What do you think will happen to the human race in the future?

[vkut79]

It is becoming quite clear that we are running out of room on planet Earth. The population has been growing at a RIDICULOUS rate, and we are nowhere near being able to leave this planet in order to colonize others. Something is going to happen to stop this population growth. There are number of likely things that could happen in the next few centuries: disease, war, famine. A longshot solution would be a widespread effort to stop having children, although there are many problems with this sort of thing, as it is unnatural and it would cause major social imbalance. I personally think that it will be a combination of the three things I mentioned, but I think disease won't be as major of an issue. I think mostly it will be famine, followed by outbreaks of war in order to conquer resources as countries will get much more desperate to sustain their populations. Cities will be filled with poor, starving homeless; at some point there the population will stabilize and probably even start decreasing.

[AgentofGaming]

Cities will be filled with poor, starving homeless; at some point there the population will stabilize and probably even start decreasing.
Well looking at poor African nations, being poor, starving and homeless doesn't seem to decrease the population.

Everything points to destruction or at least everything crashing down:
Nuclear Weapons
War
Terrorism
Global Warming
Overconsumption
Chemical contamination
Waste
Abuse of antibiotics
Apathy
Intolerance and Ultra Conservative thought
Radical Religiousness
Societal reliance on oil

[vkut79]

I suppose that even the incredible poverty and starvation found in Africa today is not at the magnitude that would stop population growth. If you think about it, it really doesn't take that much sustenance to produce a family, quite a bit less than what people are used to in Western countries. If you can just get by on a little bit of food, you will be really hungry still, but you can have children. Also Africa is much not that densely populated, compared to Europe, India, and China. They still have more than enough adequate resources to keep people from starving, the problem is more from political turmoil, which results in economic failure. At the point where resources are so scarce that families will literally not be able to afford any more mouths to feed, at that point population growth should slow down and maybe stop.

[thod]

More research into pygmies and midgets. If we were all 2 foot tall then we would occupy less space and use less resources.

The trouble with the high IQ idea is that most of them are nerds, dorks, dweebs whatever and they do not breed under natural conditions. When they should be out conjoining genitals, they sit at home watching superman reruns on TV. So many on this board have the IQ but lack any concept of empathy, they cant see that they are flawed and any planned breeding would exclude them.

[IFearAManOf1Book]

Yet aren't INTJs devoted to logic, and therefore the fact is recognized that our flaws are what make us a vital part of society, current and planned? Doesn't the lack of sexual relationships make INTJs an ideal choice for a planned breeding system, since there would be minimal risk of unscheduled offspring, and others could carry on their genes in that fashion?

[Mr Zip]

Human beings will find a way to survive. We always have. If theres a possibility, we'll find it.

I see no reason to be fatalistic. Prepared, yes, but theres enough good in the world Id just as soon focus on that, and work to solve whatever problems that cross your path or you choose to focus on.

Lifes too short to think its all shit, IMO.

[Antares]

I've heard from some sources that the Earth is producing enough food to support 12 billion people 0___o So if some drastic movements were made to give everyone equal share of food, famine won't be a factor.

[pavman]

It is becoming quite clear that we are running out of room on planet Earth. The population has been growing at a RIDICULOUS rate, and we are nowhere near being able to leave this planet in order to colonize others. Something is going to happen to stop this population growth.

Not to worry, all data points to peaking around 2050 with 8 - 10B and entering a population decline. Although the US is finally at replacement rate again (thank you Mexican-Americans). :thumbsup:

[vkut79]

What will be the cause of this population decline starting around 2050? Do you know what factors exactly will cause it?

[pavman]

Yes, I have done the research. The factors are:

1. Low/lowering birth rates
2. Low/lowering fertility rates
3. Increased health risks as the population waits longer to have children, lowering the birth rate (see 1).
4. De-emphasis on traditional families (Ie. Increase in homosexual unions where there isn't a possibility of natural conception).
5. Increase in abortions/one-child policies

Those are what I believe are the biggest contributing factors.

The UN and population research groups all point to the same correlation in the western, and emerging, worlds. Kind of the antithesis of the sky is falling nair-do-wells of the 70s with their over-population myth (which was started in the late 19th century, if I recall correctly). The irony is that we've been able to keep the food supply at or above support for quite a while, contrary to the opinion of those in the 70s.

I mean, space isn't really an issue, unless you are an urban dweller. If you have ever taken a western vacation in the US...there's tons of empty space out there.

The one area I didn't really look into much (as I really didn't think of it at the time) was water supply; however, I am sure humans can become quite creative with water supply if there was ever any question regarding that.

Do you want me to dig up the data links? Its been a while since I had a discussion of this nature.

[vkut79]

"1. Low/lowering birth rates
2. Low/lowering fertility rates
3. Increased health risks as the population waits longer to have children, lowering the birth rate (see 1)."

Well this is all really the same thing. Fertility rate and birth rate are closely related. But why would the fertility rate decrease? What is the reason why people would be encouraged to have smaller families? Lack of resources and space apparently won't be an issue, so what is?





vkut79 added to this post, 1 minutes and 23 seconds later...

Increase in the use of contraception is one reason.

[sonofone]

There seems to be a lot of work designed around both lowering the the birth rate and extending the life of humans. I think earth will stabilize, and if we can't do it, well, it will kill us all and that will be that.

[thod]

Well this is all really the same thing. Fertility rate and birth rate are closely related. But why would the fertility rate decrease? What is the reason why people would be encouraged to have smaller families? Lack of resources and space apparently won't be an issue, so what is?


We are no longer popping out babies at 16 years old. We now go to college, then we want to use it in a 'career' while we pay off the college debt, then we need to save ever larger sums for housing. By the time its all done the women are near menopause. This is only possible due to contraception. The beauty of it is that the populace are willing to buy the lie. They all do this and they all end up childless still with huge debts age 40.

Its a huge evolutionary pressure. The women that are able to breed later than others will go on to leave more offspring into the next generation. For the moment it leads to the reduced birth rates we see in all modern countries.

