Glossolalia: Nonsense or Divine Communication?

[Airius]

To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.



The passionate, sometimes rhythmic, language-like patter that pours forth from religious people who “speak in tongues” reflects a state of mental possession, many of them say. Now they have some neuroscience to back them up. --

A Neuroscientific Look at Speaking in Tongues (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.)




Inspired from some of the religious threads.
This particular subject has been racking my brain for a while, and without bias, I haven't drawn any conclusions from what I've read or seen. So I'll just provide what I've found.

Have any of you experienced glossolalia?
What are your thoughts on it?

[NephilimAzrael]

Very interesting. Some may say that scientific study and religion don't mix, I would be pleased to see the reactions that this may receive. It seems from that article that the active process is consiered by the experienced to be somewhat automated, but as is the norm, it must be activated by some form of process (neurological principles). It is most definitely not a divine communication, unless it is the inner realm of consciousness that is this divinity one is communicating with.

The article also mentioned the neurophysiology of meditation, so for comparison, here is a link to an article regarding meditation by Dr C.S. Shah (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.)

[Tocsin]

Ms. Morgan, a co-author of the study, was also a research subject. She is a born-again Christian who says she considers the ability to speak in tongues a gift.

The results of the study might have seemed more credible if it wasn't so obvious that one of the authors has an obvious bias.

[Monte314]

The results of the study might have seemed more credible if it wasn't so obvious that one of the authors has an obvious bias.

Oh, yes... they should all have a negative bias if they want to get the "right" result.

[PHS Philip]

Oh, yes... they should all have a negative bias if they want to get the "right" result.

Monte, isn't the point of experimental science that you try to prove the claim wrong, not right? Neutral, in terms of an experiment, means that the expectation is that your hypothesis is wrong, I thought?

[Monte314]

Monte, isn't the point of experimental science that you try to prove the claim wrong, not right? Neutral, in terms of an experiment, means that the expectation is that your hypothesis is wrong, I thought?

Yes, you are right: the goal of such studies is to reject the null hypothesis.

I was objecting to the insinuation that persons-of-faith are less credible researchers because of their faith. Would this writer have felt, for example, that research about the mental health of atheists would be more credible if conducted by theists? I suspect not.

[Airius]

I don't believe that one persons' religion in the study would have a significant effect on the group's findings. The credibility of the results is not lost in me.

[PHS Philip]

Yes, you are right: the goal of such studies is to refute the null hypothesis.

I was objecting to the insinuation that persons-of-faith are less credible researchers because of their faith. Would this writer have felt, for example, that research about the mental health of atheists would be more credible if conducted by theists? I suspect not.

Ok, that makes more sense.

It's also worth mentioning that the researcher didn't try to hide her bias. A disclosed bias is almost always less bad than an undisclosed one, because it shows that the researcher is at least conscious of it, and probably tried to keep it out of the work as much as possible (no one can entirely eliminate their biases from their work, but you can do a better or worse job of it).

[cal]

I have a serious born again friend who's talked tongues for some years. He seems to get something from it. At least he believes he does. Maybe he does.

But he also used to make some prophecies at times, and sometimes still does. His success rate hasn't been great. But he's just one example.

I should maybe also add that my friend has people who at times interpret what he says. He's also not given to lying, that I know of. I believe he believes what he says. I sometimes just don't know if what he believes is true.

[Monte314]

As to the question around which this thread is based: maybe it's nonsense AND divine communication... in the same sense as any encrypted message.

[PHS Philip]

As to the question around which this thread is based: maybe it's nonsense AND divine communication... in the same sense as any encrypted message.

Pi contains a message, type of thing? ;)

[Monte314]

Pi contains a message, type of thing? ;)

Sort of, but a message in pi would clearly be addressed to the whole universe.

[It is an interesting fact, by the way, that given a sufficiently long burst of "white noise", and any finite length message you want, I can create a "decrypter" that will find that message in the noise. So, don't be surprised when someone discovers a "message from God" in pi... it's gonna' happen eventually.]

The Apostle Paul says that a statement in "tongues" is only understood by those whom God has gifted to understand such. It is not expected that one giving the message knows what it means.

Such a message could be personal in nature, suitable to the need of the moment. Paul says that in a public meeting, if there is no one present who has this interpretative gift, then tongues shouldn't be spoken out to the whole assembly, but should be spoken "to himself and to God", e.g., quietly like a private prayer.

The Bible does not teach that such utterances are authoritative. They are to be judged by the hearers in light of what The Scriptures say.

[PHS Philip]

Sort of, but a message in pi would clearly be addressed to the whole universe.

[It is an interesting fact, by the way, that given a sufficiently long burst of "white noise", and any finite length message you want, I can create a "decrypter" that will find that message in the noise. So, don't be surprised when someone discovers a "message from God" in pi... it's gonna' happen eventually.]

Yeah, that was what I was making the joke about. Infinite random series are fun.