ISTJ? INTJ? INTP?

[ssrprotege]

I know a member wrote something like this, but I would like to find out as well, because some of my friends actually identify me as an ISTJ. There are various "theories": an ISTJ? an INTP? an INTJ? I will a bit of what I was like both when I was in Korea and am in Canada.

(Warning: this thread is disorganized and long. Sorry for my terrible organizational skills.)

To find out what I was like, I asked my parents as well. Some events that happened when I was a kid. Basically, I showed talent in math (and did well throughout high school years without studying much), and scored high on most of the aptitude test subjects but did poorly when the aptitude test had to do with interpersonal/social skills. My parents told me that I asked "why" questions a lot. It seems I was quite a curious boy.

My socializing experience was quite awkward. I tried (hard) to go talk to my classmates, but later I somehow find out that they do not like me. This always puzzled me because I found none of my remarks would ever offend anyone. I still have these conflicts; if I have, I tend to logically explain why it was inappropriate for me to say something. (Sorry, couldn't think of any example)

I have always liked being alone, but I don't think I liked reading books that much, somehow. I was (and am) pretty creative, as I remember I loved fantasizing about what I would put in my time capsule if I were to have one. I do live in my own head. I find myself naturally constantly thinking about something. I can't make it stop; for this reason I frequently forget instructions my parents gave and even where I put my things.

A bit of talk about my learning and/or reading style. My learning style both reflects the Sensing style and the Intuitive style. I strive to get the general principle behind it, but I am very detail-oriented as well. I believe that to get a good big picture, details must be settled down as well.

When it comes to reality, I tend to be dismissive of reality, as reality exists for the future. I do not believe in "the art of living in present"; rather, I am the one who prepares for the future or reflects past experiences.

The general description of the Sensates is that they do not like taking risks. It heavily depends on what it is about. I am a great intellectual risk taker - I love going to the library and picking random books that seem to interest me. But I take no risks in fiscal matters.

In terms of joke, I do a lot of puns and word-plays. I have a wide range of jokes, but most jokes are concerned with finding the connections between unrelated subjects.

I am curious. I am open-minded to other ideas - but only when it comes to my interest (namely philosophy, psychology, math, Uncertainty Principle, cryptography, classical music). My two closest friends are interested in technology, such as computer, weapons, nuclear bombs, robotics, and certain areas in physics, which I have little interest in. Occasionally, they seem to think I am not quite open-minded and am satisfied with having familiar knowledge. I remember just saying "ok, so what?" when they tried to get me talk with "technologies."

I think I talked enough about the S and N dichotomy. It comes down to the J-and-P preference - I generally find this the most unclear preference.

I can be a planner, especially when it comes to something that requires deadline. I started studying for my IB exams (in May) on March, and I started writing for my college application essays on August. Most assignments I begin early and expect to finish them before the deadline so that I can concentrate on my inner-self enrichment (e.g. reading, listening to music, researching or just daydreaming/thinking i.e. relaxing). I am by no means a last-minute person. I am very inflexible and can become disgruntled when there is a sudden interruption in my plan.

Yet, my indecisiveness and rebelliousness cancel out my J preference. When I am asked to decide between two things, I tend to think so much that I find it difficult which to choose. For instance, when I went to the store to buy a CD and find two great CDs (but only have money to buy one), I hesitate for quite a lengthy period. In most cases, I do not remember making a clear-cut decision. My parents frequently accused me of being too wishy-washy. Also, I believe the convention primarily exists to be questioned. For instance, I don't blindly take what the teachers say. I once remember nit-picking every detail with my teacher when I had disagreements on the dictions in my essay. Oh, and I should say this as well: I am not a planner when it comes to my personal lives and/or personal satisfaction. I can be quite impulsive when it comes to my personal stuff. My room is always disorganized (hence frequently being scolded).

I myself think I am not an ISTJ; but I cannot decide between INTJ and INTP. If this thread is too difficult to read due to its organization, I will make a bit of revision if you want. :)

To answer eggs' question:
I am a bit of both. When it comes to my inner nourishment (projects that I self-start, I mean), I think I feel excited to start the projects. If not all, 50% of those "inner-self" projects I finish. Regarding other projects I feel very good when I finish the projects.

[eggs]

Do you like starting projects or finishing projects?