Not everyone is fooled though. Take the Amish for example. They don't believe in advanced education, they don't use contraception, they average 7 children per family. Thier philosophy is proving fitter and therefore correct. You can have too much education for your own good.

[Antares]

Well looking at poor African nations, being poor, starving and homeless doesn't seem to decrease the population.


The reason for that is they're receiving outside help. Stop the food supply? They're gone (at least some of them). Besides having sex a lot and popping out more children than they can responsibly care for, it's all savvy concerning the population. There's just one tiny problem there. Too much sex; too little responsibility. If they would just stop and think before intercourse (assuming they don't go on with it anyway), there would be less starving children in the world today. Although I can't blame them, given the quality of education (or the lack of it) they receive. The imbalance in the world today is staggering, but I'd say that we need time. We have come a long way already, and many people are making the efforts.

[pavman]

But why would the fertility rate decrease?

Well, this is the crux of the matter. People are wondering why the fertility rate is declining. Its not just people having less children, its the fact that in first-world countries, people are having trouble conceiving. There is no doubt some environmental factors at play here. I don't have the data handy, but after posting the links in another thread, you can find them at this post:

To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

[AntiCorp]

Humans will endure. We are relatively new on this planet, still in our evolution and development. We tend to place too much emphasis and value on the immediate without considering the "big picture."

If humans follow the pattern of every other life form on this planet (living and extinct), then I am sorry to say that our population will decline intensely. Only the life forms that are truly unique endure.

Famine, poverty, starvation, greed, climate, exploitation of resources, etc. will pave the road to another world war. Unfortunately, it will be the catalyst that brings the remnants of humanity together.

I believe the key to our survival is integrating the uniqueness and specializations of each and every culture. As an American, I hate the fact that we have used our position/power to suppress rather than acting as a guide.

[meanlittlechimp]

It is becoming quite clear that we are running out of room on planet Earth. The population has been growing at a RIDICULOUS rate, and we are nowhere near being able to leave this planet in order to colonize others. Something is going to happen to stop this population growth. There are number of likely things that could happen in the next few centuries: disease, war, famine. A longshot solution would be a widespread effort to stop having children, although there are many problems with this sort of thing, as it is unnatural and it would cause major social imbalance. I personally think that it will be a combination of the three things I mentioned, but I think disease won't be as major of an issue. I think mostly it will be famine, followed by outbreaks of war in order to conquer resources as countries will get much more desperate to sustain their populations. Cities will be filled with poor, starving homeless; at some point there the population will stabilize and probably even start decreasing.


I agree with you completely, it's inevitable with Chinese and Indian growth rates (2/5ths of the world population becoming industrialized) and increasing demand on natural resources - while the finite supply of resources are draining alarmingly fast. They'll be massive oil shortages in our lifetimes, and hopefully Governments will take action sooner than later. The rampant consumer waste in this country and in others is just hastening the pace.

Combine this with global warming and a more unstable climate, the only chance we have to solve this is through major breakthroughs in technology or a population decrease (through war or what have you). We'll obviously need both, but we're definitely due for a painful re-adjustment.

[AgentofGaming]

I agree with you completely, it's inevitable with Chinese and Indian growth rates (2/5ths of the world population becoming industrialized) and increasing demand on natural resources - while the finite supply of resources are draining alarmingly fast. They'll be massive oil shortages in our lifetimes, and hopefully Governments will take action sooner than later. The rampant consumer waste in this country and in others is just hastening the pace.
I completely agree.
Has anyone watched this?
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

We're already over-consuming and if everyone wanted to consume like a typical North American well let's just say the world, would be already consumed. China and India are joining in consumerism.

[lordrrr]

I suppose that even the incredible poverty and starvation found in Africa today is not at the magnitude that would stop population growth. If you think about it, it really doesn't take that much sustenance to produce a family, quite a bit less than what people are used to in Western countries. If you can just get by on a little bit of food, you will be really hungry still, but you can have children. Also Africa is much not that densely populated, compared to Europe, India, and China. They still have more than enough adequate resources to keep people from starving, the problem is more from political turmoil, which results in economic failure. At the point where resources are so scarce that families will literally not be able to afford any more mouths to feed, at that point population growth should slow down and maybe stop.

My opinion on Africa is it's a society that wasn't meant to be modernized in any way. If we just left it the way it was, save for getting oil or something (damn I don't think there's any natural resources worthy of anything in Africa anyway) things would be perfect. Instead, we force America upon them :/

[INTJayW]

They'll be massive oil shortages in our lifetimes, and hopefully Governments will take action sooner than later.



I wouldn’t hold your breath on that one.

And at the rate that China & India's new middle class is growing and buying cars. We will most likely see major economic trauma in the next decade.

It is now all but confirmed that Saudi Arabia has peaked, and if Saudi Arabia has peaked the world has peaked. Third world countries are stocking up on coal because they don't have access to oil, China has been having blackouts for over a year now, Britain north sea is in terminal decline and is dropping by 8% a year, and no major oil refinery has been built anywhere in the world since the 1980s, not to mention the price of oil hit another peak today of 106/Barrel almost 662% increase in price since 1999, the demand for Corn to produce ethanol is causing more and more farmers to trade off growing other crops because corn has become more profitable, driving up the price of all food stuffs hence the agricultural boom we are in.

And the best hope of the world is technology?

There are 852 million cars on the roads world wide, with a life of about 15 years. How much do you think it would cost the world to replace those with higher priced lower efficiency hydrogen/Electric vehicles which by the way still require energy such as coal or oil to produce the hydrogen?

The fact of the matter is technology uses energy it does not produce energy. No major new form of energy has been invented in the last 40 years.
Everything we think of as clean energy today Solar panels/Wind/Hydro/Geothermal/Ethanol/Biodiesel etc... have all been around for a long time, and they were never adopted because they were always way more expensive than plain old oil!

