Women and Musicians

[Nomadofthehills]

To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


What is it about musicians that turns on women?

Also, I shouldn't have to say this, but by "women" I realize that SOME women are not attracted to musicians, blah blah blah.


Anyway, discuss.

[daydreamer]

for me, it would be beauty.

a good musician has the power to make beauty.

of course so does a guy with a great stereo and an awesome music collection :)

[Blse]

I would assume that creativity is attractive. I like to draw and girls in H.S. (much less so in college) loved that. I still think creativity is always a good quality though.

[Fanowene]

Very geeky version of this:
The night before the ACM Programming Contest (as in Friday night) there was a computer party and I was playing Beatles RockBand on Wii with some other people. Eventually most of the people I knew had left and I think we were three people or so left in the room. One of the students then decided to play the guitar and sing at the same time (and he was doing so in a calm/quite way; he didn't have an ego). That was impressive and definitely attractive. It showed the soft side (though I already had the impression that he was very soft/nice in general), and also showed a lot of skill (or at least that he was ready to risk something; I was so new to the game that I had no chance of playing my part and checking up on what he was doing). I think his name is the only name I learned this weekend (including last name, thanks to name tags).

[Shorgenfunkel]

Brotip: To exploit this, don't write metal.

Except doom metal.

[Horrorgasm]

I'm a bass player. If you count that as a musician it has never helped my dating life.

[BlackOp]

Girls love musicians...and always will. This is proven fact #3 of nature...dont question it. ^^^ Yeah but you play bass. :p

[Causa Mortis]

I had a buddy who was so incredibly desperate for women that he trolled around with this stupid guitar all the time in high school and in college. Needless to say it failed. Miserably.

[Coralaisly]

My best friend is married to a musician. She just about died a little when she listened to their latest album (he didn't let her come to the recording studio. he wanted it to be a suprise, so he always conveniently sent her to my house when they were going to record) and realized that one of the songs was about her. She called me all frantic and excited telling me how amazing he was and how poetic it all was and blah blah blah. I can't really understand that.. I can't say I'd care either way if a song was writen about me, I don't need that outward validation.

When I dated a musician, it had more to do with his intensity and confidence paired with the serenity and grace that he displayed, he almost reminded me of a lion, proud and strong, but not vain. In control and perfectly ok with himself (at least outwardly). I was drawn to that confidence and grace like a moth to the flame.

I guess it really depends on the type of woman and the genre of musician, too.

[zibber]

Also, I shouldn't have to say this, but by "women" I realize that SOME women are not attracted to musicians, blah blah blah.

I'm glad you're aware of the generalization. You might also be interested to find out that men are attracted to female musicians as well. And artists in general. And some are attracted to creative people of their own biological sex. Verily.

[SpaceCadet]

I'm glad you're aware of the generalization. You might also be interested to find out that men are attracted to female musicians as well. And artists in general. And some are attracted to creative people of their own biological sex. Verily.

My man goes crazy for the rock n' roll chicks.
By the way, I love how reasonable you are, Zibber. It's nice to see. Verily.

[Antares]

Musicians usually have intense personalities, and if they're really passionate about their music, it's extremely attractive to me. They just have this... chaotic, unconventional, but brilliant mind, and music is my passion as well, as I consider myself a musician. It's hard to put into words what exactly I find so attractive about their minds, but let's just say, a lot of them have very complex personalities, and are prone to... dazzling me in a stunning flash of hypothetical lightning. There's a theory of that in This Is Your Brain on Music (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.). I don't have much of an opinion on that, but yes, I'm fatally attracted to musicians.

[liquidzilla]

I usually find them irritating, way too into music and I can't relate as I barely play music at all anymore. I think of music as a private thing and dislike people playing in front of me (which all musicians I've met do). It just feels like they are showing off and I like to keep music as something meaningful to the person (i.e. a musician wrote a song about me and I was quite angry, I didn't want my life put into music).

[SelfMadeBum]

The passion.

The unbridled, unrestrained passion.

[realitycheque]

There are biological roots to this attraction. The most obvious is in songbirds, where the male courts the female with his musical virtuosity.

In the human brain, music can be a secondary component of the "reward system", and is thought to be associated with noradrenaline which regulates attention, and which is indirectly chemically balanced with dopamine (euphoria, love, pleasure, addiction). See To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

But all that nice stuff about passion and creativity is true too.

[catzmeow]

I'd rather have a nice scientist or military officer, personally.