[Elfrun]

No offence meant, but is your lack of concern in other peoples interests selfishness?

You don't really sound INTJ to me.

Have you done this test (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.), I'd be interested in your results just to rule out possibilities cause your description sounds a little like Asperger syndrome?!?

[Marcus]

You humor seems to be more ISTJ than INTJ. In my experience, ISTJ makes word-plays and puns, INTJ makes sarcasms and pretends.

These descriptions I found to be the most useful:
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[Freak]

I tend to think that you sound ISTJ to me

I would suggest you take this test and then figure it out...
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....you might find out yourself as an ISTJ:idea:

[sriv]

That's odd. I don't think you are ISTJ at all. ISTJ are very grounded and are by no means detached.

Like Freak, I would suggest going to cognitive processes.

INTJ - Ni, Te, Fi, Se
INTP - Ti, Ne, Si, Fe

Are you more interested in understanding than doing?
The clearest differences arise between Ni vs Ne and Fi vs Fe.
Ni's are more abstract in thought - detached from reality, Ne's are looking for patterns in the world around them.
As you age, do you find that you are more and more expressive of emotion or have more and more internal emotion?

[ssrprotege]

No offence meant, but is your lack of concern in other peoples interests selfishness?

You don't really sound INTJ to me.

Have you done this test (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.), I'd be interested in your results just to rule out possibilities cause your description sounds a little like Asperger syndrome?!?

I did a test before, and I got "You are likely an Aspie"
And I don't think it's my selfishness; it's rather that I just don't understand...I think you know what I mean.

Thank you for your insight....Especially, I score high on the Intelligent - Aspie category



ssrprotege added to this post, 5 minutes and 38 seconds later...

I tend to think that you sound ISTJ to me

I would suggest you take this test and then figure it out...
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

....you might find out yourself as an ISTJ:idea:

That's odd. I don't think you are ISTJ at all. ISTJ are very grounded and are by no means detached.

Like Freak, I would suggest going to cognitive processes.

INTJ - Ni, Te, Fi, Se
INTP - Ti, Ne, Si, Fe

Are you more interested in understanding than doing?
The clearest differences arise between Ni vs Ne and Fi vs Fe.
Ni's are more abstract in thought - detached from reality, Ne's are looking for patterns in the world around them.
As you age, do you find that you are more and more expressive of emotion or have more and more internal emotion?

Oh yes, I did those. Depending on my interpretations, the results were slightly different. Yet, the general results I got:

Se: unused / limited use
Si: limited or good use
Ne: excellent use
Ni: excellent use
Te: good or excellent use
Ti: excellent use
Fe: unused (every time I get this)
Fi: good or excellent use

This does suggest that I am either INTJ or INTP. And I am definitely Fi, because I tend to be introspective when it comes to feelings. I find expressing feelings very awkward. Ni and Ne, I can use both quite flexibly, but I score slightly high in Ni.

And I assume my writing style sounds like an ISTJ? Yet, my personality doesn't. ISTJ has great respect towards the authority, but I show my respect towards the authority only when what they do seems rational. Also, I hate repetitions and hate being in the rut (i.e. using my "established skills" every day in the job), it just sounds too boring to me. I like using untested ideas and taking risks. I do not think this sounds Guardian at all.

I think INTJ's do (witty) word-plays and puns as well?

I’m not the idea person, but if I have experience I will give my opinion about how I think it should be done. If it’s new, I am very much apt to sit back and take it all in and sit on it and think about it. I try to catch myself, but it’s so unnatural for me to see the good side of things, and turning around my perspective takes a lot out of me. I want a rock-solid case for why I feel the way I do. A lot of my ideas are very practical, not theoretical—the down-to-earth stuff people really need to know. Sometimes when people don’t see my point, I tend to withdraw or stand back.

Partially describes me, actually. But my ideas are not practical at all; it's rather theoretical (down-to-earth is not in my list). "I'm not the idea person": depends on the subjects, but I feel more excited when ideas are concerned.

I can’t stand people who don’t care for others, who are irresponsible or rude, who shoot their mouth off without knowing what they are talking about or who don’t do what they are supposed to do and want something for nothing.