We are currently having trouble feeding 6.3 billion people with 80 or so million being added every day, and with the major input in most Ammonia fertilizers being Natural gas, something North America will effectively run out of in 10 years, the major question the world will be concerned with will not be climate change it will be where is my next meal coming from!

Everytime history repeats itself, the price goes up!
-Unknown

[simoncpu]

Humans will ascend and become energy-based beings. Their mind capacity will increase a thousand-fold, as they will no longer be bound by the limitations of being a carbon-based entity.

I wonder how sex as an energy-based being feels like...

[AgentofGaming]

The reason for that is they're receiving outside help. Stop the food supply? They're gone (at least some of them).
It's quite unfortunate that most of the countries end up reliant on the aid. Seems to defeat the purpose of becoming more efficient if deliveries come in through the front door.

As for stopping food, that'd be practical but then I'm sure people in the UN would start calling it a humanitarian crisis.

My opinion on Africa is it's a society that wasn't meant to be modernized in any way. If we just left it the way it was, save for getting oil or something (damn I don't think there's any natural resources worthy of anything in Africa anyway) things would be perfect. Instead, we force America upon them :/

Africa has diamonds, that in fact caused the Boer Wars.
They also have that mineral that they use to make cell phones(I can't remember what it's called) that children have to mine.
That being said probably only South Africa is first world although the north African countries are more modernly developed they aren't exactly stable. Nigeria also has vast oil reserves however the wealth is concentrated in the hands of very few people and they have a rather corrupt government.

[eMachine]

I'll bet it was an INTJ who first realized the world was going to get over-populated and spread the theory... it probably went something like this:::

"Damn, there are way too many people here... and they're all so stupid... and they're all getting drunk and having unprotected sex all the time... there's only going to be more of them in the future... they will be the end of us!" Hehe.

Really though, I'm sure at some point the planet is just going to go through some sort of transition and then we'll be gone. It seems to have happened to most other species. The advantage that we have is our intelligence, our technology will save us from many things. It's impossible to tell when or how this planet is going to change, but it does seem inevitable and there are a vast number of possibilities. There is actually a very small scale of environmental factors in which the human body can thrive, we actually reside in this little niche where environmental factors have stabilized on this planet long enough for us to exist and evolve into what we are. There's no way to know when this 'era' of our planet will end.

In that case, our only chance of survival is to improve our space-faring capabilities, if we can do that it's quite possible our species can continue to exist for a while longer. There are many things that our society needs to overcome to make it possible to devote more to those technologies. NASA's space shuttle has hardly improved at all since the 60's and yet how much money has been spent on improving technologies for military uses?

(This whole ramble is based on the hope that we don't destroy ourselves/eachother.)

[Jed3]

Unless the population decreases soon, I dont think humanity will be here in 1000 years.

[Jack]

Unless the population decreases soon, I dont think humanity will be here in 1000 years.

God Dammit! I was so hoping to see some really good fireworks in our lifetime.

[INTJayW]

God Dammit! I was so hoping to see some really good fireworks in our lifetime.

Sit tight. You may yet.

[bubbles]

Biologists believe that there is a mass extinction (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) event occurring in the present. I think human extinction will be part of this extinction event. Nature has always done a good job of dealing with species that whose population grow unsustainably, either by introducing a new predator (a virus in this case?) or the specie will just consume all of its resources and drive itself to extinction. Because of the nature of humans (and other species), people will fight for resources and reduce the human population significantly or drive themselves to extinction. It would be interesting if only a few survive and modern technology disappears completely. Then people will start re-inventing technology again and the cycle repeats...kind of like science fiction.

[INTroJect]

To answer the so-called population problem, here is perfect evidence that the issue is adressing itself without our need to worry about it:
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
(I do not think we are going to population bomb ourselves out of existence because even the far reaches of the planet are taking measures to address it)

We humans have been expecting an end to humanity as long as we have been able to ponder the possibility. Anything is likely to happen, and we will likely have ups and downs along the way (famine/plague/pestilence/etc) but I think our destiny is to eventually move on to other planets and outside of the solar system. We may not know how to do it now w our current abilities but I think that it will eventually happen. The more planets that have humans living on them the more sure we can be of our existence as a species. There are resources outside of our planet that are going to be useful for us, we will start to identify them and in the end our own blessed greed for resources will be what saves us.

[E148]

It is becoming quite clear that we are running out of room on planet Earth. The population has been growing at a RIDICULOUS rate, and we are nowhere near being able to leave this planet in order to colonize others. Something is going to happen to stop this population growth. There are number of likely things that could happen in the next few centuries: disease, war, famine. A longshot solution would be a widespread effort to stop having children, although there are many problems with this sort of thing, as it is unnatural and it would cause major social imbalance. I personally think that it will be a combination of the three things I mentioned, but I think disease won't be as major of an issue. I think mostly it will be famine, followed by outbreaks of war in order to conquer resources as countries will get much more desperate to sustain their populations. Cities will be filled with poor, starving homeless; at some point there the population will stabilize and probably even start decreasing.



Someone will win (the human race). :laugh:

The long solution (modified) has and is being tried in Chinese cities, only one child per couple. I would say it is not really working very well.
I think that we can grow enough food (and farm the seas as well).

But try thinking in really long terms.

I forget exactly but in 2-4 billion years the Earth and all inner Planets will be engulfed by the Sun. We had better be off this planet long before that because our atmosphere will be gone before then.

We had better find a way to economically do inter-stellar travel. We had better find a planet comparable to Earth- not just aimlessly travel space.

It sounds like a long time but there is much to do. Trying to get several billion or trillion people off this rock is not going to be easy. Think of the food needs that we would have to take with us.

[drek996]

I think we will be an extinct race, I hope that life itself always exists, but forms of life have a life-cycle which spams some unknown time frame but it has to end, there is just too much time.

[gogurtdynasty]

We're almost done...

