My boss lies to my face

**QuantumEnigma** · 05-31-2012, 06:48 PM

What would you do if your boss had told you that you would manage a pending new-hire, and then a few weeks later gets pissed off at you (for saying the truth) and then lists himself as the hiring manager, and denies that there was ever a different arrangement in the first place?

If it is relevant, I've seen him lie to his manager as well, and I suspect he fears my competence. I was hired (by a different person) on the agreement that I would be in charge of any new hires in my area.

**curiousgeorge01** · 05-31-2012, 08:05 PM

Bring it up with his boss and the person who hired you. At least is shows you're interested in doing it whether or not you get to do it this one time.

**MarianasTrench** · 05-31-2012, 08:32 PM

This is not a good situation

**mieu** · 05-31-2012, 08:38 PM

Originally Posted by QuantumEnigma
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What would you do if your boss had told you that you would manage a pending new-hire, and then a few weeks later gets pissed off at you (for saying the truth) and then lists himself as the hiring manager, and denies that there was ever a different arrangement in the first place?

If it is relevant, I've seen him lie to his manager as well, and I suspect he fears my competence. I was hired (by a different person) on the agreement that I would be in charge of any new hires in my area.

If he fears your competence, then it is his call whether or not to give you the opportunity. That's a manager's job--giving you opportunities for advancement that they feel you deserve or can handle. Is there any possibility that your actions have proven that you probably aren't fit for the job of managing another employee? If not, explain, and if so, why are you negating it?

People don't tend to give themselves more work to do (on top of the work they already have) just for funsies. A vindictive person would deny you the opportunity by setting you up to fail, not by making their own life harder.

**stoopidkitty** · 05-31-2012, 08:46 PM

Tell the individual who hired you that your manager is preventing you from doing the job you were hired to do. And/or explain that to your boss's manager as politely as possible. At least let someone know that you're concerned that your manager may be overstepping his boundaries. I think that shows that you're not only adamant about fulfilling your job description, but unwilling to let people step over you. What exactly did you say that pissed him off to begin with? Maybe your manager's decisions are totally justified, and as your manager he has legitimate concerns about your job performance or attitude...

**QuantumEnigma** · 05-31-2012, 08:47 PM

	Originally Posted by mieu To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	If he fears your competence, then it is his call whether or not to give you the opportunity. That's a manager's job. Is there any possibility that your actions have proven that you probably aren't fit for the job of managing another employee? If not, explain, and if so, why are you negating it?

I did not speak clearly -- he is afraid BECAUSE I am competent. It is as if he views me as a threat to his powerbase, rather than an asset.

His stated objection is that he sometimes dislikes my tone, and this leads him to question whether I would be too harsh with a direct report. (He is wrong.)

---------- Post added 05-31-2012 at 08:54 PM ----------

	Originally Posted by curiousgeorge01 To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Bring it up with his boss and the person who hired you. At least is shows you're interested in doing it whether or not you get to do it this one time.

I wrote an email pointing out that he had something very differently a month ago and put his boss on copy, but I think this only fanned the flames. My boss argues very emotionally, he's not interested in logic.

We had a "discussion" today, and I walked away with the distinct impression that if I were very "good" (i.e. kissed his butt) for the next 500 years then maaaaaybe I could have a shot at being an unofficial supervisor.

---------- Post added 05-31-2012 at 09:04 PM ----------

	Originally Posted by stoopidkitty To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	What exactly did you say that pissed him off to begin with?

I told him that I would not participate in fraud.

	Originally Posted by stoopidkitty To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Maybe your manager's decisions are totally justified, and as your manager he has legitimate concerns about your job performance or attitude...

Regarding performance and attitude, he has nothing but praise for my performance. On the attitude front, he feels (incorrectly) that my tone was negative the past two weeks. (In reality it is factual, he simply hates the implications of the particular facts.) He could cite no other complaints - I asked. I also asked for his criteria on me being "ready" to manage - he refused to give any.
Even if he had a legitimate concern, what about the lying aspect? That is what I do not know how to deal with.