Not quite: I just don't care and walk off when I see someone like this. Or I ten d to just zone out. :p

I get up in the morning and do my routine. And I take time at the end of each day to try to plan what’s happening the next day, what I’m going to be working on first, second, third, and so on through out the day, to eliminate the unexpected. Sometimes I might carry a book or something in case I have to wait somewhere. That makes life easy and full. Stability is important to me and change may not be that easy, but variety is good too. I seek advice when I need to change.

Stability<Change/Unexpected, when my personal life is concerned. When I deal with the outer world, I don't necessarily like changes. The routine and plan part doesn't necessarily describe me.

[sriv]

Se: unused / limited use
Si: limited or good use
Ne: excellent use
Ni: excellent use
Te: good or excellent use
Ti: excellent use
Fe: unused (every time I get this)
Fi: good or excellent use

This does suggest that I am either INTJ or INTP. And I am definitely Fi, because I tend to be introspective when it comes to feelings. I find expressing feelings very awkward. Ni and Ne, I can use both quite flexibly, but I score slightly high in Ni.


Your results seem somewhat exaggerated.
I'll ask you the same question I asked PRBori:
Describe your dominant (or not?) Ni in your own words. Don't go out and do research; I want an intuitive answer.

[ssrprotege]

No worry sriv, if I do research, that means I may know myself less than accurately, which I don't really want. Anyway, here's my answer:

I think Ni is intuition, or my inner voice. I think it's incorporating what's going on in my brain (generally applied to ideas, as you suggested) to obtain a flash insight ('Oh, right!' feeling). That's the very first idea that comes up to my mind.

I think I experienced this Ni - if my definition is 'correct' - especially while I study science. At first, it didn't make any sense, but after being stressed out and taking a bit of rest and looking back, everything makes sense in a flash second. That's what happened to me while I was studying for the IB exams...anyhow, that's my answer. I don't think I gave the sufficient answer...but I did my best to verbalize my understanding..

Just another idea that popped out of my brain. How about this: the "umpp" feeling function. Of course, all of a sudden.

[sriv]

No worry sriv, if I do research, that means I may not know myself less than accurately, which I don't really want. Anyway, here's my answer:

I think Ni is intuition, or my inner voice. I think it's incorporating what's going on in my brain (generally applied to ideas, as you suggested) to obtain a flash insight ('Oh, right!' feeling). That's the very first idea that comes up to my mind.

I think I experienced this Ni - if my definition is 'correct' - especially while I study science. At first, it didn't make any sense, but after being stressed out and taking a bit of rest and looking back, everything makes sense in a flash second. That's what happened to me while I was studying for the IB exams...anyhow, that's my answer. I don't think I gave the sufficient answer...but I did my best to verbalize my understanding..

Good answer. According to your description, I would conclude you are an INTJ.

[Elfrun]

You’ve successfully confused me ssr!

I can see INTJ and INTP from your second post and your comment about hating reputation does not fit in with Aspergers. Do the following things fit?
 repetitive routines or rituals
 peculiarities in speech and language, such as speaking in an overly formal manner or in a monotone, or taking figures of speech literally
 socially and emotionally inappropriate behaviour and the inability to interact successfully with peers
 problems with non-verbal communication, including the restricted use of gestures, limited or inappropriate facial expressions, or a peculiar, stiff gaze
 clumsy and uncoordinated motor movements
 abnormal eye contact
 aloofness
 the failure to turn when called by name
 the failure to use gestures to point or show
 a lack of interactive play
 a lack of interest in peers

If they don’t I’m thinking INTP, but that’s just a suspicion, I’m by no means certain!

INTP types are quiet, thoughtful, analytical individuals who don't mind spending long periods of time on their own, working through problems and forming solutions. They are very curious about systems and how things work, and are frequently found in careers such as science, architecture and law. INTPs tend to be less at ease in social situations and the "caring professions," although they enjoy the company of those who share their interests. They also tend to be impatient with the bureaucracy, rigid hierarchies, and politics prevalent in many professions, preferring to work informally with others as equals

*By the way, I’m super impressed with the fact that you start projects early, that kind of discipline always blows me away mostly because I’m very much a last minute person :rolleyes:

[ssrprotege]

You’ve successfully confused me ssr!

