[Zsych]

	Originally Posted by psykhe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	There ya go. Don't blame me [read:women] for your vulnerability, dear. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Oh its just adaptation against people with overly high senses of entitlement - does make for less altruism even towards the rest of people though.

Hurts the women too - those that I might've helped once, if they needed it.

[Apricots]

Noticing all forms of social manipulation comes naturally to me. In fact, the subtle is so pronounced, that I'll miss grand details, such as strange clothes, or a change in hair-colour. So, yeah, I notice.

That said, yeah, of course it's annoying sometimes. But all forms of social manipulation are annoying sometimes. If I think a girl is being too... I don't know... "raunchy" in her attempt to lure guys, I don't usually shed tears for the guys that follow along to her piper song.

Like attracts like, right?

Of course, I'm probably doing this on a subtle level all the time. I don't mean to be manipulative, but bending my demeanor slightly to create greater group harmony is part of my nature.

If I want to attract someone, I act attractive, right? If I want to befriend someone, I act friendly.

[Monte314]

This is normal human behavior, as Apricots has suggested. People play to their strengths in order to optimize their circumstances.

5,000 years ago, if a man wanted something held by another, he might consider taking it by force. Women, generally lacking this direct option, would naturally hone skills enabling them to mobilize the strength of males within their sphere of influence to accomplish similar ends.

These skills still exist, are still necessary and useful, and are still cultivated... though we now have social constructs regulating their deployment. No one should be surprised by this.

[joliet]

I think the distaste towards other women who do this does come out of a competition thing. But the way I see it, the entire male population isn't mine for the picking nor am I desperately reaching out for all of them. If I don't care for the man who is being targeted, I don't have an opinion for the woman--and vice versa. If a man falls for what I would consider an unsophisticated and disingenuous tactic, he's lost romantic interest from me and I become easily distracted to move my vision immediately elsewhere. If a woman uses an incredibly genuine form of her feminine wiles (aka genuine romantic interest) to a guy who reciprocates, kudos to them both.

So long as the man isn't someone I'm already committed to. It annoys me when a female tries to get romantic attention from someone they know I'm dating. I feel that I'm starting to get to the point where I no longer feel insecure about this happening, but to be honest, I do still get a little insecure.

[Claudus]

This is just romantic deception... I've known several girls who did this sort of thing, and would shrug it off with a comment like, "well, if he's dumb enough to do things for me, it's his fault"... which is the typical blame the victim logic that many criminals and predators use (and apparently psykhe).

In the end, I think women like this lose more than they gain.

[Distance]

	Originally Posted by joliet To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	So long as the man isn't someone I'm already committed to. It annoys me when a female tries to get romantic attention from someone they know I'm dating. I feel that I'm starting to get to the point where I no longer feel insecure about this happening, but to be honest, I do still get a little insecure.

Shift your perception. I find observing this type of interaction between a guy I'm dating and a woman soliciting his attention, to be of the utmost fascination. Great way to tell his character!

[psykhe]

	Originally Posted by Claudus To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	This is just romantic deception... I've known several girls who did this sort of thing, and would shrug it off with a comment like, "well, if he's dumb enough to do things for me, it's his fault"... which is the typical blame the victim logic that many criminals and predators use (and apparently psykhe). In the end, I think women like this lose more than they gain.

*shudders* omg, I feel nekkid.

Seriously, we're talking about feminine charms not psychopathy. And agree with Apricots, social manipulation is real and relevant - comes in different sizes and shapes, some subtle some pronounced.

[Claudus]

	Originally Posted by psykhe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	*shudders* omg, I feel nekkid.

That is as it happens. It does not follow that a deep, intricate character is more or less estimable than such a one as yours.

	Originally Posted by psykhe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Seriously, we're talking about feminine charms not psychopathy.

	Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	I was wondering if women actively notice and have opinions on women who actively use feminine wiles to get reactions / stuff from guys.

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	1: a trick or stratagem intended to ensnare or deceive; also : a beguiling or playful trick 2: skill in outwitting : trickery, guile

Or were you ironically demonstrating feminine wiles?

[SeverusSin]

Men can't see through feminine wiles? What a joke. The stupid men who do stuff because some chick batted her eyelid can speak for themselves.

[MechanicalSun]

Seduction games, a practice on the edge of extinction nowadays.

[Shadeylark]

meh, women who act like this to get guys or things are simply the female version of male PUA in my eyes.

straight women and gay men control the sex universe; bow before the power of pussy!

[Shadeylark]

	Originally Posted by SeverusSin To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Men can't see through feminine wiles? What a joke. The stupid men who do stuff because some chick batted her eyelid can speak for themselves.

the wise man realizes he doesn't, and can't, know everything all the time.

---------- Post added 07-13-2012 at 11:40 AM ----------

	Originally Posted by MechanicalSun To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Seduction games, a practice on the edge of extinction nowadays.

you really think so?

the game isn't ending, its just changing.

[Eyedears]

	Originally Posted by psykhe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Seriously, we're talking about feminine charms not psychopathy.

In a whole lot of cases, that type of woman is indeed psychopathic (note: that's not the same as sociopathic), and hence extremely dangerous as I mentioned in my previous post. I have encountered enough of them to know (even just at the women's college I attended).

	Originally Posted by psykhe To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	...social manipulation is real and relevant - comes in different sizes and shapes, some subtle some pronounced.

Yes, unfortunately exceedingly true, and it stinks no matter how it manifests.

[holdyourhead]

	Originally Posted by Causa Mortis To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	There's a male equivalent: the shit rich guys get away with.

