Attention Deficit Disorder

[cda]

I have a question for the fellow INTJs out there.. Growing up did people try to convince you that you have ADD or have some type of 'learning disability' because you arent 'normal'? My high school actually wanted to put me in Special Ed and prescribe me ritalin because they thought I lacked focus.

I didn't do well in school and was truant a lot, but I did well on most tests and always scored high on SATs, and my principal and school guidance counselor were puzzled.

[ssfanatic]

I think ADD is a huge excuse. How can you prescribe one guy who jumps off the walls with ADD and then diagnose the another guy who just has a little trouble focusing in classes that are below his level.
There may be, to some level, a form of ADD, but most of the time it is used by the kid as an excuse to do what he wants rather than learn.

Im sure im going to pick up a lot of flack from this one ;D...

[eMachine]

I think schools try to diagnose kids with ADD or ADHD because it makes it easier for them to control their classroom and keep on schedule. It's not a 'learning disorder', except in the way that you may need to learn to pay attention to boring things or atleast be able to pretend to focus so they let you be. I think generally if a person can pay attention to something that stimulates them, that they are interested in, they don't have an attention deficit, the teacher/subject is just not interesting.

I do think there is probably real ADD, but it's way over-diagnosed. My nephew, for instance was diagnosed with ADD at age 3 and was prescribed ritalin, which zombified him. I moved away for a few years and then moved back, he's a teenager now. I noticed that my nephew is able to sit and talk with my husband (or rather, listen to my husband talk:rolleyes:) for hours, something that I can rarely manage. So I asked my brother-in-law if his son was still taking ritalin for ADD to which he replied "no, he grew out of it."

If it's something that a person can simply grow out of, or learn to control with self-discipline, I think it probably shouldn't be refered to as a real disorder that they suffer from, just a facet of their evolving personality.

(Oh, it was never suspected that I had ADD. I was truant often from 3rd grade on, to the point that I was placed in several group homes throughout my adolescence. They tried to diagnose me with a few things, one that I can remember was Disruptive Behavior Disorder, when I argued this I was told that I am "the disruptive force in my own life". :thinking:)

[aok]

I wonder if ADD is more common in intuitives...supposedly people w/ ADD have more theta waves- which are associated w/ daydreaming...their prefontal cortex also tends to be deactivated at certain times of outward necessity- like finishing a test w/in a prescribed time limit...I think I probably self-medicate w/ caffeine at work to activate my prefrontal cortex and get more consciously involved in the present productive reality of what I'm involved in...

[Motor Jax]

I think ADD is a huge excuse. How can you prescribe one guy who jumps off the walls with ADD and then diagnose the another guy who just has a little trouble focusing in classes that are below his level.
There may be, to some level, a form of ADD, but most of the time it is used by the kid as an excuse to do what he wants rather than learn.

Im sure im going to pick up a lot of flack from this one ;D...

i agree with you in part, but i also come from a family that is also riddled with ADHD and Autism, Down Syndrome, and Bi-Polar Manic Depression

i have none of the above, btw. but i have also known a lot of students with very lax parents who have turned to the school system and medication to control their kids. i think it all starts at home.

the ones in my family with ADHD have all learned to control it. of course it takes great time and discipline. my brother, very ADHD, was on Ritalin for a couple of years, but mom quit giving it to him simply because he was a zombie and he didn't like it anyways. but growing up with a belt had taught him more than that Ritalin ever did.

my son also has ADHD, and is pretty much uncontrollable right now. but through experience we have learned about proper discipline and attention they seek

i think it all has to do with nurture, discipline, and love... but then that's me

[Parallel]

I have ADD although I didn't know it until my first year of college. Not knowing I had it actually helped me a lot since I naturally found ways to make up for things that were "off." But for college, I had to start taking medication because there was no way I could wing it like I did in high school with the amount of work I had.

So I take Adderall now which I love because it makes me so productive I even shock myself with the things I get done but it does sort of make me zombiish and uptight when I'm on it. It also kind of erases my personality when I'm on it, but oh well, at least I'm super productive, haha.

[lancelot]

I have a question for the fellow INTJs out there.. Growing up did people try to convince you that you have ADD or have some type of 'learning disability' because you arent 'normal'? My high school actually wanted to put me in Special Ed and prescribe me ritalin because they thought I lacked focus.

I didn't do well in school and was truant a lot, but I did well on most tests and always scored high on SATs, and my principal and school guidance counselor were puzzled.

I am going to state the obvious, there is a hugh overlap between highly gifted characteristics and ADD characteristics.

Unfortunately many people in education are not experts in psychology, cognitive science, and the traits and characteristics of the highly gifted.

In some cases, highly gifted students are mislabled ADD.

Ps. A kid who fuctions well in a class room, and on task 90% of the time would not be highly gifted.

Educators are not going to waist time on highly gifted kids that represent
less than one percent of the population.

In my opinion, gate programs, charter schools, accommodate moderately gifted kids. A kid beyond 140 IQ, is not interested in "busy work"; a kid beyond 140 IQ needs imagination and creativity, his freakin brain doesn't even kick in until he reaches the stratosphere.

[ssfanatic]

i agree with you in part, but i also come from a family that is also riddled with ADHD and Autism, Down Syndrome, and Bi-Polar Manic Depression

i have none of the above, btw. but i have also known a lot of students with very lax parents who have turned to the school system and medication to control their kids. i think it all starts at home.

the ones in my family with ADHD have all learned to control it. of course it takes great time and discipline. my brother, very ADHD, was on Ritalin for a couple of years, but mom quit giving it to him simply because he was a zombie and he didn't like it anyways. but growing up with a belt had taught him more than that Ritalin ever did.

my son also has ADHD, and is pretty much uncontrollable right now. but through experience we have learned about proper discipline and attention they seek

i think it all has to do with nurture, discipline, and love... but then that's me
I had a long discussion with someone on INTP central about disciplining children. My counterpart couldnt understand that disciplining children was out of love, and that if you didnt, then they would turn into a person liked by no one. I just think pain is still the best catalyst for learning a lesson, it may sound heartless, but im a product of this environment and i thoroughly appreciate it.

[eclecticjoker]

In first grade my teacher talked to my parents about the possibility that I had ADD. My parents didn't find it particularly important, even if it was interesting. They really hadn't even heard of it before then.

Now I'm nineteen, and I just don't know. Most of the research that I've read on ADD deals with ADHD, which is a disorder that most kids do grow out of. The type of ADD that I would likely have is one that doesn't go away. It's the dreamy, unfocused and lazy type. I exhibit almost all of the symptoms of that, but they all seem very mundane, and aside from depressingly low performance in school, they really don't seem to affect my life in any considerable fashion.

