Calling all INTJ males. INFP needing advice [Archive]

Princess39

12-10-2008, 09:41 AM

Hi Everyone,

I am new to this post, so apologies for this being super long…:)

I have known this INTJ for about 5 months now. We both are in our late 30’s. When we first started communicating he seemed very aloof and cold, but as we begin to work more closely together, he is a little nicer and relaxed but not too much. I can still tell that off and on, he’s seems a little timid around me some times. When we do have to speak about business, he always starts off by asking me how I’m doing, and now starting to ask about my weekends….You know he makes the effort of “small talk”. This is over the phone and in passing.

I sense that he may be interested in me, but I can’t really tell. In these last 2 months I just found out that he sees me as a friend from a comment he made when giving me advice. He told me he was telling me the truth…as a friend. This was unusual for me, being that I didn’t know we were on that level yet.

I think he has initiated a few things with me. He offered to help me with a personal project that I am working on as well as asked me out to lunch. He told me (shyly and looking down at the table) to ask him if I ever needed anymore help and I told him that I would. I respect his time, so I only ask questions if need be. So, needing his help for the second time, I suggested we do coffee, but he suggested we do lunch again…he’s only touched me once (very lightly) and that was to get my attention that I noticed he was sitting right beside me, and that led to “small talk”…all of 30 seconds…Boy did he turn RED!!!

I’m REALLY interested in knowing him more and I love his cerebral nature, but don’t want him to think that it’s just all about business. I want to let him know, but I am really shy when it comes to things like this. I feel like I am getting “mixed messages” and possibly even sending them, because I can’t read his signals. I am not into the rejecting thing at all :embarassed:, so I guess I want to know for sure if any of this means this INTJ is interested in me or just sees me as a friend needing help? Your comments would greatly help me “save face”, if I do need to bluntly let him know.:scared:

Jgib5328

12-10-2008, 10:01 AM

I think he may be interested and he seems to be trying to act on it, which is a VERY hard thing for an INTJ to do. If you are really interested, you have to be really upfront with him. Maybe ask him to hang out, see a movie, or anything. Underdeveloped INTJs even if they really like someone, won't show it because they're scared and uncomfortable. You should also be very patient, INTJs take a long time with romance.

Antagonist

12-10-2008, 10:04 AM

As an INTJ, I can tell you myself that I would never invite somebody I didn't have some sort of interested in out to lunch simply because I abhor small talk and it makes me feel awkward. When I go to lunch with my business associates it's usually all business. When the conversation steers away from that topic I just go quiet and listen until I'm addressed again, or it steers back to something factually based that I have knowledge about. Your best bet would just be to go to lunch with him and see how that goes. If he makes the effort to make small talk he's most likely interested. I know that when I was dating my current girlfriend (INFJ) I was reluctant to make any sort of advances until I was absolutely sure that the feelings were returned.

I hope this helps =)

Henry

12-10-2008, 10:06 AM

so I guess I want to know for sure if any of this means this INTJ is interested in me or just sees me as a friend needing help?

It sounds like a possibility, but there's only one way to tell. Its dreadful. ANd hoorible: talk to him.

INTJs are not going to excel at non-verbal communication. We're just not. And I don't think INFPs are either. So you're really left with one option.

muchado

12-10-2008, 10:09 AM

Princess,

He likes you. Try telling him this: "You have my permission to ask me out." They like brutal honesty.

INTJs, what do you think of this?

OmegaPsi

12-10-2008, 10:11 AM

"I am not into the rejecting thing at all."

That bit kind of throws me off for a moment. Do you want to pursue an active relationship with him? If not, don't waste his time, and bluntly tell him so. I would be a bit irritated if I did put in the effort to cultivate a meaningful relationship with someone and it was all for naught. Of course thats me..Though we may share the same personality type [INTJ] and gender, I can't claim to know what he may do or what he's thinking.

In my opinion drawn from my own nature, I would say he's interested. Many of us INTJs could not care a speck of interest in someone else's affairs, but he offered you help on a project and one of the most important things we can probably give you as INTJs is our minds, ideas, and opinions. Sure, it may seem like its all business, because thats what we're generally best at.

So go for it, or not. Whichever way you're inclined.
Well that's my opinion for what its worth.
Good luck!

[warning!: as you may or may not know, I have generalized a great deal and added a bias with my own personal nature,experiences, and introspection..He and I differ in all those categories, and generalizations are dangerous..so I may be way off my mark. Had to add in that disclaimer..]

ElstonGunn

12-10-2008, 11:03 AM

I want to let him know, but I am really shy when it comes to things like this.