[runoverazebra]

I dated a guy that was a musician for a while. I didn't know he was a musician before we started dating. It didn't add or detract from his attractiveness. Then I found out that he was a shitty musician, and his attractiveness level fell quite a bit. Honestly, I would take a nerd/geek over a musician any day.

[Murky Muse]

I respect anyone that can play an instrument because it is hard and takes a lot practice. If said musician also happens to be an attractive guy then all the better.

[ToC]

Just learn one really good song, and then tell every chick you bring home that you wrote it just for them. You might want to change a few words here and there if you're dating multiple women in a social circle...

[MartinH]

Dunno, but it runs in my family, my mum and her sister have both settled down with musicians. I'm learning guitar, but my wife says she'll only be impressed when I can play Bryan Adams for her, so it isn't going to end well...

[Samoan Corleone]

Music requires skill and skills are attractive, like nun chuck skills, boar-hunting skills, computer hacking skills.

It's a good thing I had vocal and piano lessons at a young age. ;)

[Blse]

The passion.

The unbridled, unrestrained passion.

I'd rather have a nice scientist or military officer, personally.

Music requires skill and skills are attractive, like nun chuck skills, boar-hunting skills, computer hacking skills.

Those three statements together are interesting in that they support the same, rather simple idea:

If passion is both: attractive in a romantic context, and commonly required for success (jobs like scientist require extensive training and experience that is hard to obtain without passion), then scientists or highly skilled people professionals are likely to be attractive by virtue of their passion (like musicians).

Or it's wishful thinking because I'm an over-educated civil servant in training and can't play any instrument :laugh:. Maybe I'm going to start a thread on "Women and analysts."

[songofcalamity]

Depends. Like the comic, most of them are pretentious and pretentious musicians aren't really attractive, in my opinion. I think it's their passion for the craft that makes female swoon over them. Women see the depth they put into their craft, and female are more idealistic, so they hope that they can receive a similar kind of intensity from the musicians. Sadly, these musicians would always put their craft before the women.

[catzmeow]

If passion is both: attractive in a romantic context, and commonly required for success (jobs like scientist require extensive training and experience that is hard to obtain without passion), then scientists or highly skilled people professionals are likely to be attractive by virtue of their passion (like musicians).


I actually agree with this. I am inspired by and attracted to passion in other people. However, I prefer the passion of the critical thinker or the man who serves his country to the passion of the musician. It is my contention that creative types tend to be slightly unstable.

I prefer people who are passionate about issues or ideas.

[invicta]

Well the fantasy of it is that they will write soulful songs for me.

The reality of it is that most of the time is spent tuning the instrument, and playing short bursts of songs written by other people.

[une fille]

Skilled hands and the ability to serenade me. I just want to be wooed, you know?

[JCrow]

I am a musician; jazz trumpet player and composer making a living in NYC. I don't think any girl ever dated me because of my music. I will say this, of the two relationships I've had, both girls seemed encouraging early on in the relationship, then by the end they were like "Will you take a day off and stop practicing that thing!!" I'm sure they were more than a bit frustrated with my constant practice(I usually practice 6-8 hours a day). I am extremely committed and focused towards growing and becoming the best musician I can be.

Woman want 'rockstars' not REAL dedicated, disciplined musicians. Most people will never understand how incredible it is to be a REAL improvisor, not just someone that strums chords and sings the same song every night.

[Nomadofthehills]

Woman want 'rockstars' not REAL dedicated, disciplined musicians. Most people will never understand how incredible it is to be a REAL improvisor, not just someone that strums chords and sings the same song every night.

Someone's bitter.

[JRant]

Music seems to be the one area where men are allowed to truly express themselfs

[Samoan Corleone]

Music seems to be the one area where men are allowed to truly express themselfs

Don't forget the sports field.

"That quarterback kinda reminds me of this guy I sorta don't like."
*Quarterback gets sacked*

[PortInStorm]

Yep, it's skill- I feel the same way towards a guy who can fix cars, build things, etc. Anytime he can do something really well, cool. Gives him a chance to display unrestrained confidence, like he owns the situation.

JCrow's so right- improv is so difficult, requires such a wide foundation of repetoire, superb communication with the band, creativity on the spot, and absolute knowledge of your instrument inside and out. Partners want to see the "stage", but probably not all that goes into the development (and maintenance) of that stage skill.