Sometimes I have wondered if I was just too bright for traditional education, or if I was ADD. Or if I was lazy. I really don't know. I do know that I could easily be medicated for ADD, but that really scares me. I use a lot of caffeine, but aside from that I'm very wary of drugs that alter behavior.

I'm tempted to believe that I'm lazy, because that's the reason I've been given most often throughout my life. I don't think I'm lazy, though. I just sort of suck at stuff. I love school and work, but I hate it, too. It should all be easier, ya know?

[lancelot]

In first grade my teacher talked to my parents about the possibility that I had ADD. My parents didn't find it particularly important, even if it was interesting. They really hadn't even heard of it before then.

Now I'm nineteen, and I just don't know. Most of the research that I've read on ADD deals with ADHD, which is a disorder that most kids do grow out of. The type of ADD that I would likely have is one that doesn't go away. It's the dreamy, unfocused and lazy type. I exhibit almost all of the symptoms of that, but they all seem very mundane, and aside from depressingly low performance in school, they really don't seem to affect my life in any considerable fashion.

Sometimes I have wondered if I was just too bright for traditional education, or if I was ADD. Or if I was lazy. I really don't know. I do know that I could easily be medicated for ADD, but that really scares me. I use a lot of caffeine, but aside from that I'm very wary of drugs that alter behavior.

I'm tempted to believe that I'm lazy, because that's the reason I've been given most often throughout my life. I don't think I'm lazy, though. I just sort of suck at stuff. I love school and work, but I hate it, too. It should all be easier, ya know?

Generally speaking, a person with ADD traits, or characteristics, yet has the ability to concentrate for long periods of time on things that interest them, is probably gifted and not ADD or ADHD. It is not unusual for gifted people to be bored with average things; sometimes it is the more interesting things in life that cause a gifted person's brain to switch on; it is at this time their giftedness will be manifested.

[eclecticjoker]

I know I'm gifted. I even fit a gifted "type". But I also fit the ADD "type". The gifted explanation is certainly more ego-satisfying, but it doesn't help my deal with my problems.

[lancelot]

I know I'm gifted. I even fit a gifted "type". But I also fit the ADD "type". The gifted explanation is certainly more ego-satisfying, but it doesn't help my deal with my problems.

Try to excell at the things you are good at, self discipline can be learned, Giftedness is just that, you are born with it. You may find your giftedness coming into play when you are challenged with something that requires creativity or something that inspires you.

Also, what people call ADD is really just characteristics of giftedness, the research is indicating this more and more.
In public education, the above philosophy is down played, much of education is about getting everyone on the same page, literialy.
Aso giftedness is not well understood by educators, There is a tendency to reward kids who are well behaved, and on task, kids who play around are not rewarded and often punished. In education, giftedness is associated with finishing home work and being well behaved.
Being well behaved and finishing home work generally are not signs of highly gifted children.

[eclecticjoker]

What you say is probably right. Still, in general and for myself particularly, it doesn't offer any solutions for the gifted underachiever. Aside from learning self-discipline.

Haha, maybe gifted courses should be more like courses for kids with disabilities, and focus on living skills and teaching kids how to deal with their purported "gifts".

[lancelot]

What you say is probably right. Still, in general and for myself particularly, it doesn't offer any solutions for the gifted underachiever. Aside from learning self-discipline.

Haha, maybe gifted courses should be more like courses for kids with disabilities, and focus on living skills and teaching kids how to deal with their purported "gifts".

Gifted people, especially visual/spatial learners, tend to be late bloomers.


You might want to research giftedness in general, and see
where you end up.

[Blaze2000]

I personally have problems staying interested in things after I've "figured out how it works". I get bored easily after the challenge of making something work, or solving the basic problem of an issue. The detail work after the solution is found gets mind numbing sometimes. I don't know if that's ADD or not, but I'd guess to some people it might look like it.

[lancelot]

I personally have problems staying interested in things after I've "figured out how it works". I get bored easily after the challenge of making something work, or solving the basic problem of an issue. The detail work after the solution is found gets mind numbing sometimes. I don't know if that's ADD or not, but I'd guess to some people it might look like it.

Some of what you are saying is characteristic of gifted people, I have researched giftedness for about 8 years off and on. You may find it very interesting to research giftedness in general, and see if it adds perspective to your concerns. Gifted people often enjoy the company of other people who are gifted.

I agree concepts are often more interesting than details.

Gifted people have so many talents, some are there and don't pop up until we are properly challenged or inspired.

[deepFlow]

Blaze2000, I can relate to what you say quite a lot. I have a really hard time just focusing on one thing to completion. Or never mind completion, just focusing long enough to get out of the starting gate, sometimes. My mind always wants to "go meta", and once I "understand the meta", then the detail-level loses interest value, and I can't bear to nail myself to it for any length of time.

I don't know if this has anything to do with ADD... (Have not been diagnosed with anything like this, but then again I haven't been tested either.)

[meanlittlechimp]

I have ADD although I didn't know it until my first year of college. Not knowing I had it actually helped me a lot since I naturally found ways to make up for things that were "off." But for college, I had to start taking medication because there was no way I could wing it like I did in high school with the amount of work I had.

How does your ADD manifest itself exactly? Would you say you have extreme ADD? I think ADD is overprescribed, but obviously it doesn't mean you don't have it.

For some reason I see ADD as more an EP think more than any other type. I can see an INTJ with OCD but ADD seems the antithesis of what I picture INTJs to be (I only 4 well personally).

[Sesquipedalian]

From my Genius/Mental Disorder thread... pertaining to the topic of ADD:
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(...easier than being redundant.)

Feel free to respond to anything I said in there within this thread. I don't want to steal valuable discussion from this thread.

[lancelot]

From my Genius/Mental Disorder thread... pertaining to the topic of ADD:
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

(...easier than being redundant.)

Feel free to respond to anything I said in there within this thread. I don't want to steal valuable discussion from this thread.

There is much research to be done regarding gifted, and profoundly gifted
people. Giftedness in my opinion is still not well understood; it may be as complex as autism, sometimes I think a profoundly gifted person is part ADD, part Autistic, deeply sensitive and creative with a good holographic memory.
Public school has caused serious problems for some gifted students, the over bearing authority figures, the mechanical approach to education,
the dumb ways they try to teach responsiblity, and teach people to follow directions.
I may be kind of a chauvinist, but I think people who are mechanical and follow directions are not very bright; It's like they have nothing else going on, they are not considering other possiblities. They do what they do, not because they are good, but because that's all they know or think about;
they are not distracted by insights or possibilites, or flaws in the person leading the group.

[Sesquipedalian]

I may be kind of a chauvinist, but I think people who are mechanical and follow directions are not very bright; It's like they have nothing else going on, they are not considering other possiblities. They do what they do, not because they are good, but because that's all they know or think about;
they are not distracted by insights or possibilites, or flaws in the person leading the group.

