INTJ Manager

[Llen]

I would like to know whether "managing people" is a rather taxing task for other INTJs on this forum.

At this point, I'm not sure if it's the fact that I:

* Can't focus, in depth, on my projects until my subordinates leave the office (since I have to deal with specific issues on their projects first). I would love to be left alone to solve my own problems; they are more interesting.

* Have a moderately hands-off approach to directing tasks unless my team is completely off the mark;

*Abhor petty office politics. In the span of a week, I have dealt with employees’ coping mechanisms and antics stemming from sheer immaturity to abject jealousy. One is still lamenting over what constitutes as “appropriate” for casual Fridays; I sent the “office protocol” memo on this two months ago… Still he does not understand.

* Grow weary of new teams every period. We have seasonal employees and each semester I have to train a new team, build new relationships and deal with new attitudes.


I come off as somewhat nice but unorganized since I don’t tell anyone, aside from upper management, details to the method of my madness. In actuality, I keep tabs on everyone and try to find ways to improve operations without ripping people’s illogical preconceptions to shreds on a daily basis. The goal of my team should be to implement the plan I create and provide feedback as necessary. However, my team’s feedback sounds more like whining rather than improvements.

Is there a way to be an effective manager without suppressing my INTJ tendencies? They probably believe that I “see right through them and find them wanting,” which would be a correct assumption.

[PRBori]

I would like to know whether "managing people" is a rather taxing task for other INTJs on this forum.

At this point, I'm not sure if it's the fact that I:

* Can't focus, in depth, on my projects until my subordinates leave the office (since I have to deal with specific issues on their projects first). I would love to be left alone to solve my own problems; they are more interesting.

A long time ago I was in a management position and although that has not being the case for quite a few years now I can honestly understand this point. I tend to do quite a bit of work at home and if for any reason I feel that I need time out from my environment, I ask to work from home.


* Have a moderately hands-off approach to directing tasks unless my team is completely off the mark;

Sometimes is much better to have a hands-on approach for it works much better in a management environment. You may want to reconsider your approach and do more hands-on.


*Abhor petty office politics. In the span of a week, I have dealt with employees’ coping mechanisms and antics stemming from sheer immaturity to abject jealousy. One is still lamenting over what constitutes as “appropriate” for casual Fridays; I sent the “office protocol” memo on this two months ago… Still he does not understand.

Unfortunatedly this is part of the deal since you are dealing with multiple personalities. Enforcing policies should not only be done by you, but others who may have a greater impact.


* Grow weary of new teams every period. We have seasonal employees and each semester I have to train a new team, build new relationships and deal with new attitudes.

Welcome to management. It is hard for us to repeat the same task over and over and training is one of those. Having to start from the beginning tends to be very tiring. And yes, dealing with new personalities can be a pain.


I come off as somewhat nice but unorganized since I don’t tell anyone, aside from upper management, details to the method of my madness. In actuality, I keep tabs on everyone and try to find ways to improve operations without ripping people’s illogical preconceptions to shreds on a daily basis. The goal of my team should be to implement the plan I create and provide feedback as necessary. However, my team’s feedback sounds more like whining rather than improvements.

It is hard for me to determined the issue here, what kind of manager are you? I think the above process really depends on what your duties are. Although as I mention before I'm not into management, I'm very stubborn and tend to do things my way regardless of what management thinks to some extend. It seems to be a typical INTJ trait. In addition, I also develop plans for my job and have provided submitted the detail plans for implementation, but I must admit not all parties join the effort for developing such plan nor do they provide the type of feedback I'm looking. They do like your team, whine about the process without providing feedback on how they would improve it. In this case we are in the same boat...



Is there a way to be an effective manager without suppressing my INTJ tendencies? They probably believe that I “see right through them and find them wanting,” which would be a correct assumption.

I will only suggest that you review your approach and try to get people's feedback thru a meeting rather than individually. You should also consider a hands-on approach in order to have a better relationship with your employees.

For me is hard to tell you exactly what to do since I have no idea on the type of management that you're working on. It seems like some areas are very similar to my job at this time.

