View Full Version : Preferred Residence
To expand on that.
I probably wouldn't ever want to live in the city. *I'm a bit of a country-side girl even though I was born and lived my early years in the heart of the city.
My fantasy home would be a small house (self designed of course), by a large body of water (the sea or the ocean... because lakes tend to have mosquito accumulation), with a large yard with several big old trees and a long driveway. *An hour or so drive from the food/entertainment district of downtown because I like my clubs, good food, and musicals *;D
Edit: the wording on a sentence... It just sounds better this way *shuu*
Firelie
09-30-2007, 03:54 PM
To expand on that.
I probably wouldn't ever want to live in the city. *I'm a bit of a country-side girl even though I was born and lived some of my life in the heart of the city.
My fantasy home would be a small house (self designed of course), by a large body of water (the sea or the ocean... because lakes tend to have mosquito accumulation), with a large yard with several big old trees and a long driveway. *An hour or so drive from the food/entertainment district of downtown because I like my clubs, good food, and musicals *;D
Ew Rei, get out of my brain!
(except I'd be alright with a smaller body of water like a creek or a river as well, and I don't like musicals)
bikerscars
09-30-2007, 03:58 PM
as long as i can remember the more rural an area was the more i felt at home
wilderness area would be my ideal location(although currently i live in the inner city and am content)
i also prefer small dwellings...well under 900 sq ft
To expand on that.
I probably wouldn't ever want to live in the city. *I'm a bit of a country-side girl even though I was born and lived some of my life in the heart of the city.
My fantasy home would be a small house (self designed of course), by a large body of water (the sea or the ocean... because lakes tend to have mosquito accumulation), with a large yard with several big old trees and a long driveway. *An hour or so drive from the food/entertainment district of downtown because I like my clubs, good food, and musicals *;D
Ew Rei, get out of my brain!
(except I'd be alright with a smaller body of water like a creek or a river as well, and I don't like musicals)
But I like big trees :(
But yeah maybe a creek/river is good too. Salt water tends to do funny things to your hair/skin.
What's wrong with musicals? It displays ultimate performing talent.
Firelie
09-30-2007, 04:13 PM
What's wrong with musicals? *It displays ultimate performing talent.
I like my stories to be uninterrupted by song.
hrm...
Okay I guess that's a valid reason. :P
I voted the last two, but I have a heavy preference for wilderness.
I would love to have a medium-large house of my own design (partially earth-seltered, highly efficient, with a large sunroom/greenhouse and a number of smaller greenhouses attached by tunnel to the mail house) near the ocean or a large lake, on a large piece of land with a stream running to the sea through it. I'd love to have such a place in Alaska...
If I had internet access and could work completely remote, or not work at all, this would be positively ideal.
I voted the last two, but I have a heavy preference for wilderness.
I would love to have a medium-large house of my own design (partially earth-seltered, highly efficient, with a large sunroom/greenhouse and a number of smaller greenhouses attached by tunnel to the mail house) near the ocean or a large lake, on a large piece of land with a stream running to the sea through it. *I'd love to have such a place in Alaska...
If I had internet access and could work completely remote, or not work at all, this would be positively ideal.
Hum, I have a thing for sunrooms too. Well rooms with huge windows that go up 2 stories... or sky lights. Though sky lights have the problem with water leakage after a while.
Hum, I have a thing for sunrooms too. Well rooms with huge windows that go up 2 stories... or sky lights. Though sky lights have the problem with water leakage after a while.
I'm big on glass, aluminum, and wood. Same here on skylights and large windows.
I also have a thing for indoor balconies into those tall sun rooms.
A suburban/rural area is my ideal place to live right now. I've lived the past few years in various neighborhoods in Chicago, and while I do love the city I hate the people who live here. Not enough privacy, too high of taxes, vagrants, unjust laws, are my main complaints I can think of now. I do enjoy smaller cities other than Chicago that have more of a suburban feel. The only problem I have with suburban dwelling is that I hate the people there as well, and as time moves on taxes will increase and it'll resemble urban living without the benefits of being in a city. I suppose rural living would be my ideal living situation, but I've never lived in the middle of no where so I don't know if I would like it really.