Nope... Nope... not a chauvanist.. ...pretty much exactly what I think.

Then again, maybe we're both chauvanists :laugh:

[lancelot]

Nope... Nope... not a chauvanist.. ...pretty much exactly what I think.

Then again, maybe we're both chauvanists :laugh:

Your picture reminds me of Val Kilmer in the movie "REAL GENIUS"
I had the pleasure of meeting actor Gabriel Jarret who played the 15yr. old Genius in the same movie. We played basketball in Manhattan Beach
and I got his autograph. I told him how the movie helped me through college.
Ah,... Good Times!

[Mr Zip]

I was diagnosed with ADHD when I was young back in the early70s, and saw it go from hyperactivity, to ADD to ADHD to whatever its called now. Back in the day they gave me thorazine (a tranquilizer) for it and It dropped me like a rock. Then I was given dexedrine in various doses till Finally at age 16 or so I got so tired of the side effects that I flushed them all down the toilet and never took them again.

I think ADHD is BS. at least in my case. I believe I had and still have mild aspergers. Giving kids speed isnt the answer. Hell, start with diet. That makes more of a difference than anything.

[Bluestocking]

My mother recently gifted me with two books about Adult ADHD, which she has decided that I have. I do seem to fit most of the symptoms of ADHD/Inattentive Type. I function imperfectly, but I function. I don't see the point in doing anything about it now.

[slut poacher]

in my early 20's i watched a feature on 20/20 dealing with ADD. i was convinced that i had it . mind always racing, unable to focus, aggression, insomnia, difficulty starting or finishing tasks, etc. i did a little research and went to see my doctor, the cause was a form of clinical depression. clinical depression doesnt necessarily make you sad and weepy. it is very common for males to have the same symptoms as me. i learned that the hormonal changes during puberty will effect seratonin levels and are a primary cause of why teenagers are the way they are. i entered puberty very early so the warning signs were probably never noticed, as i grew older it just became normal for me, not having known anything else. my doctor prescribed prozac which certainly did level me out. the problem with prozac is that it also turns you into someone else. i was able to focus and a lot of the little things that go along with it were greatly improved. but i wasnt the same person anymore, i was overly aggressive before and this stuff made me as docile as a drugged cow, my "dont fuck with me nature" is a primary component of who i am, and prozac made me not even care. then there is prozac with alchohol, you might be ok a few times but i dont recommend it. my behavior on my 25th birthday was enough to convince me that prozac especially in combination with alchohol wasnt for me. i found an excellent substitute: st.johns wort, cheap, no prescription required and it takes the edge off without turning you into a zombie. i'm 38 now and i seldom get squirrelly (my term) these days, but i do keep some on hand for times when i catch myself starting to slip a little. it has worked great for me and i have recommended it to several people i know, who have had similar success with it. the best part of all that i have found with it is: no side effects. i'd say give it a shot, if it doesnt work at least it is unlikely to make things worse.

[lancelot]

When evaluating a person labeled ADD

The one differentiating factor is, are you able to concentrate for long periods of time on something that interests you? If the answer is yes, then you are not ADHD, meaning Minimal brain damage, or having a neurological impairment.
Yet the reasons for the inability to pay attention to some things is still not fully understood. From the reading I have been doing, I see researchers moving away from the "brain damaged" hypothesis and associating ADD characteristics, and triats with giftedness. Also it is not unusal for a person labled ADD to have an above average or higher IQ when tested by a psychologist.

Obviously more research needs to be done, and education should be reformed. In my opinion, public schools are not accomodating the gifted population. Excatly what is giftedness but a superior learning style; A learning style different friom the average person, in some cases a superior learning ability, involving creativity, insight and application of knowledge. Superior learning styles should not be stifled by public schools, as long as "ADD" is misinterpreted as a disibility, gifted students will continue to be discriminated against.

[Mind Warrior]

Ahhh I knew a post like this would come up soon.

Well I have ADHD and I have quite a bit of experience with it having been diagnosed when I was in my first semester in grad school. I got through grad school and earned an MBA back in 99 but I have been able to do little with the degree. ADHD has proven to be a huge hurdle which I have been unable to conquer. Most people who know me just don't get it, on the outside I come up with ideas and strategies that few people think of, but yet I haven't been able to make anything career wise go for me.......ok I will have to say yet! But being an underachiever is a common theme for many people with ADHD, so I am pretty much in the norm.

When I was tested I remember taking several tests, but one proved to be very illuminating. It is called the Wechsler's Adult Intelligence Scale and it shows a great breakdown of your IQ. The breakdown is the fascinating part because it shows clearly in my case that I have a processing problem and working memory problem. Those are key thing that point to ADHD along with other things such as personal interview, family interview, and other things. All things together are what point a competent professional to saying yes, it appears this person has ADHD.

What is funny is that I had also had this same test administered when I was a Sophomore in college when I was about to get kicked out of school because I wasn't doing well and thought I was an idiot. Both score are consistent and both score point towards ADHD.

The diagnosis was a double edged sword for me, it proved I wasn't lazy (I knew I wasn't lazy but everyone else thought/thinks I am) or stupid (yeap I thought I was stupid and that if I just worked harder than everyone else I CAN succeed) but it showed me I have a problem that I can't just tough through as much as I want to. Parts of my IQ breakdown showed an IQ of 140 and then other parts (performance oriented) said I had an IQ of like 70. From what I was told all the subcomponents parts of the score shouldn't deviate by much, but mine deviate by about 70 points, that's not normal. So I am not stupid, even with my average IQ being 120, but I'm not happy either.

I tried the Ritalin when I was in grad school but I am so anti drug it isn't funny. Besides the brain is so complex that the doctors are just mixing things trying to find something that will work with your brain chemistry. I am not a guinea pig and I am pretty worried about the long term side affects. The ones they don't really know or don't really want to tell you about.

So for anyone on here who really thinks they have ADHD you need to get yourself tested and decide if drugs and a lot of personal discipline might do you some good. Here is the Wikipedia site for the adult intelligence test. Read it, it is pretty interesting and it is more interesting taking it and learning about yourself. Just like it is learning about being an INTJ from this site.

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[lancelot]

In addition to ADD, are there other people who had difficulty growing up as a result of being gifted or super duper gifted? Anyone super duper gifted with aspie charcteristics, ADD charcteristics, dyslexia or what ever?

[sam988]

I think i don't have ADD, but i was wondering if you guys too have the problem of barely being able to pay attention to the professor most of the time and with most subjects?

I just get lost in my thoughts before i know it. And when the class is done i barely got anything if it is boring and not one of the ones i like. But then i can go through a book and in 15 minutes i get everything that was said in the class that had a duration of 1 and a half hour or so.... I really hate learning by having to listen to the teacher, i prefer to read it on my own.

[lancelot]

I think i don't have ADD, but i was wondering if you guys too have the problem of barely being able to pay attention to the professor most of the time and with most subjects?