If he is interested in you (which I can neither confirm nor deny), then he's probably also shy about it, too. Who do you think is going to blink first? Why don't you sit around wondering about it for a year or two before doing anything productive? You could maybe half-heartedly attempt to figure it out by doing something minor, then when he doesn't catch the hint (and couldn't possibly be expected to), take it as a sure sign that he's not interested.

Princess,

He likes you. Try telling him this: "You have my permission to ask me out." They like brutal honesty.

INTJs, what do you think of this?

I would lose all romantic interest and most of the general respect I had in a woman if she said that to me. If someone is going to go that far with it, I could only assume that granting permission is the same basic thing as admitting her own interest. Except it's a lot more stupid, self-absorbed, and self-entitled in my eyes. Of course, I'm a bitter bastard about these things, so don't take me seriously at all.

Vagrant

12-10-2008, 11:20 AM

He likes you. Plain enough.

INTJ behavior is simple -- if we are making an effort to spend time with you, we like you (even offering to help with a project). Otherwise we'd much rather be by ourselves. However, I cannot say the extent to which he likes you. My guess is as more than a friend.

As for what to do? Try asking him out. :p

SeaCzar

12-10-2008, 11:33 AM

I really hate assumptions, but, here's my $0.02.....

If he is offering to spend time with you, he is definately interested in you as a person. This is big, because we tend to be a cautious lot when it comes to letting anyone "in", whether it be for friendship or romance. I would suggest taking him up on the time offer, and see where things go from there. Subtle hints we do not to get, so try to be a bit more direct. Good luck with it.

pletharoe

12-10-2008, 12:10 PM

It certainly sounds to me like he likes you. I can't make any sweeping "INTJs do this" comments, but I can speak from my experience as an INTJ.

To me, small talk is wasted time. Only useful to appease and blend in with society. I'm not really interested in how your weekend was, I'm just asking because it's polite. However, if the personal questions go any deeper than just an initial throwaway query, it's because I genuinely want to reach out. This is difficult territory for me as asking if you've seen "Pride and prejudice" doesn't directly serve much purpose.

Using the word "friend" places you above colleagues and acquaintances. I'll only call people friends if I genuinely respect them and enjoy their company. I'm told that I'm very hard to read, but I think I'm just giving out signals very clearly albeit in a different way. My general demeanour gives nothing away, however telling someone something as a "friend" adds emotional weight and means that you've got through a couple of layers of my emotional armour.

I can't do smalltalk. It doesn't seem to have a purpose. I know it does have a purpose, but that purpose is veiled in pointless chatter. If he's tried to do this it was incredibly difficult for him. He'll have felt awkward and embarrassed. I only ever step out of my comfort zone if it's for a purpose. I accept that other people work differently from me, so sometimes I try to interact on their level. Doing this shows a keen eagerness to please.

So what should you do about it?...

Muchado seems to have a good idea, but I don't think it's ever happened to him. ElstonGunn appears more insightful. I like to be told things plain and simple, however "You have my persmission to ask me out." sounds to me like you're playing games. I'd suggest some sort of one on one meeting one evening. I recently went on a first date at a squash court. It's a bit unorthodox, but it's something we both enjoy. We didn't have time to get nervous around each other, we were too busy scoring points and laughing at how bad we were. Find something you're both interested in which you can *do* together. You'll have a chance to get to know each other properly and maybe go for a quick drink afterwards. If he's interested, he'll get the idea. Especially if you hug him good night in stead of the usual goodbye (I'm sure you know that goodbye's get more fun in the following order - saying, shaking hands, hug, kiss on the cheek, kiss on the lips. However you say goodbye now, try "going up a level". If he likes the idea he'll continue to talk to you the next day. If not, you'll know about it.

Hope that helps

Monte314

12-10-2008, 12:12 PM

My wife is an INFP... she chased me for two years, and finally ran me to ground. Her persistence, affirmation, showing interest, not becoming impatient... all helped.

OrrDavey

12-10-2008, 05:57 PM

He is totally into you.

And it sounds like he has very little experience (I could be wrong, though) with relationships. You'll probably have to do more of the work at first.

bmartinl

12-10-2008, 06:00 PM

Realize that he is not playing by your rules. The reason he "only touched you once, lightly" is because that's how INTJs are. If you like him, you must be straight-forward and tell him. We usually need to be led by someone more experienced, and if you feel like doing that, by all means do it! There is nothing WRONG with doing that if you like being around him.

It seems to me that you guys are at the point where you have hung out at work, in a business relationship, and he has expressed interest in you. Neither of you know how to step up to the next level. I think in this situation it would be nice to actually talk about it. You'll probably have to bring it up...but don't freak out...INTJs appreciate being asked honest questions. Say something like:

"So we've had lunch, worked on projects...I think you're a cool guy because X,Y,Z (compliment will make him more comfortable). Do you think you might have feelings for me?"

