Pornography

[Karamazov]

I'm always reminded of the obscenity trial of Larry Flint, at the behest of anti-pornography committee in Ohio, headed by none other than Charles H. Keating Jr (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.). Irony is always amusing.

This was merely a smaller battle against the backdrop of the Miller V. California case (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts._of_the_decision), which concluded that obscenity wasn't protected under the First Amendment, and now the so-called Miller test (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) is used to determine what is or isn't obscene.

So what are your thoughts concerning the proliferation of pornography? Is it responsible for the moral degradation of society, as some have posited? Is it a gateway for more "deviant" behavior?

Have you ever partaken in viewing it? If so, what are your thoughts on that experience, whether in the past or still on going?

[PHS Philip]

My only comment on America's "obscenity" phobia: puritanism is silly.

[muguly]

Naked people are happy people. You don't see too many people arguing and fighting when watching porn either on or off the screen.

[tp6626]

I would add that without clothes and possessions, there appears to be less distinction between social levels / classes. Porn is one of the few things that highlights just how much like animals we really are. Which is fine by me!

[Malotis]

So what are your thoughts concerning the proliferation of pornography?

My thoughts on pornography are the same as everything else; do what you want, just don't infringe the rights of somebody else in the process. If one party wants to supply or produce pornographic material, and another party wants to purchase it, then I believe any or all potential transactions that take place accordingly should be done 100% free of any or all third person parties who view the practice as corrupt or otherwise worth regulating for some "heightened" morale judgment.


Is it responsible for the moral degradation of society, as some have posited? Is it a gateway for more "deviant" behavior??

Pornography is not responsible for the moral degradation of society. If anyone else has posted otherwise then they are straight up morons who should consider hanging themselves.


Have you ever partaken in viewing it?

Of course I have partaken in viewing it. The problem with pornography, however, is that 99.9% of the free stuff online is crap, and the stuff you can pay for isn't much better either. If I'm high, alone, horny, and home, (which unfortunately isn't often) then I may take out some dvd's or otherwise search for something that offers the desired visual images that help get me off (HBO, Showtime, Cinamax, magazines, etc).


If so, what are your thoughts on that experience, whether in the past or still on going?

I find that my thoughts on those experiences are hard to describe unless you can understand the appeal of being high, and more specifically, the appeal of high sex. ;)

[CarolinetheENFP]

haha
i love it!
and i was totally addicted
till i got caught
talk about awkward conversations..

[Colette]

So what are your thoughts concerning the proliferation of pornography? Is it responsible for the moral degradation of society, as some have posited? Is it a gateway for more "deviant" behavior?

I don't think it's responsible for moral degradation, but I would suspect a possible association between a penchant for pornography, and a tendency to objectify sexual partners of that gender (and perhaps that gender generally). People I've talked to who enjoy porn, deny this of course, and say that they can compartmentalise the porn, in relation to real life, healthy relationships, but I do wonder the extent to which this is really true.

Have you ever partaken in viewing it? If so, what are your thoughts on that experience, whether in the past or still on going?

I've seen it, but have no enjoyment of it or wish to partake at all. It's not that I have a moral objection, just that it bores and vaguely disgusts me. I guess I'm basically not turned on by random bodies, divorced from any kind of mind, soul or personality.

[Eric86]

I watch it every now and then, but I do really like it a lot. It's really fun to see.:) (even if all I'm doing is watching it lol) It doesn't make me think any differently of girls than I always have, though.

[Autoptic]

So what are your thoughts concerning the proliferation of pornography? Is it responsible for the moral degradation of society, as some have posited? Is it a gateway for more "deviant" behavior?

Have you ever partaken in viewing it? If so, what are your thoughts on that experience, whether in the past or still on going?

It's human. That depends on the moral system, but the current popular moral system descended from a number of previous moral systems, pretty much all of which would consider their bastard descendant a woefully degraded state. Define deviant, if you mean kinky, yes, from some. All I've ever heard of, having mental issues resulting from it, had preexisting issues. Yes, it's pretty much my only experience as yet but hasn't compelled me into anything stupid. I don't intend to do casual relationships much less treat the female as an object. I've rather had enough of objects because of the porn.

[enWTFp]

Everybody, everybody, everybody... a favourite song by SOAD.

I wouldn't believe any non-ISFJ participant in the discussion if they claim they've never 'touched' this 'issue'.