Overpopulation=less isolation+ natural competition for resources= famine + Disease + Ideological battles + loss of cultural knowledge

i could go on for a while but i don't think it's necessary

But i could be wrong... I always hold hopes for change

[vaguely dissatisfied]

With any luck the world will be rid of humans at some point in the future.

[muguly]

Most will kill each other, some die of illness, famine, poverty, the rest will thrive and create a better race. One where there will be peace with nature and each other........hopefully.

[Aldrin]

Meh. Allot of "problems" only exist because it benefits capitalism and the wealthy. People make enormous profits off wars and strife. Food production isn't terribly much of a problem, here in the USA farmers are paid not to grow certain crops on a certain percentage of their land to keep the prices high enough for them to make a profit.

Underdeveloped nations like northern Africa are starving and in extreme poverty for a few reasons in addition to warfare, there is little to no formal education or job prospects, and so the people can not support themselves or afford/know of basic technologies that would drastically improve quality of life. Sadly all the aid is doing is allowing them languish in their extreme poverty. Extreme measures in infusing Education and job opportunities are needed more then food, or else it will never end.

The human population can not sustain itself when half of it is unproductive and on the verge of death. If every single person was educated and productive our yields and rate of technological advancement would probably be more then double what it is now due to all the added brainpower.

While it is surely true that people in more affluent countries have increased difficulty in conception due to delaying pregnancy to later years, the vast majority of couples probably weren't planning on having more than four children, and indeed the national average is slightly less than 2. When there are no social "safety nets" such as social security, Medicare, etc. your best chance of support are your own children, so you'll want to have as many as you can. When one is well supported by society and job security, to the point of excess of personal needs one does not need children as support, but rather can invest in providing higher quality education for their children.

And as already mentioned land is not really a problem, there is plenty of it unsettled as it is to provide for many multiples of our current population. Ideally as our utilities become increasingly "virtual" we need, and do not feel as much of a need for so much space. Thus living quarters can continue to shrink so as to be compact and efficient, wasting less energy and space. From an idealized singularity perspective why waste so much money on a house when you can log-in to your virtual mansion that is indiscernible from reality?

Energy, and clean energy at that is a bit of a problem but not terribly. Personally I'm all for solar. It is not a perfect method, but it is becoming increasingly efficient and attractive. Solar panels could in time be used as a means of energy for producing themselves, essentially making each subsequent panel have "zero, clean energy debt", although now they can pay their own energy production cost back within about a year. Panels have a limited life span and need occasional maintenance of course, although with time they only continue to increase their efficiency, and decrease resource cost. I fear that energy companies of old will simple become the energy companies of new and continue to charge unjustifiable fees however.

Greed. The necessary evil, and yet main opposing force to progress. What will happen in the future? Its hard to say, a prosperous post-singularity civilization, a stagnant, limited post-singularity civilization, a dictatorial post-singularity civilization? I rather doubt the complete apocalyptic view, while capitalism may prosper on strife, it doesn't want to destroy itself, just slowly leech off of everything else.

[INTroJect]

I think we will be an extinct race, I hope that life itself always exists, but forms of life have a life-cycle which spams some unknown time frame but it has to end, there is just too much time.

Well Duh. Now that I am thinking about it that way, if you span out the number of years long enough the only possibility is extinction. I guess with that in mind the question how long we have left for that to happen. I think its going to be in the thousands or tens of thousands or even more. There are lots of issues that we are all seeing today (I think they are overblown) but complete wipeout is a lot harder to do than what one would imagine. All-out complete nuclear war could do that but the chances of it happening are less now that USSR is gone, maybe at worst some terrorists will get a few and blow up some cities but the chances of it being "lets launch everything at everyone!" has been reduced. However, we are advancing very very fast and it is inevitable that something even more deadly that will come into existence.

I think we should hurry up and populate a second planet, who cares which planet as long as its the most feasible, its such an easy way to reduce the probability of our own extinction. The problem with that is that humans thrive on our interdependence and the thing that will bring us to other planets will be something away from the earth that will be of use to the population, the interdependence is that causes development. So if there are useful things on the moon and we move there, the populations on both the earth and the moon will be depending on each other, like how the different regions of the earth provide their products in exchange for the products of others. Not sure if the people living on the moon will be able to survive it if the earth population was wiped out.

Just some quick thoughts on the matter.

[blueback]

On a long enough timeline, everyone's lifespan drops to zero.

[notoppings]

Logan's Run. Good movie possible concept.

[sriv]

Burn them all and will God know his own. jk.

I am the person that believes that human creativity and adaptability will prevent it from becoming totally wiped out, but I do not discount a bottleneck.

[SmileyMan]

Humans adapt. Our race will survive, as we're found everywhere on Earth.

[Younggun88]

It will become extinct like every species before us and after us.

[thod]

The question is not if we will become extinct but what species we leave behind. A species as succesful as ours should speciate into several branchs. We are on the edge of manipulating our own genome. We will have water breathing fish humans for example. Then the question moves to what it is to be human. The fish men may well find they have no use for a big brain and devolve to save energy.

[knitteratheart]

It will become extinct like every species before us and after us.

Except for cockroaches. You forgot about the cockroaches.

But really everyone seems to have such a pessimistic view of the future. Me too, of course, but that's really beside the point.

Let's see, my preditction: a great world war, possibly happening in our lifetime, in which close to 95% of the human race will die, taking a good deal of human and plant life with us into oblivion. What's left of the world-if indeed there is anything left-will enter a dark age where people will have to eke out a living on a ruined planet.

[Firebert]

If it is a question of whether or not the human race will survive as a species, I believe that flexibility and survivability is what has contributed so much to our longevity.

If it is a question of whether our planet will be left in a state similar to how it is now, I think that humans will attempt to modify and streamline our planet to yield higher payloads per sq meter.

Much of our survivability hinges on our ability to modify our living conditions, so I believe that our planet will become highly urbanized with specialized methods for high-efficiency food, oxygen, and water production.

Either that or we all bite the big one.

[merid]

Logan's Run. Good movie possible concept.

I would add idiots in as well.