In regards to suppressing your INTJ tendecies, I wouldn't change too much, but I would try to work on building a better relationship only for the sake of your career. Sometimes we have to adjust to the situations even if it means suppressing part of who we are.

It's kind of a plan and survival game... required only to ensure we excel on our plans and reach our goals.

[Llen]

Thanks for your response. Things actually took an interesting turn of events since I last wrote:

Due to an impending project, I had to turn on my INTJ tendencies in order to develop a plan for my team and implement it within a few hours. Several emails, memos, diagrams, charts and instruction manuals later, the office is quiet and everyone is working since I've given them more than enough work/information to keep them busy.

[PRBori]

Thanks for your response. Things actually took an interesting turn of events since I last wrote:

Due to an impending project, I had to turn on my INTJ tendencies in order to develop a plan for my team and implement it within a few hours. Several emails, memos, diagrams, charts and instruction manuals later, the office is quiet and everyone is working since I've given them more than enough work/information to keep them busy.

I'm glad things worked out. Putting our ideas in paper and diseminating them is always a good way to ensure others understand. Actually, that's normally the best way to do it.

People cannot read our minds. Currently I have someone trying to learn how I did my DB and is always asking me questions about what programming I used, how the DB's connect, and although I would love to tell him, I can't all the time. He is over 60+ and is great to see him want to learn, but I have so much to do myself that I can't always describe to him my own application or develop the technical and user manuals when its' still a work in progress.

Anyway, you get the point. :thumbsup:

[mind_wander]

Thanks for your response. Things actually took an interesting turn of events since I last wrote:

Due to an impending project, I had to turn on my INTJ tendencies in order to develop a plan for my team and implement it within a few hours. Several emails, memos, diagrams, charts and instruction manuals later, the office is quiet and everyone is working since I've given them more than enough work/information to keep them busy.

Glad to hear it. I have an BA Degree in Management. Although, currently I am a seasonal worker. lol, interesting how you are annoyed with seasonal workers when I am from the seasonal worker perspective. I am willing to work with the supervisors and upper management. Their duties is overload with tons upon tons of stuff, project, and more fun filled stuff. What I do is from a seasonal worker perspective, incase someone around me is new or already in the system, who needs help with something? I am glad to helped them out, if either A: Not paying any attention to what the supervisor or manager had just said, B: If they need someone [seasonal worker] to repeat for them, its fine with me; before the supervisor comes back with deep disappointment with tons of sarcasms. Now everyone around me are more on the lines of XSFJ, XSTJ, EXFP, ENTP, etc. I don't really find too any INTJs around me :( oh well, at least no one really is bothering me. Why? Your job is to do work and less talking :) Great I don't talk much and I do alot of work :) Only when I talk is when there are important questions or need some clarifications.

Like PRBori, said about more on the hands-on approach. A nice simple, step by step program helps people understand what an INTJ is thinking? How close is the INTJ step by step process, its by a long-shot. There is more too it than that, but thats under that lovely small print, if you are not an administer position, then you don't get too many rights to do what you want? You also want to know who is that trouble maker making gossips and clear up any untruthfulness. They are very annoying and creates internal and external conflicts within the departments or other departments. Yeah, your job as an INTJ is to eliminate that crap immediately!!! Before its going to get out of hand, like in this situation you just mentioned above. Great you managed to figured out this complex system, its part of life, so suck it up and take it with pride.

[Vicimdhar]

I'm not a manager, but one method of dealing with office politics is by always considering it as part of the problem to solve. Then you can use your INTJ-tendencies to deal with that. As I plan to take on a leadership position later, I'm now already trying to understand how this kind of politics works and can be influenced.

[treharnevx]

Thank you so much. I love this forum. I feel like I am home.

[Ricardo Diaz]

I can't speak for a corporate environment but in a small business setting, if your staff are in a lawless third world country (has it's benefits) fear and setting an example of erring employees is an excellent management tactic to ensure loyalty and consistent performance. Nothing like a good beating or pay cut/negative penalty to increase output. Fear is an excellent motivator. Also necessary if you can't/don't trust your employees.

[Kitesurf]

Welcome to the INTJ management club.

INTJ's can be one of the best managers around. Always concerned about efficiency and the bottom line, fair and consistent with people, and unemotional.