Princess39

12-10-2008, 06:31 PM

OrrDavey

12-10-2008, 07:19 PM

Acextreme

12-10-2008, 09:32 PM

Can you elaborate on what you mean when you said...The reason he "only touched you once, lightly" is because that's how INTJs are.

Actually, if I didn't misunderstand what you said, he touched you lightly only to get your attention, yes? Then I guess you shouldn't read too much into it. For one, we don't really touch anyone when we talk. I don't. If I have to get someone's attention by touch, I will usually use a proxy that's already in my hands, like a pen or something to tap the person's arm or something. But of course, if I am dining, I wouldn't use any of the utensils in my hands.

But even if I really have to tap on a female using my hands to get their attention, I will usually do it quite cautiously, like poking on her shoulders or maybe a light tap on her arms, etc. So like I say, if it's to just get your attention, then I suggest you don't read too much into it; we only touch a person if necessary like getting her attention...

To tell if an INTJ is interested, let him initiate dates. And this is very important to take note of, if he does initiate dates, and if you are interested, try not to reject, especially for the first "official" date, unless you got a real valid reason and you better let him know the reasons clearly so that he don't feel that it's an excuse to avoid him. And if you do have a need to turn down his date proposal due to some events, you can say something like "I am not free on that day, unfortunately but how about [xxx date]"; in other words, counter propose another day. This will say that you are interested to hang out with me but you are busy on the day that I proposed. If you don't counter propose, I might think that you are trying to avoid my advances after a couple of tries; girls who want to turn down guys usually say they are busy and don't suggest another day in return, in hopes that the guy will just let it go. Generally, if I ask a girl out a couple of times or 3 initially and they get rejected without any reasons to my knowledge, I will just assume she's plain not interested and I will move on.

The fact that an INTJ is asking you out means a hellva lot of things. Better if it's not business context. Well, you can move away from that by leading him. For example, during one of the business talks, you can suggest that there's this movie you are really interested to watch and asking him whether he wants to join you. Simple. And how INTJs know if you are interested? Well, we use the same yardstick; if you are hanging out with me for social reasons like movies, coffee, dinner, etc, that means you are saying you are at least remotely interested. And oh yes, at least to me, the events have different intimacy levels; a coffee is more casual, lunch is a more intimate setting, followed by dinner, and movies, and lastly, maybe a walk in the park just the 2 of us...etc...

Hope this helps even a little...

Vagrant

12-10-2008, 10:58 PM

Can you elaborate on what you mean when you said...The reason he "only touched you once, lightly" is because that's how INTJs are.

It's funny, because I tend to flirt physically -- but I rarely if ever actually touch the girl except for tickling -- by that point, however, I am extremely fond of them. We just don't touch people naturally. Like, I pay attention if somebody touches my back.

Princess39

12-10-2008, 11:35 PM

The fact is that we almost never touch anyone unless they are in a really close relationship with us. And I am not just saying this. Using touch as a form of communication for an INTJ is like a regular guy grabbing your ass or something like that.

I know, I know... that was a really elaborate explanation.

OrrDavey,

You're funny...This was elaborate...but honest. I dig it!

Princess39 added to this post, 11 minutes and 58 seconds later...

Actually, if I didn't misunderstand what you said, he touched you lightly only to get your attention, yes? Then I guess you shouldn't read too much into it. For one, we don't really touch anyone when we talk. I don't. If I have to get someone's attention by touch, I will usually use a proxy that's already in my hands, like a pen or something to tap the person's arm or something. But of course, if I am dining, I wouldn't use any of the utensils in my hands.

But even if I really have to tap on a female using my hands to get their attention, I will usually do it quite cautiously, like poking on her shoulders or maybe a light tap on her arms, etc. So like I say, if it's to just get your attention, then I suggest you don't read too much into it; we only touch a person if necessary like getting her attention...

To tell if an INTJ is interested, let him initiate dates. And this is very important to take note of, if he does initiate dates, and if you are interested, try not to reject, especially for the first "official" date, unless you got a real valid reason and you better let him know the reasons clearly so that he don't feel that it's an excuse to avoid him. And if you do have a need to turn down his date proposal due to some events, you can say something like "I am not free on that day, unfortunately but how about [xxx date]"; in other words, counter propose another day. This will say that you are interested to hang out with me but you are busy on the day that I proposed. If you don't counter propose, I might think that you are trying to avoid my advances after a couple of tries; girls who want to turn down guys usually say they are busy and don't suggest another day in return, in hopes that the guy will just let it go. Generally, if I ask a girl out a couple of times or 3 initially and they get rejected without any reasons to my knowledge, I will just assume she's plain not interested and I will move on.