Tarrick
10-01-2007, 02:05 AM
To expand on that.
I probably wouldn't ever want to live in the city. I'm a bit of a country-side girl even though I was born and lived some of my life in the heart of the city.
My fantasy home would be a small house (self designed of course), by a large body of water (the sea or the ocean... because lakes tend to have mosquito accumulation), with a large yard with several big old trees and a long driveway. An hour or so drive from the food/entertainment district of downtown because I like my clubs, good food, and musicals ;D
Ew Rei, get out of my brain!
(except I'd be alright with a smaller body of water like a creek or a river as well, and I don't like musicals)
If Rei's in your brain, then so am I Firelie. Although I more favor it being in the mountains than the beach.
I'm big on glass, aluminum, and wood. Same here on skylights and large windows.
I also have a thing for indoor balconies into those tall sun rooms.
Yeah yeah! *Simple, clean, bright; cross between modern minimalistic and nature.
If Rei's in your brain, then so am I Firelie. Although I more favor it being in the mountains than the beach.
Mountains were cool for me too (well cliff specifically). *But after visiting HK this summer, and going through all those mountian road... it really isn't fun winding down those crazy mountian roads. *Of course we could just invent some other sort of transport.
Firelie
10-01-2007, 02:36 AM
Ew Rei, get out of my brain!
(except I'd be alright with a smaller body of water like a creek or a river as well, and I don't like musicals)
If Rei's in your brain, then so am I Firelie. Although I more favor it being in the mountains than the beach.
If your mountains are forested, then you're still in it. :-X
deicruxified
10-01-2007, 02:38 AM
i currently live in a suburb that has lots of trees in it... i currently live next to the wilderness. the scent of trees and the morning dew has always been relaxing.
i don't want to live in a city
Tarrick
10-01-2007, 02:41 AM
If your mountains are forested, then you're still in it. :-X
Oh yeah. If we're neighbors one day, we'll make a joint-defense pact, okay?
Firelie
10-01-2007, 02:42 AM
If your mountains are forested, then you're still in it. * :-X
Oh yeah. If we're neighbors one day, we'll make a joint-defense pact, okay?
And a fort?!?!?!?! OMG I WANT TO MAKE A FORT!
If your mountains are forested, then you're still in it. * :-X
Oh yeah. If we're neighbors one day, we'll make a joint-defense pact, okay?
And a fort?!?!?!?! OMG I WANT TO MAKE A FORT!
A fort would be great on an island in the middle of a large river, at the mouth of the fall. I read a book where the character's strong hold was such a place. It sounded sooo nice and secluded. *dreamy*
Firelie
10-01-2007, 02:53 AM
We should get an island with a mountain on it and wifi.
We should get an island with a mountain on it and wifi.
I'm sure there are lotsa those.
Though the problem is I think a lot of them are active volcanoes... :suspicious:
Firelie
10-01-2007, 02:58 AM
I'm sure there are lotsa those.
Though the problem is I think a lot of them are active volcanoes... *:suspicious:
But volcanoes are so cool...!
:wacko:
Jezebel
10-01-2007, 03:08 AM
Looks like I'm the only one that gave urban a vote. I lived in the wilderness when I was growing up, which is probably what killed my desire for it. It was beautiful, but lacked a lot of modern conveniences and was a lot of work. It was a huge hassle having to drive so far just to go to the nearest small town. With the limited selection of people I came into contact with, it was also hard for me to meet people I had things in common with. So I didn't get much social contact. As introverted as I am, all the isolation led to depression.
I really appreciate being in the city and having easy access to everything I need, and having a lot of people to choose from to interact with. If I ever move to a rural area again, I would probably have to be able to make money from home and still be somewhat close to a town.
Tarrick
10-01-2007, 03:10 AM
But volcanoes are so cool...!
:wacko:
Volcanoes are hot! But that's cool. 8-)
I'm sure there are lotsa those.
Though the problem is I think a lot of them are active volcanoes... *:suspicious:
But volcanoes are so cool...!
:wacko:
In a... "I vant to bury you aliveeee in melted rock!" kinda way.
