[Tocsin]

	Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Its a Japanese term for men who want little from life. Don't care much about money or girls...

Damn.

I thought it was going to be about guys who like to eat bush.

[sunlover]

Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Its a Japanese term for men who want little from life. Don't care much about money or girls. Don't take initiative... like looking pretty. Here's an To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. . One quote: "I don't take initiative with women, I don't talk to them" *blushes* "I'd welcome it if a girl talked to me, but I never take the first step myself." I find this quote funny: "Nowadays, women have more education and enjoy working. Women are scary now" <-- Ha Ha! There's also more talk about openly accepting being sensitive and vulnerable. What actually caught my eye though (apart from the economic effects that large numbers of these people would have, especially in Japan) was: Multiple recent surveys suggest that about 60 percent of young Japanese men — in their 20s and early 30s — identify themselves as herbivores. -- Yikes! Free energy and a bunch of other technological advancements had better come fast, if significant numbers of people no longer feel like being enterprising. An actual failed economy would make for a truly bad punch to the face style, wake-up call from reality. "Hello, this is reality" *shoves katana through man's chest* "You die for being too weak to defend yourself against the product of your actions." *leaves fool bleeding on the ground and walks away* ... On the other hand, if technology advances enough, people and their labor becomes largely redundant anyway, and it no longer matters if these people want to work or breed.

Substitute "INTJ" for herbivore and the quote would be spot on IMO.

[AnnaMolly]

	Originally Posted by eagleseven To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Generally speaking, these herbivore men have low-paying, low-stress jobs. Would you be okay with completely paying for rent, since he can't afford to chip in? You are the breadwinner, after all.

I'd be fine with being the main breadwinner, since I'm likely to have a pretty well paying job in the future. However, I would indeed prefer a partner who also went to university, and who's willing to go to work. If these two criteria are met, I don't care about the rest, or how much money he earns in specific. And I'd much rather have a guy with a low-stress job with mediocre pay who can spend lots of time with me and potential children, than one with a high-strung, high-stress job that earns a lot of money but is stressed out most of the time and rarely has time for anything else.

	Originally Posted by Daniel86 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Slightly OT, but it's odd to me that you joined an INTJ forum if you like emotional men and not unemotional men. Unless you enjoy interacting with people you dislike...

INTJ's not being emotional is a stupid stereotype propogated by kids who think it's super cool to be an emotionless ice cold villain robot. It's simply not true. They're not especially outwardly emotional, but they do have inferior Fi, making them quite sensitive and value-driven.

	Originally Posted by Daniel86 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Secondly, if men and women were the same, wouldn't it be...boring? Women stress me but, I don't wish they were like men. Then we'd all just be friends, there would be no relationship. Where would be the tension? IMO you need both "poles".

No, it wouldn't. I don't need tension, and I don't really understand why some people apparently do.
According to your theory, lesbian or gay relationships wouldn't ever work, then.

	Originally Posted by zibber To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	More'n plenty of us here already.

You're not easy to find.

	Originally Posted by SarcasticVlad To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	In that case the term is just a euphemism for boring losers.

What is boring and loser-like about being in touch with one's feelings and not making power and income the main focus of your life?

[DesertKnight]

I took this article from an objective viewpoint and I did find it quite interesting. I'm taking the stance of this being both positive and negative (as most things usually are). Rejecting the norms of a needlessly difficult and backwards society is a good thing, but the way in which they are doing it seems less than optimal.

I may not know what I'm talking about but it seems to me the Japanese (Asian cultures in general) have a way of taking something much too far and much too seriously and this is kind of heading in that direction. Sometimes this works out well and they excel at ridiculously difficult things to excel at, and sometimes it makes them terrible human beings, all cultures are capable of this of course and I think this is a case of that. They are deciding that the way they have been doing and looking at things was incorrect so they've gone wildly in the other direction as they are prone to do.

Personally I couldn't live my life like that; I have a desire to excel inherent in my nature, I want to fix and create and fight and I couldn't do any of those things without at least a little initiative and motivation. Now whether they lack this from an actual life viewpoint is unknown from the article, simply that their work ethic is changing, that isn't to say their outlook on life is though and I suppose if they still want things from life or want to better themselves then it isn't as doom and gloom as it seems.

I should also note that I don't really care about it one way or the other. Women have been lagging behind men in Asian cultures for much too long in general; having them come up the ladder is more than overdue; what the men do is largely inconsequential as long as someone exists to do the work they don't want to.

[mieu]

grr people who are different than me grr

[zibber]

	Originally Posted by DesertKnight To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Rejecting the norms of a needlessly difficult and backwards society is a good thing, but the way in which they are doing it seems less than optimal.

Sweets Club, man.

Think about Sweets Club.

[DesertKnight]

Another lol, this is a good internet day.

I actually like spicy food over sweets
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
. That is not to say that doesn't sound pretty awesome though.