'succesfully'? Sarcasm?! Anyway, I don't mind clearing up for you :)


I can see INTJ and INTP from your second post and your comment about hating reputation does not fit in with Aspergers. Do the following things fit?
 repetitive routines or rituals
Perhaps you meant "repetition" here. I don't think I am obsessive with repetitive "routines" or "rituals." My overall structure of life is pretty unchanging, though, and I don't mind it. But some 'small' changes I need, or it will be boring.


 peculiarities in speech and language, such as speaking in an overly formal manner or in a monotone, or taking figures of speech literally

Somewhat, actually, I was told by some people that I tend to speak in a formal manner. Nothing more. That I love using metaphors in speech means that I don't take figures of speech literally.


 socially and emotionally inappropriate behaviour and the inability to interact successfully with peers
Yes, that describes me. "emotionally" maybe, but "socially" very true...


 problems with non-verbal communication, including the restricted use of gestures, limited or inappropriate facial expressions, or a peculiar, stiff gaze

Partially, I am horrible at reading facial expressions. Stiff...yes, to some extent.


 clumsy and uncoordinated motor movements

Uh-huh, as a result PE was the most horrible time in my school.


 abnormal eye contact

I have hard time making eye contacts when I speak.


 aloofness

Totally describes me.



 the failure to turn when called by name

Only when I am deeply immersed in thought i.e. zoned out


 the failure to use gestures to point or show

Not sure about this one...


 a lack of interactive play
 a lack of interest in peers

If they don’t I’m thinking INTP, but that’s just a suspicion, I’m by no means certain!
I am highly independent, so the first one is true. I have little interest in peers, that's very true as well. Except one or two friends, most of them approached to me and I became friends with them.



*By the way, I’m super impressed with the fact that you start projects early, that kind of discipline always blows me away mostly because I’m very much a last minute person :rolleyes:
Starting projects early and getting it out of my mind seem to come to me naturally. My mother was a compulsive early-starter, and my father is a compulsive planner (very, very strong J). I think this one is independent of my inherent types; it has to do with my parents' influence....

But some days later I may have to be a 'last-minute' person. I have been studying for upcoming physics exams, and after they are done, I have to go back to read my books....and I have to return those books to the library soon.......:rolleyes:

Where is this from?

INTP types are quiet, thoughtful, analytical individuals who don't mind spending long periods of time on their own, working through problems and forming solutions.
Yes!
They are very curious about systems and how things work, and are frequently found in careers such as science, architecture and law.
True as well!
INTPs tend to be less at ease in social situations and the "caring professions," although they enjoy the company of those who share their interests.
Rings very true to me.

They also tend to be impatient with the bureaucracy, rigid hierarchies, and politics prevalent in many professions, preferring to work informally with others as equals.
Ah, bureaucracy, hierarchies, politics.....will strangle me, that's true.

So the difference between INTJ and INTP is that the former can work within the bureaucratic system and the latter cannot?

But I don't think Ti is my dominant function. If you ask me to intuitively define "Introverted Thinking," (as sriv asked me to define Ni) I don't think I will be able to do it.....

[Elfrun]

'successfully'? Sarcasm?!

Nope, more like serious humour ;)


The list was a basic checklist for Aspergers, obviously I can’t say that’s you because I only know you’re writing but because of how many you could relate to it might be worth checking out, in my opinion the main difference that people with Aspergers face is the inability to naturally understand social norms but techniques can be learnt so it’s not so frustrating dealing with other peoples reactions.

There are a number of people around this forum who either state they have Aspergers or can relate, for me I know a couple of people IRL with the syndrome and I can definitely see similarities between them and me and I’m 100% certain that I don’t have it, I just think the INTx temperaments can relate. Either way that’s up to you to see if it fits.

The quote about INTP's was actually from Wikipedia. Check out the full description of the INTP (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) and INTJ (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) if you like. Another website I stumbled across that might help compare the types is socionics (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.).

So the difference between INTJ and INTP is that the former can work within the bureaucratic system and the latter cannot?

Actually INTJ’s are not great with authority either, we’re inclined to challenge what we don’t see as logically correct regardless of rank or tradition. The main difference I see is that INTP's are motivated to action by changes in a situation while INTJ's are motivated to action by the decisions they make in regards that change. Here's a some differences according to socionics.