The fact that an INTJ is asking you out means a hellva lot of things. Better if it's not business context. Well, you can move away from that by leading him. For example, during one of the business talks, you can suggest that there's this movie you are really interested to watch and asking him whether he wants to join you. Simple. And how INTJs know if you are interested? Well, we use the same yardstick; if you are hanging out with me for social reasons like movies, coffee, dinner, etc, that means you are saying you are at least remotely interested. And oh yes, at least to me, the events have different intimacy levels; a coffee is more casual, lunch is a more intimate setting, followed by dinner, and movies, and lastly, maybe a walk in the park just the 2 of us...etc...

Hope this helps even a little...

Acextreme,

1. Yes, this was most helpful. I should have been clearer when I said he touched me lightly on my arm to get my attention. He didn't want to talk to me about anything important or work related. We were outside of work and I was in the middle of talking with another female co-worker. He got my attention to have some "small talk".

2. Well, I tried to get him outside of work. That is why I offered to have Saturday coffee. He turned that down and suggested lunch again for the second time while we are at work. He seems like he more comfortable in his work environment.

Frag

12-11-2008, 12:49 AM

To the OP...

I would lose all romantic interest and most of the general respect I had in a woman if she said that to me.
Disregard this. Elston prefers his women really "girly", and allegedly has no confidence issues. Ever.

He likes you. Try telling him this: "You have my permission to ask me out." They like brutal honesty.

INTJs, what do you think of this?
I'll agree with this suggestion. Because this guy has absolutely zero confidence, so providing some "definative proof" fits the bill.
If he hides under the table at first, dont be suprised. ;-)

Or, it could all be nothing, we don't know.

Acextreme

12-11-2008, 09:45 AM

Princess,

He likes you. Try telling him this: "You have my permission to ask me out." They like brutal honesty.

INTJs, what do you think of this?

Eh, no, don't attempt this. It's true that we like brutal honesty but not presented this way. This makes it too...I don't know...conceited, forceful, desperate...along those lines...

To be obvious, just spent time with that INTJ, it says a lot to us...

ClydeB

12-11-2008, 10:17 AM

Speaking from personal experience. My last steady girlfriend and I met in a class. Even though I (at first) thought I was getting the interested vibe from her I was still too nervous to actually ask her out or do something that was not class focused with her. One day she started doing a stream of consciousness thinking out loud speech where she was comparing how we matched up. "Well, your in your thirties, and I'm in my thirties, your single, and I'm single, we both like computers, etc etc"
It let me know that she was doing the same thing I was, which was trying to figure out if she was interested in me as a potential date. Rather than the 'leach off the smart guy' thing I had run into so many times before.

Perhaps you should use the fact that he's willing to engage you in small talk (always a good sign) to give him some concrete facts to work with. Things he can plug into that internal argument of his to help him convince himself that you really are interested in him. Maybe in the form of leading questions if nothing else.
"Are you looking forward to lunch together as much as I am?"
"Where would you take girl out to if you were interested in her?" ... "That's sounds interesting, we should do that sometime"

Or something.

Sinequanon

12-11-2008, 10:19 AM

Princess,

He likes you. Try telling him this: "You have my permission to ask me out." They like brutal honesty.

INTJs, what do you think of this?
Why not "Do you want to ask me out?"

The permission thing I think is getting a bunch of INTJ haunches up.

memorysnap

12-11-2008, 10:33 AM

Or maybe "I'd be pleased if you asked me out"

Luthor Rex

12-11-2008, 11:51 AM

Can you elaborate on what you mean when you said...The reason he "only touched you once, lightly" is because that's how INTJs are.

Yeah I was wondering about that too.

In my own experiences I've learned to read a woman's body language well enough that I don't ask for dates any longer. If I know she likes me I've had a lot of success with just leaning in and kissing the girl, and then asking her on the date (this has worked on three different women so far). Actually I've learned to do it because I'm nervous and I don't like ambiguous situations. It seems that a lot of women are shockingly open to men doing this. Don't get me wrong, you have to be rather gentlemanly about it, so no tongue and no groping to go with it. You could try the reverse on him. If he balks, you could say something like "don't you like kissing pretty girls?" Or maybe "I guess you don't like me then". If he does like you, he'll probably relent.

Haven't been slapped yet, but there's always a first time I suppose.

Zombicide

12-11-2008, 11:54 AM

curiousjane

12-11-2008, 01:10 PM

Two thoughts for the time being:

1) He turned red? From just talking to you? Girl, either he saw his wife watching (this is a joke, by the way, for emphasis), or he could be completely taken with you/unused to talking to women.

2) He asked you to lunch while at work? Sorry, but this doesn't sound like a date to me. I don't frequently eat lunch with just a single male from my office, but just going to lunch from work sounds more like he doesn't want to be alone at lunch. Not that he's into you. YET, this is merely looking one side of the story. You know how he acts, and if he acts differently than normal around you, and if you're getting the "he's asking me out" vibe, well, he probably is.

