived as having to do with magic and was seen as an agent that acts upon the mind. Especially music in myths had magical power over the minds of people and gods. In the history of aesthetics you will find a more scientific belief in the effect of music upon the psyche. Each of the various modes (similar to scales) had a specific character to it, and some of them were regarded negatively as they were believed to make people drink, become mad/hysterical, or very sad. A remnant of this is seen today in the major scale being regarded as "happy" and the minor scale as "sad".

**Autumnleaf** · 08-18-2012, 09:41 AM

There is more to mass media than is apparent. As men and women who understand systems, I invite you to take a peek.

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"This is a direct quote, brothers and sisters. He said, "Our music is calculated to drive the kids to sex." I'm sure I had a real look of shock on my face in receiving such a bold response. He quickly added, "Well, it's not my fault what they do. That's up to them. I'm just making a lot of money."

Then he told me he'd been in Mexico making a video because he could make it for about one third of what it would cost in the United States. He told me this was a great day for them because now instead of just having audio where they could portray some of what they wanted to about sex and all, they now had videos and could have the people both hear it and see it portrayed. He said this would have much more impact on the youth, that his music was selling much more, and thus he was making much more money.

As I said, we talked for a couple of hours. Let me just share a few things that happened because it teaches the importance of what we are discussing with respect to music. As we chatted, I told him I was married and had eight children. He told me that he was not married but that he had three children and was proud of it. He told me that he had one woman pregnant in Virginia, one in New York, and one in England, as I recall. He told me that it didn't matter what you did in life, that you could take whatever you wanted, and you could do whatever you wanted. He said there were no commandments, there was no God, and nothing really mattered. He indicated there was no judgment day and you could just do whatever you felt like doing. Whatever I told him in our discussion was white he said was black. And whatever he said was white I told him was black."

**SarcasticVlad** · 08-18-2012, 09:52 AM

	Originally Posted by Autumnleaf To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	He said, "Our music is calculated to drive the kids to sex."

Right. Because otherwise kids would never think of sex.

**Autumnleaf** · 08-18-2012, 09:57 AM

	Originally Posted by SarcasticVlad To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Right. Because otherwise kids would never think of sex.

There is people choosing to jump off a cliff versus someone standing near a cliff thinking about it and someone they trust giving them a push.

**Aeon** · 08-18-2012, 10:21 AM

It ain't got shizz on "Call Me Maybe"
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**Nightmare** · 08-18-2012, 11:27 AM

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is also amazing live! They include a full orchestra and egyptian instruments!

(hardcore zep fan)

**SarcasticVlad** · 08-18-2012, 12:39 PM

	Originally Posted by Autumnleaf To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	There is people choosing to jump off a cliff versus someone standing near a cliff thinking about it and someone they trust giving them a push.

That's a very poor example. Sex drive is natural, healthy and to be expected.

**RBM** · 08-19-2012, 09:56 AM

	Originally Posted by Nightmare To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. is also amazing live! They include a full orchestra and egyptian instruments! (hardcore zep fan)

Thanks for the clip, Nightmare ! Got this senior citizen rocking in his recliner. Excellent production value in the piece. hehehe

@ OP

Seems like this OP is at bottom line, about fear of LOSS of control.

Petty common fare for the species. Also more pronounced in the younger of the species, but that state of fear of loss of control can exist all the way from cradle to grave in individual cases :-(

If this sort of fear exists under the influence of mere pot and 'shrooms, I'd expect it to manifest most assuredly in any stronger hallucinogen, like LSD, for example. Definitely an element to take note of and consider in future 'under the influence' escapades, based on my past experiences.

**Autumnleaf** · 08-19-2012, 02:57 PM

	Originally Posted by SarcasticVlad To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	That's a very poor example. Sex drive is natural, healthy and to be expected.

Defecation is too. There are times and places for everything.

