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INTJ: Who are we? None
Old 07-03-2012, 12:53 PM   #1
Tactical Panda
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Written for INTJs.

Within this context INTJ refers to the function preference of Ni, Te, Fi and inferior Se.
Feel free to comment or offer different views, as this thread is about perspectives.

Who are we?
In the most essential sense, we are people who possesses the INTJ type. Type doesn't tell you who you are or everything about you, just as being 'right handed', 'left handed', 'male', 'female', 'good', 'bad', 'dead' or 'alive' tells you everything about a person. Type tells you your preference for functions, which is useful to those who understand what that means, similarly to knowing the difference between dead and alive and knowing what that entails for a person.

What happened to me for me to end up like this?
I suppose we would have to split this into nature and nurture, as who you have come to be probably depends on both those aspects. In part this is because INTJs in some respects are diverse. For example, there are generally happy INTJs and there are generally unhappy INTJs. There are INTJs who many people gravitate towards and there are INTJs who most people feel uncomfortable around. There are INTJ artists and INTJ doctors and INTJ professors and INTJ dancers.

For whatever reason, you developed a function preference of an INTJ. How that came about and how if formed after that depended on your life story, so to speak.

Am I alone?
In a sense, no. There have likely been INTJs since very early in human history, scattered across countries and eras and issues and divides. Likely many of them faced some similar challenges to what you face. And, as history suggests, the end of the world did not result from them being themselves, even if that meant retaining a measure of natural prudence.

In other words, others have coped with being an INTJ too.

How does this INTJ intelligence thing work?
There are many theories on such things. I suggest reading some of Jung's work to look into functions rather than simply intelligence and what each one means.

In brief:
  • You have an introverted type. (Your types main function is an introverted function, Ni, which is introverted intuition.)
  • Your main function is an irrational (or "beyond rational") function, unlike T or F functions.
  • In your four main preference functions your extraverted rational function is Te, extraverted thinking.
  • In your four main preference functions your introverted rational function is Fi, introverted feeling.
  • Your inferior function is Se, extraverted sensing.

How does each function work?
In practice within concert with one another, at varying stages and directions of development.

In other words, in real people when one function operates others are likely operating.

The functions seem to develop over time, some becoming healthier at different rates to others, others perhaps less healthy and more self destructive. Presumably life will have challenges.

Is the INTJ type any good to have?
I think it is. Like all the types, you seem to have natural aptitudes at your disposal and the ability to manage going through life. You can learn from other people, you can learn about yourself, and have a diverse set of skills that you can naturally develop.

What are some of the INTJ strengths and weaknesses?
As Charles Darwin knew well, a 'strength' and 'weakness' is contingent on change and environment, as well as the ability to balance adapting with success.

In light of that, some of the possible characteristics of INTJs is as follows, which may overlap with other types:
  • Occasionaly lapses into awkwardness. This doesn't mean a life of unpopularity. Think of it as a quirk. INFJs can live with very similar and still manage to do well, as can some INTJs such as charming professors.
  • Occasional lapses into desire for a measure of solitude. It seems to be a side effect of having an introverted main function.
  • Concern with honest responsibility. Candid credit is good for character if you aren't being selfish, but is bad for those who consider selfishness and ease to be intelligent.
  • Concern with the nature of truth and meaning.
  • A childhood love of drawing.
  • The determination to learn when it seems meaningful.
  • An ability to hold to and develop long term plans with intelligence and much dedication. Putting decade long plans first, before rest and relaxation year upon year seems to occur for some INTJs I have encountered.
  • Intuitive grasp that usually kicks in now and then for various topics. I suppose this can leave people who don't see the ideas flying about behind the words feeling unsettled or sometimes threatened.
  • Distance and impersonal analysis seem like quirks, which provides both strengths and weaknesses, similarly to most all approaches.
  • Sometimes lapses into distracting or simple indulgences when under stress.

What does an unhealthy INTJ look like?
I suppose like any old fool: one whos pride manages to distract themself from self-destruction. I suggest honestly seeking wise council from someone you trust if in doubt.

What does a healthy INTJ look like?
I suppose like a normal person, with a meaningful plan in the works and a mind that can be applied well to the challenges that are faced. Some wisdom, love, maintained meaningful relationships and sensible life management are probably good to have alongside intelligence.

What does a super INTJ look like?
I suppose someone who works from home, getting rich trading stocks or something that allows them to do well with a very flexible timetable? Or maybe like Ayn Rand and Nietzsche's philosophical love child, who every sentence has unnecessarily intuitive depth waiting to burst into an impersonal monologue against the shackles upon the human condition? I don't really know.