Tarrick
10-01-2007, 03:34 AM
Something like that Rei. No one ever finds bodies in a magma fields! [smiley=wiseguy.gif]
Actually...
Unless my memory deludes me... They did find perfectly preserved bodies in the solidified stuff in Pompeii...
Looks like I'm the only one that gave urban a vote. I lived in the wilderness when I was growing up, which is probably what killed my desire for it. It was beautiful, but lacked a lot of modern conveniences and was a lot of work. It was a huge hassle having to drive so far just to go to the nearest small town. With the limited selection of people I came into contact with, it was also hard for me to meet people I had things in common with. So I didn't get much social contact. As introverted as I am, all the isolation led to depression.
I really appreciate being in the city and having easy access to everything I need, and having a lot of people to choose from to interact with. If I ever move to a rural area again, I would probably have to be able to make money from home and still be somewhat close to a town.
Well you know... fantasy home. We could include a really cool helicopter... it'll speed up the travelling.
Besides... I don't meet many people I have things in common with in the city either. I figure I might as well stick to cool forums like these :thumbsup:
Tarrick
10-01-2007, 12:12 PM
Actually...
Unless my memory deludes me... They did find perfectly preserved bodies in the solidified stuff in Pompeii...
Not in LIVE magma fields, I should say. And certainly not while I'm still around.
rwyatt365
10-01-2007, 01:19 PM
My dream house would be;
In the mountains (eastern TN, western NC –ish),
Situated along a GREAT driving road,
About 50-75 miles from "civilization",
Near water (mountain stream, lake, waterfall),
A small house with a great big kitchen adjacent to a big common area,
Surrounded by a wrap-around porch,
Internet-enabled,
Paid-for!!
Thanks for reminding me! Nearby mountains are also required, and I envision that the property is forested.
With all the INTJs who want to live in the mountains... we'll have entire mountians populated with just INTJs in no time.
Jez, I don't think you'll have to worry too much about not having anyone to relate to...
I suspect I may have to add a storage shed and a small stable to my property. One for the animals and one for the storage of food/supplies, delivered on monthly basis.
rwyatt365
10-01-2007, 02:42 PM
With all the INTJs who want to live in the mountains... we'll have entire mountians populated with just INTJs in no time.
Jez, I don't think you'll have to worry too much about not having anyone to relate to...
I suspect I may have to add a storage shed and a small stable to my property. *One for the animals and one for the storage of food/supplies, delivered on monthly basis.
Maybe that's why we're 1%-ers. All of us isolated in our mountain-top retreats. We have self-isolated and reduced our contribution to the gene pool. We face imminent extinction! :scared:
This hilarious image of "skinny, pale, short-haired, blank but penetrating stare'd" army in moving trucks, driving in a flock toward the same direction, up a mountian, just popped into my head there.
Whether we physically isolate ourselves in mountian-top retreats or not, our type is bound to isolate the most extreme of us from the gene pool anyway.
Jezebel
10-01-2007, 02:56 PM
I actually have property in the TN mountains... I choose not to live there though. I'm at work right now so I don't have access to all my pictures, but I put a few of the countryside area in this thread. (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) The house I actually lived in was in the woods though.
I actually have property in the TN mountains... I choose not to live there though. I'm at work right now so I don't have access to all my pictures, but I put a few of the countryside area in this thread. (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) The house I actually lived in was in the woods though.
I for one want to see pictures of that house ;D
Jezebel
10-01-2007, 04:45 PM
I for one want to see pictures of that house *;D
Sure, if you care. The only ones I have available right now don't really show it in all of its glory (it's overgrown and run down now from lack of care), but I'll upload some when I get home so that you guys can live vicariously through my photos.
Jbmontag
10-01-2007, 04:52 PM
My dream house since I was little was a stone tower with a telescope at the top, or a mortar, seems to be a sticking point in my fantasy. Though I did move to Colorado because I would like to build it in Northern New Mexico.
I prefer wilderness, I've had neighbors my entire life. In fact I can hear some arguing right now :thumbsup:
rwyatt365
10-01-2007, 05:23 PM
I for one want to see pictures of that house ;D
Sure, if you care. The only ones I have available right now don't really show it in all of its glory (it's overgrown and run down now from lack of care), but I'll upload some when I get home so that you guys can live vicariously through my photos.
