[larrysb]

Something I've been pondering lately is whether the development of a strong preference for introversion and possibly intuition may be a defense mechanism for a highly developed empathic sense?

In a family of origin with a lot of chaotic emotion, anger and consequences of rage, and some violence or abuse and poor emotional boundaries, a child may develop a strong sense of the emotions of others as a survival skill. If a child is constantly in danger of being punished, physically or verbally, depending on the moods and emotional condition of his/her parents, a sensitive and skillful child would develop this empathic sense to cope with the situation. A constant, well tuned and instinctive sense of the emotional state of his family, particularly parents so that he knew when to hide, or make himself known in those moments where his needs might be met.

As the MBTI characteristics are known to mature and gel as children become teenagers, it seems plausible that a child with such a developed sense/skill of empathy would tend to withdraw from others, because the flood of emotions from so many people would simply be overwhelming.

The intuitive sense would also likely become well developed in the same condition of family of origin. The constant need to read under the surface, to compute the intent and condition of the family and parents, rather than trusting the external demeanor as a survival mechanism. This would seem particularly true if the family dynamics are such that sudden fits of rage or anger are common and seemingly appear out of no where, or in the case where a parent perhaps has a mental illness which produces irrational and unpredictable reactions at times.

My hypothesis is that intuitive abilities become developed secondary to and as an enhancement to empathic senses developed at an early age to cope with a chaotic family dynamic. Further, as socialization extends beyond the family group to the child's cohorts, the empathic sense becomes overwhelming and a preference for introversion develops.

[deckard]

	My hypothesis is that intuitive abilities become developed secondary to and as an enhancement to empathic senses developed at an early age to cope with a chaotic family dynamic. Further, as socialization extends beyond the family group to the child's cohorts, the empathic sense becomes overwhelming and a preference for introversion develops.

I could see it in the case of the abused but I was not. At least not by a measure I'd call abuse. My uncles and aunts were given the belt, as were many, if not most of their generation... under the notion of spare the rod spoil the child. They certainly are anything but spoiled. I could not say the same for many people I've known my own age or younger than myself. Sometimes you forget how to ingrain independence if your own parenting approach is constantly brought to your conscious attention with a measure of guilt by the "balanced" outer society. I'd venture to guess there are more dysfunctional families on this planet than there are not. So by whose measure have we decided this is abuse, that is discipline and this is nurturing, healthy care?

My being abused probably came more in the form of school house bullies. Though members of the clique - they saw cause to give me trouble. I fought back in the form of ostracizing them by reducing them to mere Neanderthals with wit and good verbal jibs. That usually wins over a group of hormonally charged "cool kids". And then I could go on about my day. Of course, maybe that's not abuse either but just teenaged competitiveness for the sake of preparing yourself for future fights to come. Most mammals do this.

	...or in the case where a parent perhaps has a mental illness which produces irrational and unpredictable reactions at times.

What does that mean, really? Almost every and any sane person pushed to the brink? Are you a parent? If yes, I doubt you'd say this so casually. Mental stability and parenthood living side by side. Funny stuff. :P

But I get what you're saying.
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[mastermind23]

The intuitive sense would also likely become well developed in the same condition of family of origin. The constant need to read under the surface, to compute the intent and condition of the family and parents, rather than trusting the external demeanor as a survival mechanism. This would seem particularly true if the family dynamics are such that sudden fits of rage or anger are common and seemingly appear out of no where, or in the case where a parent perhaps has a mental illness which produces irrational and unpredictable reactions at times.

Hmm interesting thoery. My own theory regarding the development of 'N' preference goes along the lines that it is developed as a form of escapism from traumatic or otherwise unhappy surroundings...a form of dissociation from the outer world and immersion in the inner world that will compensate for and be a distraction to the chaotic outer circumstance. Going under the blanket of your mind, metaphorically speaking.

	My hypothesis is that intuitive abilities become developed secondary to and as an enhancement to empathic senses developed at an early age to cope with a chaotic family dynamic. Further, as socialization extends beyond the family group to the child's cohorts, the empathic sense becomes overwhelming and a preference for introversion develops.