[DuValK]

I play piano. Pianists may not be as 'sexy' as guitar players, but I still get girls

[Samoan Corleone]

I play piano. Pianists may not be as 'sexy' as guitar players, but I still get girls

Pianists are for girls with class. ;)

[Causa Mortis]

Don't forget the sports field.

"That quarterback kinda reminds me of this guy I sorta don't like."
*Quarterback gets sacked*

Heh yeah I miss those days. A healthy, masculine outlet for aggressive energy. It was marvelous.

[4x5is12]

The guy I like's a drummer. Come to think of it, I think I first realized how much I liked him when I saw him play. For me, I think it's attractive b/c it shows the guy's got sensitivity and depth of feeling and creative passion. And then there's the pure admiration of creative talent, and I love competency. But it's not like in that cartoon. I can't STAND musicians that are in it for the fame or money or - worst of all - girls. That is so not cool. I harbour great contempt for such persons. I only respect the ones that actually love what they do. And I wouldn't like a guy just BECAUSE he's a musician. That is so superficial.

[mrStevens]

The 'A' class of pretty much any endeavor will be attractive to the opposite sex me thinks. There are even groupies for world class chess players.

If you are good at something. Other people know you or your name. You get attention. Musicians especially get attention on stage by the rest of the audience. Public speakers get attention by speaking in front of crowds. Who doesn't want to say proudly, "That's my sig other up there."

[Corvineve]

Music affects emotion. It has enormous power to alter and control mood. It can induce physical responses from toe tapping to full body involvement. A song can energize, relax, make you laugh or cry or lull you to sleep. A melody or beat can evoke memory, seed fantasy, suggest culture or era. It can be anything. But the reaction it causes is primitive and pure. Ancient matches strength with contemporary. It is infinite.
The musician is its creator. Its source. The magical creature who translates the invisible language of feeling into audible form and gives it freely and unselfishly to the wind.
We must show appreciation for such generosity.
And the anticipation of the reward for that is what makes women lust for musicians.

[realitycheque]

Music affects emotion. It has enormous power to alter and control mood. It can induce physical responses from toe tapping to full body involvement. A song can energize, relax, make you laugh or cry or lull you to sleep. A melody or beat can evoke memory, seed fantasy, suggest culture or era. It can be anything. But the reaction it causes is primitive and pure. Ancient matches strength with contemporary. It is infinite.
The musician is its creator. Its source. The magical creature who translates the invisible language of feeling into audible form and gives it freely and unselfishly to the wind.
We must show appreciation for such generosity.
And the anticipation of the reward for that is what makes women lust for musicians.

Emotions. Biochemicals. One in the same. So romantic.

From wikipedia:
Dopamine is commonly associated with the pleasure system of the brain, providing feelings of enjoyment and reinforcement to motivate a person proactively to perform certain activities. Dopamine is released (particularly in areas such as the prefrontal cortex) by naturally rewarding experiences such as food, sex, drugs, and neutral stimuli that become associated with them.

Dopaminergic neurons of the midbrain are the main source of dopamine in the brain. Dopamine has been shown to be involved in the control of movements, the signaling of error in prediction of reward, motivation, and cognition.

Dopamine is closely associated with reward-seeking behaviors, such as approach, consumption, and addiction. Recent researches suggest that the firing of dopaminergic neurons is a motivational substance as a consequence of reward-anticipation. This hypothesis is based on the evidence that, when a reward is greater than expected, the firing of certain dopaminergic neurons increases, which consequently increases desire or motivation towards the reward.

Dopamine's role in experiencing pleasure has been questioned by several researchers. It has been argued that dopamine is more associated with anticipatory desire and motivation (commonly referred to as "wanting") as opposed to actual consummatory pleasure (commonly referred to as "liking").

So one might extrapolate that groupies are addicted to musicians, and have a smidgen of scientific foundation to back it up.

[Corvineve]

Groupies are an exaggerated version of people who collect books personally inscribed by the author or chase after celebrities to have their photos taken together. They try to collect some tangible evidence or shared experience from their target to boost their sense of worth and status among those like themselves that it matters to. The Glory of being brushed by the hand of the famous, in exchange for the abandonment of dignity. It is superficial, false and about the lack within the groupie. Some may be musical, but others pursue NASCAR drivers, artists or atheletes etc. Main requirement; fame and money and exposure.
A stalker is a lone groupie, maybe focused on someone well-known and visible, maybe not.
It's not about innocent attraction. It's about agenda.
Different kind of pleasure, same chemical reaction or not.