I just get lost in my thoughts before i know it. And when the class is done i barely got anything if it is boring and not one of the ones i like. But then i can go through a book and in 15 minutes i get everything that was said in the class that had a duration of 1 and a half hour or so.... I really hate learning by having to listen to the teacher, i prefer to read it on my own.

From my experience, teachers generally lecture about the assigned reading; this reinforces what we have read; unfortunately for me, I was often behind on the reading. I would think having done the reading would make the lecture more interestng. I had a tendency not to do homework or read ahead of time. I would show up to class and ask "what are we doing? Did anyone do the home work?" A friend of mine told me she heard a class mate say I was on drugs(I was not on drugs);this is because I would show up unprepared without doing the homework. She thought I would be offended, actually I felt sorry for the person who said it. He worked so hard, did all the homework, and had a study group, and he still couldn't pass the tests. He was not dumb,
he was just struggling with some of the more cryptic aspects of our curriculum.
When I return to grad. school, I plan to read ahead of the lecture and do all the homework assignments.
I wish I could be like a normal "good" student.

It's interesting how many of us associate completing the homework with being a good person. Well, maybe if I work hard enough I will get a gold star next to my name.

[lancelot]

Are there any more women, girls, ladies with ADD?

Is it more common for men or women to have ADD?

[Szarra]

Are there any more women, girls, ladies with ADD?

Is it more common for men or women to have ADD?

I have ADD. My son has ADHD and Asperger's.

Men/boys are more likely to be diagnosed with ADHD because they seem to manifest the physical signs much more often than girls. It's usually much harder to spot the quiet kid in the corner daydreaming when there is another jiggling around in their seat constantly.

I was the daydreamer. Still am. But it's not the lazy sort of daydreaming that most people think. My mind usually has several things going at once. I'll be thinking about the book I'm reading, listening to the song I just heard on the radio, laughing at a funny line from a movie, worrying about what to cook for dinner, etc., etc. Unfortunately, since I can't keep my mind from doing all these things at once, I have a hard time actually getting anything done. Outside distractions, such as the kids coming to ask me questions do not help at all. They just add one more thing to the list.

Example: I can walk to the kitchen to get a soda and along the way notice a pair of socks. I pick up the socks and start to take them to the hamper. Someone stops me in the hall to ask what's for dinner. I start thinking about dinner and head for the kitchen. Half way through fixing dinner, I notice that I've placed the socks on the cabinet, I've left my online gaming group sitting at the castle awaiting my return and I still don't have a soda!

As far as schooling goes, I was lucky and went to a very small school. (Usually less than 10 in a class.) I think it is much easier for the daydreamers to slip through the cracks at a large school. Also I think recess (or lack of) plays a big part in the so-called ADHD of today's kids. I think that if they had more chances to run around and burn off some of that excess energy they'd find focusing in the classroom much easier. If the child turns into a total zombie when placed on medication then the dosage is too high or not needed at all, IMO.

Speaking of medication, those of you on Adderall or Ritalin that don't like it might want to ask your doctor about Concerta and Strattera. Far fewer side effects according to my son's doctor. My son started on Dexadrine which barely worked on him and it caused him to not eat. (Well, duh Dexadrine...Dexatrim... Yes it's an appetite suppressant and they use it for ADHD.) He later switched to Concerta which worked much better but still suppressed his appetite. He took Strattera up until a few months ago and it worked very well for him without messing up his appetite as much as the others. Now he takes nothing. He still has bouts of hyperactivity but now that he's older, he's better able to redirect that energy on his own. But that, like anything, varies from person to person.

You do not "grow out of it". You learn to work around it and with it.

Edit:
The one differentiating factor is, are you able to concentrate for long periods of time on something that interests you? If the answer is yes, then you are not ADHD, meaning Minimal brain damage, or having a neurological impairment.

I'm going to have to say "Buzz! Wrong answer."
Someone with ADD can become hyper-focused on something that interests them to the point of excluding everything around the them.
For me it's books. I can "get lost" in a book because I become hyper-focused on the story. If you do manage to draw my attention away from the book, then I will happily hyper-focus on the myriad ways that I want to kill you for breaking my concentration. Either way, I'm not going to be paying attention to you and at this point my brain is reverting to it's usual state of multi-activity, further complicating the issue.

ADD should stand for Attention Differently Divided. ;D

[lancelot]

"I'm going to have to say "Buzz! Wrong answer."
Someone with ADD can become hyper-focused on something that interests them to the point of excluding everything around the them.
For me it's books. I can "get lost" in a book because I become hyper-focused on the story. If you do manage to draw my attention away from the book, then I will happily hyper-focus on the myriad ways that I want to kill you for breaking my concentration. Either way, I'm not going to be paying attention to you and at this point my brain is reverting to it's usual state of multi-activity, further complicating the issue."

The researhers, psychologists, cognitive scientists are making the claim that kids able to concentrate on projects for long periods of time are
not ADHD. I generally don't say things I have not researched.

Psychologists, cognitive scientists are now claiming "ADD" kids are more likely gifted. This also raises the question do we lable someone gifted because their IQ is high or because they are on task, and well behaved? Also are gifted kids in their environment or element when they are labled? or I should say mislabled. There is a tendency to lable kids gifted, when they are on task, ie. concetrating for long periods of time, on things that normally would not stimulate a highly gifted child.

[Szarra]

I'm not saying they aren't gifted. Just that they think differently.

Someone with ADD can be very gifted but more than likely only in a narrow field. That's because it's interesting to them and they hyper-focus on it. Hyper-focusing is very different from just focusing. With hyper-focusing you tend to go into extreme detail and memorization mode (for lack of better words). If the person can focus for long periods of time on anything you put in front of them and make interesting, then no they don't have ADD. You could not get me to focus on pygmy iguanas of the Amazon, no matter how great the presentation. Why? They just don't interest me. I can and will go on and on for hours about books that I've read and liked. I can usually quote them or at the very least flip quickly through and find a particular passage.

I think the main fault in labeling someone with ADD/ADHD is that people hear the word "disorder" and think "that's bad!". Maybe they should start calling us gifted and get rid of disorder altogether.

[ethsar46]

Lol, this topic reminds me of that south park episode where they say all the kids have ADD because they couldnt remember details from the book the Great Gatsby. Not exactly an exciting read.

They all end up on prescription drugs listening to phil collins, lol.

In anycase, i very much doubt i have ADD but i find i do get bored of things quickly.

[Szarra]

Lol, this topic reminds me of that south park episode where they say all the kids have ADD because they couldnt remember details from the book the Great Gatsby. Not exactly an exciting read.

They all end up on prescription drugs listening to phil collins, lol.

In anycase, i very much doubt i have ADD but i find i do get bored of things quickly.