[Jack]

Someone will win (the human race)....

... Trying to get several billion or trillion people off this rock is not going to be easy. Think of the food needs that we would have to take with us.

Do you really believe that could happen?... I'd say more like two of every species DNA in capsules sent to another planet, and then cross your fingers... But that isn't feasible.

I don't think our species, or life in general will ever inhabit another planet simply because planetary conditions have to be absolutely identical to that of the Earth, 99.999999999 isn't good enough.

[Mozzes]

Biologists believe that there is a mass extinction (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) event occurring in the present. I think human extinction will be part of this extinction event. Nature has always done a good job of dealing with species that whose population grow unsustainably, either by introducing a new predator (a virus in this case?) or the specie will just consume all of its resources and drive itself to extinction. Because of the nature of humans (and other species), people will fight for resources and reduce the human population significantly or drive themselves to extinction. It would be interesting if only a few survive and modern technology disappears completely. Then people will start re-inventing technology again and the cycle repeats...kind of like science fiction.

There's a huge difference between humans and every other living organism that we know to have inhabited this planet: all other species can only "manipulate" nature via genetic mutations and the interactions of those phenotype modifications in natural selection. Humans, on the other hand, have the ability to manipulate nature via technology. If the technology gets developed there will never be a problem with food because we will have several options available. One is extremely tall hydroponic buildings (in fact, building upwards will be a solution to other problems, particularly human housing). Another viable option is orbital hydroponics since it's been demonstrated by NASA astronauts that plants do not need gravity for proper growth. Hell, scientists are even close to being able to grow meat in vitro. There will quite likely be a day when you can have a steak or a burger without cows being an extant species. Even solutions to rising oceans are in the works in the form of artificial island landmasses.

Of course phasing out destructive technologies (fossil fuels) will still be important and hopefully the next Administration will be an ally of that goal.

[Metafire]

Optimistic scenario: We develop friendly AI or upload our minds into computers and enhance our intelligence and thinking speed dramatically. Of course some humans will still be left just being normal humans. The destiny of the posthuman minds and the conservative human beings would be that the later will be something like pets for posthumanity. So regular humans will exist as long as there are posthumans who like the concept of having old fashioned humans as pets. It's hard to predict that time span.

Eventually humans will possibly never die out, because their construction plans (DNA, proteins) will be saved in case there will be some kind of nostalgia wave.

Pessimistic scenario(s): A catastrophe concerning self replicating nanobots or unfriendly AI happens and all humans get killed in a matter of weeks or so. In the optimistic pessimistic scenario those nanobots or the unfriendly AI would start a new technological civilization and evolve into something greater. In the pessimistic pessimistic scenario the nanobots/KI are too dumb to create a real civilization, but there is a chance that some other animal will evolve and finally will start creating technology again. Ultimately, in the very pessimistic pessimistic scenario the nanobots/AI manage to destroy themselves and all other life on this planet completely, because of extreme dumbness.

Unrealistic scenario: Nothing like that happens.

[onlyparallel]

I'm sure that technology can save us form a lot of things, as Frickles pointed out, but the real question is can our technology save us from ourselves?

And of corse the answer is no. We're greedy, and irresponsible with what we do. If we're going to go extinct it will most certaintly be our own fault. As a whole (or at least the people who have the most power in the world) we're selfish. For example, to some people the only reason to save trees from going extinct is without them we couldn't print money. Nevermind oxygen.

[Big Grizzle]

Humans will ascend and become energy-based beings. Their mind capacity will increase a thousand-fold, as they will no longer be bound by the limitations of being a carbon-based entity.

I wonder how sex as an energy-based being feels like...

Matter is energy so we are already energy based beings.

[simoncpu]

But INTJs are not joke-based and fun-based beings... Hihihi...

[Mozzes]

Matter is energy so we are already energy based beings.

More to the point, we "run" on chemical energy via phosphorylation of nucleotide phosphates.

[simoncpu]

I run on chemical energy via caffeine. Sometimes via alcohol. I tried drinking both though... the effect was kindda cool, but I'm afraid to do it again because I might end up subtracting precious life from my system...

As to what will happen to the human race in the future, well... I dunno... I wish society would one day find cybernetic implants acceptable. I want to multiply my memory and processing powers. Hehehe...

[Ool]

Four technological developments will shape the future of humanity. It is very hard to determine just how they will do that or in what order or time. But they are:


Space exploitation, mostly for solar energy and living space, later for material resources.
Genetics.
Cybernetics.
Artificial intelligence.


As far as space exploitation is concerned, what most people tend to forget today is that we’re living a two-dimensional existence on the outer crust of this planet, like mold on a wall. Most of the resources that this magma ball contains aren’t even within our reach because of the heat and the pressure we’d encounter if we dug to the depths where they can be found. Outer space, on the other hand, is in our reach, and there is a gigantic fusion furnace out there which shines enough energy down on this planet that it would be more than enough to run today’s economy. But it also shines two billion times more energy past this world and out into deep space. Only a ridiculously small fraction of that would make us more powerful than we’ve ever been in the history of our species.

So there’s actually a huge potential for growth ahead of us once we find a way through this bottleneck and out of this gravity well. The idea that we should have an energy crisis and a Malthusian catastrophe looming in light of all the raw power and living space out there is a joke of astronomical proportions.

Genetics will also play a huge role in our future development. It will give us the opportunity to adapt our bodies to different climates and environments without the cruelty of natural selection by evolution, which requires generations to breed and die before any changes happen.

Then there is cybernetics, which will allow us to transcend the inefficiencies of our physique based on the fact that we’re machines out of components that have to grow at room and body temperature, as opposed to our industrially manufactured materials, which are created at much higher energies than the organic compounds we consist of could ever survive.

Artificial intelligence might even do away with our requirement for organic brains, which would still be a weak link even if we perfect our bodies through genetics and cybernetics. If we were nothing but platform-independent software that would render us more versatile and adaptible than ever before.