Yes, I know these two things conflict. But that's what I got out of your story. Be careful with INTJs who are shy. They require gentleness and patience. :)

(Oh, and don't expect him to touch you affectionately, not even when you're on an official "date". This requires a significant warm-up period, it seems. From what I've been told ... a hug is like making out. ;))

Princess39

12-11-2008, 02:07 PM

Have you asked him if he's single or seeing anyone? If so, did he reciprocate, asking you the same?

It might be a good idea to ask. Not so much because he may be unavailable but rather because it would make for a good conversation piece/hint.

I know he's single, but I am not sure if he's seeing anyone or not. So, I will add this to my "small talk" conversation with him next week...hint taken!!

Princess39 added to this post, 23 minutes and 6 seconds later...

Two thoughts for the time being:

1) He turned red? From just talking to you? Girl, either he saw his wife watching (this is a joke, by the way, for emphasis), or he could be completely taken with you/unused to talking to women.

2) He asked you to lunch while at work? Sorry, but this doesn't sound like a date to me. I don't frequently eat lunch with just a single male from my office, but just going to lunch from work sounds more like he doesn't want to be alone at lunch. Not that he's into you. YET, this is merely looking one side of the story. You know how he acts, and if he acts differently than normal around you, and if you're getting the "he's asking me out" vibe, well, he probably is.

Yes, I know these two things conflict. But that's what I got out of your story. Be careful with INTJs who are shy. They require gentleness and patience. :)

(Oh, and don't expect him to touch you affectionately, not even when you're on an official "date". This requires a significant warm-up period, it seems. From what I've been told ... a hug is like making out. ;))

curiousjane

In reponse to when you stated:

"He asked you to lunch while at work? Sorry, but this doesn't sound like a date to me. I don't frequently eat lunch with just a single male from my office, but just going to lunch from work sounds more like he doesn't want to be alone at lunch..."

Yes. Your 1 & 2 reponses are conflicting. I don't get a sense of him being lonely and I am good with percieving. Your the first person to say that. I never thought that our lunch was a date. I'm working on leading up to that point. Right now, we are accessing if he's interested in me or not. From what I gather from the INTJ men themselves, the majority (but a few ) think that he is or could be interested, and how I would go about "verbally" letting him know I feel the same way too.

ElstonGunn

12-11-2008, 02:44 PM

Right now, we are accessing if he's interested in me or not. From what I gather from the INTJ men themselves, the majority (but a few ) think that he is or could be interested, and how I would go about "verbally" letting him know I feel the same way too.

Saying "I like you. I'd like to spend some time with you outside of work," or something like that is out of the question, right? I think it would save you a lot of time and effort (whether it works out or not). It might also win you some interest and respect.

But I'm pretty sure you're against being that direct and honest with him, so I won't mention it to you again.

Princess39

12-11-2008, 04:35 PM

Saying "I like you. I'd like to spend some time with you outside of work," or something like that is out of the question, right? I think it would save you a lot of time and effort (whether it works out or not). It might also win you some interest and respect.

But I'm pretty sure you're against being that direct and honest with him, so I won't mention it to you again.

Actually, ElstonGunn, The responses that I received from the INTJs’ on this post, has given me the courage that I need to be subtly direct. As a matter of fact, I like your response, its sounds like something I would say…something very girly. How did you know?

See…I knew you weren’t the “bitter bastard” you claimed to be.

Acextreme

12-11-2008, 05:59 PM

2) He asked you to lunch while at work? Sorry, but this doesn't sound like a date to me. I don't frequently eat lunch with just a single male from my office, but just going to lunch from work sounds more like he doesn't want to be alone at lunch. Not that he's into you. YET, this is merely looking one side of the story. You know how he acts, and if he acts differently than normal around you, and if you're getting the "he's asking me out" vibe, well, he probably is.

Oh, actually, it might be a date, who knows. Honestly, most INTJs are absolute comfortable and fine with having lunch alone. I definitely am. There's plenty of people who feels like super lonely to have a meal alone, but not me. So the only way to really see if he's just asking you out because he doesn't want to be eating alone is to see if he has been always having lunch alone or not before he asked you. Also, if he's having lunch not alone, who are the people he always have lunch with. If he switched lunch partners, that also say something; he could have asked you to join him and his other lunch partner(s) instead.

(Oh, and don't expect him to touch you affectionately, not even when you're on an official "date". This requires a significant warm-up period, it seems. From what I've been told ... a hug is like making out. ;))

Haha, yes, you are there with that understanding. It will take a LONG warm-up period, at least for me. So I guess that must have seemed to other girls I dated that I am not that interested in them? Gosh, why do all of them think guys are hormone-driven out-of-control males who would attempt physical contact whenever the chance arises?