Heh. I liked that episode.

Though you make me think I'm not being clear on my position. Let's try this... If you were to take a class and the final test was on the Great Gatsby, would you be able to read the book and retain enough of it for the test? Need more incentive? This test is the only grade you receive for the class. If you fail this class, then you end up scooping dog doody for a living at less than minimum wage with absolutely no chance at change. Could you force yourself to at least pass? Someone with ADD would find this exceedingly difficult, if not impossible.

LOL. Right now I'm having great difficulty focusing on this post. There is a yappy dog down the street that won't shut-up. My son is playing ball in the house with the dogs. The cat is scratching at the door to get in. And my daughter is yelling her head off at all of them! Something in my brain just won't let me filter out everything else and allow me to concentrate.

I guess what I'm trying to say is: Don't lump me in with the lazy idiots who don't even try. I do try. There are just some things I can't seem to do (things most people consider "normal"), no matter what I try.

[Kuriozidee]

I have a question for the fellow INTJs out there.. Growing up did people try to convince you that you have ADD or have some type of 'learning disability' because you arent 'normal'? My high school actually wanted to put me in Special Ed and prescribe me ritalin because they thought I lacked focus.

I didn't do well in school and was truant a lot, but I did well on most tests and always scored high on SATs, and my principal and school guidance counselor were puzzled.
My brother and I would be twins if it weren't for the 2.5 year difference between us, which may seem somewhat off the subject, but both of us wound up being prescribed adderall way after we became adults. It helps, although I don't necessarily like depending on it.
I have had similar experiences growing up where I also seemed to be into trouble more than I can admit but I have always done well in school unless I just wasn't doing the work at all. I dropped out when I was 16, did not attend any pre-test classes, walked in 2 years later to take my GED and passed with flying colors. With the exception of my accounting class in college, I have maintained mostly A's with the occasional B and still maintain a 3.85 out of 4.0. To most, that would seem like bragging... but it is more of a fascination to me when I look at others and wonder why they find education so difficult.

[lancelot]

"I'm not saying they aren't gifted. Just that they think differently.

Someone with ADD can be very gifted but more than likely only in a narrow field. That's because it's interesting to them and they hyper-focus on it. Hyper-focusing is very different from just focusing. With hyper-focusing you tend to go into extreme detail and memorization mode (for lack of better words). If the person can focus for long periods of time on anything you put in front of them and make interesting, then no they don't have ADD. You could not get me to focus on pygmy iguanas of the Amazon, no matter how great the presentation. Why? They just don't interest me. I can and will go on and on for hours about books that I've read and liked. I can usually quote them or at the very least flip quickly through and find a particular passage.

I think the main fault in labeling someone with ADD/ADHD is that people hear the word "disorder" and think "that's bad!". Maybe they should start calling us gifted and get rid of disorder altogether."



Your comments are interesting, but in my opinion they do not reflect what the research regarding "ADD" is indicating. I am not talking about hyperfocussing, what I mean is, Concentrate for long periods of time: able to read a book that interests them, work on science project, art etc.

ADD, like everything else is a continuum, many people labled ADD have High IQs, and few do not. However many kids labeled, or mislabled ADD are highly gifted; the "ADD" traits, more often than not, are seen in highly gifted people.
I suppose there are some people labled "ADD" who could not read a
"Dick and Jane" book, but they would be a very small minority.
Also, I find it very interesting, that so many people in this forum claim to have ADD, and have made it all the way to graduate school.
Honestly, they would never had made it this far, if they were somehow impaired: unable to concentrate, complete homework, read a book or what ever.

I realize higher IQ, and a highly creative mind compensates for difficulty focussing; the good news is, minds can be trained, creativity and IQ are innate.

[Avid]

This post makes me giggle. People all through my past SWORE I had some sort of problem because I was the master of multi tasking. So what they saw as a lack of focus was really me not using my mind enough to keep me entertained. My husband (who is also an INTJ) has a mother that sits there and swears all day that he has ADD. People need to quit making excuses for those who require full attention to learn anything. I can half listen to most anything and retain enough to easly relay it back with my handy "excessive words" filter.

[nzashadow]

Research has shown that in order to retain an individuals focus, a task has to be challenging but not too challenging.

If a task is "too simple" for the mind to comprehend, it will lose focus. If a task is "too challenging" it will also lose focus.

It's easy to spot when a person is just dumb, but a person who has trouble concentrating on simple tasks can easily be mislabeled as slow, or if they proven their intelligence than the simpler course is to label them as "ADD".

[celesul]

So far, many people here have been saying things are AD/HD that simply aren't. :nono: AD/HD is most often diagnosed in gifted kids, but sometimes in non-gifted. However, so are other learning problems, such as dyslexia. Both do seem to be correlated with non-auditory learning styles, but there are exceptions even with that.

AD/HD people can focus on something to the point of hyper-focusing, but that doesn't mean that they only focus on what they want. If I hyper-focus, I won't notice that I'm hungry, sleepy, or need to go to the bathroom. So, eventually my stomach starts grumbling loudly enough to become rather irritating, and I stare at it in shock, the the clock, and realize I've not eaten for a day. Oops. :faint:

I have medium to mild AD/HD, and have been on meds for a few years, but most of my life has been spent unmedicated. However, I encountered problems like that, as I really can't concentrate, or sit still.

If someone "grew out" of AD/HD, they never had it in the first place. AD/HD is not a stage, it's part of life. They've done studies that show differences in brain activity in both degree and area. It's possible to learn to work with it, but it depends on the severity.

For me, I'm trying my best to learn to live with it, but it places a few restrictions upon me. I cannot go through school without meds, because I cannot focus in an unstructured environment, so I'd never do my homework, even if I found it fascinating (this is related to forgetting to eat, by the way). I've taught myself to focus in a structured environment though, so I can, for the most part, focus during the school day. So, with coffee (caffeine is excellent for AD/HD ^.^) and a structured environment, I would be fine off of meds. But I'd still be in trouble at home with daily life. Coming from a family of people with AD/HD, I can tell you exactly how long food can stay in the fridge without going moldy, and how much longer it takes for the mold to stink up everything else and make a bagel look like a mossy rock. :laugh:

Now, next issue. Attention deficit hyperactivity disorder. Most people exhibit AD/HD like symptoms, but that does not make them AD/HD. Until it interferes with functionality, it is not AD/HD. Sure, tons of people can't pay attention when we read a boring book. That's because it's boring. :rolleyes: Still, they can pay attention to what they want to, such as pestering parents for allowance, and eating dinner on time. I forgot to ask my parents for allowance money for 3 years, and they refused to pay it at that time, which would have been a nice amount of money. :(I forget things I want.