So this is basically our future. But it is hard to predict in detail when technological quantum leaps are going to happen, pushing us forward within these fields. They won’t mean the end of competition, wars, death, and suffering, of course. But they will render our future so immense that our present existence will appear like nothing but a seed of what is yet to come…

[ArchonAlarion]

First Stage:

IN THE U.S.:
Under the false threats of terrorism, the U.S. will shed many of it's civil liberties and become a banking/military industrial complex/oil corporate contolled police state. The U.S. will use Iraq as a puppet state and a base from which to gain control of oil and lauch more imperialist crusades into the desert lands. The banking establishment, already in control of both the IRS and Federal Reserve will continue to use the fractional reserve system to drive up inflation. The inflation will create depressions, which will then be blamed on businesses and will serve as a catalyst for increased regualtion, taxation, and government control.

The energy corporations, using the fear of man made climate change, will lobby the government and the media to hype up the populace. Using the hype they will be able to make a huge profit off of meaningless carbon credits, and will use their lobbying power to gain control of business regulation commitees. This way they can limit small businesses and maintain their position.

All this will be made possible by the public schooling system, where man made climate change theory will be "madatory science." School will be compulsory. The education bureaucrats will be lobbied by the coporations to dumb down the incoming generations.

As always, most of the resulting problems will be blamed on business. The truth is that big business is in control, and uses big government as a way to suppress innovative competition.

The media corporations will be lobbied to give certain candidates a lot of publicity and face time in order to prime the sheep like populace for the "free elections." Really the winner is already chosen.

IN EUROPE:
The E.U. will become increasingly centralized. Russia gains more and more power with the finding of artic oil deposits. Russia changes its name to something a little more "nostalgic."

U.K. resists the E.U. and becomes much more closely allied to the U.S. The U.K.'s fate is closely similar to the U.S.'s above.

IN ASIA:
China, with it's economic might, entices surrounding asian countries into close alliances. Increasing pressure is put on the U.S. from asian countries demanding payment of debts.

The asian countries enter secret agreements with the Russians to support Middle Eastern terrorism.

WORLD POLITICS:
China
Vassal states: Japan, United Korea, India, United South East Asia, The New Caliphate
Allies: Russia

E.U.
Vassal States: France, Germany, Italy, Northern Europe, Eastern Europe
Allies: Russia

The U.S.
Vassal States: Canada, Mexico, U.K., Central America.



I'll post the second stage soon.

[Lf0]

I'm sure that technology can save us form a lot of things, as Frickles pointed out, but the real question is can our technology save us from ourselves?

And of corse the answer is no. We're greedy, and irresponsible with what we do. If we're going to go extinct it will most certaintly be our own fault. As a whole (or at least the people who have the most power in the world) we're selfish. For example, to some people the only reason to save trees from going extinct is without them we couldn't print money. Nevermind oxygen.

The problem is at a fundamental level. Humans are not yet fit to live in peace. As always have, humankind develops best from crisis. The crisis can be anything really, but it should come soon before something irreversible happens. If no crisis appear we might evolve naturally, though I think human DNA might be fixed a bit and some silicon might be added here and there. After few decades of fixing we would not be humans anymore, but then again who wants to be human =)

Nowadays new wave of imperialism seems to be forming so perhaps we might live to see the next war. Perhaps if we are lucky we get to fight in it.

[knock7]

Four technological developments will shape the future of humanity. It is very hard to determine just how they will do that or in what order or time. But they are:


Space exploitation, mostly for solar energy and living space, later for material resources.
Genetics.
Cybernetics.
Artificial intelligence.


As far as space exploitation is concerned, what most people tend to forget today is that we’re living a two-dimensional existence on the outer crust of this planet, like mold on a wall. Most of the resources that this magma ball contains aren’t even within our reach because of the heat and the pressure we’d encounter if we dug to the depths where they can be found. Outer space, on the other hand, is in our reach, and there is a gigantic fusion furnace out there which shines enough energy down on this planet that it would be more than enough to run today’s economy. But it also shines two billion times more energy past this world and out into deep space. Only a ridiculously small fraction of that would make us more powerful than we’ve ever been in the history of our species.

So there’s actually a huge potential for growth ahead of us once we find a way through this bottleneck and out of this gravity well. The idea that we should have an energy crisis and a Malthusian catastrophe looming in light of all the raw power and living space out there is a joke of astronomical proportions.

Genetics will also play a huge role in our future development. It will give us the opportunity to adapt our bodies to different climates and environments without the cruelty of natural selection by evolution, which requires generations to breed and die before any changes happen.

Then there is cybernetics, which will allow us to transcend the inefficiencies of our physique based on the fact that we’re machines out of components that have to grow at room and body temperature, as opposed to our industrially manufactured materials, which are created at much higher energies than the organic compounds we consist of could ever survive.

Artificial intelligence might even do away with our requirement for organic brains, which would still be a weak link even if we perfect our bodies through genetics and cybernetics. If we were nothing but platform-independent software that would render us more versatile and adaptible than ever before.

So this is basically our future. But it is hard to predict in detail when technological quantum leaps are going to happen, pushing us forward within these fields. They won’t mean the end of competition, wars, death, and suffering, of course. But they will render our future so immense that our present existence will appear like nothing but a seed of what is yet to come…

I agree with your vision.

Space exploration is probably a generation or two away. However, our children will go to space in there lifetime for tourism.

The genetics will happen before we die. We are only about 30 years away from real genetic enhancement.

Cybernetics is a generation or two away.

AI is here, if we don't end up in a Terminator future.

Human mind to machine brain is probably further off, but I think a real possibility.

I only hope that I will live to see some of this. However, keep in mind that these technologies come at a price and only the rich and powerful will be able to afford these upgrades for a significant amount of time.

[Beery Swine]

I apologize if this offends the starter of this thread, but this is absolutely ridiculous. I just did a little quick math and if 7 billion people could only exist in a square 1,000 x 1,000 miles or 1 million square miles (America is about 3,000 miles east to west, to give an idea of proportion) that would be about 3,982 square feet per person, or 63 x 63 feet. That's every man, woman, child, and infant.