08-17-2012, 01:26 PM	#1
alrightgame Member [20%] MBTI: IXTJ Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 801	I'm convinced that Kashmir is about controlling the audience. In other words, Led Zeppelin has forced hypnosis in their drug infused audience, similar to Illuminati manipulation. This manipulation effect only works in live performances, where you get bass and lights, and Robert Plant's auditory cues (or whoever is performing). Just watch the audience around you. They are all moving in a sheep state, back and forth. There isn't much dancing, just a zombie effect. This is possibly the scariest moments in my life I have ever experienced, because even I fall into that trance when I'm not forcing myself to stay away from it. It literally feels like I've lost control. Here is a synopsis of this song, and what I think Led Zeppelin is try to warn us of, at least for those who observe the audience first hand. (note: I put this in the the psychology thread, because I feel it is a form of hypnosis; feel free to move it moderators) “Oh let the sun beat down upon my face, stars to fill my dream” Here, Zeppelin is telling their audience to let the stage lights and and performance take them. They are telling them to relax. “I am a traveler of both time and space, to be where I have been” They are taking your trust in this lyric, once again, coaxing the audience into paying attention. “To sit with elders of the gentle race, this world has seldom seen” At this point, the music has moved you into a trance, and into their world of control. They are saying they are in control of you, but there is nothing to fear. “They talk of days for which they sit and wait and all will be revealed” They are talking about the length of the trance, and that it will break at the end. “Talk and song from tongues of lilting grace, whose sounds caress my ear” Led Zeppelin is asking you to focus more and more on their voice and the instruments. “But not a word I heard could I relate, the story was quite clear Oh, oh.” Meaning Led Zeppelin is not in the trance, but they can relate to it. This moment is iterated a bit later. “Oh, I been flying... mama, there ain't no denyin' I've been flying, ain't no denyin', no denyin'” Obviously drugs help the audience go deeper into the trance. This is highly subjective due to altered states of an individual's mind. “All I see turns to brown, as the sun burns the ground And my eyes fill with sand, as I scan this wasted land Trying to find, trying to find where I've been.” Led Zeppelin is talking about what the audience looks like to them. A baron wasteland of uselessness. They also are stating that they understand this effect, and that you are nearly powerless to control your human social natures. This is the part where you are in the deepest part of the trance, around 4:00. “Oh, pilot of the storm who leaves no trace, like thoughts inside a dream” At this point, the audience does not know they are in a trance, but Zeppelin knows. They are also in complete control. “Heed the path that led me to that place, yellow desert stream My Shangri-La beneath the summer moon, I will return again Sure as the dust that floats high in June, when movin' through Kashmir.” They are closing the trance, stating that they will take you again because of your weak mind. You are mindless drivel, wasted potential, and entirely too easy to control. “Oh, father of the four winds, fill my sails, across the sea of years With no provision but an open face, along the straits of fear Ohh.” They fear the hypnotic effect their music can have on their audience, and realize the potential that it could become a serious weapon against the masses. They are actually trying to warn us of what we have become during the song. “When I'm on, when I'm on my way, yeah When I see, when I see the way, you stay-yeah” This is them noticing that people stay in the trance until the song is over. “Ooh, yeah-yeah, ooh, yeah-yeah, when I'm down... Ooh, yeah-yeah, ooh, yeah-yeah, well I'm down, so down Ooh, my baby, oooh, my baby, let me take you there Let me take you there. Let me take you there” Continuation of the song, and closing it off. The audience is released from the instrumental hypnosis, then nearly everyone turns and look at each other, as if shaken out of a stupor and they are witnessing their surroundings for the first time. Before they were not doing this. This is my observation after seeing it a couple of times by cover bands (good ones, might I add). It really is the strangest effect I’ve ever seen a song have on an audience. People are practically line dancing back and forth, heads nodding, and they keep doing it until the song is over. And yes, I know it is possible to not fall into this trance, but when you are at this kind of concert, you tend to go with the flow. I seriously believe Led Zeppelin has touched the roots of what music allows humanity to do to each other. The purpose of music is to allow one to let go, even dangerously so. I think they were also warning us about propaganda and to be careful, as these are the same techniques governments use to control the people. Pink Floyd might have the best album ever, but I think Kashmir touches on the very nature of the relationship between humans and music. Do you guys see this? What is your take? (And yes, I was on shrooms and pot when I observed this IRL)
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08-17-2012, 01:33 PM	#2
Kearley65 Member [19%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 761	When ever I hear this song I lose control anyways. Led Zeppelin has always done that to me and that is why I love their music.
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08-17-2012, 02:07 PM	#4
Lolwut Member [08%] MBTI: INTP Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 320	Never heard this song... I'll listen to it in the morning cause i'm kinda scared after reading your post at midnight in my bedroom with the lights off.
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08-17-2012, 02:21 PM	#6
clumsywordsmith Member [07%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 316	Doubtful. In fact, I've never been all that certain as to why people seem to rave so much about this particular song; plenty of other stuff they do that is head and shoulders above it. That said, any decent music tends to have a hypnotic effect on anyone under the influence. Not just decent music, but crappy music too.
