Changing laws to accommodate people from overseas

[SiMey]

I can understand that when a family or cultural group moves to another country, they bring their culture, norms, traditions and values with them.

I've also heard and experienced the "frozen culture" for some adults, in that they take a snap shot of their country of origin with them. Parents act as if that is how things are in that country, even 20 years later, as they have not had the opportunity to change and grow with that culture. Going back to a country of origin after such a long time can be a culture shock. Kids born in the new country can be caught between two sets of cultural expectations.

Can anyone help me understand why you would move to a country with different cultural values and laws to your own and then expect that country to change?

Is it about escaping violence, poverty and political instability as a priority and then a late reaction to the realities of being in a new country where you just didn't think these issues through before hand?

[Mozzes]

I can understand that when a family or cultural group moves to another country, they bring their culture, norms, traditions and values with them.

I've also heard and experienced the "frozen culture" for some adults, in that they take a snap shot of their country of origin with them. Parents act as if that is how things are in that country, even 20 years later, as they have not had the opportunity to change and grow with that culture. Going back to a country of origin after such a long time can be a culture shock. Kids born in the new country can be caught between two sets of cultural expectations.

Can anyone help me understand why you would move to a country with different cultural values and laws to your own and then expect that country to change?

Is it about escaping violence, poverty and political instability as a priority and then a late reaction to the realities of being in a new country where you just didn't think these issues through before hand?

Probably it's not the culture they're seeking to escape from it's poor economics or political instability.

"Changing laws to accommodate people from overseas" - could you explain what you mean by this? Maybe provide some examples.

[SiMey]

Yeah I'm probabky a bit vague on what I mean.

I've read stuff about recognising Sharia law? Is there room for that in your country?

"Sharia law refers to a set of non-static laws set out to govern life for Muslims. It sets out to follow the example of God on Earth.

All aspects of life, including worship, marriage, charity and exchange of money, is covered by Sharia law.

Sharia law details rule of dress for men and women, and requires women to dress 'modestly'. How this is interpreted differs from country to country, and village to village.

Drinking alcohol is banned under Sharia law, as is eating pork, or purposely eating non-Halal meat."

"The actual term "Sharia" means "path to a watering hole". Just as water sustains life, supporters of Sharia law argue their system sustains spiritual life.

Western critics of Sharia often accuse the customs of being harsh and draconian, but for many Muslims, it is an ordained by the Prophet and sets a clear example of how they should be leading their lives.

Many of the punishments required by Sharia that are deemed cruel and/or excessive by Western societies - so called Hadd punishments - are in fact relatively rare. Supporters of Sharia law claim the vast majority of criminal cases eschew these harsh penalties after all surrounding circumstances have been recorded.

Recent cases, such as of the young Saudi rape victim sentenced to lashings and jail for breaking the country's strict segregation laws, have thrust Sharia law into the headlines."

[Tenacious B]

I think that if you move to a different country it should be because you want to become a member of that nation and live by its guidelines. If the ways of your home country are so great, why leave?

I wouldn't go to a very different country, say Saudi Arabia, and expect them to start doing things as we do in America or even speak to me in English.

When in Rome, as the say...

[zibber]

It's a sticky, context sensitive issue. In my eyes, the safest general statement I feel I can make is that there should always be room for ethnic communities (like your Chinatowns) with some level of autonomy, as long as the constitution of whatever country they're in isn't neglected. No beating homos to death, if you will.

The sharia stories are used by the extreme right in Holland to pander to nationalists/xenophobes, which is unfortunate. How did you hear about it?

[scholarwarrior]

May be far right xenophobes, but that doesn't mean they don't have a perspective to learn from anyway. Besides, far right in a country like Holland is probably not that shocking to those in the States.
Agree with her or not, might be helpful to read 'Infidel' by Ayaan Hirsi Ali. She may be on the right, but hard to call her a xenophobe since she's from Ethiopia. Of course its biased, as is any story, but there is something to take away from it.
countries with sharia law are just one example anyway. it will always be hard to adjust to a very different culture. It means different values which are tough to change, no matter where you're from or where you're going to.