**Autumnleaf** · 05-31-2012, 09:56 PM

If he demanded you participate in fraud then you should tell his boss you don't feel comfortable working under such an ethically compromised individual. Unless the whole organization is ethically compromised in which case you're fucked.

**QuantumEnigma** · 05-31-2012, 10:25 PM

	Originally Posted by Autumnleaf To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	Unless the whole organization is ethically compromised in which case you're fucked.

I think you've got it. Interesting that I never saw the obvious - thank you.

**stoopidkitty** · 05-31-2012, 10:29 PM

	Originally Posted by Autumnleaf To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	If he demanded you participate in fraud then you should tell his boss you don't feel comfortable working under such an ethically compromised individual. Unless the whole organization is ethically compromised in which case you're fucked.

^ I agree with this.

Kinda sounds like he backed himself into a corner when you refused to participate, and now it's you against him. He doesn't want you to have any more power than you currently have, because clearly your work ethic/morals outshine his. I think you're right that he perceives you as a threat to his position, and that's exactly what you should be to him and how you should respond.

**stealthfighter** · 06-01-2012, 03:10 AM

In my workplace, our boss is so fond of lying that no one virtually takes her seriously. As far as leadership is concerned, she's an incompetent and lame duck manager anyway so we don't pay much attention.

**FruitLoop** · 06-01-2012, 03:19 AM

Why does it bother you? How does it affect you?

**mieu** · 06-01-2012, 04:46 AM

If you were standing up for ethics then obviously you're doing the right thing, even if it will likely force you to seek employment elsewhere. His reasons for taking the opportunity make sense now. How can the company train new hires if the trainer thinks that the entire operation is a sham? It makes sense to him from a managerial point of view, but it really sounds like you need to get into a place that has harmony with your values.

**Mogura** · 06-01-2012, 04:59 AM

I've been asked to participate in fraud at a couple companies I worked for. Rather than just outright saying, "no," and risk losing your job or (more likely) being sidelined, tell the person you would be more than happy to carry out their nefarious task and request that they e-mail the request to you.

Remember kids, if it's not in writing, it never happened...

**curiousgeorge01** · 06-01-2012, 05:16 AM

Originally Posted by QuantumEnigma
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I wrote an email pointing out that he had something very differently a month ago and put his boss on copy, but I think this only fanned the flames. My boss argues very emotionally, he's not interested in logic.

We had a "discussion" today, and I walked away with the distinct impression that if I were very "good" (i.e. kissed his butt) for the next 500 years then maaaaaybe I could have a shot at being an unofficial supervisor.

I meant as a complaint and not to include your boss on the email.

**themuzicman** · 06-01-2012, 05:19 AM

Originally Posted by QuantumEnigma
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What would you do if your boss had told you that you would manage a pending new-hire, and then a few weeks later gets pissed off at you (for saying the truth) and then lists himself as the hiring manager, and denies that there was ever a different arrangement in the first place?

If it is relevant, I've seen him lie to his manager as well, and I suspect he fears my competence. I was hired (by a different person) on the agreement that I would be in charge of any new hires in my area.

If you have evidence of lying, bring it up. If you don't, find a new job.

**frontaLobotomy** · 06-01-2012, 06:06 AM

Take a recorder with you to every meeting you have with this guy, even group meetings. Binding people to their word is the first step in taking action against crappy bosses.

**Fox** · 06-01-2012, 06:43 AM

A boss that lies? That even happens.

**Dangime** · 06-01-2012, 09:59 AM

Been in this fight before, unfortunately it's usually a losing one.

Let's face it there's a lot of companies out there based on unethical practices. They get away with it because there's a fundamental difference between what's "right" and what's "legal". If the manager really did something illegal and you get it in writing, AND it's not a practice embedded in the company's practices already you're set. If unethical behavior is the norm at the company, you're screwed. You'll be viewed as a disruptive force, be paid lip serviced if you take it higher up, and eventually be placed on the list to get rid of.