[Zsych]

On one side there are issues with the Japanese economy contracting (so the women stepping up aren't necessarily enough by themselves). On another is the fact that their gigantic national debt (much like the US) means that they can't afford to become less productive either. It actually has to keep becoming more productive (that's the nature of our economic system - you expand or you die)

When more than a few people make the same kind of choice, its no longer individual freedom, its a social movement... in this case along a direction that Japan may not be able to handle. And the idea that any of us really choose what we think and thus what we think matters a lot, is delusion. We just adapt to our lives. These people are just adapting in a way that's dangerous to their long term welfare.

[Distance]

:shrugs: One of those, if it makes them happy, who cares?

[Zsych]

A crime is basically a behavior that if wide-spread, becomes a detriment to the society. That's what this falls under. Even if they don't individually hurt the country very much (like a thief usually doesn't cause much harm individually), they represent a type of behavior that collectively hurts the country and its future generations, as it becomes more widespread.

[Distance]

To the best of my knowledge, as of yet, Japan hasn't automated its people.

[AlfredSchnittke]

	Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	A crime is basically a behavior that if wide-spread, becomes a detriment to the society. That's what this falls under. Even if they don't individually hurt the country very much (like a thief usually doesn't cause much harm individually), they represent a type of behavior that collectively hurts the country and its future generations, as it becomes more widespread.

What atrocity could fail to be justified by such logic?

[The Dan Keizer]

Hmm I like this herbivorous men idea. Sounds like my kind of life.

[BuShinJu]

And look at your western horizon Japan, that's China, read as big economic and military superpower who may or may not be interested in subsuming declining countries and increase their presence in the Pacific.

I don't think the Chinese have forgiven them for Nanking anyway.

So, what if the whole world is switching to a matriarcal society, women holding the information education and power base.

Things will change but the world will keep turning.

[Lilie]

	Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	A crime is basically a behavior that if wide-spread, becomes a detriment to the society. That's what this falls under. Even if they don't individually hurt the country very much (like a thief usually doesn't cause much harm individually), they represent a type of behavior that collectively hurts the country and its future generations, as it becomes more widespread.

This kind of argument is exactly what they are rebelling against. They are tired of the constant stress of group harmony and nationalism. Economic expansion can't continue forever. It has to stop eventually.

[Oros Ull]

I can’t say I’m too disappointed with this.

I’m not really that interested in effeminate or flamboyant men (or people in general), I find them annoying most to the time, at least those I’ve met. They are high maintenance and unreliable which just irritates me to no end. I won’t try to tell you what your aspirations should be, a minimalistic life style is perfectly fine IMO but when you are too much of a push over to achieve even that much then we have a problem. That has always been my main issue with women as well, unless a person can carry their own weight I don’t want too much to do with them. If they have a legitimate problem that’s one thing but just being a wuss is unacceptable to me.

With all that being said however I do kind of like this idea for the sociological factor. Men acting like women is kind of lame but at least they are setting a new emotional foundation for the future or men. As much as I dislike a sissy I hate the fact that men are considered weak just for wanting to express their emotions from time to time. This sort of thing will hopefully even the playing field a little so that men who are actually well balanced between their physical capability and emotional understanding won’t immediately be deemed as inadequate by default for not being the raging macho meat heads that the current stereotype portrays “Ideal” men as.

Then again this sort of thing is hardly new; there have been extremely successful effeminate men and social constructs all thru history. But current Western and Eastern culture could stand to tone down the testosterone a little and actually think of ways to deal with all the issues they are having instead of just consuming and competing like animals the way they have been for the past century.

Drive, initiative, Strength, ect are intrinsically masculine traits we should do everything in our power to preserve, however reigning victorious through bloodshed over our enemies is hardly the only factor that comes into play when maintaining a society. Most of the more subtle aspects such as philosophy and culture have been drastically overlooked since the dawn of the industrial era; which requires a more patient and reserved (feminine) perspective to solve.

So perhaps the promotion of a poet culture taking the reins wouldn’t be so bad. It’s true that history has shown us that when this happens economic decline is sure to follow. But at the same time the world is at its highest population in recorded history, we have scared the world with war and alienated each other thru technology. So perhaps toning things down a notch and reassessing the way we do things in this radically new world of ours would be in everyone’s best interests, even if it will inevitably lead to good amount of sacrifice.

[zibber]

	Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	A crime is basically a behavior that if wide-spread, becomes a detriment to the society. That's what this falls under. Even if they don't individually hurt the country very much (like a thief usually doesn't cause much harm individually), they represent a type of behavior that collectively hurts the country and its future generations, as it becomes more widespread.

Are you feeling okay? A little light in the head? I think you should lie down and close your eyes for a minute. Put your feet up. Have some chicken soup or something.

[mieu]

	Originally Posted by Zsych To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	A crime is basically a behavior that if wide-spread, becomes a detriment to the society. That's what this falls under. Even if they don't individually hurt the country very much (like a thief usually doesn't cause much harm individually), they represent a type of behavior that collectively hurts the country and its future generations, as it becomes more widespread.

So what's a good punishment for these criminals?

[True Rune]

What's more interesting is that these guys are scorned by most of the women there. Personally, as long as they are good..what cause have I for concern?