The extention of developing strong empathetic skills could lead to a preference for 'F' (vs 'T') in the MBTI spectrum - a focus on emotions of both others and oneself develops. But perhaps a counter argument could be made that a 'T' preference develops in this way in order to suppress the overwhelming empathy and to guard oneself emotionally by adopting a rationalising preference, and a cold exterior.

In the case of unhappy surroundings and the disturbance primarily coming from people closest to you (family members), it might lead a person growing up in such an enviroment not to trust in other people and feel that in some sense getting close to people results in 'trouble'...generally immersing oneself with the outer world brings 'trouble'...thus preference for introversion develops.

But these are all just theories...it is anyone's guess as to how any preference develops...

[reckful]

Decades of twin studies have shown that identical twins raised in the same household are no more alike in basic temperament (e.g., introversion or an N preference) than identical twins raised in separate households.

If any theory correlating family environment with temperament only purports to account for certain rare INxx cases with very unusual family circumstances, I assume the twin statistics probably leave room for that. But family environment doesn't account for the vast majority of INxx cases.

It's unclear how much of temperament is genetic (although the twin studies suggest it's somewhere in the neighborhood of half to two-thirds) and how much is "other stuff" -- but, whatever the relevant "other stuff" may be, it's now pretty clear that, generally speaking, how your parents treat you isn't a significant factor.

[larrysb]

Originally Posted by reckful To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Decades of twin studies have shown that identical twins raised in the same household are no more alike in basic temperament (e.g., introversion or an N preference) than identical twins raised in separate households. If any theory correlating family environment with temperament only purports to account for certain rare INxx cases with very unusual family circumstances, I assume the twin statistics probably leave room for that. But family environment doesn't account for the vast majority of INxx cases. It's unclear how much of temperament is genetic (although the twin studies suggest it's somewhere in the neighborhood of half to two-thirds) and how much is "other stuff" -- but, whatever the relevant "other stuff" may be, it's now pretty clear that, generally speaking, how your parents treat you isn't a significant factor.

Curiously, if identical twins are no more alike in temperament, that would suggest NO correlation with genetics, wouldn't it?

I think the problem of being raised in the same household is the assumption that each twin is treated identically. This is never the case, parents do treat their twins differently. A mother has to feed them sequentially, the exact same conditions and words are never spoken to them. It is really impossible to impose a control group in this case. Also, the fact that one twin interacts with the other increases the independent stimuli, leading to further differentiation between the two.

Interesting input on the thread though. Keep it coming.

[reckful]

You misunderstood. It's not that "identical twins are no more alike" than non-identical twins. It's that identical twins raised in the same household are no more alike than identical twins raised in different households. Identical twins raised in various combinations of circumstances are substantially more alike in temperament than non-identical twins raised under the same circumstances -- which is what points to the relatively strong genetic influence.

Also: Although you're certainly right that the "household experience" of two identical twins is going to be somewhat different, that would only lead you to expect that not all the household influences on temperament would be the same -- not that there would be no household influences on temperament that would tend to tug the twins in the same direction (and therefore make twins raised in the same household at least somewhat more alike than twins raised separately).

[Stitch]

Originally Posted by larrysb To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Something I've been pondering lately is whether the development of a strong preference for introversion and possibly intuition may be a defense mechanism for a highly developed empathic sense? In a family of origin with a lot of chaotic emotion, anger and consequences of rage, and some violence or abuse and poor emotional boundaries, a child may develop a strong sense of the emotions of others as a survival skill. If a child is constantly in danger of being punished, physically or verbally, depending on the moods and emotional condition of his/her parents, a sensitive and skillful child would develop this empathic sense to cope with the situation. A constant, well tuned and instinctive sense of the emotional state of his family, particularly parents so that he knew when to hide, or make himself known in those moments where his needs might be met. As the MBTI characteristics are known to mature and gel as children become teenagers, it seems plausible that a child with such a developed sense/skill of empathy would tend to withdraw from others, because the flood of emotions from so many people would simply be overwhelming. The intuitive sense would also likely become well developed in the same condition of family of origin. The constant need to read under the surface, to compute the intent and condition of the family and parents, rather than trusting the external demeanor as a survival mechanism. This would seem particularly true if the family dynamics are such that sudden fits of rage or anger are common and seemingly appear out of no where, or in the case where a parent perhaps has a mental illness which produces irrational and unpredictable reactions at times. My hypothesis is that intuitive abilities become developed secondary to and as an enhancement to empathic senses developed at an early age to cope with a chaotic family dynamic. Further, as socialization extends beyond the family group to the child's cohorts, the empathic sense becomes overwhelming and a preference for introversion develops.