Yeah, inquiring minds want to know!
My dream house since I was little was a stone tower with a telescope at the top, or a mortar, seems to be a sticking point in my fantasy. Though I did move to Colorado because I would like to build it in Northern New Mexico.
I prefer wilderness, I've had neighbors my entire life. In fact I can hear some arguing right now :thumbsup:
OOOOOh telescope.
Yeah, that reminds me why I like skylights. It's cool to watch the rainfall and all, but mainly it's great for star gazing (maybe discover a new planet? ;D
Anyone here like lofts? I have this wierd attraction to loft homes.
Anyone here like lofts? I have this wierd attraction to loft homes.
Curious. I didn't even realize that's what they called it, but that's my thing with "indoor balconies". I would prefer to have a second story on a house that is like a usable (multi-purpose) loft of sorts, except it's at ground level due to an incline and the lower floor is partially underground, only the entire structure is built on the side of a hill so the lower floor is also at ground level. The front would make it look very small and uninteresting, you'd have to go around back or inside to realize there was so much more to it.
We should get an island with a mountain on it and wifi.
How about an island in SE Alaska? There are some entire ones for sale there...
We could have them run some fiber to the island and build an INTJ commune there. We'd need to use boats for transportation rather than cars, though.
Anyone here like lofts? *I have this wierd attraction to loft homes.
Curious. *I didn't even realize that's what they called it, but that's my thing with "indoor balconies". *I would prefer to have a second story on a house that is like a usable (multi-purpose) loft of sorts, except it's at ground level due to an incline and the lower floor is partially underground, only the entire structure is built on the side of a hill so the lower floor is also at ground level. *The front would make it look very small and uninteresting, you'd have to go around back or inside to realize there was so much more to it.
Yeah prety much. I like the idea of lofts esp because it allows a high ceiling in parts of the house, and it really opens up a small space. Plus I've always liked spending time on elevated places because then I could watch people while people wouldn't think to look up and see me ;D
There's this really cool group idea of houses in/on trees btw, if you guys are interested.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Seriously hating the decor, but it's just a really cool idea.
To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Guido
10-01-2007, 09:18 PM
I've always been in a city or close to it, so the idea of living in the middle of nowhere isn't something that's terribly appealing. I live downtown, about 10 mins walking distance from work and I'm very close to anything I'd ever need to go to. Also, I need 1337 internet p0wers to play my online games, which are found in cities rather than on the outskirts. Internet connectivity isn't quite as good the further out you go.
Jezebel
10-01-2007, 09:55 PM
Okay, by request. A few pictures of where I grew up, various times during the year.
1-the house from the backview. It's on a hill, so looks 2 stories from this view, front is ground level...that little building to the right is an outhouse
2-pond (and my cousins). chicken coups in the background.
3-another view of the pond/chicken coups at dusk.
4-picture taken from the front yard in spring
5-picture taken from the yard in the summer...just included cause the others are so dreary
1. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
2. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. 3. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
4. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. 5. To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Tarrick
10-01-2007, 10:03 PM
Actually, I remember a year or two back, my friend was looking at (half-seriously at any rate) a old Nuclear Silo Complex in Idaho or Eastern Washington. It was a bit pricey, but the location was great and you had a ton of room underground.
Jezebel
10-01-2007, 10:08 PM
I've always been in a city or close to it, so the idea of living in the middle of nowhere isn't something that's terribly appealing. I live downtown, about 10 mins walking distance from work and I'm very close to anything I'd ever need to go to. Also, I need 1337 internet p0wers to play my online games, which are found in cities rather than on the outskirts. Internet connectivity isn't quite as good the further out you go.
I agree 100%... and I'm also a 10 minute walk from work. Great isn't it? Not sure what all the appeal is about living in out in the middle of nowhere.
Guido
10-02-2007, 02:35 AM
Exactly! It's efficiency at it's prime. Besides, people in rural areas tend to be more chatty. I'll never have to worry about neighbours bothering me :D I've been in my building for over a year and I only know one person in the entire place and that's because we work at the same company.