[Rohsiph]

Woman want 'rockstars' not REAL dedicated, disciplined musicians. Most people will never understand how incredible it is to be a REAL improvisor, not just someone that strums chords and sings the same song every night.

Generally, and noting it moves off from the basic topic, but I'd say it's alike for writers: women want the "poet" who will string together a couple horrifically cliched rhymes 'especially for her,' not someone who has spent a decade crafting a unique voice and vision who is still rarely satisfied with any of his output.

Someone's bitter.

Like a peculiar fruit that'd be addictive once one's used to that initial burn.

For me, I think it's attractive b/c it shows the guy's got sensitivity and depth of feeling and creative passion. And then there's the pure admiration of creative talent, and I love competency.

I doubt this is the norm. This is what an artist would want to be admired for, but most of the artists I know have yet to find anyone like this (self included). True creativity is scary--where does it come from? How did it get there? Why isn't everyone else like that?

It's much better (for the regular folk) if one's talents tend to fit in with the conventional sounds and styles.

[Silverity]

Generally, and noting it moves off from the basic topic, but I'd say it's alike for writers: women want the "poet" who will string together a couple horrifically cliched rhymes 'especially for her,' not someone who has spent a decade crafting a unique voice and vision who is still rarely satisfied with any of his output.


Hm, I disagree with this. If a guy claims talent and in reality sucks I'd call that a turn off.

This thread, like many others, is a generalization ("all women") fought back with miniscule retortions ("In my experience"). I guess I'll add my own =P

I dated a pianist. He, as a musician, and in my opinion, was brilliant. He could sit down at a table and just... write music. Left to right, top to bottom, just write it the way I'd write a letter. He had every note, combination of notes, and stylistic phrasings in his head like a language. It blew my mind. His passion is what caught my eye, and his genuine talent held it.

If he had been equally good at, say, designing buildings, I'd have been equally lured. I love music, being a once-player myself, but really what got me was that he had something he loved, and he was pursuing it.

I've been approached by bad writers and bad musicians, and people who really want talent but just don't have the creativity. Maybe they'll grow into it. Either way, I didn't feel the same spark of interest for them. If it isn't a real talent being pursued with real ambition I'm afraid I won't care much for it.

I'm sure SOME women want musicians just for the sake of having one, but not all women. I'm sure there are SOME women who really don't want a musician...after all, they tend to tour about and a lot of them have music as their first love and the woman has to be content with second place.

What I'm trying to say is that I'm not sure it has to do with music or being a musician, I think people in general are attracted to success, talent and drive.

[MikeC]

I'm glad you're aware of the generalization. You might also be interested to find out that men are attracted to female musicians as well. And artists in general. And some are attracted to creative people of their own biological sex. Verily.

I'd verily go gay for John Legend.

[JCrow]

I remember reading a while back that women are attracted to Social Status above all else. This going back possibly to wanting to be with the Chief of the tribe, and the social advantages that go along with that.

If people are looking up to a famous musician(or famous anything), then maybe that's some of the motivation. Everyone is paying attention to this guy, so he seems important, so you want to be with him and make him yours.

Obviously this is a huge generalization, just trying to think of another reason why this attraction to Rockstar musicians exists(and i'm standing by my 'Rockstar' statement).

Because someone will try to state the same is true for men wanting to be with 'important' women, I will use the idea of the 'trophy wife' as counter evidence. As well as Jerry Seinfeld's bit on how men will date cashiers, and they don't care what a woman does, as long as she's attractive.

I am attracted to people with a passion for something in life, my passion happens to be music. I really have difficulty relating to people that don't have something they really love to do. (Most people have not found something they love, which is why I can't relate to most people)

Maybe the whole thing is more about 'Having a passion', or something that you're really into that makes you attractive?

[Zodd]

Supposedly men with creative jobs like "painters, writers, musicians whatever" have twice the amount of sex then men without creative jobs.

[Corvineve]

This was written in 1917 by (female) poet Sara Teasedale, one of the most often quoted lyric poets of all time...

PIERROT

Pierrot stands in the garden
Beneath a waning moon,
And on his flute he fashions
A fragile silver tune.

Pierrot plays in the garden,
He thinks he plays for me,
But I am quite forgotten
Under the cherry tree.

Pierrot plays in the garden,
And all the roses know
That Pierrot loves his music, -
But I love Pierrot.

