[Qjiggy]

Want to share an article I came across. Introversion is certainly this years buzz word and hope more examples will come about to make companies and even our educators to realize that leadership can come from a quiet person; great leadership that is.


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[JC22]

	Can introverts lead?

To our dooms.

[Megalomania]

Shy/awkward/bad interpersonal skills = bad employee
Introverted with social skills = as good as or better than extroverts.

[Qjiggy]

Extroverts are for full control of every situation - i've worked with a handful of them and they rarely do listen. They will have one or two work really hard for the cause, and have everyone just do the necessary.

Introverts are the opposite. They do not need full control of situation but they assert responsibility and encourage others how to find a solution. They listen. Instead of having one or two people work hard, they can double the numbers have almost everyone taking responsibilities. I believe this because it is what I do at my job, and it gets easier and easier as time goes by. Extroverts will be too busy micro-managing everyone, including themselves. My problem, its a hard to sell the idea to others, and it is slower to have great "numbers" to show for (in the beginning.) But once the train picks up steam, it just keeps going and going.

[Jade333]

Is this an introversion or extroversion label though? I've know both introverts and extroverts to be tremendously insightful and effective leaders as well as the complete opposite. Wouldn't experience, intelligence and accountability hold weight in the matter?

[psykhe]

Leadership doesn't just mean you know what you are talking but also know how to convince your listener/audience that you know exactly what you are talking.

Leading is persuading. It's a combination of technical skills and soft skills. Charisma can be found from both extroverts and introverts. So to answer the OP, yes introverts can lead too.

	Originally Posted by Qjiggy To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Extroverts will be too busy micro-managing everyone, including themselves.

ENTJs and ISTJs alike are capable of micromanaging, if not always.

[Fox]

I don't see why they can't lead.


Many people see leaders as the most outgoing and friendly person who can quickly form bonds with people. That isn't common with introverts.

Besides it is better to be the puppet master.

[cynicdave]

I've been rapidly promoted to management positions since I was in my early 20s. First few hires I made on my own were all complete failures. I made every single classical mistake regarding leadership. I was a good employee-- but a terrible manager. I spent no time in the training, in the improving of people's lives outside of my own. My natural talents saved me as I would generally do all the important work myself. And I would feel comfortable taking credit for it.

But you know what? I learned that all the important things in the world rarely get accomplished by one person. Groups and teams accomplish a lot more than I can ever do. And teams require social lubrication to work well.

I got better with leadership as the years went by and as I gained more experience. I got a lot better with communication, presentation, socializing, and the art of the work-place debate. I got better at thinking on my feet and trying to perfect my tone, my voice, and attitude rather than the exact correctness of every thing I said verbally (a lot of INTJ's try to be too precise with their language which can seriously bog down and bore people). I realized that not everyone responds to ideas and theory and many were not interested in due diligence when it came to important decisions (arguing for arguing's sake is what non-INTJs call it).

Instead I learned how the 99% of non INTJ's get stuff done. Emotional pleas, loyalty to personality rather than ideas, flattery, demonstration of the "upside" rather than the "how to get there". Training isn't just imparting knowledge-- it's a way to bond and work together as a team and to spend some time with another employee.

As intuitives, sometimes we just "know" things right away and it takes some time for us to figure out the words behind them. I learned how to buy time in a tense workplace discussion by changing the subject and the character of the debate to be more jargony so people would get bogged down in the semantics of things for a few minutes while I came up with more fully explainable ideas and thoughts to support my opinions.

I learned how to disagree in a nice but genuine way, especially to superiors. "Well , I'm not quite sure with what you are saying, but I'm also not 100% with what I believe, but in any case, I'll be giving it by best anyway like I always do because I really respect ya, oh magnificent leader! =)"

It helps that I've never had a bad superior. I guess they may have been poor in one way or another, but I've always dealt with what I could quickly. I've had all kinds of personality types, mostly extroverts, but I can truly say I learned something from all of them.

In most startups, extroverts are usually the ones who have the information from their network of friends to be able to get funding, hire the right people, refine their ideas, and learn about new things that aren't necessarily written down. In fact, I would say in the startup community, it's the potential people you might be able to call upon that's way more important to get something big started rather than some elaborate and unique new "idea".

I'm a very strong introvert. I'm am completely socialized out by the time I get home, and I generally very much enjoy the silence until I sleep. But if you were to see me at work, you may think I'm "outgoing", "friendly" and can "quickly form connections" with anyone.

All of that is easily learned with a bit of effort and training. There are plenty of extroverts who can't seem make a connection with people no matter how much they spew random words (mostly about themselves).

I don't think it's even very hard for INTJs. Most social interaction follow predictable rules. These rules are harder to come by introverts because they get tired faster when dealing with other people, whereas extraverts have plenty of opportunities when growing up to stumble into the right things to say and respond in interactions. Most small talk is simply trying to find some kind of common interest and then talking about it for a few minutes. That's why in addition to any uncommon hobbies you probably have, it pays to see the latest movies, follow a sports team, (or play a sport), watch a popular TV show, read magazines like esquire or maximum etc.

In any case, I think INTJ's because they are so methodical, has potential to be far superior than most people at connecting on a deeper level by finding something to like or discuss about the other person on some kind of abstract, thoughtful, or emotional level, and that means often extroverts flock to these INTJ's like crazy.

[Qjiggy]

@cynicdave, nicely done!

I got the image of what a leader/manager should be back in college. I was excited to put my study into action. Made all possible mistake that I could think of, only to find out what really works. Being an introvert in an extrovert role is certainly not easy. But as intj, we can learn to adapt quickly and learn from our mistake. Our minds are greater than what our body can do.

