Difference between INTJ and INTP

[foroneonly]

I'm having some difficulty understanding this. From what I can tell the INTJ "lives in their head" but want to apply his ideas to real world whilst the INTP is more theoretical and abstract in what is important? And what I guess are the main differences between the two types because what I'm concluding from the description is they both are not outwardly emotional, spend alot focusing internally, and not all that concerned with the outside world? I'm not sure the part the P and J difference play into all this. Thanks!

[Uberfuhrer]

Yes. The INTJ is the person with a visionary scheme and dreams of making his/her internal ideas as concrete as possible...although they are not necessarily patient with the details of realizing an internal conception.

The INTP follows ideas in the external world via Ne and analyzes and perfects them internally via their dominant function of Ti.

IxTPs tend to be more curious and open-minded while INxJs are more stubborn and cling to their own ideas which they are convinced of.

Contrary to popular belief, an INTJ is not a scientific type, they rely on insight of Ni. In my opinion, science is everything but Intuitive. The ISTP is the scientific type, relying on concrete data of Se to be analyzed internally via Ti, while the INTP is the philosophical type, wondering about abstract unknowns in the external environment, courtesy of Ne, to be analyzed internally via Ti.

[curiousjane]

Speaking from personal experience, the INTPs I know hit it off famously with me, because we have that Ne in common. My best friend, the INTP gal that she is, can think up scenario after scenario for political, relational, or simply psychological connections, and then delights in sifting through them to find the gold amongst the dust. Ideas and Connections are her joy. She is very problem-oriented, but it doesn't throw her off to discuss and learn about topics just for the fun of doing so. She doesn't have to apply all that knowledge.

Most INTJs I've met, however, need to take that information and do something with it. Everything needs to have a purpose. Not to say INTJs can't let loose and have fun exploring a concept, or being totally abstract just for the fun of it.

[INTJoe]

The INTP will always remain a bit less biased than an INTJ. If you ask an INTJ about a topic, they will likely say "It isn't worth a sh*t".

An INTP will glady tell you about the topic and let you make your decision. INTPs are more like consultants. INTJs always hear about a topic and immediately discard what they don't believe is correct, and will take what is correct and try to use it for some greater good.

I think INTJs are a bit more creative, but compared to the SPs, we aren't very, so it is almost moot. INTJs are more heated, stubborn, bullish, predictable...lol.

My INTP friend enjoys things like disassembling a computer to learn how it works. I'd never do that. I'd rather have him do it, then ask him questions about it because it's more efficient that way.

Think of the INTP as the resource, and the INTJ as the one devising some plan based on the info. (a plan they can't convince anybody of doing) lol.

[Uberfuhrer]

I think INTJs are a bit more creative, but compared to the SPs, we aren't very, so it is almost moot. INTJs are more heated, stubborn, bullish, predictable...lol.

But the INTJ is a visionary type.

Why do people connect creativity with having a predictable lifestyle? Creative and imaginative thinking is N, predictability and routine lifestyles are J. P has little to do with creativity, just adaptability and open-mindedness.

With that said, however, INTPs tend to be more interested in fun.

[realkodiac]

But the INTJ is a visionary type.

...With that said, however, INTPs tend to be more interested in fun.

Try telling that to leprecon(my cousin who is an intp). lol. I'm an INTJ. The biggest differences between me and him are "in the details" so to speak. On a basic and generalized level he will go over all the details several times to make a decision. I will simply look for what I deem "necassary" to make a good decision/plan/strategy and adjust accordingly. I'm sure if he notices this thread he'll pop out a 3000 word response filling out all the "details" that I failed to mention. :laugh:

[errrzarrr]

I have doubts about this. I scored INTJ on the first test i did and INTP on the last on another webpage.

Is it possible that I change J and P temporaly?

Put the INTJ/INTP differences clear to me. If a Proffesional in this, then better. :cool:

[INTJoe]

But the INTJ is a visionary type.