[Antares]

I am a musician; jazz trumpet player and composer making a living in NYC. I don't think any girl ever dated me because of my music. I will say this, of the two relationships I've had, both girls seemed encouraging early on in the relationship, then by the end they were like "Will you take a day off and stop practicing that thing!!" I'm sure they were more than a bit frustrated with my constant practice(I usually practice 6-8 hours a day). I am extremely committed and focused towards growing and becoming the best musician I can be.

Woman want 'rockstars' not REAL dedicated, disciplined musicians. Most people will never understand how incredible it is to be a REAL improvisor, not just someone that strums chords and sings the same song every night.

Well, if they think you're devoting too much time to the instrument and not enough time to them, that can be a problem. Most "streetboy" guitarists don't have that much skill, to be honest, and it's hard to tell who really has a passion for their instrument as opposed as someone who just lugs it around all day if you just deal with them on a superficial basis. Me, I devoted most of my life to the piano, and I play at a semi-professional level. It's immensely satisfying, but nobody has dated me because of my skills with the keyboard (some of my friends have found my devotion to the instrument quite baffling). Most of them heard me play a few easy tunes on my piccolo, and they went gaga. It's not that I can't play hard music on my flute and piccolo, as I am in a Symphonic ensemble; but it's not like I'm going to go around playing the solo from Stars and Stripes Forever. If she's not a musician, play an easy, soulful tune to her, and you're on the right track. If she is, she'll probably be practicing as much as you do, and when both of you are done, go have quality time.

[froggifunki]

What about "Men and Musicians"?

I have this tiny fantasy of writing soulful, truly exquisite songs for a guy and them pushing him over the edge and into my arms. Likelihood of this happening?


Music affects emotion. It has enormous power to alter and control mood. It can induce physical responses from toe tapping to full body involvement. A song can energize, relax, make you laugh or cry or lull you to sleep. A melody or beat can evoke memory, seed fantasy, suggest culture or era. It can be anything. But the reaction it causes is primitive and pure. Ancient matches strength with contemporary. It is infinite.
The musician is its creator. Its source. The magical creature who translates the invisible language of feeling into audible form and gives it freely and unselfishly to the wind.
We must show appreciation for such generosity.
And the anticipation of the reward for that is what makes women lust for musicians.

^this. Stunningly said. (it made me check your profile, and darn it, Corvineve, you're a girl. :P)

Passion and Skill - I think that's mostly it for the deep women, "rockstar" complex/social status for the shallow ones. And the raw emotion / beauty of it, for all of us. There it is, in a nice over-simplified generalization/nutshell.

[Rohsiph]

What about "Men and Musicians"?

Regular small-talk topic among men often seems to be "which celebrity would you want to be with." Probably tends toward raunchy more often than not, but regardless the few times I'm tempted toward thinking about this sort of thing I couldn't care less about anyone on the tabloids.

However, three not-so-popular female musicians I'd drop everything for the opportunity to spend some time with (not necessarily raunchy--perhaps even preferably 'tame'). In both cases it all has to do with the passion and the impeccable resonance between their musics and my own aesthetic leanings.

Regular guys just want to frolic with fashion models just as regular girls just want to frolic with rock stars.

[saberu]

women like musicians because they draw attention onto themselves. its a social thing, the same with actors or politicians.

the music is mostly irrelevant

[Zodd]

It allso negates a bit of the "succes" woman seek in men maybe. With art you have the easy excuse that other people just don't get it, so you don't even have to be a succesfull artist per se.

[Ben1220]

I've seen some people mention that people who are passionate or skillful at something are seen as more attractive, and some saying that this is why scientists can be attractive. What about someone who is both a musician and a scientist, with passion for both?

Do they get bonus points for being a polymath? :P

[Wtfpeople]

I'm ugly as hell, but let me tell you, singing works.

Whenever I go to karaoke with friends I never pick songs. I usually start singing when someone says "here, I picked this for you. You have to sing it, cause I cant. Or at least back me up then." LOL!

You know how it's usually very noisy in places? Singing silences ambient noise.

Yeah, some people kinda laugh when I start singing because they think im just fooling around, but, once they realize im not playing, they go completely silent and its like I have them in a trance. Even... guys... hahahahahah.

I believe it's because singing is a subset of language and language is a subset of communication. When you communicate beautifully with your words, people tend to listen. Especially if they dont expect you to be a singer.