But, as I said, mine is mild. I do know a kid who I would not want to be in the same room or car with him when he's off meds. :scared: He's hyperactive and impulsive on a high dose of meds, he's a threat to his and others' safety off of them. He cannot control his impulses to the point that he'd run in front of a car if there was something he wanted in front of it.

The three major symptoms are impulsively, hyperactivity, and distractibility. Distractibility is ADD. Hyperactivity, distractibility, and impulsively are ADHD, and impulsively is the most dangerous. I'm distractible and hyperactive, but not impulsive to the point of disorder, with puts me at ADHD. Both of those symptoms are irritating and make for great jokes (looking back at it anyway, it's not that funny at the time;)), but impulsively is not funny in the slightest, and kids with ADHD with all three symptoms are the ones who get meds at age 3, because they can be dangerous. Responsible doctors don't prescribe meds before age 6 at earliest unless a kid's safety is at risk, or he's been kicked out of 3 kindergartens already. How does one get kicked out of kindergarten!? :stunned:

My point is mainly that AD/HD does exist, it's correlated with various things, but brain activity shows a legitimate difference. It's over-diagnosed and not all that well understood, and most people show symptoms, but unless it's consistent for their entire life and present in all areas: home, school, friends, it is not AD/HD. (you'd not believe how hard it can be to make friends for someone with AD/HD, as they can irritate their friends as well:().

[lancelot]

"So far, many people here have been saying things are AD/HD that simply aren't. AD/HD is most often diagnosed in gifted kids, but sometimes in non-gifted. However, so are other learning problems, such as dyslexia. Both do seem to be correlated with non-auditory learning styles, but there are exceptions even with that. "

Nice to hear your comments about gifted people and "ADD" characteristics, it's about time the truth came out. I think it's high time public school reforms its methodology,and stops associating ADD characteristics with substandard brain power.

PS. Mechanical, non creative people never impressed me.
Any kid can follow rules and directions, but how many kids question what they are being told to do?

[celesul]

AD/HD people can excel in advanced areas with some ease, most actually find that as everyone else has more trouble, it gets easier. However, to get to the interesting parts, one must still survive school, and I'm on meds to do that, as I've learned to control enough to not get into trouble except with school.

Really, I wish they'd just change the school system a bit. My school is fairly good about it, but even they aren't perfect. I've forgotten to take meds a few times, and my math teacher was very sympathetic in terms of what she'd allow (we had a quiz that day) as long as it didn't give me an unfair advantage or distract the other kids. So I took the quiz standing up. Honestly, having desks for standing height in the back or side of the room would help most AD/HD kids a lot, as it allows less disruptive fidgeting, or even helps just hyper kids.

And most importantly, standing or using bouncy balls doesn't affect anyone else or give an unfair advantage. I'm in high school, and I want extra time on anything that involves writing because my handwriting is illegible unless I put a lot of effort into it. But I'd consider it cheating to take extra time on the reading or math sections of the SAT, because there are no handwriting issues, and I already do so much better than most people on them. My brother has the same moral code, and hated using extra time that he was allowed to take. For each of us, standing or fidgeting allows us to concentrate better without doing something that seems a bit like permitted cheating (depends on the subject though. I'm mildly dyslexic, and really do have trouble writing. But that is the only thing I take much extra time on).

In essence, we like accommodations that help us, but are neutral for anyone else. I need to use a pen instead of a pencil to increase the legibility of my handwriting. I want to stand while taking a test. The SAT essay section requires a pencil, and I was denied the accommodation of using a pen, and most teachers view standing as disruptive.

[suzyk]

I don't have ADD/ADHD, but I have some kind of learning disability. I did some research, and I related the most to dyscalculia, but 50 percent of the symptoms don't apply to me. I can see and read numbers perfectly, but I can't solve some questions that a normal person would be able to do with ease. I can't read analog clocks either, it takes me some time and I usually come up with the wrong time anyways. It's really weird, since most people are good at math and bad at language. So my teachers don't know how to help me.

[lancelot]

I don't have ADD/ADHD, but I have some kind of learning disability. I did some research, and I related the most to dyscalculia, but 50 percent of the symptoms don't apply to me. I can see and read numbers perfectly, but I can't solve some questions that a normal person would be able to do with ease. I can't read analog clocks either, it takes me some time and I usually come up with the wrong time anyways. It's really weird, since most people are good at math and bad at language. So my teachers don't know how to help me.

Wow, I had never heard of dyscalculia before, I was also suprised so many celebrities had it. I would imagine, there is a continum from mild to severe.

I would that you could excell in every way imaginable.

[Hdier]

The problem with ADD and ADHD is that a lot of doctors simply diagnose children who have shorter-than-average attention spans or who simply have more energy than normal with it; it actually is a real problem caused by a chemical imbalance in the brain.

Currently, my 'peers' in my math class are attempting to convince me that I have ADHD because I get bored after doing all of the work in the first ten minutes of a forty minute class, and start humming and such.

My brother has ADHD, though. (Fortunately, he got a real diagnosis instead of a 'here take these pills and stop bugging me' diagnosis)

[Jakalwarrior]

This post makes me giggle. People all through my past SWORE I had some sort of problem because I was the master of multi tasking. So what they saw as a lack of focus was really me not using my mind enough to keep me entertained. My husband (who is also an INTJ) has a mother that sits there and swears all day that he has ADD. People need to quit making excuses for those who require full attention to learn anything. I can half listen to most anything and retain enough to easly relay it back with my handy "excessive words" filter.

I am the person she speaks off lol. Even my shrink said I wasnt ADD, I was just learning faster than the other students and getting bored (I attended some pretty dumb schools).

[True Rune]

Yep, just about all of my siblings and myself are said to have ADD..
We were also truant during high school, which had dire consequences..

[lancelot]

I am the person she speaks off lol. Even my shrink said I wasnt ADD, I was just learning faster than the other students and getting bored (I attended some pretty dumb schools).

It's interesting how many people in this forum claim to ADD characteristics, and so many have made it to graduate school and beyond.

It's also interesting how many people with ADD traits are so freakin brilliant!

It seems to me most brilliant people are a little different,
you know either, ADD or Aspie traits, social anxiety disorder, or some other thing going on? I am refering to traits not full on symptoms, it seems to be a combination of different qualitites that make someone brilliant.

[Capwolf]

I am curious, are there any brilliant people who are not a little strange?
either ADD or Aspie traits? social anxiety disorder, or some other thing going on?
Yes, there are plenty. They tend to be considered just "successful," though. They don't need to be "brilliant but."

And you're not going to find many here, if you're looking for introverts who are significantly above average, intelligence-wise, and also socially successful enough not to have thought of themselves as having "Aspie traits." Being introverted brings social difficulty (especially in youth and older age) because we don't have the inner driving need to practice or keep up as often as extraverts do--although I would have thought that you Js would be less prone to being disorganized and mentally scattered.