To counter some of the characteristic INTJ weaknesses.
Have slightly more team meetings than you think are necessary. Keep them jovial in the beginning, then turn them serious (discuss tasks / goals / problems), then finish on a high note discussing everything that is being done well (a good time to hand out awards etc).

Study the MBTI personalities of your team.. especially of the members that seem higher maintainance. Use MBTI to communicate with them on their level.. (I.E. Feelings versus Thinking, Sensing versus Intuitive etc). This really helps with high maintenance empoyees that also happen to be high producers.

Its not easy managing people, most people are a little crazy and self centered (or at least seem that way to me.)

Good luck

[Polymath20]

Managers don't have to be engaging, they just have to delegate well. Any TJ can probably see the end goal and devise a way to get there. From there, it's just a matter of knowing who on your team can do which part. Some managers are friendly, outgoing and personable. Some aren't. The best managers will be hands-off and let their people do their work, so INTJ's are good for this.

[Kitesurf]

PS. One last characteristic INTJ weakness.. Don't forget to keep advertising how well you are doing and consequently your team now that you are managing them. There's only one reason to take on all that extra work.. Your reward.

[scorpiomover]

I would like to know whether "managing people" is a rather taxing task for other INTJs on this forum.In the UK, management is notoriously difficult. Many managers are not that good at their job. So I gather that everyone finds it hard.

* Can't focus, in depth, on my projects until my subordinates leave the office (since I have to deal with specific issues on their projects first). I would love to be left alone to solve my own problems; they are more interesting.

* Have a moderately hands-off approach to directing tasks unless my team is completely off the mark;

*Abhor petty office politics. In the span of a week, I have dealt with employees’ coping mechanisms and antics stemming from sheer immaturity to abject jealousy. One is still lamenting over what constitutes as “appropriate” for casual Fridays; I sent the “office protocol” memo on this two months ago… Still he does not understand. I worked for INTJs and ENTJs. I found that most of the time, the situation was utter chaos, and the way that I and others were handled, caused a lot of problems for the manager. Those managers would have to micro-manage me and their other employees, watching everything they did. The situation was difficult for everyone, the manager, me, and the other employees in the department.

However, I ALSO found that some managers were a dream to work for. Everything went like clockwork. The manager still had to put in a lot of interpersonal time in, to communicate effectively with his employees. But quite often, they had at least half of their time free for themselves. One of the managers I worked for, got things so well-managed, that he even found he could leave almost every Friday lunctime. Normally, Friday afternoons were the time when everything went wrong. But not in his department.

1) I noticed that in those departments that worked well, the manager had set up his own systems for handling the departmental problems. Those systems sorted out a ot of problems by themselves.

2) Those managers realised that different people needed to be instructed differently to get them to understand what needed to be done. The way of instruction that worked for an employee, usually corresponded with their MBTI type. When they used the system of instruction that worked for that employee, the employee understood what was needed, and the job was done very efficiently. When the employees was not instructed according to the way he/she would understand things, then the instructions were rarely carried out correctly, and often the employee needed to be told 6-7 different times. Often this resulted in the manager having to watch over the employee during the whole job, to see that it was done correctly.

3) Different people responded to different ways of being talked to. Some people were A-types, that responded better to pressure. Others were B-types, pressuring them would just make them work much more poorly.

4) Different people have different strengths and weaknesses. Selecting the right person for the right task, is crucial. Just by using good selection for delegating tasks, usually does improve the efficiency of the task many times over what it normally takes.

The differences in the different departments were just astounding. I've also seen that when a manager that usually had a lot of problems, changed to start using the above, then his life got much, much easier. So it's not static. Even if you have a bad team, it appears that if you change your methods and systems to a more useful one, they become a very efficient team.

Also, I've seen that even good managers, when they slacked off on a project, and didn't follow their systems completely, then things started going wrong, and they found they had more problems. So it is a matter of consistently doing what works, every single time.

* Grow weary of new teams every period. We have seasonal employees and each semester I have to train a new team, build new relationships and deal with new attitudes.From what I observed and experienced, most of the learning period, was a matter of the manager identifying the methods of communication and the methods of social interaction favoured by each team member, and then using what worked for each team member. When the manager did this quickly, the employeee automatically got into things very, very quickly. When the manager took more time to do this, the employee also took more time to develop. Identifying their type, and using the methods that worked for them, was key.