[vkut79]

I apologize if this offends the starter of this thread, but this is absolutely ridiculous. I just did a little quick math and if 7 billion people could only exist in a square 1,000 x 1,000 miles or 1 million square miles (America is about 3,000 miles east to west, to give an idea of proportion) that would be about 3,982 square feet per person, or 63 x 63 feet. That's every man, woman, child, and infant.

This isn't about pure physical space, I'm sorry if that was misleadingly phrased (I see now that it probably was). When I said that we are "running out of room", I wasn't talking literally about physical space for people, more about "civilization space" for people. I was talking about the number of people compared to the number of resources that our finite planetary home provides us with. The fact of the matter is that we will not be able to accelerate our resource production to keep up with the growing population for very long, since we have almost maximized the resource production by this point.

[Ool]

This isn't about pure physical space, I'm sorry if that was misleadingly phrased (I see now that it probably was). When I said that we are "running out of room", I wasn't talking literally about physical space for people, more about "civilization space" for people. I was talking about the number of people compared to the number of resources that our finite planetary home provides us with. The fact of the matter is that we will not be able to accelerate our resource production to keep up with the growing population for very long, since we have almost maximized the resource production by this point.

Well, I’m not sure we have, but I agree with the fact that there is more to living space than how many square meters your apartment is. We need to ingest a certain amount of calories, for instance, which have to be grown in sunlight, which means a certain area of arable land is set aside for each of us. If we eat lots of meat then that area increases tenfold, because making meat out of vegetables by feeding them to animals is a wasteful process.

Then there are the ground resources which don’t get renewed and the limited amount of carbon the atmosphere and the oceans can absorb. If it’s faster than plants can sequester them then we have a problem.

Outer space would be a great breakthrough as far as energy and living space is concerned. The sun wastes so much energy into outer space; collecting but a fraction of that and beaming it down as microwaves would give us more than enough to recycle our material resources again and again, from water to food and organic building materials to plastics to metals…

[PRBori]

Hmm... well it depends, some areas are overpopulated, but other areas are empty. So I personally don't think that there is an overgrowth of population. Besides with the current events and diceases that spread like the wind thousands of people are being killed or will die within the next few years including complete generations wiped out.

That said, I believe there will be fewer people alive in the future since today's generation seem to be lost and inheriting all types of diceases that are uncurable at this time. Not to mention the climate from la nina, the ozone layer, the melting of the North Pole which will cause islands to disappear as it happenned recently. I don't mean to sound harsh, but that's what I see.

Only a few sane people will survive the events that are happening now and the events that will happen in the future, because things will get worse. I predict that in the next few years a few islands will disappear completely along with the people that live on them, food will be scarced due to climate changes and therefore people will either kill each other or die from hunger. Earth plates will shift just as they did millions of years ago and the shape of earth will once again have to be re-drawn. Whether we will become extinct like the dinosaurs, I cannot say, but whatever awaits will certainly have a great impact on humanity.

The theory is that Dinosaurs were extinct due to a huge asteroid, I know we are not fully safe from such event either for every day millions of meteorites are in space and could hit earth anytime, I remember hearing something about an asteroid bigger than earth heading this way... according to NASA calculations is 800 years away.. that said we are never out of the loop.

I know I probably sound crazy... I know my way of thinking is different, but I can only talk about what I see happening

There is also the chance that we develop better space stations and if we are lucky discover another planet, but chances of that are very slim... A nice fiction film of course can portray such... but reality is a little different.

[Ool]

There is also the chance that we develop better space stations and if we are lucky discover another planet, but chances of that are very slim... A nice fiction film of course can portray such... but reality is a little different.

Trust me, if you could develop better space stations you wouldn’t want another planet. Or rather you’d want that planet to build a trillion space stations out of for quadrillions of people.

Planets are very inefficient entities. All that matter, just for mass, so that a pitiful few billion can live on its outer surface, with the rest of it not used at all. If you think that’s what the future is going to be like then you have no imagination…

[PRBori]

Trust me, if you could develop better space stations you wouldn’t want another planet. Or rather you’d want that planet to build a trillion space stations out of for quadrillions of people.

Planets are very inefficient entities. All that matter, just for mass, so that a pitiful few billion can live on its outer surface, with the rest of it not used at all. If you think that’s what the future is going to be like then you have no imagination…

No, actually I'm a bit more realistic than many of you. I don't foresee an overpopulated world, just the oposite. I would like to see many of what the fiction movies portrayed in one future and although there are many advances in technologies, technologies alone will not stop the current events cause by the climate. Yes, in a real world if everything was perfect then it would be nice to dream of a different technological world were we could all live happily ever after.

Unfortunatedly reality is another.... we as humans have no control of natural disaster and we have plenty of examples lately which have killed thousands of people and change the lives of others. They are unexpected... changes in the earth plates, changes in the seas which are rising ever since the North Pole started melting...

Anyone can have an imagination... but not everyone imagines fiction.... there those of us who take into consideration the current events and imagine things that could happen in reality. And I guess, I fall on the second category for I'm realistic, not fictional.

[AmINot]

plague, war, famine. (random order)

repeat.

[Ool]

Anyone can have an imagination... but not everyone imagines fiction.... there those of us who take into consideration the current events and imagine things that could happen in reality. And I guess, I fall on the second category for I'm realistic, not fictional.

There is no tectonic activity in space. And if we had enough energy then we wouldn’t need climate. We could just pump our water wherever we need it rather than wait for rain.

We’re basically living off of scraps that nature throws at us when we could have he whole cake. And nobody would mind, either, because nobody else is eating that cake if we don’t do it…

[PRBori]

There is no tectonic activity in space. And if we had enough energy then we wouldn’t need climate. We could just pump our water wherever we need it rather than wait for rain.