Jezebel
10-02-2007, 02:44 AM
Exactly! It's efficiency at it's prime. Besides, people in rural areas tend to be more chatty. I'll never have to worry about neighbours bothering me :D I've been in my building for over a year and I only know one person in the entire place and that's because we work at the same company.
Another good point! I didn't have many neighbors when I lived in the country, but for the few people that lived somewhat close, I knew them all. And I always ran into people when I went to town. Now? I've been in the same apartment complex for 2 years, and I only even know the name of one neighbor. I only who he is because he's the landlord's son.
rwyatt365
10-02-2007, 11:50 AM
I can't speak for anyone else, so I'll try to let you know why I'd want to be out in the middle of nowhere…
I have almost always lived in the city. Yes, I understand the attraction and dynamics of city-life but I must say that I can't stand it. I don't (and never have) lived close to work – a 20 minute drive is as close as I've ever gotten – so that "efficiency" is lost on me. Traversing the city in the company of so many incompetent drivers (yes, the INTJ superiority raring it's ugly head) causes me many hours of aggravation every week. The city that I currently live in, and have lived in for the majority of my life, is dirty, smelly and crumbling visibly daily.
I have briefly lived in other places and was never so at peace as when I was away from the circumstances that I describe above. I spent a week in Phoenix AZ (for business, years ago) and took every moment that I could to escape into the Superstition Mountains – that was bliss to me. Once I had to visit two facilities for another job – one in Oklahoma City, the other in Charlotte NC – I mixed in some vacation time and drove, round-trip from Fort Wayne, IN to OKC, to Charlotte and back. Taking my time traveling the 2-lanes, I was in heaven for those two weeks. Recently I drove to Asheville NC just so that I could explore some of the twisty back roads in eastern TN and western NC for a day.
What I'm trying to say is that I find myself restricted in the company of people. I feel better and think better when I'm by myself. I love driving, it doesn't matter where – the journey is what I'm about, not the destination. And the most exciting thing that I can think of is to round a corner and have my breath be taken away by a vista laid out in front of me. That has happened mostly when I'm "out in the middle of nowhere".
Have you ever looked up in the desert sky and see ALL of the stars in the heavens? Have you seen how the clouds hang onto the peaks of the Smokey Mountains? Have you seen Vegas glittering from afar like a handful of diamonds scattered in the blackness of the night? Have you stood on the edge of the Grand Canyon and thought, "how did that teenie-weenie little river do all of this?" Have you floated in the Great Salt Lake, or baked at the bottom and froze on the top of Pikes Peak, or stood in 120-degree heat in Death Valley, or seen Old Faithful?
Those things and more take my breath away, that's never happened in NY, or LA, or London, or Rome.
That's why I want to be in the middle of nowhere.
quartertone
10-02-2007, 11:07 PM
I would think that you could be more anonymous in a huge city than in the middle of nowhare where you HAVE to say hi to your neighbors. Plus the city is the center of all new culture and ideas.
But given the choice, I would pick the complete solitude of the wilderness.
I don't plan on having any neighbours...
Besides... I don't not like the city so much because I'm trying to avoid people. *It's the noise, and the smog among other things.
I don't mind spending time in the city from time to time. *The hustle and bustle is a good change of pace; and like quartertone said, you're nameless in a crowd... but I would probably hate living there. *The one thing I learned from the busy city is that the hustle and bustle becomes so intense that many people stop doing things other than work that are worthwhile. *And that is probably one of the most dreaded things that could happen.
EDIT:
That outdoor pond/skating rink looks GREAT. I've always wanted a skating pond in my yard.
rwyatt365
10-03-2007, 07:42 AM
I would think that you could be more anonymous in a huge city than in the middle of nowhare where you HAVE to say hi to your neighbors. Plus the city is the center of all new culture and ideas.
But given the choice, I would pick the complete solitude of the wilderness.
Anonymous, perhaps - hiding in plain sight as it were. However, out in the boonies you don't HAVE to say "hi" to your neighbors unless you choose to see them. Surrounded by enough land you can choose the time and place of your encounters. Whereas in the city - where you are hustled and bustled - people can impose their "hi's" on you at their discretion.