Princess39

12-11-2008, 06:30 PM

...So the only way to really see if he's just asking you out because he doesn't want to be eating alone is to see if he has been always having lunch alone or not before he asked you. Also, if he's having lunch not alone, who are the people he always have lunch with. If he switched lunch partners, that also say something; he could have asked you to join him and his other lunch partner(s) instead.

From the times that I've seen in passing, he has gone to lunch with a group of people and male associates. The majority of the time, I've seen him alone. He doesn't come off as needing anyone to go to lunch with him. He looks very comfortable being alone.

When we went to lunch, it wasn’t your average fast food or take out joint...It was an actual restaurant. One where you waited to be seated, server took your order and afterwards you paid for valet parking…and we didn’t go dutch…He paid!

Do INTJs do this for girls they are not interested in?

mplogue

12-11-2008, 06:31 PM

Just grab him by the ears and give him a hot and passionate kiss. You'll find out if he likes you or not........ INTJs may be shy, but they appreciate directness.

azelismia

12-11-2008, 07:57 PM

To the OP...

Disregard this. Elston prefers his women really "girly", and allegedly has no confidence issues. Ever.

I'll agree with this suggestion. Because this guy has absolutely zero confidence, so providing some "definative proof" fits the bill.
If he hides under the table at first, dont be suprised. ;-)

Or, it could all be nothing, we don't know.

I am not an intj guy, but if I were a guy and a girl said this to me I'd be horrified. for all of the reasons elston states. it's the way it's stated..Even if I were interested this would be a red flag that the person was way too infantile for my liking.

I think the tact of hinting at movies or galleries or something is far better. Or just say casually, you know, I really like you.

Acextreme

12-12-2008, 12:03 AM

From the times that I've seen in passing, he has gone to lunch with a group of people and male associates. The majority of the time, I've seen him alone. He doesn't come off as needing anyone to go to lunch with him. He looks very comfortable being alone.

When we went to lunch, it wasn’t your average fast food or take out joint...It was an actual restaurant. One where you waited to be seated, server took your order and afterwards you paid for valet parking…and we didn’t go dutch…He paid!

Do INTJs do this for girls they are not interested in?

Shit, he's interested, for real. I only do that to gals that I am interested in. So yes, this one thing confirms he's interested. And if you said this is not your average fast-food or take out joint, and he pays for it, then that's almost certain about his interest level.

Now it's only you; do you have any interest in him? If you do, then make it more obvious to him.

Princess39

12-12-2008, 07:04 AM

Shit, he's interested, for real. I only do that to gals that I am interested in. So yes, this one thing confirms he's interested. And if you said this is not your average fast-food or take out joint, and he pays for it, then that's almost certain about his interest level.

Now it's only you; do you have any interest in him? If you do, then make it more obvious to him.

Yes. I am interested in him. However, subtle is not the key. From what INTJs are telling me, I must be more direct...:blush:

Acextreme

12-12-2008, 08:12 AM

Yes. I am interested in him. However, subtle is not the key. From what INTJs are telling me, I must be more direct...:blush:

Well, easy, ask him out for movie. Simple. At least that will work for me...

Frag

12-12-2008, 08:13 AM

I think the tact of hinting at movies or galleries or something is far better. Or just say casually, you know, I really like you.
Er yes, more like this.

I wouldn't go with the literal version of that original suggestion either ;-)

But I think the central point - to send a clear message - still holds.

Vagrant

12-12-2008, 11:00 AM

Yeah. Subtlety isn't an INTJ's strong suit. You can go for the head on approach, or drop some very obvious hints.

imjin

12-12-2008, 11:38 AM

Princess,

He likes you. Try telling him this: "You have my permission to ask me out." They like brutal honesty.

INTJs, what do you think of this?

As an INTJ, I would totally go for that. That breaks through so many barriers, it makes it almost too easy to talk to the girl. Although, I'm married now, prior to that, it took an enormous amount of energy to work up the nerve to talk to a girl, especially to ask her out, and I had a pretty decent dating track record. It just never got any easier.

SeaCzar

12-12-2008, 04:04 PM

Show him this thread.

ElstonGunn

12-12-2008, 04:46 PM

Yeah. Subtlety isn't an INTJ's strong suit. You can go for the head on approach, or drop some very obvious hints.

I can sometimes catch a subtle hint or two, but I never act on them. You can't know if your interpretation of a hint is correct or not until after you've acted on it, which doesn't sit well with me. Hints are inherently ambiguous, and I'd rather not act on shaky information.