Perceiving
• act impulsively following the situation
• can start many things at once without finishing them properly
• prefer to have freedom from obligations
• are curious and like a fresh look at things
• work productivity depends on their mood
• often act without any preparation

Judging
• do not like to leave unanswered questions
• plan work ahead and tend to finish it
• do not like to change their decisions
• have relatively stable workability
• easily follow rules and discipline

But I don't think Ti is my dominant function. If you ask me to intuitively define "Introverted Thinking," I don't think I will be able to do it.....

In the INTP, the dominant function, as with all introverts, is introverted. As introverted Thinkers, INTPs spend the majority of their time and energy putting order to the interior, logical world of principles and generalizations in an effort to understand. Introverted Thinking is cool, articulate, and aware of the forces that bind reality together

I take the approach that individually the letters are interesting and insightful enough but to accurately type someone you need to consider the whole picture, the interrelationship between the four types is more important then any individual function. The MBTI is based on how an individual thinks and feels, I don’t know how anyone other than myself does this all I know is how someone behaves and what they say so ultimately your opinion is the only one that matters, we’ll help give you incite but the correct typing can only be achieved by you. Personally using a combination of Myers Briggs and the Kiersey model I'm still inclined to suggest you're INTP but you tell me :)

[ssrprotege]

The quote about INTP's was actually from Wikipedia. Check out the full description of the INTP (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) and INTJ (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) if you like. Another website I stumbled across that might help compare the types is socionics (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.).


Oh yes, I stumbled upon the socionics site, but it's pretty messy in that there is a "J/P switch." I have troubles with those. In one sec, I would say "why not, makes sense" and then in one sec, I would think "No, I don't get it." I ended up just thinking those as two independent....personality type system.


Actually INTJ’s are not great with authority either, we’re inclined to challenge what we don’t see as logically correct regardless of rank or tradition. The main difference I see is that INTP's are motivated to action by changes in a situation while INTJ's are motivated to action by the decisions they make in regards that change. Here's a some differences according to socionics.

Yes, that's what I thought, but I inferred that you said I am a P because I don't necessarily obey the authority...

Thank you for the list...I already saw it..but let's see...
I will look at these based on how I deal with external world..


Perceiving
1. act impulsively following the situation
2. can start many things at once without finishing them properly
3. prefer to have freedom from obligations
4. are curious and like a fresh look at things
5. work productivity depends on their mood
6. often act without any preparation


Not true: 1, 2, 4 (only when I am interested in certain subjects!), 5, 6
True: 3


Judging
1. do not like to leave unanswered questions
2. plan work ahead and tend to finish it
3. do not like to change their decisions
4. have relatively stable workability
5. easily follow rules and discipline


Mostly true, but not extremely. I can follow rules and disciplines, only if those are sensible to me.

It pretty much says the same thing as MBTI! How come they get switched? This keeps messing me up.


I take the approach that individually the letters are interesting and insightful enough but to accurately type someone you need to consider the whole picture, the interrelationship between the four types is more important then any individual function.

Agreed. It's the interactions that are very important...

The MBTI is based on how an individual thinks and feels, I don’t know how anyone other than myself does this all I know is how someone behaves and what they say so ultimately your opinion is the only one that matters, we’ll help give you insight but the correct typing can only be achieved by you. Personally using a combination of Myers Briggs and the Keirsey model I'm still inclined to suggest you're INTP but you tell me :)

I identify myself as a J (so when my entirely personal stuff matters, I act like a P, as MBTI suggests). Problem here, though: I don't think I am the one who are obsessive with applying my knowledge for practical applications. Knowing and musing about knowledge is good enough for me. Just knowing it is good enough for me! INTJ's have to use their knowledge, or their Te will be wasted pretty much. That doesn't fit me, but I don't feel logic is my primary function...as I consider myself that I use an 'irrational' function quite often..

[Elfrun]

Oh yes, I stumbled upon the socionics site, but it's pretty messy in that there is a "J/P switch." I have troubles with those. In one sec, I would say "why not, makes sense" and then in one sec, I would think "No, I don't get it." I ended up just thinking those as two independent....personality type system.

I feel ya, very hard to navigate, some interesting information hidden away though! The switch you suggested would be fantastic :thumbsup:

Yes, that's what I thought, but I inferred that you said I am a P because I don't necessarily obey the authority...