Question; are all of the "culture" and "new ideas" of the city worth absorbing? Perhaps the filter of time and distance might mature those things, sorting out the good from the bad.
Just a thought.
Question; are all of the "culture" and "new ideas" of the city worth absorbing? Perhaps the filter of time and distance might mature those things, sorting out the good from the bad.
Probably not, however it's is a good idea to stay in sync with these culture and new ideas. You can't tell what is good and what is not unless you have had a chance to experience it. Once you have, and judged it, then you may continue the exposure as you like.
rasoirviolon
10-03-2007, 05:25 PM
so by making a quick head count... (with me included) there are three people who are content as city-dwellers? currently i live in the suburbs and since i just vacationed in singapore last august, i've begun to hate this place even more.
even though i am incredibly introspective and don't enjoy socialising too much, the lure of the rush of the city is irresistable to me! ...my up-bringing has seriously influenced me on this. in the city (in my opinion) you're able to feel connected with the present yet isolate yourself and watch the world speed by at the same time. ...my kind of appeal. :)
so by making a quick head count... (with me included) there are three people who are content as city-dwellers? currently i live in the suburbs and since i just vacationed in singapore last august, i've begun to hate this place even more.
even though i am incredibly introspective and don't enjoy socialising too much, the lure of the rush of the city is irresistable to me! ...my up-bringing has seriously influenced me on this. in the city (in my opinion) you're able to feel connected with the present yet isolate yourself and watch the world speed by at the same time. ...my kind of appeal. *:)
I get the same rush. But the thing is I don't think it's healthy to be in that rush all the time, day and night. I'd rather travel longer to get to the city than to live there and deal with the stifle.
rwyatt365
10-04-2007, 08:36 AM
so by making a quick head count... (with me included) there are three people who are content as city-dwellers? currently i live in the suburbs and since i just vacationed in singapore last august, i've begun to hate this place even more.
even though i am incredibly introspective and don't enjoy socialising too much, the lure of the rush of the city is irresistable to me! ...my up-bringing has seriously influenced me on this. in the city (in my opinion) you're able to feel connected with the present yet isolate yourself and watch the world speed by at the same time. ...my kind of appeal. *:)
I get the same rush. *But the thing is I don't think it's healthy to be in that rush all the time, day and night. *I'd rather travel longer to get to the city than to live there and deal with the stifle.
I don't get the rush - city life grates on me. But I do appreciate it's conveniences. That's why I'd like to reside away from the buzz of the city, then go there when (if?) I choose to.
To each his/her own!
INTJohn
10-06-2007, 01:09 PM
The nearest house straight out from my back door is 2 miles away and the nearest house out my front door is a little over one mile away.
I could live in Los Angle-eez, however, as long as I was the only resident.
INTJohn
rwyatt365
10-06-2007, 02:17 PM
The nearest house straight out from my back door is 2 miles away and the nearest house out my front door is a little over one mile away.
I could live in Los Angle-eez, however, as long as I was the only resident.
INTJohn
Bliss!
I've always said that the only thing wrong with this planet is all of these damned people!
INTJohn
10-06-2007, 02:38 PM
This planet will take care of that problem shortly, too........
........and when Humanity is on the verge of extinction, the second to the last person alive will have been killed by an INTJ.........
.........who will then loudly proclaim that they have now built
THE PERFECT WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
INTJohn
This planet will take care of that problem shortly, too........
........and when Humanity is on the verge of extinction, the second to the last person alive will have been killed by an INTJ.........
.........who will then loudly proclaim that they have now built
THE PERFECT WORLD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
INTJohn
LOL!
GG ::)
bikerscars
10-13-2007, 04:21 PM
i like this vantage point:
My house is pretty cool and fits many of my requirements at some level, otherwise I wouldn't live here...
This is the view off my back deck over the mountain/reservoir:
Here's what the house looks like from down below in the field. Match the palm tree in the middle-left to the palm tree in the last picture. That's where I am!
bikerscars
10-13-2007, 05:02 PM
wolf you obviously have no issues with flooding...
nice pics
palm trees... where's home? (ya know we're looking for a location to hold an intj convention sometime before we die) :)
vBulletin® v3.7.1, Copyright ©2000-2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.