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08-17-2012, 02:37 PM	#8
alrightgame Member [20%] MBTI: IXTJ Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 801	See, the thing is that I think a majority of you are missing, is it has to be played live for it to have this effect. You cannot get the effect from a Youtube video. I need some input from someone who has seen it live, from a coverband or the source.
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08-17-2012, 02:50 PM	#9
Kearley65 Member [19%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 761	No, Page on the guitar, Paul Jones on bass, Bonham on drums and Plant's voice pulls my mind away every time by just listening to the music. Great Music should do this whether you are at a live concert or listening to the song on the radio. I understand what you are saying about their music but I think it has more to do with my love for the music than some mental mind game. When I listen to music I try to find all the different sounds form the different instruments and I fall into a musical trance.
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08-18-2012, 03:51 AM	#10
SarcasticVlad Veteran Member [63%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 2,528	So Led Zeppelin is a good band. What else is new? Good music is supposed to have a strong positive effect on the listener.
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08-18-2012, 04:24 AM	#11
gypsy stardust Veteran Member [88%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 3,545	Beware of the Beatles too! To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. I hear if you listen to them backwards you'll discover a sudden urge to ... Buy Beatles albums... And satan will get you if you listen to heavy metal. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Of course you get sucked in with Kashmir it has a very simple, repetitive theme that draws you in and then is built up to epic proportions. Music is supposed to affect you, that's the point. If it isn't touching your emotions it isn't very good. Mozart's Requiem, Ravel's Bolero, Wagner's Siegfried Idyll, Mussorgsky's Night on Bald Mountain, Saint Saens Danse Macbre, etc also have the same effect, what was the powdered wig crowd trying to hypnotize you to do? Cluck like a chicken? I had the great pleasure of experiencing an Orchestral Jethro Tull concert a few years ago with Lucia Micarelli (an excellent young violinist) where they blew the roof off with a performance of Kashmir that put the recording to shame. I can't listen to the original without mourning the loss of that live performance.
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08-18-2012, 09:20 AM	#12
John F Kennedy Member [36%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 1,461	You might want to do some research into anthropology of music and partly aesthetics of music. Music in various cultures has been perceived as having to do with magic and was seen as an agent that acts upon the mind. Especially music in myths had magical power over the minds of people and gods. In the history of aesthetics you will find a more scientific belief in the effect of music upon the psyche. Each of the various modes (similar to scales) had a specific character to it, and some of them were regarded negatively as they were believed to make people drink, become mad/hysterical, or very sad. A remnant of this is seen today in the major scale being regarded as "happy" and the minor scale as "sad".
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08-18-2012, 09:41 AM	#13
Autumnleaf Core Member [228%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 9,122	There is more to mass media than is apparent. As men and women who understand systems, I invite you to take a peek. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. "This is a direct quote, brothers and sisters. He said, "Our music is calculated to drive the kids to sex." I'm sure I had a real look of shock on my face in receiving such a bold response. He quickly added, "Well, it's not my fault what they do. That's up to them. I'm just making a lot of money." Then he told me he'd been in Mexico making a video because he could make it for about one third of what it would cost in the United States. He told me this was a great day for them because now instead of just having audio where they could portray some of what they wanted to about sex and all, they now had videos and could have the people both hear it and see it portrayed. He said this would have much more impact on the youth, that his music was selling much more, and thus he was making much more money. As I said, we talked for a couple of hours. Let me just share a few things that happened because it teaches the importance of what we are discussing with respect to music. As we chatted, I told him I was married and had eight children. He told me that he was not married but that he had three children and was proud of it. He told me that he had one woman pregnant in Virginia, one in New York, and one in England, as I recall. He told me that it didn't matter what you did in life, that you could take whatever you wanted, and you could do whatever you wanted. He said there were no commandments, there was no God, and nothing really mattered. He indicated there was no judgment day and you could just do whatever you felt like doing. Whatever I told him in our discussion was white he said was black. And whatever he said was white I told him was black."
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08-18-2012, 10:21 AM	#16
Aeon New Member [01%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 64	It ain't got shizz on "Call Me Maybe" To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
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08-18-2012, 11:27 AM	#17
Nightmare Member [29%] MBTI: INFP Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,184	To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. is also amazing live! They include a full orchestra and egyptian instruments! (hardcore zep fan)
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