Nope, just cut and pasted a whole section for you to see if it fit.


It pretty much says the same thing as MBTI! How come they get switched? This keeps messing me up.

It get's switched? :huh:


I identify myself as a J (so when my entirely personal stuff matters, I act like a P, as MBTI suggests). Problem here, though: I don't think I am the one who are obsessive with applying my knowledge for practical applications. Knowing and musing about knowledge is good enough for me. Just knowing it is good enough for me! INTJ's have to use their knowledge, or their Te will be wasted pretty much. That doesn't fit me, but I don't feel logic is my primary function...as I consider myself that I use an 'irrational' function quite often..

Now do you see why you confused me :p

[ssrprotege]

It get's switched? :huh:

Kind of. INTJ in MBTI = INTp in socionics
INTj in socionics = INTP in MBTI

I don't think they should be switched, but when it comes to descriptions, they really look switched. Check this out:

Click ! (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.)

Wikisocion: J/P Switch (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.)

The switch happens to introverts. No wonder introverts are harder to "read."


Now do you see why you confused me :p

Mhm, the four letters and the combinations don't go along....I know. Acting like a Judger but when it comes to interactions behaving more like an INTP....
That's why my Fourth Letter was always the problem for me. Maybe I don't know myself well enough. :huh::embarassed:

[Elfrun]

Mm-kay, terrible link to use then! I'll have to check it out more.

[ssrprotege]

Mm-kay, terrible link to use then! I'll have to check it out more.

Are you talking about Socionics site?

I know some people say socionics is a BS (and socionics people accuse MBTI) because of the J/P switch mess. I try not to be biased, because socionics do shed interesting side of Self (like, hidden agenda thing. And it also shows your subconscious Self more successfully than MBTI, which mostly deals with conscious part of Self.). So, you should be careful not to be confused with MBTI when you look at socionics.

Anyhow, interesting to see that Socionics is based on Kepinski's, Jung's, and Freud's theories. Kepinski criticized Jung, Jung criticized Freud, and Freud criticized Jung. Yet those theories merge to make another personality type theory system. It's fascinating, really. Just that these 'conflicts' (Between MBTI and socionics) are problematic. ;)

[Elfrun]

Yep, the link wasn't on purpose, I didn't pay enough attention to it. I've never really paid much attention to socionics in general actually, my preference is MBTI & Keirsey, I guess there are a lot of different and valid opinions out there. It’s funny how they all get melded to become something else!

[Amonite]

You are likely an INTP. My bio is very similar. I did very well in school with minimal need to study, entering contests and the like, and was valedictorian - but I had only a few select friends. Even those friendships were not very deep. In general I was not popular, but could not explain why. (Although one girl helpfully told me I gave off a vibe, because I was very confident in my abilities and moral compass, that "I thought I was better than everyone else").

Once out of highschool I did make more friends, and learn how to socialize - but it helped that I took some psychology classes and joined theater. I still have difficulty forming deep friendships, but I can 'mimic' proper social behavior well enough that I fit in. {So many unwritten social codes!}.

I also both the big picture (Concept/idea) and zooming in on the details. The step-by-step process from the big picture to the details I am -not- good at. This obsession with details is to the point of perfectionism - I find a hard time coming up for air when I am working on a project. (Or a forum post). It never seems 'done' to me. I want to re-edit. However, I love to brainstorm new concepts.

I can plan expertly/efficiently when there is a deadline or responsibility - but if there is no deadline I am horrible at self-management. I plan 'enough time' for a project. Often this is towards the last minute, but I can work quickly, and I work the best under pressure. I never wait until there isn't enough time.

I am horrible at making deciscions - etc.

I highly doubt you are an ISTJ. They tend to be very conventional/rule oriented, and at the very least, love structure and order. Also, while this is only from my own observations of adult INTJs and ISTJs, ISTJs "fit in" a lot better. While they are introverted, others tend to accept them and enjoy their company. INTJs are very "hit and miss" for people. They tend to have a few people who "get" them and think they are awesome (cause they are), and then the rest sit there going ????? They can be very popular in the right group mix, though.