Do INTJs have emotions?
Having functions doesn't stop someone from having emotions. Although functions seem to help or hinder awareness of them.

Crying at funerals and sad movies when deeply moved happens, as do other normal things.

I hear INTJs are pretty smart? Which is the smartest type?
In terms of academics? I'm not sure.

As a crude measurement, in my limited experience seen the following:
  • ISFP (highest HS score I've yet encountered), ESFJs (law), ISFJs (med), ESFPs (PHD)
  • INTPs (med), ENTJ (med), INTJ (med), ENTP (dentistry)
  • INFP (dentistry), ENFJ (commerce/engineering, but beat my HS score), INFJ (PHD math), ENFP (aero engineering)
  • ISTP (professor), ESTJ (med), ISTJ (aero engineering), ESTP (med)

So I think type doesn't stop someone from doing well, but don't know if such a thing as a smartest type can be, what it would entail or if there is one which it would be.

Are INTJs selfish?
To a degree yes, they are just as everyone is.
But I have seen some INTJs do unselfish things to the point of getting international mail saying thanks from the people they have helped long after the help has been given and the person has left the country. If that says anything. (Hopefully that character is what you make of it, even if it happens quietly without others notice.)

Are INTJs out to control everyone?
Control of others isn't needed for effectiveness if one is good at contingency planning. Control makes contingency planning redundant, aside from many things suggesting that control strict enought to enable that has been impossible thus far.
I have no idea as to why an INTJ would need rigid control, thus leaving the issue of desire a seemingly emotional issue rather than a pragmatic one.

As to emotionally controlling people, I'm not sure. Do you want to? Is there some sort of scar you have experienced? Or perhaps there is no control desire in terms of what is unhealthy?

Controlling people seems like a social concern or a means to try and get an emotional kick. I don't see how or why that relates to things INTJs invest their time and concerns with any more than suggesting ENFPs are out to control people out of some misplaced suspicion of them.

What types do INTJs get along well with?
Get out there in the real world and find out. Perhaps start with INFPs if you prefer to not start off with something too threatening.

Anything I should look out for?
People can be messed up. Someone who presents themself as an MBTI type doesn't really change that. I suggest getting some experience with others, and reflecting upon it in your own time.
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Old 07-03-2012, 05:00 PM   #2
jonathanb
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Certainly a nice thing to have. Thanks for the effort. I think this should be in Sticky, and that others should add to it as well.

"Childhood love of drawing"? You serious? I still draw like I did in 2nd grade. I have no drawing ability. Drawing is a very S activity, at least as far as Realism is concerned.

How about:

- A love for complex systems.

And the number 1 INTJ trait of:

- Always chasing improvement in and of everything.


Smart in academic terms (with the exception of sciences) is related to having a very strong Si, and remembering lots of stuff to write down in tests. This is not real intelligence or wisdom - just a skill. If you go by math skills, INTPs are the "smartest". I personally prefer Keirsey's model of the 4 intelligences: Tactical, Strategic, Logistical and Diplomatic. Makes a whole lot more sense than the commonly held models.

Selfishness:
I think we're selfish towards most people, and utterly unselfish, to the point of giving too much, to the few we really care about.

Control:
Healthy INTJs don't wish to control people, but processes and planning. ENTJs and ESTJs want to control people. INTJs might be interested in manipulating people for the heck of it, but I don't think they tend to enjoy that sort of management in the long term.

Getting along with:
Most NFs, even if they seem a bit emotional at times. Doing great with ISTJs, possibly most of them. Love-hate relationship with ESTJs, as both types commonly work well together, have mutual respect, but annoy the hell out of each other quite often (will never work as a romantic relationship). ISFJs and ESFJs are more difficult, as they represent social politically correctness that INTJs heavily dislike, and the INTJs may think their logic is backwards. ESFPs are out of the question most of the time, certainly for relationships.. Other SPs are context and personality dependent.

