Polling day tomorrow: Obama or McCain?

[Colette]

Josh has a thread for discussion on this, but to test the thesis that INTJs are more conservative, I thought I'd do a quick straw poll. I'm only giving two choices (i.e. there isn't a "neither" choice), so if you vote you have to pick one.

[Avid]

I wish I could be a part of your poll but because of moral obligations I can't bring myself to. Both of these candidates flip flop around more than grounded fish and their policy ideas suck. I'd go with Barr even though I don't like him either since his past voting record is trash. He says he has changed but really he is just riding the Ron Paul train. I don't want him elected but at least the libertarian party would have a chance of getting 10% and maybe become a 3rd party as I believe this 2 party system is failing us and more options is never a bad thing. Not that our vote counts that much since its up to the electoral college anyway. They only vote for the states best interests though...

[Colette]

Well I watched part of the Democratic convention, and I reckon it rivalled the Olympic opening ceremony for pomp and splendour. Obama sounded entirely presidential, and suitably humble to boot. Can you imagine anything McCain could come up with beat that unforgettable Obama line?:

"This election's not about me, it's about YOU"

OK he may not have written it, but he said it, and he said it like he really meant it :)

[Motor Jax]

i'm voting Obama...

i'm not for the reasoning that i just want to see a black man in office, but rather i think he is pretty reasonable and seems to get things done

last year, i thought he would have flounder... but he managed to stay concentrated and keep his cool... i think he will do good under pressure...


heh, electorial college... << i don't trust them...

[Snowdragon]

Obama/Biden.












On the plus side, that bat Katherine Harris isn't around to mess up the votes like she did in 2000.

[void]

Barack Hussein Obama bin Biden. "POW POW POW" doesn't stand a chance in a policy comparison. Unfortunately, policy is the last thing the voting population cares about.

[Avid]

Barack Hussein Obama bin Biden. This made me laugh so hard I cant believe I missed that. /wins thread

[void]

This made me laugh so hard I cant believe I missed that. /wins thread

The phrase was coined at Fark, merely minutes after Obama announced his VP selection. I'm sure you have also heard other (inane) references such as, The One, The Messiah, Obamessiah, B. Hussein O., half-honkey-all-donkey, etc.

[Colette]

Barack Hussein Obama bin Biden. "POW POW POW" doesn't stand a chance in a policy comparison. Unfortunately, policy is the last thing the voting population cares about.

And why exactly is that? He has more clearly articulated policy settings in areas such as the war in Iraq, economic policy, tax cuts, and mortgage assistance, than McCain, who is often vague and hedging his bets when questioned about policy in these areas. But I suppose it's more fun to mock his name and alleged 'associations' than engage in actual debate.

[PHS Philip]

And why exactly is that? He has more clearly articulated policy settings in areas such as the war in Iraq, economic policy, tax cuts, and mortgage assistance, than McCain, who is often vague and hedging his bets when questioned about policy in these areas. But I suppose it's more fun to mock his name and alleged 'associations' than engage in actual debate.

Er, he was making fun of both of them. Mostly McCain, I think.

[void]

And why exactly is that? He has more clearly articulated policy settings in areas such as the war in Iraq, economic policy, tax cuts, and mortgage assistance, than McCain, who is often vague and hedging his bets when questioned about policy in these areas. But I suppose it's more fun to mock his name and alleged 'associations' than engage in actual debate.

You misread my post. I meant exactly what you stated here, and the phrase was not meant to mock him - I just find it humorous. Plus it scares the brainwashed morons who are convinced beyond all logic and reason that Obama is a "sekrit Mooslim!!1" (something like 12% according to a recent survey).

EDIT: "POW POW POW" refers to McCain, of course, since he has been using that tired excuse to avoid answering tough questions.

EDIT 2: I was wrong about the "19% believe he is Muslim" - it's was 12% (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) in mid-July.

[Colette]

You misread my post. I meant exactly what you stated here, and the phrase was not meant to mock him - I just find it humorous. Plus it scares the brainwashed morons who are convinced beyond all logic and reason that Obama is a "sekrit Mooslim!!1" (something like 19% according to a recent survey).

EDIT: "POW POW POW" refers to McCain, of course, since he has been using that tired excuse to avoid answering tough questions.

Oh well sorry if I misunderstood - I'm hoping that dumb book by arch conservartive David Freddoso (the same author whose malicious diatribe scuppered Kerry's chances in the 2004) campaign, isn't going to take hold and sway voters' opinions in the way the Kerry book did. I'd like to think the average American is smarter than that.

I'm pretty concerned about McCain's recently stated economic policies. If (as seems likely) the key to an economic revival in the US is a federal bailout of Fanny and Freddie, then I fail to see how McCain's policies of:

* making Bush's tax cuts for high income earners permanent;
* attempting to balance the budget;
*reducing the corporate tax rate from 35% to 25%;
* ultimate privatisation of Fanny and Freddie (imo likely to diminish overseas investor confidence in the medium term, rather than restore it)

can result in the kind of economic revival and return to world economic confidence, that Americans clearly want to see happen.

