Opening Up

[qwerty]

How do you guy approach the subject of being different with other people in a real life setting(not online :))? Like when you've known someone for a while and you've hidden yourself from the world and you want the person to understand, not for validation but because you see that they're reading you wrong and it kills you because you care about them. Every time I've thought about it, the ideas are either extremely complex or extremely conceited or extremely crazy (I guess that's why I hide it).

As I say the reason is because I see they're reading me wrong but the thing is that try as hard as I can I can't read them either and I have to know how they think.

[Apococlock]

At first, it can be a ridiculously, almost impossible thing to do. With time and effort though I'm confident that anyone can open up... even if they are overly crazy or what have you.

My opinion on the matter is simple, if you think of them as a close or even good friend, they should understand the true "you" no matter what you say or do, conceited, crazy, or not.

[Tarrick]

I've pretty much built my life in layers, and the more comfortable I am with someone, the closer I let them and expose them the more inner workings of my mind.

So far though I've never opened up all the way with anyone.

[Sohrab]

Layering and compartmentalizing worked for me. There is always the risk of not being understood even if you are completely honest so risk it. If you want to know what the person thinks, why not just ask? I know it is the hardest thing to do especially for our crowd, but if the person values you as much as you do them they'll make an effort to meet you halfway.

I've gained good friends this way but lost some, do this if the benefits outweigh the risk.

[Jezebel]

So far though I've never opened up all the way with anyone.
But do you have any desire to?

I don't. I know there are some people who want to find someone they can share anything and everything with... but that's never been a desire for me. Even though I'm in a relationship, I have a weird, driving need to keep some things completely to myself. Not because I'm hiding anything because it's bad or out of shame. I just have this intense need for privacy I can't shake. I wonder what causes that?

[qwerty]

So far though I've never opened up all the way with anyone.
But do you have any desire to?

I don't. I know there are some people who want to find someone they can share anything and everything with... but that's never been a desire for me. Even though I'm in a relationship, I have a weird, driving need to keep some things completely to myself. Not because I'm hiding anything because it's bad or out of shame. I just have this intense need for privacy I can't shake. I wonder what causes that?


Lol I'm talking about everything here guys, but not for a soul mate (very complicated). More to open a person up and get an answer about something.

The idea is that complete honesty is the one thing that this person lacks (the person doesn't lie but they don't tell the entire truth) and they're hiding the deepest secret like the key to the universe, I understand the privacy concept Jezebel and that is where this idea came from. If somebody asked me about myself in this level of detail I wouldn't surrender everything for the sake of telling them, but I would perhaps play my cards to the table and let them see one or two if it was asked in the perfect way by say someone who can provoke emotion and work around the normal framework of communication.

The drive to answer certain questions(about another person - an extremely confusing person) is such that every ounce of energy I have is being spent trying to peel them back. Not for manipulation or anything negative, just the thirst for the knowledge and validation that this person is an enigma in my map of the universe not just a mistake I've made, like some small calculation that isn't correct.

The outcomes of getting the answers I want are stacked against me but what sort of intj would I be if I didn't pursue the question, even at the cost of my personality and the way other people see me?

I have to know......

{edit 42 posts --- I guess I have my sign that this is the answer to life the universe and everything :) }

[StJimmy]

if i'm understanding what you're getting at, i think i've found myself in a fairly similar situation. is this ongoing, or...?

there's a little voice in my head telling me i should say "sometimes, you just can't make it better."

[qwerty]

Yeah well it's complicated (for the sake of anonymity no details). But as an overview: lets just say I'm head over heals about this person and every part of me says they feel the same, their body language the way they talk the things they do all point in the right direction, but she forces herself not to go further as if there is something holding them back. I have to know if I'm right and understand why or if I'm wrong and my radars blown.

I'm not looking for anything because it's dragged on way too long and it would be an anticlimax and also because I get the feeling that no matter what I say I won't convince them to let go so it's not a soul mate or a manipulation thing (I refuse to beg and I knowing that it's oneway if I force her makes it worthless), it's a thing that makes no sense in rational thinking terms and unfortunately it's something that for the life of me I can't deduce on my own.

I don't know why I need to know so badly or why I've held onto it all for the time I have (I get bored of this charade in a week normally and I've never had a problem with emotional stuff).

Damn irrationals!! Why can't I make sense of you! She must be a witch!

[StJimmy]

oops. i hit "delete" instead of modify.

uhh. what did i just say? my ex had repressed emotions, i tried to help her face them, ended up alienating her, we were both stubborn about not wanting to be "wrong" about the relationship.

my best advice i think is take a break from each other. see other people. i know that's not easy. a couple of old saws spring to mind, like "you don't know what you've got till it's gone," and, "if you love something, set it free. if it comes back to you, it's yours."

[qwerty]

yeah, well I know exactly where you're coming from, the problem is that repressed emotional state where they are afraid of letting go because they were hurt badly before. There was a 2 month no talking period in there and things starting going well again (not the same but neither better or worse).