From
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- relationships of other types to INTJs :

INFP - Advisor - each has an area of insight that the other lacks

ESTP - Cohort - mutually drawn into experiential escapades

INFJ - Companion - similar modes of expression: bear each other's company well

INTP - Complement - compatible strengths with opposite emphases

ISFP - Supplement - like Pal, but functions are farther removed: each can add to the other's strengths

ENFJ - Tribesman - share a sense of culture, but with different interests and abilities

ESFP - Anima - fits Dr. Beebe's description of the anima/anumus: each is the other's inferior (4th) function

ENTP - Contrast - point and counterpoint on each function

ESTJ - Counterpart - perform similar functions in totally different realms

ISFJ - Enigma - a puzzle: totally foreign in nearly every facet

INTJ - Identity - same types: a typological mirror-image

ISTJ - Neighbor - arrive at the same place by variant processes

ESFJ - Novelty - intriguingly different: interestingly so

ENTJ - Pal - work and play well together: minimal natural type conflict

ENFP Pedagogue - each is both the other's mentor and student: has a "parent to child" feel

ISTP - Suitemate - a person one might be comfortable sharing an office. Prefer similar climates, but don't necessarily have much in common as far as goals or world view
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Old 07-03-2012, 08:10 PM   #3
Tactical Panda
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A love of drawing is not the same as skill in drawing.
One can enjoy things one is not particularly good at if it isn't intended for others enjoyment.
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Old 07-04-2012, 01:06 AM   #4
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Childhood love of drawing? This is definitely true for me but I've never heard anyone say that about INTJs before. Where did you get that? Also, why is it supposed to wear off?
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Old 07-04-2012, 01:24 AM   #5
Tactical Panda
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  Originally Posted by Collide
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Childhood love of drawing? This is definitely true for me but I've never heard anyone say that about INTJs before. Where did you get that? Also, why is it supposed to wear off?

Does it wear off?
How does one become absolutely certain of it being possessed by all INTJs?

Well, if paper didn't exist that quality would not. However, it is a convenient medium.

"A medium for what?", you may ask. That is the question.

My hunch on the matter came from a combination of MBTI child reports, a study of the nature of Ni and my own experience. In other words, it is a theory rather than a law - but it has done better than many theories thus far, and is of consequence to understanding INTJs.

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Old 07-04-2012, 01:41 AM   #6
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  Originally Posted by Tactical Panda
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Does it wear off?

You said "childhood" so I assumed that because it was specified that it would wear off. I wonder why I haven't seen this attributed to adult INTJs?

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Old 07-04-2012, 01:43 AM   #7
Tactical Panda
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  Originally Posted by Collide
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You said "childhood" so I assumed that because it was specified that it would wear off. I wonder why I haven't seen this attributed to adult INTJs?

Hmm. I intended for it to be interpreted as aquired in childhood.

It may wear off, but it seems like a happier situation if it doesn't.
I still enjoy drawing, even when its part of work and computers get involved.

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Old 07-04-2012, 02:32 AM   #8
SarcasticVlad
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This is the first time I heard about INTJ love of drawing. I thought that was just a personality trait that has nothing to do with MBTI. I do enjoy drawing. When I couldn't focus in school because the class was too boring I'd draw. My books were always covered in doodles. Mostly human-animal hybrids, robots and aliens.
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Old 07-07-2012, 05:36 AM   #9
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Drawing? I suppose that, yes, as a child I enjoyed drawing, or at least that is how I remember it. Honestly I can't even say that I remember a fond time where I was drawing. I suppose I was only trying to express in that way because i liked so many drawings of others. So no, I do not think that I had anything more than an artificial love of drawing, because I had and have the the very true love for drawings, though never those of my own creation. Nowadays I understand completely my ineptitude and no longer even attempt to draw, for I find it to be such an unsatisfying tedium. No, no, I choose instead to "illustrate" my world and my emotional expression through the complexities of English. I find it better, more rigid and systematic, than I find drawing. It is just as mathematics is to me, though with an undeniable level of artistic endeavor, though this is not the driving force. I prefer sciences over mathematics, and the learning of definitions, factual information and concrete results (with the fun being in the analyses) over visually driven things, though those are most certainly appreciated.
Also, the drive to control someone just for the hell of it, or at least one potent process of theirs is something I have done more than once and more often than not I was doing it to satisfy some kind of carnal urge. Oh that and there misery had made me feel temporarily less miserable and out of control.
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Old 07-07-2012, 07:11 AM   #10
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I'm sure every type enjoys drawing for one cog. function reason or another (except STJs, the only dots they connect are bullet points between facts or best fits on a graph ba da dum psh)



As for the thread topic, INTJs are the eye of the storm, to be vague while also metaphorically badass in true MBTI fashion (though I do believe it's a relevant sentiment, you could mellow it out and say INTJs tend to assume position in the eye of a given storm as a typical strategy)

(I could certainly elaborate by inserting the functioning of other MBTI types into the context of a storm for contrast, creating relationships between them and the contextual elements of the storm. I'm sure that would do much in the way of grasping the (unknown to you) big picture that inspired my analogy in the first place (hmm, I must be NJ))
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