My personal view is that it doesn't lead us to anything good, but it is inevitable part of our process of imposing the human subconsciousness out in the light of our consciousness. As I said, I don't find anything good in this process, because it is the type of never-ending greedy process like for example the usage of petrol. The more we use, the more we need. We exhaust our own subconsciousness with paralyzing total information (in 1984 style) and it only leaves us emptier and emptier from the inside. We dig deeper in the subconsciousness only to find and create uglier and uglier things there (because that is the natural role of the subconsciousness, and it is needed - it balances out our public sanity). So nothing good comes out of this, we would never 'clear' the ugly side and completely put it into the light, and if we ever succeed we would tear ourselves from half of our own human identity, which I think will affect badly our overall capabilities. The result for now is the increasing amount of 'insane' individuals in the public light.

stasis made a great short comment in another thread, mentioning the loss of innocence for the sake of information. In some sense I talk about the same thing.

I realize this process is irreversible, and I do not fight against the path that humanity walks. I am just a little amused by how much we insist on increasing the speed when it is clear we just do it by force of our own speed now, and not because of any objective (outside of the human society) reasons.

Another song is Stinkfist by Tool, but let's not mention it.

[Autoptic]

You could say the same for the introspection of the first sentient apes. If they stopped, they never would have lost their "simianity" and we would have no humanity. We are just becoming something else, growing pains and all.

[enWTFp]

I agree, let's say I'm allowed to dislike the thing we are becoming, and also I am not convinced anymore that there is any real choice in what we do - humanity as a whole - because the social processes of the group take over. I do not approve the lack of freedom which following the line of progress imposes on us.

From my point of view, people look as some ants on a steep leaf, they have freedom in their individual movements, but as a group they just follow the steep down. And moreover, I do not believe that this is really the optimal path for us. I believe this is the optimal path for nature, with probability to get rid of us. (which leads me to another Tool song - Aenima, but let's not mention it too)

[redbaren]

I look at at porn on a regular basis to relive my pressure, I am under age but I do not care there is no age limit on my right to relive my pressures. I really don't care if people look at it or not, I don't think it should be a forbidden subject when its some thing normal.

[Skatt]

I agree, let's say I'm allowed to dislike the thing we are becoming, and also I am not convinced anymore that there is any real choice in what we do - humanity as a whole - because the social processes of the group take over. I do not approve the lack of freedom which following the line of progress imposes on us.

From my point of view, people look as some ants on a steep leaf, they have freedom in their individual movements, but as a group they just follow the steep down. And moreover, I do not believe that this is really the optimal path for us. I believe this is the optimal path for nature, with probability to get rid of us. (which leads me to another Tool song - Aenima, but let's not mention it too)

That was a remarkably INTJ thing to say, I suppose rather that it's better to say that it just really hit me that ENFPs have the world-view thing too.
Since I was very young I've identified this 'end' of our primal nature. It seems like no matter how smart and organized we get as a whole, we will always remain in our primitive 'tribes with spears' state.
I like porn, I like freedom, I like chaos. I think I've agreed with almost every response on this thread. Not Colette's though, I don't really get where that idea comes from.
Porn works and that makes it good enough for me. I've even heard rumors of it being useful in rehabilitation for sex-offenders, never really looked into that much though.

[Airius]

I enjoy watching pornography. It gives me creative ideas.

[Saint]

Porn is a great for humanity. Socially, it's an incredible tool.

Think about it: With the aide of porn*, lust can be cured with just a hand. (Masturbation.)

Think about that. Seriously. How civilized a society we are to have this! It really is great that we have created such an outlet for our horomes. And it's not to detract from sex, it's simply a substitute when the sex is not available (or at lest that's how porn is used most of the time?).

Degradation of society? What basis is there for such a claim?! What degradation? Is society better off hiding from who we really are? That's nonsense.


* = or really just a good imagination, porn is simply a helper

[Danisty]

Is it responsible for the moral degradation of society, as some have posited?No, people have the desires before they have the porn. Where do you think porn comes from?

Is it a gateway for more "deviant" behavior?What do you consider deviant?

Have you ever partaken in viewing it? If so, what are your thoughts on that experience, whether in the past or still on going?I'm a big fan of porn and I often feel in the minority since I'm a woman. Seriously, I don't know where I'd be without porn. I probably would have gone insane already. Unlike most women, I seem to have a thing for visual stimulation and I don't find porn any more harmful than a romance novel. It's basically the same thing, but targeted at a different audience.