We’re basically living off of scraps that nature throws at us when we could have he whole cake. And nobody would mind, either, because nobody else is eating that cake if we don’t do it…

Ayy, ay, ay.... let's see.. right now the country is in a deficit, which means it's making money it doesn't exist. NASA which is basically the one in charge of such depends on the US money which is basically our tax money again to develop anything....

That said if there was to be a bad recession what are the chances of such technological advances to be made without money? OK maybe Russia or China will take over and develop the technology but what's to say they will share. Humanity this days is so divided that is not even funny.

Imagination is great, don't get me wrong... I would like to imagine a perfect technological world outside earth or even within earth if there was not much uncertainty on current events... but reality is other. We could go on and on in this subject, but I'm just answering the question posted by the original member. That's how I see things, that's what I see in the future from a realistic perspective, at least based on current events.

Would I like to imagine a technological world with such advancements and discoveries that would mitigate diceases, provide a more stable world... yes, who doesn't, but is that real... could it be real, yes it could... does it depends on current events... definetdly... so if current events change for the better then I can dream of such place.. until then we are still a bit far...

[Ool]

That said if there was to be a bad recession what are the chances of such technological advances to be made without money? OK maybe Russia or China will take over and develop the technology but what's to say they will share. Humanity this days is so divided that is not even funny.

Yeah, but maybe this whole thing isn’t so much about money but the human will and spirit to go for those things. And maybe bad times are likelier to bring it about than good times.

After all, what got the US out of the Great Depression other than having an excuse for massive government spending and employment, arming itself for a World War?

What was it that brought about Moon missions other than rocketry developed for that selfsame war? What was it that gave people the incentive to keep developing rockets other than the Cold War and feeling the need for mutually assured nuclear destruction…?

I think it isn’t so much the bad times that cripple our incentive for radical progress but the fact that times are too good. I myself am no exception to this. The fact that I don’t have to fear for my survival is making me very lazy…

What was it that brought people to America other than religious persecution and economic hardship at home? What was it that made people seek a new life outside the city other than squalid urban conditions during the Gilded Age? Admittedly, we have less than optimal urban conditions these days, but nowadays there is nowhere left to go other than the suburbs. And now the suburbs will become uninhabitable because fuel prices will soon render our work commutes unaffordable.

So the plot is thickening, and once it blows up one of the discharges just may trailblaze a path to somewhere new and desirable. We can only wait and hope…

[PRBori]

Yeah, but maybe this whole thing isn’t so much about money but the human will and spirit to go for those things. And maybe bad times are likelier to bring it about than good times.

So the plot is thickening, and once it blows up one of the discharges just may trailblaze a path to somewhere new and desirable. We can only wait and hope…

Yes, you're right it will depend on human will and the questions to ask would be:

- Would humans put aside their differences and work for a better world?

- Would humans work together to help each other to survive without depending so much on material aspects?

- Would humans who are so used to the new technology survive a few years without it and live once again like primitive times to some extend in order to accomplish the main goal?

- Would human learn to share or will they kill each other if food was scarced?

You will need to have every human ship in on his will and that sounds very hard.. could it be possible? Again, yes it could be... is it realistic? No, todays generations don't care much about others... people who care and may be willing to work together along with others are only a few...

Take as an example what's being going on for over 20 years between Israel and Palestine. There notion of dealing is "An eye for an eye" and that doesn't seem to change. You kill some of us, we will retaliate and kill some of yours. As long as you have that type of behavior do not expect a whole lot.

Look at North Korea and South Korea... same type of issues, one land divided within, one with nuclear power and one with none. It is sad to see such divisions.

I'm sure there are many other examples... but that's how it is. Irak and Iran both divided by religious sect beliefs... you have Sunnis and Shias both call themselves muslim, yet both basically hate each other... They will start a civil war anytime they want just for their religious differences...

If for years those differences have not being resolved, how would you expect the humans to unite and resolve such matters out of nothing? Again, it may be possible... of course you will need a miracle for such, but possible. Is it realistic? that's the question... how realistic would it be to believe that the human race will unite.

Would I like to see a UNIFY race, of course who wouldn't... but reality hit's hard, even here at home.

[Beery Swine]

Well, if resources is your concern, we could end world hunger tomorrow if we as a species adopted a strict vegetarian diet. In fact, if I have my information right, we could all be quite morbidly obese and have plenty of food left to throw away each year. I like Jack in the Box and Subway, but if we decided to go veggie, I couldn't say no morally.

[Ool]

Well, if resources is your concern, we could end world hunger tomorrow if we as a species adopted a strict vegetarian diet. In fact, if I have my information right, we could all be quite morbidly obese and have plenty of food left to throw away each year. I like Jack in the Box and Subway, but if we decided to go veggie, I couldn't say no morally.

My diet consists of a bowl of basic muesli with soy milk and three tablespoons of casein powder (caffeinated, chocolate-flavored), two apples, two bananas, and one Subway sub. (Usually the veggie patty, heavily spiced but no additional salt.) And that’s it for the whole day.

Oh, and pills, just in case: Magnesium, the vitamin B’s, follic acid, potassium chloride, vitamin C, E, zinc, iodide, salmon oil.

I’d drink iced tea, but, unlike in the US, they don’t have unsweetened iced tea in fast food restaurants in Germany, so it’s mostly just tap water for me. Sauerkraut juice every now and then…

If there were suddenly no meat around any more I’d hardly even notice…

[Beery Swine]

They have Subway in Germany? Don't other countries have their own fast food chains? Why do ours always get imported? It seems a bit uncreative.

[Ool]

They have Subway in Germany? Don't other countries have their own fast food chains? Why do ours always get imported? It seems a bit uncreative.

German food—fast or otherwise—tends to be a bit high on the cholesterol side…

To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.(restaurant)

I mean, if I ate rotisserie chicken as often as I eat subs then I wouldn’t expect to see my 60th birthday. (I mean metaphorically speaking, since it is well-established that I can never die…)

Of course the same goes for burger and fries. Deadly…!