[Erika Redmark]

The thing is that they expect the new country to adapt to them. I heard that in Britain (sometime last year?), some Muslims had complained about a stuffed animal of Piglet, from Winnie-the-Pooh, that was in a store window, and how it was "offensive" to them. And more recently I read a news article about cashiers who won't ring up alcohol purchases, and they have to get another cashier over there to do it for them. I thought it didn't matter as long as they weren't the ones actually consuming the beer or pork or whatever? What do they care if people who don't even belong to their religion don't follow their religion? That's what I don't get.

[Shakyamuni]

Canada is a multicultural country. What does this mean? It means (in my jaded view) that we have no national identity or culture. Instead the country has attempted to become a conglomeration of ethnic groups which lacks any unifying culture. Canada is a country of first generation immigrants. As such, government policy has attempted to please the electorate. For example, there has been controversy over Sikh's being allowed to wear Turbans in the RCMP (national police force), and not having to ride motorcycles with a helmet, being allowed to carry around ceremonial daggers etc etc.

Canada bends over backwards to accommodate special interest groups. In my opinion the government has gone too far, and it has simply become a matter of riding the high horse of the so called "moral" political left that hides behind the charade of equality.

[SiMey]

I recently read about polygamy, in that in some countries while in may not be legal, if the marriage occurred in a country where the marriage was legally recognised, the marriage may still be recognised in the new country the couple (triple?) moved to.

I guess the other way around that is just to live defacto with lots of wives? Nothing usually would prevent that.

I was just interested in whether people had come across this issue much.

Also related is the issue of recognising tribal laws of indigenous people. Would you accept some groups instead of going to jail, for example, spearing each other in the leg?

[tehinternetsgam]

If you move to a country, then you choose to abide by that countries laws. If you don't like the laws, then don't move there... Or... Fight to have the laws changed for everyone, which should, in a working democratic system, require a consensus of opinion on the law change.

So, in that sense, fighting to have Sharia law recognized is the Muslim's right, if they're citizens... But it's also other citizens rights to tell the Muslim's where to shove their Sharia law. If that's the consensus opinion, so be it.

Being an atheist, I can say with a fair degree of certainty that there's not a pigs chance in hell that I'll ever respect Sharia law within the public domain. If I ever go to a Muslim's house or mosque (or country), then maybe I will.

[walfin]

If I ever go to a Muslim's house or mosque (or country), then maybe I will.
Shhh...don't ever tell them that lest someone chops off your hand if you take an apple you're not supposed to.
Sorry. Couldn't resist.

[Erika Redmark]

So, in that sense, fighting to have Sharia law recognized is the Muslim's right, if they're citizens... But it's also other citizens rights to tell the Muslim's where to shove their Sharia law. If that's the consensus opinion, so be it.

Oh, they couldn't tell them that…that would be "insensitive". Even if it is the consensus opinion, it's not likely to seem that way, since most people don't want to be branded as bigots.

[tehinternetsgam]

Oh, they couldn't tell them that…that would be "insensitive". Even if it is the consensus opinion, it's not likely to seem that way, since most people don't want to be branded as bigots.

That is indeed a problem. The major issue here is political correctness. A lot of people seem all too happy to shovel away their own rights in order to appear nice. And there are plenty of others who are quite happy to abuse this weakness for their own gain. People suck.

Shhh...don't ever tell them that lest someone chops off your hand if you take an apple you're not supposed to.
Sorry. Couldn't resist.

Haha, yeah. I was kinda thinking that when I wrote it. But it's all good; there's not much chance of me ever visiting a mosque or Muslim nation. Although at the rate we're going half the countries we consider 'western' will be Muslim in a few decades anyway.

[SiMey]

Although at the rate we're going half the countries we consider 'western' will be Muslim in a few decades anyway.

This will indeed be interesting in the future if through population migration some countries may have different majorities in future.

Will the country and culture change the people or will the people change the culture and laws in future?

[konec]

This will indeed be interesting in the future if through population migration some countries may have different majorities in future.

Will the country and culture change the people or will the people change the culture and laws in future?

Both probably.

[Erika Redmark]

I'm thinking more the latter. With birth rates as they are, the ethnic/cultural balances will change dramatically in the next couple of generations, and who knows what will happen?