Why do people connect creativity with having a predictable lifestyle? Creative and imaginative thinking is N, predictability and routine lifestyles are J. P has little to do with creativity, just adaptability and open-mindedness.


I think we're talking about 2 different types of creativity. The SPs are the "artisans"...creative in a scheming way, not so much a visionary way like an NJ.

I'm saying INTJs are more creative (or maybe "creationist" is a better term???) than INTPs, but compared to many SPs we would appear uncreative, cold, and robotic. I think it's because they can't understand the NJ type of creation.

[nemo]

According to Keirsey, INTJs are directive and have the "contingency planning" intelligence and INTPs are informative and have the "architectual" kind of intelligence.

The difference (as I understand it) is that INTJs are supposed to be better at long range forecasting, prediction, and applying subtle leverage in order to achieve their vision. They become very much possessed by their internal vision, and typically develop some way of implementing it as a secondary. When they solve a problem, they typically have some idea of a solution before they've fully solved it.

INTPs are more about exploring and refining the logical coherency of ideas, as well as creating their own (the "architects" of ideas). It's an interesting analogy because architecture is artistic, but certainly subject to constraints (physics, engineering) -- and in many ways INTPs theories are subject to logic in the same way. When they have a problem, they may not know exactly the solution, but are more interested in the kinds of methods to solve it, which they want to understand so they can kind of "solve every other similar problem" with those methods, i.e. they focus on generalizing solutions into the All Encompassing Theory of Reality v2.31.2 (beta) in their heads.

I don't know if I'd call either type "more" creative than the other.

Keirsey's descriptions of intelligence are obviously highly based on Ni/Te and Ti/Ne differences, too.

[Uberfuhrer]

The difference (as I understand it) is that INTJs are supposed to be better at long range forecasting, prediction, and applying subtle leverage in order to achieve their vision. They become very much possessed by their internal vision, and typically develop some way of implementing it as a secondary. When they solve a problem, they typically have some idea of a solution before they've fully solved it.

Yep, that's pretty much me. I get obsessed with an idea, but I have less confidence to implement it. Rather than developing the plan to realize it, though, I usually get into wishful thinking, such as hoping the idea will become real without lifting a finger. I tend to wish I could be God, that is, when I say I want something, it happens.

In fact, this is why very few of my roller coaster designs are actually complete, because it's painstaking and I become impatient with the details of realizing them. (The designs I've shown here are merely the tip of the iceberg of the other designs I planned but never followed through -- they either involve too much detail work to realize or are just unrealistic.)

INTJs also tend to have the most unrealistic expectations of any type. This was, in fact, one of the reasons I was put into special ed classes in high school -- that and anger issues and unwillingness to conform, which often stemmed from unrealistic expectations.

[Lagawrd]

Mmm, I dont know. The INTJ described here does not sound much like me much. When i get a vision, I use every means necessary to complete it. My visions are rather realistic. They used to be somewhat unrealistic when I was younger and did not have much views on reality. But that all changed after I got the hang of thoughts. I still make mistakes in planning and thinking, but that is only rarely and happen with things i do not have knowledge of.

[Vivid]

The major difference I see in INTJs and INTPs is that INTPs /really/ tend to thrive in school.

[Uberfuhrer]

INTJs also tend to have a more rebellious streak like ISTPs, although they are less directly expressive of it. INTPs are often a little more conforming due to their tertiary Si, although dominant Ti combined with tertiary Si could also be the source of their nitpicking tendencies.

But INTPs theoretically tend to be better in academics than INTJs, because they are always open to new concepts -- the INTJ, on the other hand, tends to be more focused on whatever interests them and relates to their own interests and visions.

[ArchonAlarion]

According to Keirsey, INTJs are directive and have the "contingency planning" intelligence and INTPs are informative and have the "architectual" kind of intelligence.

The difference (as I understand it) is that INTJs are supposed to be better at long range forecasting, prediction, and applying subtle leverage in order to achieve their vision. They become very much possessed by their internal vision, and typically develop some way of implementing it as a secondary. When they solve a problem, they typically have some idea of a solution before they've fully solved it.