[Mogura]

I dunno if it's related to my type, but I tend to be a better leader than manager. This is especially true during times of chaos or uncertainty.

[Thinktress]

Here's my take on it. Introrverts aren't generally as popular, but they can definitely exude a sense of quiet authority and confidence that stands them in good stead as a leader.

[INTroJect]

Im a strong introvert and was a fantastic leader in the service. Things ran very well and absolutely no bs at all. It wasnt something that I ever sought out but it kind of landed on me a few times. Isnt colin powell an intj?

[MULTIVERSE]

When properly paid

[Distance]

I'll admit to not watching the clip. It doesn't matter how smart or capable you are. If you can't people manage where people willingly follow, you're fucked.

[cynicdave]

Everyone, including INTJs, want to feel like they matter. No matter how tired we get when interacting with others, we are all social creatures on a deep level (down to our genes), and a truthful and well-thought out compliment will really make our day (A stupid, shallow compliment we don't even notice, and we might actually waste precious time arguing with someone who was just trying to be nice).

Because of our deep perspective on what a great compliment is, when we try really hard to be truthfully amicable, we can be effective at getting people to like and respect us. At the end of the day, being respected and liked is what you mostly need to get stuff done in a non INTJ world.

---------- Post added 08-18-2012 at 09:39 PM ----------

In terms of the difference between "leadership" and "managing", I think there's a false dichotomy being presented in the video abstract between management and leadership. To me, effective management IS good leadership. It's not just "getting out of the way". It's knowing WHEN to get out of the way. If you don't spend the effort training people over long periods of time consistently and setting clear goals and expectations, getting "out of the way" is akin to not participating. This has predictable results-- meaning that people will flounder and they will not achieve the goals you want them to achieve.

At first, you set pretty specific and granular goals (i.e. micromanagement) . In the example of data analytics, maybe you first tell them to create spreadsheet columns from an online report. You spend time training people to achieve these very specific goals. Perhaps you spend a few hours training people how to use excel, and giving them shortcuts and mouse commands to speed up their work after you notice inefficiencies. Because it's impossible for anyone to assimilate all information at once, you have to do this pretty consistently over a long period of time.

Then you broaden the goals. Maybe in some time they have the baseline knowledge in order to look up information on their own. You give them online sources to look up excel formulas and macros on their own. Maybe after a while, you teach them how to do simple data aggregation, and then reveal them pivot tables to quickly transform data once they struggle with manually copying and summing up large columns of information. Previously cryptic concepts start to look easy. After awhile, their knowledge base increases and they start grasping how to present and visualize the information, and you teach them about how to present data to important people in the company.

Good leadership and management is a lot of social interaction. Tiring and endless training, conversations, and compliments to make sure people feel confident and valued enough to keep going and keep broadening their capabilities. A good leader and manager spends endless time teaching and coaching. Constructive criticisms, truthful and real compliments, and strong knowledge of the industry to the granular level in which they lead are the hallmarks of a good leader/manager.

[Shinganist]

I think so, depends on the person. I've never had a problem leading but I usually only like to lead when leadership is failing.

[Arbosis]

Yes, they can.
The good thing, is that they will do the right thing, not just the easy popular thing.
The bad thing, it may be one of the most tiring things you can ever do.

[Distance]

	Originally Posted by Arbosis To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Yes, they can. The good thing, is that they will do the right thing, not just the easy popular thing. The bad thing, it may be one of the most tiring things you can ever do.

Right thing? Isn't this a stretch?

[Arbosis]

I know that "the right thing" is very subjective, what I meant was what the introvert thinks it's right.

[Ethereal Dream]

Yes of course they can. I did for some time although I did get tired of it. If I were self employed it would probably have been a more positive experience. I didn't like the politics that came along with leadership although in most companies you can't escape that regardless of position. I did lead for a few years, really wasn't my thing and prefer to work independently. The people that reported to me did like working under me from the reviews they gave. I think introverts may be better at listening to their employees individually (that was one of the positive reviews given to me) and recognizing their talents, helping them with self development and advancing to positions appropriate for their personality and skills.

[Moxiie]

Either type can lead, I've worked with spectacular introvert and extrovert leaders, both have lessons to learn about how to lead, sometimes those lessons are different. Leadership isn't about type, it's about how to work well with others.

[JC22]

can X's lead?


unstable psychopaths...

[Mohammad]

Extroverts tend to talk to everyone all the time. Their energy can be sensed. It is contagious enough for most followers to be inspired.
Introverts tend to listen more. Their energy is felt by fewer people initially. They are inclined to silence and prefer to control meetings less. However, as time progresses their style starts working.

Essentially, extroverts take less time than introverts to be effective leaders.

[Distance]

As a thought, consider self-interest (a rational trait). Why would people follow anyone who they don't believe will lead in a manner that includes taking into consideration, their needs?

[Qjiggy]

	Originally Posted by Distance To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	As a thought, consider self-interest (a rational trait). Why would people follow anyone who they don't believe will lead in a manner that includes taking into consideration, their needs?

Good point! Maybe people has to follow them because they were appointed/hired by someone in the company? Others may not need to follow them based on their liking, but they can if they need their job. But that won't classify just anyone to be a good leader; usually great leadership is associated with winning which can happen only through time. Creating a sudden influx of improvement in a short time isn't really a success story.

A losing team hardly says "with great leadership we curved our effort losing our place in the market from first to second".