As for deciding between INTJ and INTP:
You could try thinking back to before you were twelve. What was your sense of humor like then? Your like of routine vs. flexibility? (The INTJ's I have personally known have had some very set routines and personal tastes. I don't mind routine, but I don't "Set it up" for myself or choose to do the same thing the same way - I prefer trying new things).

[Palladium]

Admittedly did not read the entire thread but you seem INTP.

[leadthebest]

The difference between INTJ and INTP:

INTJ: Whether you listen or not I am going to say it anyway. I don't really care (unless you are close to me) what you think of my statement. I usually dress the same way for the same occasion, and for some INTJs they try to look better than the rest.

INTP: If you are not going to listen to me, I won't share what I am thinking with you anyway. I don't have a rigid style of dress.

That's how I usually differentiate the two. BTW, I am doing IB :D (May 2013)

---------- Post added 03-18-2013 at 12:30 PM ----------

BTW read the descriptions on each INTJ and INTP. You can find them on the web. Whichever one fits you is probably your personality

[babsa]

This does suggest that I am either INTJ or INTP. And I am definitely Fi, because I tend to be introspective when it comes to feelings. I find expressing feelings very awkward.

This does not mean you are Fi; functions work in different ways with different types. An INTP will not express his or her feelings in the same manner an INFJ would.

[Distance]

An INTP will not express his or her feelingsThis is all you need to express. :p

[davai]

This is all you need to express.

Yeah, if he wanted to purposely confuse the OP.

It's fairly easy to elicit emotion from an INTP IRL, but most of it spills out on it's own. The observations made by jndiii, Scorpiomover, and Thod among others in this thread (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) are pretty good.

[Distance]

Yeah, if he wanted to purposely confuse the OP.Did you notice the date of the OP? It's almost five years old. I suspect the OP has long figured out his type.

It's fairly easy to elicit emotion from an INTP IRL, but most of it spills out on it's own. The observations made by jndiii, Scorpiomover, and Thod among others in this thread (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) are pretty good.It was a tongue in cheek comment since INTPs can sometimes have difficulty figuring out what they are or should be feeling towards external stimuli. Even when they've figured it out, they don't always express it or have difficulty expressing it in emotive terms.

I'm surprised that anyone would had difficulty understanding the nature of my post.

[davai]

Did you notice the date of the OP? It's almost five years old. I suspect the OP has long figured out his type.

Nope, didn't clock it.

It was a tongue in cheek comment since INTPs can sometimes have difficulty figuring out what they are or should be feeling towards external stimuli. Even when they've figured it out, they don't always express it or have difficulty expressing it in emotive terms.


Difficultly as a conscious expression perhaps? Unconsciously, i.e. the normal state, they tend to be fairly reactive i've found, a sort of free flowing of emotion as circumstances dictate. Unlike INTJs, and to a lesser extent ISTJs and then the IxFPs, who seem more rigid and tense concerning their expression. You made a good observation in that thread i linked about that actually - that it's easy to observe emotion in them via facial expression, but their natural inclination is to not express it, leading to that rigid and tense sort of look. Is that typical of Fi more than Fe? Seems to be the case IME.

I'm surprised that anyone would had difficulty understanding the nature of my post.

According to some stuff i read about my type, they harmonize and clarify. Guess it's in my nature to nit pick about details so everything is crystal clear.

As jndiii said in that thread - "Si is tertiary. They (INxPs) aren't happy if they can't pick the nits they see."

[babsa]

This is all you need to express. :p

:)

Yeah, if he wanted to purposely confuse the OP.

It's fairly easy to elicit emotion from an INTP IRL, but most of it spills out on it's own. The observations made by jndiii, Scorpiomover, and Thod among others in this thread (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) are pretty good.

Emotion is different than feelings, and eliciting emotions does not refute my assertion that an INTP won't express his or her feelings in the same manner that an INFJ would. Just because the OP has trouble conveying his or her feelings, it doesn't mean that he or she is an extroverted feeler. Emotions is just an outlet for one's feelings, but you can share what you are feeling without being outwardly emotional; the OP stated that he or she has trouble expressing feelings, not emotions.

Nope, didn't clock it.



Difficultly as a conscious expression perhaps? Unconsciously, i.e. the normal state, they tend to be fairly reactive i've found, a sort of free flowing of emotion as circumstances dictate.

As i said, emotions =/= feelings. Try asking that same INTP to tell you about those feelings he stuffs away in that decrepit closet of his.