INTPs are more about exploring and refining the logical coherency of ideas, as well as creating their own (the "architects" of ideas). It's an interesting analogy because architecture is artistic, but certainly subject to constraints (physics, engineering) -- and in many ways INTPs theories are subject to logic in the same way. When they have a problem, they may not know exactly the solution, but are more interested in the kinds of methods to solve it, which they want to understand so they can kind of "solve every other similar problem" with those methods, i.e. they focus on generalizing solutions into the All Encompassing Theory of Reality v2.31.2 (beta) in their heads.

I don't know if I'd call either type "more" creative than the other.

Keirsey's descriptions of intelligence are obviously highly based on Ni/Te and Ti/Ne differences, too.

Damn it! I can't figure out which I am. Both of those descriptions fit me. On tests I get either. Does anyone know a way I can figure it out? Or is it possible that I am really an INTx?

[errrzarrr]

I keep without understanding the main and important differences. :/





errrzarrr added to this post, 1 minutes and 13 seconds later...

Damn it! I can't figure out which I am. Both of those descriptions fit me. On tests I get either. Does anyone know a way I can figure it out? Or is it possible that I am really an INTx?

same happens here. I have scored both. I wonder if is that possible, being INT(J/P)

[INTJoe]

The major difference I see in INTJs and INTPs is that INTPs /really/ tend to thrive in school.

In Type Talk by Otto Kroeger he states that INTJs are the most successful type in the field of academics.

This doesn't mean we are as academic as INTPs, it just means we are probably more focused on the end goal. INTPs probably think "I want to learn as much about every subject, as it hits me", while INTJs start the school year thinking "OK, 9 months from now what do I need to do to assure I get all A's and B's in all my courses, and still manage to have time for my hobbies."

Maybe that's a bad example but anyway...blah. I think INTJs are more like juggernauts when it comes to academia. INTPs are a bit more blase.

Also...as I've stated earlier, I don't think INTJs are more creative than INTPs...I think they are more "creationary". When my INTP friend comes to my apartment I'm like "Here let me show you what I'm composing or working on." When I go to his, he's got disassembled CPUs sitting around. lol.

[Uberfuhrer]

Type Talk also describes INTJs as underachievers in academia. I personally did very well on exams in high school, but I never did my homework. I never liked the idea of homework -- what's from school should stay at school, what I do out of school should be my time only.

Type Talk has the best INTJ description for me in any book I've read although online descriptions, such as those at Lifexplore, PersonalityTest.net, and Enspired Profiles, describe me quite well, too (I identify with ENTP on all of those, too). I usually get excited about an idea that I never make it real; it's just expanded upon in my head into something either unrealistically ambitious or paranoid. I often get convinced of certain things such as being rejected by the outer world, and I have vivid imaginings of scenarios.

[cRyPT]

The major difference I see in INTJs and INTPs is that INTPs /really/ tend to thrive in school.
I believe my highest mark that I have in my core subjects is 70. My perception forces me to collect all of the possible information before making a decision. Thus, I do not finish a lot of my assignments due to that and my own unrealistically high self-expectations for the quality of my work.

Also... We recently were supposed to write an essay about our ideals of love. Needless to say, I refused to do it.

I know an INTJ and she is getting no lower then 92 ;)

[errrzarrr]

hey uberfuhrer you look like you know(professionally) about this. Tell me where I can read more about INTJ and that Type Talk you talk about.

[Uberfuhrer]

hey uberfuhrer you look like you know(professionally) about this. Tell me where I can read more about INTJ and that Type Talk you talk about.

Type Talk (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.). I've got an older version, but it shouldn't be that different.

Murray State (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) also has the description of INTJ from Type Talk. It's the second one down.





Uberfuhrer added to this post, 5 minutes and 18 seconds later...