[cncracer]

I am not sure I object to what society see as porn as long as it is an adult and not forced issue. An adult who make porn or watches porn on their own is not a concern to me.
The problem is when it involves minors (a legal issue), or is against a person desires (a personal issue).
The issue on being nude is not porn in my view, this is a fall back on the old religious views which attach our true self image, and is more harmful than porn in my view.

[Henry]

Of course I have partaken in viewing it. The problem with pornography, however, is that 99.9% of the free stuff online is crap, and the stuff you can pay for isn't much better either. If I'm high, alone, horny, and home, (which unfortunately isn't often) then I may take out some dvd's or otherwise search for something that offers the desired visual images that help get me off (HBO, Showtime, Cinamax, magazines, etc).


Not really. Any of the 2.0 type sites offer some exceptional quality videos. Just sort by rating and look over thumbnails for something that fits your fancy.

Regarding whether it leads to degradation, I don't buy it. It may lead to becoming irreligious, but honeslty I've been exposed to porn since I was 12 or so and have not had any significant sexual problems or unethical sexual behavior. I had a few shallow sexual relationships in college, but who doesn't?

The problem is when it involves minors (a legal issue), or is against a person desires (a personal issue).

Of course. Consent in any sexual situation is vital for it to be "ethical", its really the only "ethical" issue out there unless the person is married. A minor can't consent, and of course if someone has delivered a clear "no" and the other party forces then its unethical and criminal. But how much porn really involves either in the age of instant age verification and overwhelming paperwork? Very little.

Drunk consent is still consent, BTW, even when the shallow hag regrets it in the morning.

[Autoptic]

Drunk consent is still consent, BTW, even when the shallow hag regrets it in the morning.

It isn't legally, and last I checked the male is always considered the aggressor even if drunk, so you might want to reconsider a drunk encounter before it happens if you're a male American at least.

[invicta]

I have no problems with pornography, I like the older, more human 70s and 80s pornography, before it went so gonzo.

It's interesting to see what the male psyche finds sexy or arousing in different eras. In the earlier porn it was very straightforward, sometimes simply nude women on film were enough. Just plain sex acts on film seemed to be the entirety of the subject matter in the stag film era.

In the 70s and 80s these films entered the big screen, and the directors would add cute little fantastical stories to them, but still the sexual activity itself was depicted as enjoyable for all involved.

Some of the pornography today is centered around having the women engaged in ever more extreme acts, and there is little to no regard for the sexuality of the woman, the focus seems to me to be more of a frustration relief than a depiction of mutual sexual engagement and enjoyment.

I'd be interested in anyone's thoughts as to why this seems to be, and what is going on socially to produce the change.

[Autoptic]

Some of the pornography today is centered around having the women engaged in ever more extreme acts, and there is little to no regard for the sexuality of the woman, the focus seems to me to be more of a frustration relief than a depiction of mutual sexual engagement and enjoyment.

Why are movies usually about conflict and the bizarre and not peace and banality? It's mundane and boring. It, it's difficulties, and/or it's failures are probably where they got the frustration.

[invicta]

So you think people are less easily sexually entertained now than in the past? I can see that being part of the reason.

[Autoptic]

In the past, few could manage this level of stimulation. Now, every boy with an open internet connection is a virtual Caligula. Do remember all the concubine/sex slave type stuff and straight out prostitution that's gone on since history began. The current Judeo-Christian stuff in the West is relatively new. Hell, the Judaism part of that is particularly laughable considering it's fully admitted history much less any veiled Christian issues.

[invicta]

Oh agreed, on the Judeo-Christian shift, anything since the time of Abraham anyway. I think that this shift plays into the modern extreme porn, in fact. That is what makes the extremism a fantasy.

[tp6626]

I would posit that our desires today are much less extremist or 'depraved' than those throughout history. The only difference today is that our technology enables more effective transmission of these things than was possible in the past.

I'm sure a roman soldier would have thought nothing of raping a woman at the side of the road in broad day light. Had they had the internet back then, he may have posted it to boast of his 'extravagance' to his friends. This could have been a common occurrence. The 'extreme' things that we have today would seem no where near extreme compared to things from the past.

[invicta]

I would posit that our desires today are much less extremist or 'depraved' than those throughout history. The only difference today is that our technology enables more effective transmission of these things than was possible in the past.

I'm sure a roman soldier would have thought nothing of raping a woman at the side of the road in broad day light. Had they had the internet back then, he may have posted it to boast of his 'extravagance' to his friends. This could have been a common occurrence. The 'extreme' things that we have today would seem no where near extreme compared to things from the past.