[davai]

eliciting emotions does not refute my assertion that an INTP won't express his or her feelings in the same manner that an INFJ would.

Never disagreed with that.

As i said, emotions =/= feelings.

I'm having trouble seeing the difference. How do you define them?

[scorpiomover]

Well-organised INTP.

Starting projects early and getting it out of my mind seem to come to me naturally. My mother was a compulsive early-starter, and my father is a compulsive planner (very, very strong J). I think this one is independent of my inherent types; it has to do with my parents' influence....The Si organisational skills comes from the influence of your parents, i.e. nurture.

Hence, the development of Si at such a young age. Gives the impression of ISTJ. Hence the confusion.

But I don't think Ti is my dominant function. If you ask me to intuitively define "Introverted Thinking," (as sriv asked me to define Ni) I don't think I will be able to do it.....If you were an N-dom, you'd have an intuitive grasp of Ti. It might be right or wrong. But you'd have one anyway.

[babsa]

I'm having trouble seeing the difference. How do you define them?

Feelings are what drives our behaviours and decisions. Emotions such as anger, sadness, etc., are how we express feelings.

[davai]

Feelings are what drives our behaviours and decisions. Emotions such as anger, sadness, etc., are how we express feelings.

Sort of like the relation between climate and weather? Feelings being a more long term crystallised set of impressions, while emotion a more short term reactivity entirely dependant on circumstance?

[babsa]

Sort of like the relation between climate and weather? Feelings being a more long term crystallised set of impressions, while emotion a more short term reactivity entirely dependant on circumstance?

Ehhh... Weather is affected by climate, but it is not completely derived from it. Nevertheless, I think that you understand the gist of what I am saying.

[davai]

Ehhh... Weather is affected by climate, but it is not completely derived from it. Nevertheless, I think that you understand the gist of what I am saying.

Yup that's what i'm saying though. One can be a generally calm person, but a certain experience/environmental pressure may induce a massive rage fit, and therefore isn't completely derived from what you call feeling.

[babsa]

Yup that's what i'm saying though. One can be a generally calm person, but a certain experience/environmental pressure may induce a massive rage fit, and therefore isn't completely derived from what yo.u call feeling.

Oh ok, fair enough, that sounds like a sound analogy

[DaBuzz]

INTJ Shadow side is INTP

[TheGreatSwagsby]

INTJ Shadow side is INTP


When unhealthy the INTJ's shadow actually becomes ENFP.

[scorpiomover]

INTJ Shadow side is INTPWhen INTJs start to doubt themselves, they start to doubt everything. It's like watching a person collapse from inside.

INTPs positively thrive on self-doubt. Self-doubt is how we know if we're right. The more we doubt ourselves, the more confident we get.

[floramacivor]

INTPs positively thrive on self-doubt. Self-doubt is how we know if we're right. The more we doubt ourselves, the more confident we get.

This sounds contradictory and impossible. What does this look like? Is it that being too certain feels confining, as if not everything is being considered and some data must be missing?

[scorpiomover]

This sounds contradictory and impossible. What does this look like? Is it that being too certain feels confining, as if not everything is being considered and some data must be missing?Yes. In the beginning, it's like being wrapped in indecision. Then a fact emerges, that whichever way you are looking at things, it is always true. These represent anchors in a sea of indecision. They limit the possibilities. With each new fact that one is certain about, more and more possibilities are limited. Finally, you are faced with only a few options, of which one is almost always clearly the most efficient and effective in the situation. Then one has unbelievable clarity and certainty in this situation. One can walk into the most lethal of situations, knowing that one's solution is bound to work.

In the beginning, this process is interminably long, for every situation. But in each situation, every possibility has been explored, and all that reasoning has been worked out, and stored in memory. Anything similar, and the same arguments can be remembered, and re-calculated, which can be milliseconds. So with each process calculated slowly, one has also worked out all the reasoning for thousands of similar situations. So as time marches on, more and more situations are known, and one is confident and clear about more and more of life.

[Chameleon]

INTPs positively thrive on self-doubt. Self-doubt is how we know if we're right. The more we doubt ourselves, the more confident we get.

When I am confident that I am wrong I am often right. When I am confident I am right I am usually wrong.