I think McCain lacks experience and depth of understanding of economic issues, and so I hope that if he is elected, his administration has the sense to confine itself to setting the broad framework for economic revival; leaving the details of how it's to be achieved to the talented and experienced Treasury secretary, Hank Paulson.

I'm also concerned about his flip-flops on key policy issues during the course of this year, when it became apparent that his stated positions left him vulnerable to distancing parts of his core constituency. Offshore drilling is one example of this, as is his about face on support for congress's 'bailout' bill.

[void]

... I'd like to think the average American is smarter than that.

2000 and 2004 proved otherwise.

I'm pretty concerned about McCain's recently stated economic policies ... I think McCain lacks experience and depth of understanding of economic issues, and so I hope that if he is elected, his administration has the sense to confine itself to setting the broad framework for economic revival; leaving the details of how it's to be achieved to the talented and experienced Treasury secretary, Hank Paulson.

McCain has confessed (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) to not having much knowledge of basic economics. But I do think his handlers will ensure he doesn't have much say in setting economic policy. Large corporations would not want to see their investment in the GOP go down the tubes by allowing him to be at the helm.

I'm also concerned about his flip-flops on key policy issues during the course of this year, when it became apparent that his stated positions left him vulnerable to distancing parts of his core constituency. Offshore drilling is one example of this, as is his about face on support for congress's 'bailout' bill.

Flip-flops and politicians are inseparable. Obama has also flip-flopped (retroactive telco immunity vote, faith-based initiatives), but McCain is still a much fuzzier pander-bear.

[chegra]

I think the reason INTJ are voting for obama is because of their demographics.

They college educated. 37% of the gifted society is made up of INTJ.

Generally most NT would vote obama, or rather most N.
But the world is dominated by S.

[bladeserver]

Colette wrote:

I think McCain lacks experience and depth of understanding of economic issues, and so I hope that if he is elected, his administration has the sense to confine itself to setting the broad framework for economic revival; leaving the details of how it's to be achieved to the talented and experienced Treasury secretary, Hank Paulson.

That was meant to be a joke right?

I have heard Hank described in many ways recently but nobody, before now, has used the words talented and experienced.

[kimsaid]

The nominal corporate tax rate is 35% but the actual tax rate when loopholes and credits are included is an average of 9% - the lowest in industrialized countries. When you say flip-flops on key policy issues please be specific. What was the original policy position, what is the new policy position and what is the explanation (if there is one) that is used as reasoning for the change. Some of this stuff sounds like the crazies who aren't taking their medication on other websites. I know this forum is much better than that.

[superjo562]

im no conservative. obamarama ftw

[Colette]

I have heard Hank described in many ways recently but nobody, before now, has used the words talented and experienced.

Elaborate? From what I've read he's been able to bring his strong relational and dealmaking skills from Goldman Sachs to the table in his role as Treasurer; and in dealing with a factious and divided Congress. I can only go on what I read, and from the perspective of an 'outsider' (i.e. a non US resident). If he's poorly regarded there, I'd be interested to know why and by whom.

[Antares]

I can't vote for McCain due to his domestic/personal policies. I have a problem with the pro-life camp and generally with anyone who doesn't know his constitution enough to know that America is not a Christian nation.

"I would probably have to say yes, that the Constitution established the United States of America as a Christian nation."

--John McCain interview with Beliefnet.com, September 2007.

I must admit though. He's one of the sanest Republicans around.

[HeyZeus]

I prefer Obama. McCain's "bomb, bomb Iran" misadventure was so gross on so many levels. That joke is DOA everywhere except the VFW, and justifiably aliented millions of Iranians who may be looking for common ground with the west. The day I heard that pathetic, dated attempt at humor (who is the target demographic for that--referring to a 60's Beach Boys song while prescribing bombing of Iran? Attempt at playful unilateralism?), McCain's candidacy became immediately unviable, and he, not up for the task of head diplomat. Our differences are with the clerics and Ahmadinejad...not the average Iranian.

[azelismia]

Obama, I don't particularly like him but he's much much better than mccain and soccermom with a tude...

[TheLastMohican]

Obama, I don't particularly like him but he's much much better than mccain and soccermom with a tude...

That's hockey mom with a 'tude.

[Henry]

Josh has a thread for discussion on this, but to test the thesis that INTJs are more conservative, I thought I'd do a quick straw poll. I'm only giving two choices (i.e. there isn't a "neither" choice), so if you vote you have to pick one.

McCain by a decent margin now, although the trailor-trash Palin trick will backfire over the next 2 months if Obama has the balls to call McCain on it.

[Jakalwarrior]

I'm still hoping they will both drop out of the race due to personal reasons or something.

"Barrack Obama and Senator McCain have become quite close on the campaign trail as what started as a strong rivalry ended in the bedroom. The two presidential hopefuls spent several hours collaborating on a joint operation to be reffered to as 'Brokeback Hill'"

In the mean time I will keep praying to the FSM to choke the two party system with a noodly appendage.