I would seriously consider using MBTI to identify people's needs of instruction and communication needs, because from what I've seen, the MBTI categories seem to roughly correspond with the problems that people caused in the workplace, and the solutions that would work best for each employee.

Is there a way to be an effective manager without suppressing my INTJ tendencies? Use your strengths to their advantages. Work out an efficient system for dealing with each individual employee, and work out an efficient system for handling the department as a whole. Your INTJ-ness will work to your advantage, and make you an excellent manager.

They probably believe that I “see right through them and find them wanting,” which would be a correct assumption.The bosses I respected, and worked best for, made me feel like this. But I really didn't mind at all, because they managed me well, and that made my workload very enjoyable and very easy to do. I'd rather have them any day of the week.

[krisl]

I was in lower level management for a while, and the interpersonal relationships were very annoying to me.

[Qjiggy]

I can't speak for a corporate environment but in a small business setting, if your staff are in a lawless third world country (has it's benefits) fear and setting an example of erring employees is an excellent management tactic to ensure loyalty and consistent performance. Nothing like a good beating or pay cut/negative penalty to increase output. Fear is an excellent motivator. Also necessary if you can't/don't trust your employees.

OMG. Fear is the WORSE form of motivation. In any organization behavior studies, fear has negative effect on a workplace. It causes distrust, unhonest work, absenteeism, and the manager using this can be labelled as bullying. Because of this tactic, it has brought a strong union movement to battle employers that demonstrate such uneducated form of management. And if you were to do business here in Canada, bullying/harassing in workplace has no place and it can be used to take unemployment issurance, as to which the employers must contribute, increasing operating expense.

To the OP, read and re-read dale carnegie's book titles "how to make friends and influence them".

I'm a retail manager. I work with people between 16-65+ years of age. Many from different ethnicity, different religion, and yes there will always be problems. There's really no way to avoid it, unless you train them to be emotionless creatures, who's purpose is to their job and not talk to each other. Mind you, some of those who use their emotion, does a better job, better than I could have done. The trick is to treat each problem as a burning fire in a Forrest. Your job is to extinguish the flames, but to do so, you must avoid it from spreading. Miscommunication is the number one source to engulfing your whole workday to become less productive. I've been doing this for over 10 years and I really need to get out of it! Lol.

If you guys get a chance, read one of the books written by Pateick Lencioni. One of his best selling book titled "the five dysfunction of a team" is my management style in my job. It's a lot of work for me, but it was a greater challenge to convert the people mentioned above to come together..,without losing/firing anyone, which in many times I thought it was the only solution. Of course I couldn't have done it without the INTP owner. But if he was more aggressive type person, I probably would have convinced him to fire many :)

[Autumnleaf]

I read "How to Win Friends and Influence People." as well as other books on dealing with people often. I'll have to check out Lencioni's book mentioned above. I work with small teams who usually know their jobs well and are happy with me because I tend to help them do part of their job as well as my own. This frees them up to do more of the 'dealing with people' part of our job which can be taxing to me, but they seldom know that because they shield me from it.

[Fishism]

Managers don't have to be engaging, they just have to delegate well. Any TJ can probably see the end goal and devise a way to get there. From there, it's just a matter of knowing who on your team can do which part. Some managers are friendly, outgoing and personable. Some aren't. The best managers will be hands-off and let their people do their work, so INTJ's are good for this.

I'm with Poly on this one. Most INTJs in management are aware of their strengths and weaknesses and understand the thing that got them in a position of power. This "thing" often doesn't translate well into an interpersonal skill. A subordinate/associate/co-manager who knows how to translate "big picture system" into "little picture people" can be the necessary bridge between levels in an organization.

An INTJ manager can almost give the following order: "You..that's right you over there. Your job is to talk properly to others since I can't. Here's what I want you to say...........".