She leaves in a few weeks and the chances of me seeing her again is slim to nothing after that. So I figure I should clear the air now and find the answers rather than being the last minute only in the movies type of person (still think I've left it too long) it should have been taken care of a month ago. My general theory falls along the lines of her bad breakup before, I guess she is afraid of having to split up with someone else she's deeply involved with when she leaves. But then again I've been wrong about her before. But it's just the backwards and forwards indecisiveness about her that gets to me.

[StJimmy]

you sure there's not a deeper root to the problem, my ex's hangup went all the way back to her parent's apparently ugly divorce when she was little. she resented her father greatly, and was very cold and distant to her stepfather. i'm certainly giving the rough version, and i hope i'm not presuming too much.

[qwerty]

well I'm not sure and that's what I plan to find out. Obviously I won't go into details when I do but I'll let you know if I get my answer

[StJimmy]

good luck man. my wife and i have been legal for over 4 years now, so there's hope for you, too ;)

[The Rose]

well I'm not sure and that's what I plan to find out. Obviously I won't go into details when I do but I'll let you know if I get my answerI have found that if I want someone to open up to me,
I have to open up to them first,
to the same degree that I want them to open up to me.

Is there a problem with saying,
"You know, I know you're leaving soon and we'll probably never see each other again,
and I just wanted you to know that I really like you.
I'm glad I got to know you.
I hope you keep in touch to let me know how you're doing." ?

If she likes you too, she'll say so, if she can.
If she doesn't like you, she won't feel put on the spot - hopefully -
and at least you'll have the closure you're looking for.

I don't know.
What do you think?

[rwyatt365]

Sorry I missed the latter stages of this thread. Qwerty, I hope you can/will get this resolved since it's gnawing at you. I'd just like to address something that Jezebel wrote;
So far though I've never opened up all the way with anyone.
But do you have any desire to?

I don't. I know there are some people who want to find someone they can share anything and everything with... but that's never been a desire for me. Even though I'm in a relationship, I have a weird, driving need to keep some things completely to myself. Not because I'm hiding anything because it's bad or out of shame. I just have this intense need for privacy I can't shake. I wonder what causes that?


I have the same "issue" (if that''s what you want to call it), no matter how close I am to someone I always feel the need to hold something back. Whenever I get some information I don't relay EVERYTHING. It's like I have to hold onto a piece of it so that it becomes my secret part. I've asked myself any number of times "why do that?", but can't find any rational reason.

[qwerty]

well I'm not sure and that's what I plan to find out. Obviously I won't go into details when I do but I'll let you know if I get my answerI have found that if I want someone to open up to me,
I have to open up to them first,
to the same degree that I want them to open up to me.

Is there a problem with saying,
"You know, I know you're leaving soon and we'll probably never see each other again,
and I just wanted you to know that I really like you.
I'm glad I got to know you.
I hope you keep in touch to let me know how you're doing." ?

If she likes you too, she'll say so, if she can.
If she doesn't like you, she won't feel put on the spot - hopefully -
and at least you'll have the closure you're looking for.

I don't know.
What do you think?
Yeah that's the whole idea of it all but not the whole 'I like you' thing.... Trust me that will end badly (it has before with this person). I'm more just interested in the why she acts the way she does because that is the confusing side of it all.

[The Rose]

How is she acting?

[Rei]

I find that being an introvert actually makes other random people open up to you even if you don't tell them anything about yourself.
But usually I'll open up a bit to people who completely open up to me (basically if know too much for them to stab me in the back :D).

I've been... preparing to hit the 'real world' where being quiet is... a workplace taboo. So I've actually decided I'll cope with the small talk thing and sound eccentric rather than like a possible psychopath. ;D

Except...
the people you WANT to open up to you... usually don't. I usually wait for an opportunity to test the key to the lock.
In case of urgency I find the best way to find out about these people is to flat out explain your case. My philosophy is if you feel like this is the last chance to say anything, then there's no loss. Otherwise I say it's a safe bet to just say keep in touch and find out later; I think people open up better when there's a physical barrier.

Even though I'm in a relationship, I have a weird, driving need to keep some things completely to myself. Not because I'm hiding anything because it's bad or out of shame. I just have this intense need for privacy I can't shake. I wonder what causes that?

I've always thought of it as self preservation. Though I think there are people I can trust enough to lay things out in the open. There really wouldn't be a point in the relationship for me if I couldn't be comfortably open.

[qwerty]

Yeah ok quick update. After some stammering around for abit I got it out there and she seemed to understand. I got what I was looking for (and also 1 or 2 more questions that don't need answering yet) and we both walked out of it with some parts still hidden which was good. I think I came off as more of an INFJ to get through to her :).

Very similar person to me and keeps hidden from the world to get by in life. Different personality class though - I'll proberly do more reading on it though I have an idea she's a low percentile istp that switches into a isfp every once in a while.

[qwerty]

I find that being an introvert actually makes other random people open up to you even if you don't tell them anything about yourself.
Except...
the people you WANT to open up to you... usually don't. I usually wait for an opportunity to test the key to the lock.


Exactly - except some times I find the hints people drop because they're too afraid to say anything.

How is she acting?

Sorry I missed this first. Contradictory at least that what I saw, everyone else just saw someone who was ditsy.