[searcher]

I don't have ADD, although I display many of the symptoms.
My school books have random doodles all through them despite repeated warnings from teachers and there are always several bits of paper in my pencil case with plans or lists on them. I also have a bit of a compulsion with taking pens to bits.

[lancelot]

I don't have ADD, although I display many of the symptoms.
My school books have random doodles all through them despite repeated warnings from teachers and there are always several bits of paper in my pencil case with plans or lists on them. I also have a bit of a compulsion with taking pens to bits.

I don't know what more to say about ADD traits, so far we have said they tend to be associated with above average IQ, and creativity. People with ADD often develop coping skills later in life. Many people in this forum have ADD, and many are college graduates or are in grad. school. It is my opinion that certain types of high IQ make people have ADD. traits. Educators tend to neglect high IQ kids with ADD traits. Educators associate high IQ with good behavior, and being on task; they do this because it fits their system of control. Educators are not a group of enlightened people, they only accomodate ADD because the law requires it. Many kids labled ADD were made to feel retarded, or told they would never amount to anything, others have trancended the self-fulfilling prophecy and became highly successful.

[lancelot]

Yes, there are plenty. They tend to be considered just "successful," though. They don't need to be "brilliant but."

And you're not going to find many here, if you're looking for introverts who are significantly above average, intelligence-wise, and also socially successful enough not to have thought of themselves as having "Aspie traits." Being introverted brings social difficulty (especially in youth and older age) because we don't have the inner driving need to practice or keep up as often as extraverts do--although I would have thought that you Js would be less prone to being disorganized and mentally scattered.

INTP
Three out of four isn't bad. Just kidding!

Have you ever considered, Bobby Fisher? I know he has done some very strange things, but he is a chess genius. I had a professor in grad. school who said Fisher is autistic. My real question is what makes fisher a chess genius? Is it because he is strange or is he strange because he is a genius?

[Capwolf]

INTP
Three out of four isn't bad. Just kidding!
Don't worry; I have the exact same thought about the lot of you!

Have you ever considered, Bobby Fisher? I know he has done some very strange things, but he is a chess genius. I had a professor in grad. school who said Fisher is autistic. My real question is what makes fisher a chess genius? Is it because he is strange or is he strange because he is a genius?

If he's autistic--and I'm hesitant to trust armchair or rumored diagnosis--then that probably contributed to his success. Repetitive and fixed interests seem to be almost a necessary condition to liking chess. ;) He could be aloof and strange because of genius, a genius (partly) because of autistic focus, or both eccentric and genius. Any is a possibility.

I don't think one trait causes or implies another; they're separate traits that might rest in the same individual. But we're more likely to categorize eccentrics as geniuses because that's the stereotype, and they're more likely to take it up because it sounds better than "weird" and they need the validation more than the externally successful brilliant types.

I went to an academic summer camp in my early to middle teens. Smart, mostly nerdy kids all around. Most of them had unconventional or "strange" interests (but well within normal limits), and clearly cared a lot more about school than many young teenagers do. Still, they had no more trouble behaving in a socially appropriate manner than any unexperienced introvert does. And I had opportunity to see them studying for the sort of long periods a P would never have instituted--very few of them had (noticeable) problems with concentration or attention. Granted, this was short-term and unusual contact; but no one I talked to mentioned everyday problems at home that would lead a doctor to either suggested diagnosis.

[lancelot]

Don't worry; I have the exact same thought about the lot of you!



If he's autistic--and I'm hesitant to trust armchair or rumored diagnosis--then that probably contributed to his success. Repetitive and fixed interests seem to be almost a necessary condition to liking chess. ;) He could be aloof and strange because of genius, a genius (partly) because of autistic focus, or both eccentric and genius. Any is a possibility.

I don't think one trait causes or implies another; they're separate traits that might rest in the same individual. But we're more likely to categorize eccentrics as geniuses because that's the stereotype, and they're more likely to take it up because it sounds better than "weird" and they need the validation more than the externally successful brilliant types.

I went to an academic summer camp in my early to middle teens. Smart, mostly nerdy kids all around. Most of them had unconventional or "strange" interests (but well within normal limits), and clearly cared a lot more about school than many young teenagers do. Still, they had no more trouble behaving in a socially appropriate manner than any unexperienced introvert does. And I had opportunity to see them studying for the sort of long periods a P would never have instituted--very few of them had (noticeable) problems with concentration or attention. Granted, this was short-term and unusual contact; but no one I talked to mentioned everyday problems at home that would lead a doctor to either suggested diagnosis.

Well, remember we are talking about a very small group of people. An IQ of 130 would only represent about 2% of the tested population.

When we look back through history, we group the great men and women of genius together. Genius is an extreamly rare quality. It would be interesting to hear people share the feelings about their own experieces regarding their high intelligence and other qualities they may have. I know other people in the forum have expressed asperberger traits as well as ADD. All the various traits that accompany high, or above average IQ are very interesting and worth hearing about.

[Capwolf]

Becoming well-known in history is much rarer than high IQ--not that 2% of the population is actually all that rare! Even 0.2% is still four people from my high school alone. Not everyone who becomes famous or achieves great things would test at a genius IQ (Richard Feynman apparently does not, bogus "estimated actual IQ" excluded); not everyone who tests at a genius IQ does anything worth remembering; and not everyone who does great things is acknowledged or remembered, much less with her or his defining traits or appearance of intelligence noted. Also, we have a stereotype of genius that includes "strange" and because of which we might miss people with high IQ who don't behave strangely.

It would be an interesting exercise to see what intelligent people from the past were like, but I don't think that if we were to collect the remembered traits of successful people, we would come up with anything necessarily representative or applicable to high-IQ people today.

Also, I'm not convinced that this forum is full of geniuses. Asking for the IQ of an NT in public is unlikely to come back with great results: even if we know how we measure up, we're not necessarily going to admit it to others--especially if everyone before us has been going on about how smart they are. And that's a bridge we cross only if we admit it to ourselves first. Plus, even if we are more likely to score well on IQ tests, it's not necessarily because we have a lot of "g"--it could also easily be because we care more about the results, and solve that particular sort of problem more easily.

[lancelot]

Becoming well-known in history is much rarer than high IQ--not that 2% of the population is actually all that rare! Even 0.2% is still four people from my high school alone. Not everyone who becomes famous or achieves great things would test at a genius IQ (Richard Feynman apparently does not, bogus "estimated actual IQ" excluded); not everyone who tests at a genius IQ does anything worth remembering; and not everyone who does great things is acknowledged or remembered, much less with her or his defining traits or appearance of intelligence noted. Also, we have a stereotype of genius that includes "strange" and because of which we might miss people with high IQ who don't behave strangely.

It would be an interesting exercise to see what intelligent people from the past were like, but I don't think that if we were to collect the remembered traits of successful people, we would come up with anything necessarily representative or applicable to high-IQ people today.