Princess39

12-12-2008, 07:04 PM

This experience has been Awesome…Thanks guys (and a few gals).:thumbsup:

This has been some really IMMENSE advice from all of you. Ranging from (disclaimers, current experiences, assumptions, $0.02, bluntness, sarcasm, explanations, directness and the like), and I respect and welcome them all. I dig the honesty and admire your creative minds.;)

I know that you guys don’t just” cast your pearls before swine”, so just know that your responses to my post was not in vain. They gave me the ammunition that I needed.

I stepped out of my comfort zone and told him that I really liked him and we should go out.;D

I can’t help but suspect that this whole thing could have just been a test for me. Nothing appeases me more then the thrill of being able to fighting in the most ultimate battle that inside my own mind. Playing only for one reason and that’s to win.

Defeating and overcome yet another one of the many faces of fear. To me gentleman that is by far the greatest victory… and with victory comes freedom!:wiseguy:

Frag

12-12-2008, 07:38 PM

Wait, wait... you missed the important part... how'd it go?

I need my soap opera, right now. ;-(

Princess39

12-12-2008, 08:04 PM

Wait, wait... you missed the important part... how'd it go?

I need my soap opera, right now. ;-(

I don't know how it went. I'm sure we will talk about it later.

I sent it on email...Don't tell me that I should have done it in person...I barely got through the email.:faint:

I express myself better that way and besides...he wasn't in the office today and remember...I rarely see him.

I know that time is important to him, so I don't disrespect him with personal stuff like this in person at the office. I like to keep it private, so he's use to me sending it this way if I have anything I want to say.

Acextreme

12-12-2008, 08:24 PM

I don't know how it went. I'm sure we will talk about it later.

I sent it on email...Don't tell me that I should have done it in person...I barely got through the email.:faint:

I express myself better that way and besides...he wasn't in the office today and remember...I rarely see him.

I know that time is important to him, so I don't disrespect him with personal stuff like this in person at the office. I like to keep it private, so he's use to me sending it this way if I have anything I want to say.

No, email's fine. We are not bothered by which media you used, or at least I am not bothered by it. My ex did that thru the office email even though she was seated just across the room. That's how the romance starts... ;)

Frag

12-12-2008, 08:43 PM

Ahhhh thats probably actually a reasonable idea anyway. Digestion time is useful, without having to immediately pick a face.

ElstonGunn

12-13-2008, 08:42 AM

If he reacts in a sort of aloof way, don't assume that it's necessarily a bad sign.

Vagrant

12-13-2008, 09:41 AM

No, email's fine. We are not bothered by which media you used, or at least I am not bothered by it. My ex did that thru the office email even though she was seated just across the room. That's how the romance starts... ;)

The only time I'm bothered by the media is when it's something really important... my ex broke up with me over AIM. Yeah, that pissed me off.

Lucid

12-13-2008, 03:50 PM

The only time I'm bothered by the media is when it's something really important... my ex broke up with me over AIM. Yeah, that pissed me off.

Ha! My most recent x and I broke up repeatedly and always over email. We both preferred it that way. :)

Acextreme

12-13-2008, 06:40 PM

The only time I'm bothered by the media is when it's something really important... my ex broke up with me over AIM. Yeah, that pissed me off.

Yeah, I won't like that too. If you want to break up, do it properly, talk to me face to face. It's not like I would eat you up; INTJs are highly unlikely to be the ones to get emotional during the breakup. Not that we don't have feelings, but that we conceal them and refuses to let them interfere with objective decision making. And we always respect the other party's (or at least me), so if she doesn't think that we should continue for whatever reason, then I don't see how refusing to breakup helps in any way.

errrzarrr

12-15-2008, 12:21 PM

Princess39

12-15-2008, 02:55 PM

hey Princess39 I am happy you got the help you needed in this forum.
What I am curious about is Why do you got interested in that particular guy in first place? What he did and what you saw in him?
...I'm just curious about that.

Hey Errrzarr,

I have many reasons for being attracted to my INTJ man. All these attributes that I’ve seen in him makes my attraction for him much deeper and I like him for who he is. :)

Here are a few things:

1. He comes off as being reserved and aloof, but underneath that titanium wall around him, he is actually a really caring, nice & sweet guy.

2.I love his cerebral nature. Don’t get me wrong. I’m a very smart girl and I hold my own with him, but he knows a lot more things and can explain them to me very well. I can see the picture, but he helps me in seeing the “bigger” picture. I respect that and like that in him and I like learning from him. It can be intense at times, but that's who he is.

3.He’s traditional. He respects me and makes me feel like women (Chivalry type).