True. Romans thought nothing of public vomiting either, another feature of todays extreme porn. I don't know if it was considered sexually arousing, but who knows?

In your posit, do you think it's natural for mens sexual desires to be so one-sided, as the rape scenario, and about domination more than mutual pleasure?

[JohnEricMartin]

I used to when I was young. Now I find it disgusting.

[Josh]

Porn is in no way responsible for moral degradation in society. Everyone has their own twisted sexual desires and fantasies (though most will not admit to them,) pornography just gives people a safe and available outlet to express it. And gives one some creative ideas to try out haha.

[tp6626]

In your posit, do you think it's natural for mens sexual desires to be so one-sided, as the rape scenario, and about domination more than mutual pleasure?

I don't think it is natural for men to be one sided like that given our culture now. However in the past this may have been the case (i.e. the culture of domination in Rome), and we have no way of knowing where its headed in the future.

This is to do with women's rights though, about which our consciences have been raised over the past 100 years or so.

Even now, gay rights have been accepted after a long period of repression, but I believe again that Romans didn't frown on homosexuality. So that would suggest that cultural values can go either way, and that we just don't know what the future will hold.

[Autoptic]

I don't think it is natural for men to be one sided like that given our culture now.

I think she meant without cultural programming, delusion, and repression as in nature instead of nurture. If she didn't, I now do.

[tp6626]

If she meant that, its difficult to imagine what we'd be like without those things.

Without those things, could women roam around raping men?

I simply don't know, and wouldn't like to hazard a guess.

[void]

Without those things, could women roam around raping men?

Giggity! [insert Quagmire picture here]

If you took away all the porn on the internet, there would be only one website left and it would be called "Bring back the porn".

[Josh]

^ Agreed haha

The majority of men will always have a natural inclination to be more sexually dominant, just as the majority of women will have the inclination to be sexually submissive.

[invicta]

^ Agreed haha

The majority of men will always have a natural inclination to be more sexually dominant, just as the majority of women will have the inclination to be sexually submissive.

A lot of people feel this way, and you may be right. This I honestly don't know, as far as a natural state is concerned, and assuming there were no fears of pregnancy, or no fears of rearing a child without support. Before the rise of patrilinear family structures there were communal orgies with equal participation.

Males have had, for centuries, the burden of pursuit. I think it is this pursuit, and all the anxiety it entails i.e. fear of rejection that is the root of many fantasies enacted in pornography. Like those plumber meets a hot housewife scenarios.





invicta added to this post, 2 minutes and 9 seconds later...

If she meant that, its difficult to imagine what we'd be like without those things.

Without those things, could women roam around raping men?

I simply don't know, and wouldn't like to hazard a guess.

Yeah it was what I meant, but no worries about guessing what we would be like with no social conditioning. Unless you want to sometime.

I am curious about the core societal undercurrent that surround the extremes in porn that we see today.

[Krazy P]

For men, sexual activity is a health issue. More is better. Prostate cancer is inevitable, but can be postponed by frequent sexual activity. As women age, sex is not as attractive as a frequent activity.

So, pornography stimulates men to keep active (masturbation) and improves their health and survival prospects.

Pretty simple, actually.

Of course, there are costs. How to reconcile the costs (to woman who participate) with the benefits (better health for men) is an open question.

That is how I see it. Men are driven to want to live longer - woman not to be "objectivized".

[Danisty]

Hmm...I'm not sure if I agree. Afterall, women hit their peak quite a bit later than men do.

[LionsPride]

My only annoyance with porn is how poorly it portrays women in the mainstream stuff. Let me rephrase that. How poorly it portrays what women want in bed in the mainstream stuff. I know that much of it is male fantasy, but there are men who 'take notes' and think they are great in bed if they 'do her like a porn movie' and wonder why she doesn't want him to finish on her face because women seem to really enjoy that in the movie. I know that sounds ridiculous, but guys don't want to be bad in the sack and there's a distinct lack of a way to practice with a women so porn sometimes becomes a video instruction tool.

[Autoptic]

People differ. If women watch porn to learn what men like, would that not fail, too?

[Danisty]

My only annoyance with porn is how poorly it portrays women in the mainstream stuff. Let me rephrase that. How poorly it portrays what women want in bed in the mainstream stuff. I know that much of it is male fantasy, but there are men who 'take notes' and think they are great in bed if they 'do her like a porn movie' and wonder why she doesn't want him to finish on her face because women seem to really enjoy that in the movie. I know that sounds ridiculous, but guys don't want to be bad in the sack and there's a distinct lack of a way to practice with a women so porn sometimes becomes a video instruction tool.I really don't think the porn should be blamed for that. If a man wants to know what a woman likes, he can always ask her. There is also a part of the female population that really wants a man to 'do her like a porn movie.' People shouldn't be so afraid of sex that they won't talk to their partner about what they like.