Think of singing as saying something profound. For intellects, it can be well formulated argument. For artisans, it can be an scintillating song.

[Stratego]

*cracks knuckles*

'K. here goes--

Talent. Not every musician out there has talent, but there are a lot that do. Talent is sexy because it makes the man special, or extraordinary. He's got everyone's attention because he's in the spotlight. That's sexy.

Power. Inceases with the number of fans he has. The more women there are screaming for him the sexier and more socially powerful in the imagination and libido he becomes. Elvis, the Beatles, Frank Sinatra. Power is sexy.

Love songs. The greatest mind fuck of all time is a soaring, angsty love song, especially one sung by a hot guy with wood slung across his lap.

(And a guitar, too ;) :laugh:)

Music gets to us on a limbic level, wayyyyy down in the Amygdala where are our primitive, simplistic emotions reside. Great music makes the hairs on the back of your neck stand up, makes you sweat, sway, and feel really, really, good. Much like sex. which usually follows after a killer concert. Love songs are sexy.

Just a few I could think of...it's not such a mystery when you think about it.

[Rohsiph]

Love songs. The greatest mind fuck of all time is a soaring, angsty love song, especially one sung by a hot guy with wood slung across his lap.

Really? In my experience, 'love songs' tend to be my least favorite unless they go far beyond being a love song. Love songs are simple, easy. Anyone can write a love song. Perhaps just anyone can't sing a lovesong, but a singer can sing any song within his/her genre/vocal range.

Much like sex. which usually follows after a killer concert. Love songs are sexy.

It sounds so simple. Your confidence in these arguments is commendable, but my experience differs greatly. Love songs don't do it. Now, a crazy lyricless number that inspires feelings of annihilation and rebirth inbetween beginning and end . . .

But perhaps it all depends on how we define "love song."

For example . . . what is this (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.)? Because this is what gets that sort of reaction out of me--and, by and large, little less.

[Wtfpeople]

Really? In my experience, 'love songs' tend to be my least favorite unless they go far beyond being a love song. Love songs are simple, easy. Anyone can write a love song. Perhaps just anyone can't sing a lovesong, but a singer can sing any song within his/her genre/vocal range.

You're obviously not a musician. As a classically trained flautist (which later turned to singing instead since its more fun and convenient) I can tell you that playing only what you see on the paper isnt making music, love song or not.

You can take the most simple major scale and turn it in to music. Or, you can just play a scale and make noises. What you see as "simple" is just your inability to understand that type of music because your presupposition limits your mind by deeming it "simple".

True, you a singer can sing any song within their range and genre. That doesnt mean they're making music. A lot of my singing sucks because I sing whatever I feel like singing, genre specific or not. You think music is a science revolving around correct pitch, tempo, rhythm and dynamics. You're wrong. Music is not a science, it is an art. Music is an art that revolves around the musicians ability to control the emotions of the audience. Your skill is based on how well to make the audience feel what you want them to feel.

It sounds so simple. Your confidence in these arguments is commendable, but my experience differs greatly. Love songs don't do it. Now, a crazy lyricless number that inspires feelings of annihilation and rebirth inbetween beginning and end . . .

But perhaps it all depends on how we define "love song."

For example . . . what is this (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.)? Because this is what gets that sort of reaction out of me--and, by and large, little less.

So you like only music you like. Nice.

Your confidence in these arguments is commendable, but your opinion differs greatly from my experience.

You want to hear a classical Puccni aria that "inspires feelings of annihilation and rebirth inbetween [sic] beginning and end"? I'm sure you've heard this song before, but just couldnt understand it.

Check this (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) out.

I was going to narrate it, but for better effect I think ill let you look up the narration.

[Rohsiph]

You're obviously not a musician. As a classically trained flautist (which later turned to singing instead since its more fun and convenient) I can tell you that playing only what you see on the paper isnt making music, love song or not.

You can take the most simple major scale and turn it in to music. Or, you can just play a scale and make noises

Clearly, considering the words in my previous post you have enough information to judge my musicianship.

Thank you for the enlightening revelation regarding how playing notes / making random noise is different from making music. Surely, I'd have never known this without your help.

What you see as "simple" is just your inability to understand that type of music because your presupposition limits your mind by deeming it "simple".

Yes, clearly I am incapable of understanding the type of music in question. I shouldn't be responding to this topic at all. But now that I can learn from you, I might as well stick around.

Am I to understand the 3.5-minute Puccini clip is representative of "love song" that is not "simple?"