4. He’s self confidant and strong
5. He’s articulate
6. He’s ambitious
7. He’s down right bluntly honest
8. He has sarcasm (which is funny to me...so do I).
9. He’s patient with me
10. He’s a good listener
11. He’s Business savvy
12. He has these beautiful “green eyes” :lovestruck:
13. He’s well groomed
14. He’s conservative
15. He just is…

This is just to name a few things that I like about him;)
Don’t get me wrong, we are both alike in many of these ways, and so far it’s enough to spark my interest in him and want to get to know him more.

errrzarrr

12-15-2008, 03:06 PM

Oh I see. Now I understand. I can really tell you are deeply in love. Whish you luck with your relationship! ;)

Princess39

12-15-2008, 03:13 PM

Oh I see. Now I understand. I can really tell you are deeply in love. Whish you luck with your relationship! ;)

I wouldn't say deeply in "Love" . I would say…very attracted to him.

We still haven’t gone out on any "official" dates yet. He’s only asked me to lunch a few times and helped me with my project. We also haven’t had the opportunity to spend quality time together.

I just told him that I really liked him and we should go out. I am not sure what he feels about me, but from the post (the INTJ men) let me know that he’s interested. He just hasn’t verbalized it.

errrzarrr

12-16-2008, 12:53 PM

Well I hope you two get in love eventually then, more soon than later. Both ways, of course!.

wotsamattaU

12-18-2008, 07:48 PM

I get the impression that an INTJ male can segue into dating without the girl ever being quite certain they are in fact, actually dating. :cool:

If he reacts in a sort of aloof way, don't assume that it's necessarily a bad sign.

What could that be interpreted as? What's the thought process going on there?

Princess, how has he been acting since you told him you like him?

Princess39

12-18-2008, 09:06 PM

Princess, how has he been acting since you told him you like him?

WotsamattaU,

The first time he offered that we go to lunch together, he was very reserved and timid. He stood at arms length and he didn't talk a lot unless it was pertaining to the project. When I asked him personal questions, he would shy away from answering them.

After I sent the email letting him know that I liked him, we went to lunch again.

This time it was so different. He started conversing from the start. He was more connected. He was initiating a lot of the conversation as well as asking me personal questions. He was like another person compared to the month before. He was more open in sharing a lot more of himself with me and I found out that he had a great sense of humor. He didn’t hesitate to let me know (somewhere in the conversations) that he needs his “personal space”. While we were waiting for our table, he even sat really close to me on the bench. We shared an appetizer together, and when our food came…we shared that too.

The only awkward moment for me was when I found out that I was 6yrs older than he. He mentioned that “I didn’t look my age”, so I think that took him by surprise. Since that awkward time, It had me wondering… Do younger INTJ men like older women?

However, I asked him about the email and he stated that he read through it so fast, that the only thing he remembered was me making this sarcastic remark. I was hoping that he would take it that way, as he is very sarcastic too. So, I didn't mention the email any further and left it alone.

That has been the only noticeable difference.

mplogue

12-18-2008, 09:30 PM

The only awkward moment for me was when I found out that I was 6yrs older than he. He mentioned that “I didn’t look my age”, so I think that took him by surprise. Since that awkward time, It had me wondering… Do younger INTJ men like older women?

I can't speak for every male INTJ, but I wouldn't say that we aren't attracted to any particular age. I think that generally, INTJ males are simply oblivious to this aspect in females - it's just not something we take into consideration.

I remember the first girl I got serious with. I was 18 at the time and had just gone into the Army and was at my first post overseas. I had guessed that she was older than me, but I never really thought about how much. I only later found out that she was eleven years older than me and had two children (still living in the US with her parents). It was a considerable shock at first. Ultimately, it wasn't the age that freaked me out the most. It was the thought of her already having children that eventually scared me off.

Princess39

12-19-2008, 07:33 AM

Ultimately, it wasn't the age that freaked me out the most. It was the thought of her already having children that eventually scared me off.

Funny...The first serious question he asked me was if I had any kids.

wotsamattaU

12-19-2008, 12:45 PM

I can't speak for every male INTJ, but I wouldn't say that we aren't attracted to any particular age. I think that generally, INTJ males are simply oblivious to this aspect in females - it's just not something we take into consideration.

I find that interesting because age is the first thing I disregard as well. If you disregard age factors and speak to that youth (of their early 20's which reside inside every adult) you will immediately strike common ground. You have just leapt over all those layers and masks which have built up over time.

In youth, I think it is not uncommon to find IN's paired with older individuals - largely because they are not meshing with the population of their peers. They can find it refreshing to converse with those somewhat older; it tends to come more easily, naturally.

Princess, what do you think of the age difference between you? Do you see it as a difficulty?

It sounds as if you noted quite a few changes in his behavior from lunch #1 to lunch #2. I particularly liked how he let you know right off the bat he needs his personal space, and also his asking if you have any kids. That smacks of someone who is interested, and is testing the lay of the land.

I think it is terrific you mustered up the fortitude to tell him of your interest straight out. :thumbsup: No doubt he appreciated that very much. I look forward to your updates.