05-31-2012, 06:48 PM	#1
QuantumEnigma Member [12%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 487	What would you do if your boss had told you that you would manage a pending new-hire, and then a few weeks later gets pissed off at you (for saying the truth) and then lists himself as the hiring manager, and denies that there was ever a different arrangement in the first place? If it is relevant, I've seen him lie to his manager as well, and I suspect he fears my competence. I was hired (by a different person) on the agreement that I would be in charge of any new hires in my area.
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05-31-2012, 08:05 PM	#2
curiousgeorge01 Core Member [117%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 4,695	Bring it up with his boss and the person who hired you. At least is shows you're interested in doing it whether or not you get to do it this one time.
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05-31-2012, 08:32 PM	#3
MarianasTrench New Member [01%] MBTI: xntx Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 6	This is not a good situation
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05-31-2012, 08:46 PM	#5
stoopidkitty Member [08%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 331	Tell the individual who hired you that your manager is preventing you from doing the job you were hired to do. And/or explain that to your boss's manager as politely as possible. At least let someone know that you're concerned that your manager may be overstepping his boundaries. I think that shows that you're not only adamant about fulfilling your job description, but unwilling to let people step over you. What exactly did you say that pissed him off to begin with? Maybe your manager's decisions are totally justified, and as your manager he has legitimate concerns about your job performance or attitude...
stoopidkitty is offline post a comment

05-31-2012, 09:56 PM	#7
Autumnleaf Core Member [227%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 9,110	If he demanded you participate in fraud then you should tell his boss you don't feel comfortable working under such an ethically compromised individual. Unless the whole organization is ethically compromised in which case you're fucked.
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06-01-2012, 03:10 AM	#10
stealthfighter Veteran Member [84%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 3,394	In my workplace, our boss is so fond of lying that no one virtually takes her seriously. As far as leadership is concerned, she's an incompetent and lame duck manager anyway so we don't pay much attention.
stealthfighter is offline post a comment

06-01-2012, 03:19 AM	#11
FruitLoop Member [12%] MBTI: iNTj Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 488	Why does it bother you? How does it affect you?
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06-01-2012, 04:46 AM	#12
mieu Core Member [183%] $/)^3^(\$ MBTI: xNTx Join Date: Oct 2010 Posts: 7,346	If you were standing up for ethics then obviously you're doing the right thing, even if it will likely force you to seek employment elsewhere. His reasons for taking the opportunity make sense now. How can the company train new hires if the trainer thinks that the entire operation is a sham? It makes sense to him from a managerial point of view, but it really sounds like you need to get into a place that has harmony with your values.
mieu is offline post a comment

06-01-2012, 04:59 AM	#13
Mogura Core Member [175%] MBTI: INFJ Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 7,031	I've been asked to participate in fraud at a couple companies I worked for. Rather than just outright saying, "no," and risk losing your job or (more likely) being sidelined, tell the person you would be more than happy to carry out their nefarious task and request that they e-mail the request to you. Remember kids, if it's not in writing, it never happened...
Mogura is offline post a comment

06-01-2012, 06:06 AM	#16
frontaLobotomy Member [11%] MBTI: INTj Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 453	Take a recorder with you to every meeting you have with this guy, even group meetings. Binding people to their word is the first step in taking action against crappy bosses.
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06-01-2012, 06:43 AM	#17
Fox Member [45%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 1,839	A boss that lies? That even happens.
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06-01-2012, 09:59 AM	#18
Dangime Member [19%] MBTI: INTJ Join Date: May 2012 Posts: 776	Been in this fight before, unfortunately it's usually a losing one. Let's face it there's a lot of companies out there based on unethical practices. They get away with it because there's a fundamental difference between what's "right" and what's "legal". If the manager really did something illegal and you get it in writing, AND it's not a practice embedded in the company's practices already you're set. If unethical behavior is the norm at the company, you're screwed. You'll be viewed as a disruptive force, be paid lip serviced if you take it higher up, and eventually be placed on the list to get rid of.
Dangime is online post a comment