[TheLastMohican]

LOL
Where did you get that?

[Jakalwarrior]

LOL
Where did you get that?

Lack of sleep corrupts my sense of humor and makes me say weird things. My other thought involved a debate interrupted by a meteor... but the goon squad might get me for that one! so I went with hoping they become lovers instead. Happy endings are always the better solution right? To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

[xtremegeek]

I can't help but feel that to vote for Obama is voting for his assassination. I believe he's the better candidate, but if he gets into office then the same republican thugs who took out Kennedy will try to do the same to Obama. It's just a feeling I have in the pit of my stomach.

Has anyone else on the forum considered this possibility?

[Synamon]

I assume Islamic terrorists will be gunning for whoever wins. Cheery thought. Makes the choice of VP just a tad more important these days don't you think?

[TheLastMohican]

I can't help but feel that to vote for Obama is voting for his assassination. I believe he's the better candidate, but if he gets into office then the same republican thugs who took out Kennedy will try to do the same to Obama. It's just a feeling I have in the pit of my stomach.

Has anyone else on the forum considered this possibility?

Within the United States, there does seem to be more Obama hatred than McCain hatred. (There is also far more Obama worship, but the haters are the ones who assassinate.) Therefore he is at more risk of being assassinated by a paranoid/irate Republican. On the other hand, McCain is at a much greater risk of being assassinated by a Muslim activist, since there is a strong trend in favor of Obama among Islamic militants. With our modern quality of Secret Service, it is hard to say which breed of assassin would have a better shot of success. The Muslim(s) would have more funding and better equipment, but the Republican(s) would have more natural accessibility due to lack of profiling.

[wunderkind]

I must admit though. He's one of the sanest Republicans around.

I think this is very true.

I can't help but feel that to vote for Obama is voting for his assassination. I believe he's the better candidate, but if he gets into office then the same republican thugs who took out Kennedy will try to do the same to Obama. It's just a feeling I have in the pit of my stomach.

Has anyone else on the forum considered this possibility?

For sure Obama is aware that his candidacy makes him possible assassination target and he takes the risk. However, I don`t think it is more dangerous job for Obama as for McCain or someone else. I think this should not be taken into consideration by voters as candidate accepts all risks of the office.

I don`t think Obama is perfect but would prefer him.

[void]

Half of the American public has had more than enough motivation to assassinate GWB in the past 8 years, and that (fortunately) has not happened. Obama will be fine. Especially considering the massive increase in federal surveillance initiated by the current administration.

[tp6626]

I voted Obama, and have two observations to make.

1. I feel as if other countries should have a say / vote in the outcome, seeing as it is going to greatly affect many many countries.

2. If this talk of assassination by republicans is an actual threat, then doesn't that illustrate a sombre point when you compare 'glorious America' to a number of African and Middle Eastern countries that America supposedly is 'more civilised' than. It would make me thing that America is as bad as any of these extremist countries if it were to happen, whilst being highly hypocritical at the same time.

[Tenacious B]

1. I feel as if other countries should have a say / vote in the outcome, seeing as it is going to greatly affect many many countries.
And of course, Americans will have a vote in the elections of other nations.


The only reason the US elections affect other nations is because other nations allow the US to do so. If the citizens of other nations do not want their governments to go along with US policy all they have to do is vote for someone who won't go along with US policy.

[Henry]

I can't help but feel that to vote for Obama is voting for his assassination. I believe he's the better candidate, but if he gets into office then the same republican thugs who took out Kennedy will try to do the same to Obama. It's just a feeling I have in the pit of my stomach.

Has anyone else on the forum considered this possibility?

Well its either Obama, who I consider an above-average candidate on key attributes of intelligence and inegrity, or the "Open Borders, Closed Legs, lolwut" team, so I'm voting Obama.

[Colette]

I voted Obama, and have two observations to make.

1. I feel as if other countries should have a say / vote in the outcome, seeing as it is going to greatly affect many many countries.


A global postal ballot? Hmm...wonder exactly how long it would take to get a clear election result under that system? :)

[tp6626]

A global postal ballot? Hmm...wonder exactly how long it would take to get a clear election result under that system? :)

It wouldn't matter anyhow if the presidency is just gonna be stolen again like last time.

[DrEast]

I can't help but feel that to vote for Obama is voting for his assassination. I believe he's the better candidate, but if he gets into office then the same republican thugs who took out Kennedy will try to do the same to Obama. It's just a feeling I have in the pit of my stomach.

Has anyone else on the forum considered this possibility?

Kennedy's assassination led to LBJ's term, during which more Democratic policy initiatives were instituted than under the reign of any president since FDR, and any president since. His Great Society initiatives are, like the New Deal, almost all still with us in some form or another. And even he couldn't, or wouldn't, end the war in Vietnam.

The thugs (sic) who took out Kennedy may well have been Republican. I don't know. But if they were classic conservatives they were only shooting themselves in the foot.