[Josh]

Hmm...I'm not sure if I agree. Afterall, women hit their peak quite a bit later than men do

Just gonna say that danisty.

I really don't think the porn should be blamed for that. If a man wants to know what a woman likes, he can always ask her. There is also a part of the female population that really wants a man to 'do her like a porn movie.' People shouldn't be so afraid of sex that they won't talk to their partner about what they like.

Again my thoughts exactly. People are so embarrassed in bed about telling their partner what they do or don't like. Open communication is definitely the key to great sex.

[xtremegeek]

My only annoyance with porn is how poorly it portrays women in the mainstream stuff. Let me rephrase that. How poorly it portrays what women want in bed in the mainstream stuff. I know that much of it is male fantasy, but there are men who 'take notes' and think they are great in bed if they 'do her like a porn movie' and wonder why she doesn't want him to finish on her face because women seem to really enjoy that in the movie. I know that sounds ridiculous, but guys don't want to be bad in the sack and there's a distinct lack of a way to practice with a women so porn sometimes becomes a video instruction tool.

I'm a woman and I approve this message!

[bucolic_]

What merit do you think there is to the idea that porn may lead to real-life sexual dissatisfaction? Reality not living up to fantasy, and so on.

[void]

What merit do you think there is to the idea that porn may lead to real-life sexual dissatisfaction? Reality not living up to fantasy, and so on.

I can attest to this. Asian tranny goat porn differs considerably from its real-life counterpart.

Crap. I've said too much.

[Josh]

rofl

[Henry]

It isn't legally, and last I checked the male is always considered the aggressor even if drunk, so you might want to reconsider a drunk encounter before it happens if you're a male American at least.

I'm well aware that some states apply this. I think its complete bullshit. Hence the comment.

[Airius]

My only annoyance with porn is how poorly it portrays women in the mainstream stuff. Let me rephrase that. How poorly it portrays what women want in bed in the mainstream stuff. I know that much of it is male fantasy, but there are men who 'take notes' and think they are great in bed if they 'do her like a porn movie' and wonder why she doesn't want him to finish on her face because women seem to really enjoy that in the movie. I know that sounds ridiculous, but guys don't want to be bad in the sack and there's a distinct lack of a way to practice with a women so porn sometimes becomes a video instruction tool.


Maybe off subject but I don't understand the appeal of facials. :huh:

[Autoptic]

I'm pretty sure it's just a dominance behavior. The face is a protected location, thus the appeal of spitting in someone's face in anger.

[vad1981]

Porn = cool
Watching porn by yourself = not cool
talking about porn on the internet = kinda not cool
watching other people watch porn = cool
having sex while watching porn = cool

facials = "man power?" = turn off for me too though....

[Thrifty]

I'm pretty sure it's just a dominance behavior. The face is a protected location, thus the appeal of spitting in someone's face in anger.

Not necessarily. It might just be the inconvenience that is having to scrub the floor later.

[Antares]

I can't stand porn, but I don't think we should stop anyone with the proper maturity watching it. I'm not big on sex, especially graphical sex.

[Dreamer]

I see no problem with pornography or most sexual activities which deviate from community standards('cept for child pornography). I think that most taboos surrounding sexuality have bases in "cultural morality"(that is, "Community standards" or popular opinion) rather than actual,pratical morality(survival of the species/the group/etc). What does porn do to hurt society? Nothing!

It is one of the few things I am quite liberal on.

Does it encourage more "deviant" activities? Of course! Some people do "upgrade" from porn to strippers to BDSM,etc. The different gay groups in the US incited groups like NAMBLA to form.

But then so does freedom of speech... A victimless activity should not be banned on the false premise that it *might* encourage crime. Live dangerously!

As for my experiences with pornography, I've been watching it since I was twelve. The "centerfold syndrome" certainly is true and I've been trying to move away from it (and from porn). It motivates me to work on social skills basically...

I prefer to do my own porn movies!

The advantages of course that I have no desire to permenantly settle down with anybody. That's equal more freedom for yours,truly.