True, you a singer can sing any song within their range and genre. That doesnt mean they're making music. A lot of my singing sucks because I sing whatever I feel like singing, genre specific or not.

I'm not sure what you're getting at here. The first part I understand, of course--I said as much in my initial post. The second line connects to your original idea. But what is your point as far as your own singing often sucking? Is your singing, whether it sucks or not, still "music" because you're doing more than just reading off a page? Please help me to see the connection.

You think music is a science revolving around correct pitch, tempo, rhythm and dynamics. You're wrong. Music is not a science, it is an art.

It's rare I'm able to argue with a true mind-reader. Thank you for taking a peek. Unfortunately, you must have caught someone else's alpha-waves as your assumption is completely wrong. Music is an art and is, in fact, one of the most important 'basic genres' of art in my life. But nice try.

Music is an art that revolves around the musicians ability to control the emotions of the audience. Your skill is based on how well to make the audience feel what you want them to feel.

I disagree here. Of course, you already know as much from both being able to read my mind and having read my PM. But, for the sake of the spectators, I'll share what you went out of your way to refuse to respond to privately:

The live experience definitely gives some authority to the artists on-stage (or wherever they're playing), but I'm more of a "reader-response" guy. The music I like I enjoy because it moves me intuitively, often in ways I find the artists are surprised to find out about (I used to attend many small-crowd concerts, and befriended a few bands before moving far, far away). I'd say the artist's skill is a combination of technical proficiency and honest passion--less about winning the audience, more about combining sounds that the artist needs to make.


You want to hear a classical Puccni aria that "inspires feelings of annihilation and rebirth inbetween [sic] beginning and end"? I'm sure you've heard this song before, but just couldnt understand it.

Check this (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) out.

I was going to narrate it, but for better effect I think ill let you look up the narration.

I watched the video. Sure enough, the three minutes taken out of context don't do much for me. Perhaps if I could borrow your peerless erudition. Indeed, I fail to see how the clip effectively strikes the kind of inspiration I hinted at. I can imagine if I could sit among the audience for the entire opera I might feel differently, but that's just speculative. Based on my diminutive abilities with music (comparatively, at least) I'm sure you're right, I could never understand it.

That said, after all of this I'm even more curious to know what you thought about the music I linked to (even if it's actually just "noise" because the artist was just reading off the page). With your greater perspective on the art I'm sure you could offer insights that would otherwise never cross my mind.

[Stratego]

Really? In my experience, 'love songs' tend to be my least favorite unless they go far beyond being a love song. Love songs are simple, easy. Anyone can write a love song. Perhaps just anyone can't sing a lovesong, but a singer can sing any song within his/her genre/vocal range..


Great point. Not everyone can sing a love song and sing it well...but for those that do...look out.

Your confidence in these arguments is commendable, but my experience differs greatly. Love songs don't do it. Now, a crazy lyricless number that inspires feelings of annihilation and rebirth inbetween beginning and end...

Love songs don't do it for you, you mean. Again, you have a great point, but your experience is not evident in the majority. As you know, INTJ's are the rarest type, and some of us are fairly unemotional. So naturally a love song, no matter how well written or performed, isn't going to move you or people like you very much. Again, that's not the majority experience.

Lastly, you seemed to express some credulity that killer sex doesn't follow a great concert. Obviously you've never been to a Radiohead concert with me. ;)

[t3hrubikscube]

I'm a woman and I'm very attracted to musicians, but I'm mostly attracted to people who play band (trumpet, sax, etc.) or orchestra (cello, viola, etc.) instruments...and the piano. Guitars and drums are nice and all, but I'm really into other instruments. I'm big on music myself, so that's probably why.

[JCrow]

Actually some interesting thoughts here on the idea of 'love songs'. I am a professional musician, and I have to admit I dislike most love songs, because I find most of them shallow and lacking true emotional depth(I'm talking about music you'd hear on the radio over the past 10 years). I think pop love songs are popular because the audience is reading into the music beyond what is there, putting their feeling onto the song, as opposed to the actual song having feeling(This raises arguments about the viewer/listener projecting emotion into the art, but i'll stop there).

I do LOVE a good love song, but the ones I really love are more about catching a brief moment, vibe or feeling. Its a difficult thing to make a genuine love song, its an easy thing to make a predictable cliche love song(but is that really love?).

I play instrumental music, so there is also a real challenge of showing an emotion or feeling without any words.