Also, I'm not convinced that this forum is full of geniuses. Asking for the IQ of an NT in public is unlikely to come back with great results: even if we know how we measure up, we're not necessarily going to admit it to others--especially if everyone before us has been going on about how smart they are. And that's a bridge we cross only if we admit it to ourselves first. Plus, even if we are more likely to score well on IQ tests, it's not necessarily because we have a lot of "g"--it could also easily be because we care more about the results, and solve that particular sort of problem more easily.

Beethoven, Issac Newton had serious emotional problems, there are others but because it's late and time for bed, I am not going to make a long list.

I would like more people to comment about their learning experiences and their life experiences. I have no doubt most people in the forum are well above average on the IQ scale.

Often highly intelligent and creative people live and interpret the world around them very differnt from the average person. I have a friend who never finished high school,yet won scolarships for his Star Testing, consistently gettin in the 98 percentile each time. Any fool can get in the 98 percentile but how many people do that who never do homework or study and drop out of school. This kid never did home work in biology, or studied for tests he got an -A on the final and flunked the class because the teacher weighted the homework to bring up the grades of the other students.

Long before the PC was invented, before Woz and Jobs and Apple, a friend of mine In third grade, yeah third grade, brought in a computer game someone had made, it was a series of knobs, which when turned to the right combination of numbers it would light up. His name was Danny Sharp, I rememeber him and only him because he was brilliant; He was also very good at chess. Back in the proverbial day when I was in 3rd grade, kids were not expossed to electronics or any kind of computer game and most kids did not play chess. What is interesting is Danny understood how the computer game
worked and had no trouble explaining it.

[deicruxified]

I didn't do well in school and was truant a lot, but I did well on most tests and always scored high on SATs, and my principal and school guidance counselor were puzzled.
same here... i did bad at tests during highschool but scored superior on sat

[Snowdragon]

I have it and I have to take ritalin or else there is hell to pay. I was 11 before I was diagnosed with ADD. Before I was diagnosed, I had to deal with the non-stop lectures of All-The-Ways-I-Just-Don't-Get-It. I don't mind the side effects, it's better than the effects when I don't take it.

meanlittlechimp- ADD is more common among NPs (mainly Ns) Just a different way of processing information.

[overclockedgirl]

wow CCD I had a similar experience. I was diagnosed in 4th grade as ADD (inattentive) and I do think I have it, but I was too stubborn to take medication until I was out of high school even though it helped me a lot with schoolwork. Now I'm starting to see how ADD helps me in some areas so I dont' think it's all bad. But in elementary school I was put in remedial reading and they started teaching me everything one on one. Then I got a 98th percentile on the standardized test for vocab/reading and they put me in regular reading after my teacher saw the scores lol and I got 98th percentile in reading on the vocab section of standardized tests ever since then. Part of my improvement was out of being annoyed. The majority of the things I'm excellent at today I can thank people in my life in the past for telling me I'm an underacheiver and motivating me to be better than them at it lol.

[Bioplasmoid]

And I can relate to what YOU say, a lot. Going meta is a great way to put it. I think in my case I prefer to have an overview of something first, time to digest it mentally, then time to ask questions on specific details, if they arise in my mind. But the compulsion to only spend time on the overview and skip to the next mental link is very strong. I love wikipedia, not for accuracy but for links, however offtopic they may be.

Blaze2000, I can relate to what you say quite a lot. I have a really hard time just focusing on one thing to completion. Or never mind completion, just focusing long enough to get out of the starting gate, sometimes. My mind always wants to "go meta", and once I "understand the meta", then the detail-level loses interest value, and I can't bear to nail myself to it for any length of time.

I don't know if this has anything to do with ADD... (Have not been diagnosed with anything like this, but then again I haven't been tested either.)

[Snowdragon]

For some reason I see ADD as more an EP think more than any other type. I can see an INTJ with OCD but ADD seems the antithesis of what I picture INTJs to be (I only 4 well personally).

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This should explain everything :)

[Malotis]

I don't have ADD but I am very jealous of some of my friends getting perscribed aderol.

[Caucus]

I was diagnosed with ADD at a younger age. I'm a visual spatial-learner and a late-bloomer. I don't acknowledge the diagnosis. It seems as though I have the opposite of attention deficit. I can spend hours focusing on topics that interest me.
Alot of teachers and parents just slap labels on kids rather than looking behind the issue. They don't realise that people learn in different ways, the affects of diet, hearing-loss and earaches etc.

[burazekun]

I had a teacher step out and protect me from the hoards of people who thought I needed special ed because I had ADD. But the teacher noticed I took in EVERYTHING, because I wasn't looking at it didn't mean I didn't see it. It showed in all my test scores. She basically told them that it was a social disorder that needed to be worked on, but not the responisblity of the school.

I'm fine now of course but I cant live without multi tasking.

[SiMey]

I'd been thinking of starting a thread on a similar topic.

While I can't pretend to have researched much on ADD, I can discuss my personal experience in dealing with a certain group of families in society.

While I don't want to discount that ADD exists or that drug companies have an agenda to make big money out of telling people that it does...

I have come across a lot of families with pretty ordinary parenting skills where the child was labeled ADD. It seemed to be the diagnosis was based on the parents' views of the child and their behaviour.

I found that most of these kids were pretty normal (aside from one) and that chaotic haphazard parenting was an influencing factor in the child's behaviour and presentation. The child who was diagnosed with ADD and "not normal" was severely abused emotionally and psychologically.

Let's just say I'm a skeptic but am willing to hear other people's thoughts. My personal sample of experience is not a controlled study. I'm not saying it does not exist, just perhaps that is it over-diagnosed.

I can't believe it is as prevalent as it seems to be.

[lancelot]

I'd been thinking of starting a thread on a similar topic.

While I can't pretend to have researched much on ADD, I can discuss my personal experience in dealing with a certain group of families in society.

While I don't want to discount that ADD exists or that drug companies have an agenda to make big money out of telling people that it does...

I have come across a lot of families with pretty ordinary parenting skills where the child was labeled ADD. It seemed to be the diagnosis was based on the parents' views of the child and their behaviour.

I found that most of these kids were pretty normal (aside from one) and that chaotic haphazard parenting was an influencing factor in the child's behaviour and presentation. The child who was diagnosed with ADD and "not normal" was severely abused emotionally and psychologically.

Let's just say I'm a skeptic but am willing to hear other people's thoughts. My personal sample of experience is not a controlled study. I'm not saying it does not exist, just perhaps that is it over-diagnosed.

I can't believe it is as prevalent as it seems to be.

Yes, ADD is over diagnosed!

I have not met all that many brilliant people, the few I have met are differnt in the way they act and think.

The body chemistry of brilliant people is also different. Intensity is repeatedly listed as a charcteristic of well above average IQ.