[Qjiggy]

Interpersonal skill are the worst. I have had people come to me and ask me for advice when they are in tears because life circumstances isn't giving them what they want. *sigh. So many times that I've told many that I'm not the best suited person to console others, but I will lend my ears and give my honesty when the time calls for it. I've once, flat out, said I'm not good with emotions and I think she needed someone to hug her....but I couldn't. I don't really understand why and I don't want to re-live that moment. I'm guessing that's lack of interpersonal skill?

I gotta get me out from retail and do more of processing job :)

[Warrior]

* Can't focus, in depth, on my projects until my subordinates leave the office (since I have to deal with specific issues on their projects first). I would love to be left alone to solve my own problems; they are more interesting.

Why are they "your" projects and not the team's projects? There can be reasons for that, but having that be a common occurrence can cause problems with your team. Of course managers do perform tasks that their teams don't, but those aren't really projects. When I need time to get those done away from interruptions, I try to move to a private room.

* Have a moderately hands-off approach to directing tasks unless my team is completely off the mark;

How good or bad of a style this is depends a lot on your team and the environment you are in. A lot of people consider this a great management style.

*Abhor petty office politics. In the span of a week, I have dealt with employees’ coping mechanisms and antics stemming from sheer immaturity to abject jealousy. One is still lamenting over what constitutes as “appropriate” for casual Fridays;

I wouldn't really consider those examples of office politics. Your team isn't a set of drones that leave their personal life at the office door on their way in. Everyone has different personal issues, levels of maturity, likes, dislikes, and similar things. Sometimes these things are just quirks that don't impact their work, sometimes there are problems that can, and sometimes these things rise to the level of needing corrective action. This is part of being a manager. In fact, it is one of the most important parts.

I sent the “office protocol” memo on this two months ago… Still he does not understand.

Sending a memo might be the start of the communication, but additional steps are almost always needed to deliver the message.


* Grow weary of new teams every period. We have seasonal employees and each semester I have to train a new team, build new relationships and deal with new attitudes.

Are you in the right management position for you? Different environments have different challenges, so there may be opportunity to find something that better suits you. Beyond that, you can look at this as a chance to build that skill set. No matter where you go, you will probably have to train new employees at some point.

I come off as somewhat nice but unorganized since I don’t tell anyone, aside from upper management, details to the method of my madness. In actuality, I keep tabs on everyone and try to find ways to improve operations without ripping people’s illogical preconceptions to shreds on a daily basis. The goal of my team should be to implement the plan I create and provide feedback as necessary. However, my team’s feedback sounds more like whining rather than improvements.

That would lead to whining anywhere. Why not tell them the goal and let them create the plan with your guidance? That way it is their plan, they have ownership of it, and will probably be more motivated to make sure it gets done.

Of course that's not always possible and the degree to which it is possible depends on your team and their abilities, but getting a team more engaged in creating a plan is one way to create a better atmosphere and see better results.

[teri]

Well, your management skills will grow over time, especially if you are always looking for ways to improve everything(including your own skills!). What works for you and what works for the particular environment you are in will be different than what works for others, but here is what works for me( and i love managing):

As a manager of a small business, my job is to determine what needs to be done, and then accomplish those goals. Obviously I can get a lot more done with more people. I am clear and concise with goals and expectations. I have a ton of sayings such as " the business is here to support us, so we need to support the business", and all of those similar ones. Anyway, luckily for me, I LOVE to train people and have worked on my training skills for fifteen years. I am also very secure, so i don't need to prove anything or worry about an employee outshining me (as an owner, security is made easy-I have had jobs where there would be one other employee above me who would try to make things horrible for me!).

Most employees want to do well, and if they are given what they need will perform

I care about the business or project and enthusiastically and clearly promote those goals to the employees (and try to choose employees who are already excited by the business or goals of the business)

I care about the lives and goals of the employees and show it. I have great confidence in the abilities and skills if the employees and know that if they are properly trained and I make an effort to think about them and their goals (and I am clear and honest), the employees will appreciate that and it cuts down on drama, office politics, etc..

I happen to love training, so I have put a lot of effort into doing a better job of training.
I work extremely hard, and love to lead by example.

When i was younger, sometimes I was perhaps a bit too rigid and failed to understand that my goals didn't necessarily mesh with those of the employees, but my management skills have improved a lot over the past fifteen yrs.