That comment, and this thread, kind of reminds me a bit of
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.

From the perspective of the women who exert some kind of power over men, I've never understood it. Do these foolish guys ACTUALLY (and incorrectly) believe that by doing anything and bending over backwards for the women they find attractive it will actually increase their chances somewhat of getting a piece of her? Or is it more of an unconscious thing, where they don't even realise they are being used?

It doesn't work on me. I'd do anything I can for someone if I think they're deserving of it. I don't care if they're male or female or what they look like, it has no bearing on that. And for me, this kind of person wouldn't deserve it because they're already getting a disproportionate amount of help or whatever from others (in comparison to what the average person receives) while also giving nothing or little in return.

[Collide]

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This thread reminds me of these articles.

	A patriarchal bargain is a decision to accept gender rules that disadvantage women in exchange for whatever power one can wrest from the system. It is an individual strategy designed to manipulate the system to one’s best advantage, but one that leaves the system itself intact.

-Lisa Wade

I'd like to get rid of these systems. The acts of females who uphold the system for their own advantages are frustrating. However, I completely understand their reasoning and don't blame them for this behavior.

[Antares]

I smile. Is that feminine wiles? Smiling makes people nicer to me. It used to be men can get what they want by force. What can we do? We need to get what we need somehow. But we shall see that both men and women act nice to gain favors. Say, "nice guys". But even more innocuously, the bellboy who smiles at you is involuntarily doing what people do when they want good will from others: look attractive and harmless. I don't kill people for smiling at me. Manipulation is everywhere. Some benign, some malevolent. Manipulation is an evolved human trait.

Some would argue that babies are engineered to be loved. You're supposed to melt around them. That gives you incentive to take care of them, whether or not they're your babies. Tell me, when a baby grins at you, do you feel tricked because you want to take him in your arms, tickle him, make him happy and feed him? Or is it a natural reaction to looking at an attractive being? But of course, maybe that's why some women destroy themselves in an attempt to look like babies.

[UltraIncredible]

	Originally Posted by Antares To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Some would argue that babies are engineered to be loved. You're supposed to melt around them. That gives you incentive to take care of them, whether or not they're your babies.

When they're not screaming or crying or puking or shitting, anyway.

[Antares]

	Originally Posted by UltraIncredible To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	When they're not screaming or crying or puking or shitting, anyway.

They also say screaming and crying (puking and shitting they cannot help, I suppose) are suppose to make their needs impossible to ignore. And their cute faces prevent you from strangling them when they annoy you too much. You also have your own maternal hormones (or paternal) for that, I suppose. Babies turn your circadian rhythm upside down and make you want to have your world turned upside down by them. You can't even accuse them of manipulation because they can't help it. If that isn't the ultimate manipulation I don't know what is.

But it's all good... For the human race.

It's quite striking. What kind of animals do we hate?

-Sharks
-Crocs
-Scorpions
-Centipedes
-Anglerfish
-Other uncute/aggressive creatures with sharp stuff dangling from their jaws and you can't influence. You can rear a croc from egg up to old age, but no affinity will stop him from biting your head off if he so wishes.

What kind of animals do we love?

-Dogs (esp. puppies)
-Cats
-Dolphins
-Lions
-Whales
-Small rodents
-Horses
-Butterflies
-Other cute/beautiful/intelligent creatures that must possess one of these qualities: a) Looks benign/beautiful/cute (ie. harmless) b) Empathetic, can bond with c) harmless

Babies are: a) Looks benign/beautiful/cute (ie. harmless) b) Empathetic, can bond with c) harmless
Many women strive (and society tells them) to be: a) Looks benign/beautiful/cute (ie. harmless) b) Empathetic, can bond with c) harmless

You get movies like The Cove generating a shitstorm of public outrage. You don't hear nearly enough people shouting "save the sharks!" Dolphins are so good at being "a) Looks benign/beautiful/cute (ie. harmless) b) Empathetic, can bond with c) harmless" they have completely diverted our attention from the wholesale slaughter of sharks for shark fin soup, and what it does to our oceanic biodiversity.

[UltraIncredible]

I suppose. And even crocodiles are kind of cute when they're babies:

( Show Spoiler )

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[Kenny]

One might say that trading sex for anything other than sex is prostitution.

Zsych... secretly... I think you love it!

You recognize the situations so I'll bet you're quite capable of teasing back to make them work harder, then you'll see who's bluffing and who wants a real game. Giving in too easily and too often can make the difference between becoming a playmate and a plaything.

The ability to show resistance also shows that you would be better partner material even if on the surface it seemed that a woman was not getting what she wanted from you.

If on the other hand you were committed to debunking all flirtation how would you ever notice someone with a real interest in you?

If you do find that she's a gold digger usher her toward a wallet based pua so that they can annihilate!

[Antares]

	Originally Posted by Kenny To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	One might say that trading sex for anything other than sex is prostitution.

What about emotional intimacy or children?

[Shadeylark]

just goes to show that homo sapien isn't quite as evolved as we think.

those animal instincts of fight or flight, protect or destroy, are all still there, simmering beneath the surface, affecting our every action and behaviour on an unconscious level to at least some degree.

[catzmeow]

I think someone needs to offer training classes to help protect these poor unsuspecting males. They're so naive and helpless when pitted against female superpowers.

muahhahahahaahhaha.

[Nemesis]

I hear x-ray vision is a form of feminine wile.

Can anyone confirm or deny?

[Shadeylark]

just please promise to use your powers for good.