And Enspired Profiles (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) also has a great description of the INTJ, and here's Lifexplore (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.), which has descriptions by Sandra Krebs Hirsch and Jean Kummerow along with a Keirsey description that rings truer to me than his description in Please Understand Me II.

[Asylum]

All N types are going to be creative.

Usually when I see an ENTP in a thread like this, pertaining to personalities and personality types I agree with them. I think ENTPs are among the best at accurately typing and noticing the differences.

I would trust an ENTJ to successfully organize a group of people to work effectively.

[PHS Philip]

Yes. The INTJ is the person with a visionary scheme and dreams of making his/her internal ideas as concrete as possible...although they are not necessarily patient with the details of realizing an internal conception.

The INTP follows ideas in the external world via Ne and analyzes and perfects them internally via their dominant function of Ti.

IxTPs tend to be more curious and open-minded while INxJs are more stubborn and cling to their own ideas which they are convinced of.

Contrary to popular belief, an INTJ is not a scientific type, they rely on insight of Ni. In my opinion, science is everything but Intuitive. The ISTP is the scientific type, relying on concrete data of Se to be analyzed internally via Ti, while the INTP is the philosophical type, wondering about abstract unknowns in the external environment, courtesy of Ne, to be analyzed internally via Ti.

Well, it depends on what sort of science. An N type generally be able to understand theory and abstract scientific concepts very well. They may also be more likely to have a breakthrough insight into how different theories tie together. These are all extremely important parts of the theoretical sciences. An S would be better at experimental science, however, as that deals more with the concrete, and less with intuitive insight.

[Cygnus]

I would say the biggest difference between me and my long time friend who is INTP is self confidence. I will make quick decisions with minimal data and move foward assertively, adjusting as I go. My friend will need much more data (and will find much more than I will bother to look for) to make a choice and will only appear decisive if the majority of data supports a conclusion.

So I envision myself as more like an automatic weapon of problem solving..I will keep shooting..alot and quickly until a solution is found. Which can lead to some unforseen consequences, which result in collateral damage :)

My friend, INTP is more like a sniper...one shot...one kill. My friend is a much better choice if you have time and want to sure of the solution, consequently the solution is more initially solid. Perfect for avoiding unforseen complications or when you are only going to get one shot at making something work.

[ssrprotege]

IxTPs tend to be more curious and open-minded while INxJs are more stubborn and cling to their own ideas which they are convinced of.

OK, I then tend to be more INxJ. I tend to pretend to be open-minded because one of my closest friends is curious about everything (he's an ENTP), driving me crazy.


Contrary to popular belief, an INTJ is not a scientific type, they rely on insight of Ni. In my opinion, science is everything but Intuitive. The ISTP is the scientific type, relying on concrete data of Se to be analyzed internally via Ti, while the INTP is the philosophical type, wondering about abstract unknowns in the external environment, courtesy of Ne, to be analyzed internally via Ti.

I don't think so. INTJ is a scientific type. Not that all INTJ's will study science, but it's valid to say INTJ's are the Scientists (archetypally speaking). Science is not just about analyzing the data. Rather, I believe science is all about theory. Data and analysis come only for the sake of theories. To understand the theories, Intuition is a must. Data analysis is rather a Te thing, and to see the underlying pattern behind the data, Intuition is necessary.

Imho, surmising an ISTP as a scientist type is itself an invalid claim, because it's very unlikely that ISTP's will be appreciative of theories. Science may look like a lot of experiments, but the ultimate objective is to find the abstract pattern behind the data and come up with a new theory!





ssrprotege added to this post, 32 minutes and 11 seconds later...

Well, it depends on what sort of science. An N type generally be able to understand theory and abstract scientific concepts very well. They may also be more likely to have a breakthrough insight into how different theories tie together. These are all extremely important parts of the theoretical sciences. An S would be better at experimental science, however, as that deals more with the concrete, and less with intuitive insight.

Perhaps the reason I don't agree with Uberfuhrer's position is that I tend to think science is mostly about theories..