Well i've brought this up about myself in the past. And your theory sounds dead on for me anyway. Though, not abuse. But my parents argued with each other a lot when i was younger. I hated it, hearing them argue, saying things that as a child were just mind boggling. The feelings i got when they argued. So, like you state, i built up this defense mechanism. I "feel" tension. In anyone, people i don't know. Regardless of any front they may have up. I can't be around lots of people because it feels like an emotional flood. I can't stand being around people fighting or arguing. Feeling it drives me crazy and i just want to get away which would relate to the "hiding" that you mention.

[peppermint]

	Originally Posted by larrysb To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
	My hypothesis is that intuitive abilities become developed secondary to and as an enhancement to empathic senses developed at an early age to cope with a chaotic family dynamic. Further, as socialization extends beyond the family group to the child's cohorts, the empathic sense becomes overwhelming and a preference for introversion develops.

I would agree that introversion can be a defense mechanism, but I do not think introversion can be generalized into that. I retreated inward in response to life, but my brother is an extrovert though we shared many of the same experiences. People do whatever they need to do to cope, and one method does not suit all.

[g20]

my experience anecdotal as it may be; I am both an alpha and a middle child, older 1/2 siblings are both Es, my younger sister is far more E than I. grew up in a fairly sheltered and very conservative home. have always been independent but as a child I was very empathetic, started wearing off by at about 7 or so and by my early 20s gone almost entirely to the point I found the circumstances around several deaths I observed to be humorous. extenuating circumstances to be considered; when I was very young my parents were in a severe car accident, my mothers head went through the windshield and part of the long term damage was petit mal seizures, when uncontrolled she clocks in almost 100 an hour, the medication up until a few years ago was as bad as the seizures making her a little slow, well a lot slow.

[Aleksandr]

Though not phyisical abuse, I was raised in a quite high stress situation whereas I was usualy the convienent person to vent on by both my parents verbaly. I do agree that I have became quite attuned to the emotions of people around me, no matter who they may be. Generaly I can tell with little effort what kind of day most extroverts I have never met have had, they project it to everyone around them to the point its almost painfull. Yes, I do also believe that having a thick outer shell you can say helps a lot to block out a lot of the un-needed emotional clutter picked up in your average social situations. I can be verry empathetic at times, usualy involving my few close friends, I can be utterly cold with the flip of a swich it seems as well.

[beav58]

I find your theory to be very interesting. I don't know a lot about the scientific data that would support such theory, however I can see a correlation. I feel my personal experience somewhat resonates your theory, however, I cannot say the same for the rest of my family. As my sister (middle child) got the vast majority of the "abuse" ended up being extroverted. To clarify, the abuse I speak of was mostly verbal abuse, however for both my older sisters, there was some physical abuse however rare. I will say that being introverted did help my older sister (first born) and myself to cope with the difficult situation, as we avoided being a target for the abuse.

I do feel like there is a correlation between abuse and empathy in children. Personally, I believe any child in a situation of abuse would have a greater degree of emotion bubbling out, as you are forced to deal with them at a much earlier age than the average person. For me, I was quite emotional as a child. Still am when my mom crosses that line in conversation. However being independent of her now, it is not as often. I find myself almost stoic in my approach to relationships now, at least at first. Especially when I am in person with someone.

Its hard to say for sure, but I can feel a connection to your theory. Would be interesting to study further if you ask me. Please let me know of any further thoughts you have. I find it fascinating.