[mmm7789]

I have seen a variety of porn over 30 years. I don't think it ever helped anyone in any meaningful way, and I believe it has probably hurt many people, in small or large ways. While many claim it is a victimless crime, I know that sex with strangers was rare, or more rare, then than now. Is it because of porn? TV? The internet? Birth control pills? I wonder, rarely, how do people who watch a lot of porn, or those who make it, really feel? Are they really just like everybody else? I don't think so, I think it's like an alcoholic, in denial, insisting "everyone else drinks this much, so it's ok". We, INTJ's, know that's a crock, we don't drink that much, and we don't watch that much porn.
Just because everybody else does it doesn't make it ok, especially for us, and everybody else may not be doing that anyway, it might just be the media, saying it. (off topic example of media hype - clinton democrats are going to cause big trouble at the convention)

[Autoptic]

You're against birth control pills?! Talk about causing problems.

Edit:bloody typos, contracted the phrase into one word and still continued

[void]

You're against bill control pills?! Talk about causing problems.

Exactly what I was thinking. It leads to runaway inflation (in my pants).

[Danisty]

Does it encourage more "deviant" activities? Of course! Some people do "upgrade" from porn to strippers to BDSM,etc.I don't know that this is really an "upgrade" syndrome. Why is it not simply possible that people watched porn and saw new ideas that they might have liked anyway but weren't exposed to before the porn? I'm trying to figure out why this is seen as some sort of bad thing. If I watch the food network and see some recipes I've never tried before and I decide to make them, does this mean the food network has caused me to upgrade?

I have seen a variety of porn over 30 years. I don't think it ever helped anyone in any meaningful way, and I believe it has probably hurt many people, in small or large ways. While many claim it is a victimless crime, I know that sex with strangers was rare, or more rare, then than now. Is it because of porn? TV? The internet? Birth control pills? I wonder, rarely, how do people who watch a lot of porn, or those who make it, really feel? Are they really just like everybody else? I don't think so, I think it's like an alcoholic, in denial, insisting "everyone else drinks this much, so it's ok". We, INTJ's, know that's a crock, we don't drink that much, and we don't watch that much porn.
Just because everybody else does it doesn't make it ok, especially for us, and everybody else may not be doing that anyway, it might just be the media, saying it. (off topic example of media hype - clinton democrats are going to cause big trouble at the convention)That sure is a lot of generalizations and assumptions. It must be convenient to denounce everyone who disagrees with you as being in denial.

[mmm7789]

I agree that there are a lot of generalizations and assumptions in my post. I don't know any statistics about any of the things I mentioned, and I'm not interested enough in porn to go look them up. I also should have a better quantification of "some" and "a lot" I disagree that I'm denouncing anyone, obviously I see some porn or I wouldn't have been watching for thirty years, I'm just asking questions, is it porn? Is it really a problem? Is it something else? I think "denounce" is a bit strong, and I am ABSOLUTLEY in favor of ALL forms of birth control, at ALL times, although most men seem to balk at wearing a condom 24/7. (do I have to put LOL?)

As far as the denial part, I should have made that more clear. I don't mean it about porn or drinking, I mean about anything and INTJ's, just because everybody else does it, doesn't mean its ok. Just because "everyone" watches American Idol, doesn't mean me, either.

Also, please, no one, ever, take anything I post as anything attacking, unless it's about child abuse or neglect. I am new here, and my debate and discussion skills have atrophied. To many Sundays spending 45 minutes discussing "Cornbread or Biscuits?"
while trying not to choke MIL. I deserve a Medal for that.

[cncracer]

I think pornography and its growth (especially in the US) relates to the restrictive values system we were raised with. I worked many years overseas (Europe and Asia) where sex was not such a taboo. I was also a child of the 60’s; which has given me many liberal ideas regarding sex. These exposures I think are why I am not attracted to porn as much as I am to something like this forum. I look at some things as just not porn (nudity) and others as criminal (child sex, rape, forced sex of any type) the rest is just a form of entertainment and if it is nothing new it is not going to keep my attention very long.

[True Rune]

I've never wanted to watch porn, but I've been around where people have put it on. Well, I'd leave the room then, but I've seen little things of it and it grosses me out. I think it has had an effect on society, and it has not been a good one. It ruins relationships and people become addicted to it. I guess from an atheistic viewpoint it's just like any other addiction, but I'm not an atheist. I guess this issue is sort of hard for me because I'm different.

[MindOverMatter]

Doesn't matter as long as no parties rights were infringed. As for the "degradation of society" I think people have the urge for sex well before viewing porno and is a benefit to society because the urge is released in a way which doesn't harm anyone.