Interracial Dating

[Andrew Popovici]

So, I'm Romanian (which classifies as white) and I have a hispanic (El Salvadorian) girlfriend. I love her, she loves me. Her parents are okay with it, my parents are being racist bastards about it. I seriously had no idea how prejudiced they could be. they offered arguments like it'll affect my school performance, I'll never get into Harvard that way, I have no time, but in the end, it all boiled down to race. I have no problem with it, they do. My dad was a little understanding (he hoped it'd be just a phase I'm going through), my mom suprised my by saying there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed, pretty american girls as well as cute Romanian/Italian girls and she doesn't want her kind in her house. This makes the black/white race struggle seem like a cakewalk!

So what do you guys say? First, your opinion on interracial dating, and then any advice.

[Nikita]

My first reaction is anger. I don't understand why racial issues matter, we're all people! Advice...maybe ask them what they would do if you had children with your g/f. Would they reject their grandchildren because of their race? I can't really think of anything more to tell you at the moment, but I'll think about it.

[rahdam]

Interracial Dating: Hell yes, greater genetic diversity leads to more fit offspring, in the evolutionary sense of the word. I have also noticed, anecdotally, that mixed race offspring are generally more attractive that pure race offspring.

Advice: Depends on how old you and how close you are to college. I would stick it out, Mom and Dad are not being reasonable from the sound of it.

[Mozzes]

Advice? Do what I would do - ignore your parents and date her anyways.

[Smotor]

I haven't done much dating (ok, any), but both of my brothers have dated a lot. My parents, especially my mom, always find something horribly wrong with any girlfriend either brother has had. I think some parents are prone to look for negatives first, therefore any potential mates are subject to extreme scrutiny.

However, race seems like a huge issue. Do other members of your family (grandparents, aunts, cousins, etc.) have the same views on the issue? I'm just curious where their racism is rooted.

Other than that, I agree with rahdam and Mozzes, definitely continue to date her, and if possible put some distance between you and your parents. This may help ease the tension and help them get some perspective. Maybe...

[Andrew Popovici]

Well, my mom (more than my dad) is horrified at what my other relatives will thinks, she is disgusted at the thought of babies walking around that look more hispanic than white, and she hates hispanics in general. My mother's parents dislike it when my mom married my dad. She was Baptist, he was Petecostal, but that was enough to set them off. (My mom's pastor said my dad would burn in hell).

What I hate is this traditional way of thinking. First it was going to friend's houses, then rock n' roll, then rap music, then it was school dances, etc. etc. etc. This latest one set me off, cuz all people are created equal! God loves them all equally! It's just simple logic, and why can't they see that?!?

[errrzarrr]

uhm, Interracial Relationships. Tastes good to meee!

[tp6626]

From my experience, the main thing is that your parents will feel embarrassed about it. Basically, the girl you end up with is a direct sign of how successful they have been as parents. Other factors that may produce a similar effect would be your educational choices, your job choices, or anything else that could in their eyes reflect badly on them.

They will be of the impression that all their friends and peers will snigger and act superior, taking that settling with a Hispanic girl is a sign that you have failed ("Oh but our Johnny is seeing a wonderful white american girl - and she's a doctor!). So, by you dating her, it is almost a direct insult to your parents reputation(s). It's not so much about what makes you happy, it's how it reflects on them and the family that is the real issue.

Your Harvard reference was also a telling clue. Some of my family are a little like that. They only want to know when you have something good to tell them that they can boast to their so called 'friends'. E.g. "Oh my grandson is going to Oxford, you know?" or "My nephew is in talks with Gordon Brown". They'd never want to say "Oh my nephew has become a trash-man" or "My son has married a girl with 5 children of different men".

Its all a reputation thing, and has very little to do with your happiness.

Difficult to get around, but you'd have to discuss this with your parents, and bring up that they're bothered about their reputations, and not really that bothered about your happiness. If they are sure if will effect your happiness, ask them to explain how. If it is what I outlined, they will be unable to provide rational answers. It will either be racism or social acceptance excuses.

However if they do come up with good reasons (I'm talking specific examples), I would advise you to listen to them. For example, if they said something like "You have been seeing her too much and your academic work is demonstrably suffering". Even in this case though, just the same could be true with an american girl, so it may indeed be a racist problem.

Difficult one. You could do what I do when you leave home. Partially disconnect, and make it clear that the people and choices you make in your life are no concern of your families. I did this, and my mother routinely interferes with my other two brothers lives, but she wouldn't dare with mine. I quite like it that way. (Or if she does when I finally take a girlfriend back to meet them, she'd better watch out, there'll be hell to pay)!!!

[Reon]

Interracial Dating: Hell yes, greater genetic diversity leads to more fit offspring, in the evolutionary sense of the word. I have also noticed, anecdotally, that mixed race offspring are generally more attractive that pure race offspring.

Advice: Depends on how old you and how close you are to college. I would stick it out, Mom and Dad are not being reasonable from the sound of it.

Haha, I'm all for interracial dating, but dating someone for those reasons, especially the last one (which in my view is another racism comment, but thats for another thread) , isn't 'love'

[rahdam]

Haha, I'm all for interracial dating, but dating someone for those reasons, especially the last one (which in my view is another racism comment, but thats for another thread) , isn't 'love'

It's an aesthetic argument based upon my own personal tastes (see: anecdotally).

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

[Gabrielle]

Considering that my criteria requires a guy taller than me and it's tough to find an Asian who is actually taller than me, I tend to date white guys, so I'm all for interracial dating. (I am not going to comment on the aesthetic value of the offspring, because I don't particularly find mixed races that attractive.) That being said...

I say, don't date. Dating in high school leads to more disasters than anything else, and 80% of the couple end up breaking up post-graduation anyway. It consumes time (Proof: if you did not have a girlfriend, you won't be having this problem so you won't be spending time writing this thread and following up on it), generally it's a huge hassle that can wait until college or even after. So you say you love... but high school is one of the most important time of your life. It may decide where you end up in the future, who you may marry (because there are greater chances of marrying someone you met at college or work, which will partially be determined BY which college you went to, and what you studied).

Honestly, are you two going to get married? I'll be frank... probably not. So while you may love her and you may like her, listen to your parents. At least while you're under their roof; less trouble for you, less screams from them, and generally less painful results over all.

[Autoptic]

This was the one point where my family will finally show their racism. I've mentioned it to Mother once and she reacted explosively. Of course, other than not dating at all, I've gone completely black sheep, and she's mellowed, so it's a non-issue. I agree with rahdam in the larger species sense. Breed until we're beige.

No family advice though, anyone dictating to my personal life is an enemy or just an idiot. I don't who they think they are.

[True Rune]

I have no problems with interracial dating. Even though I'm not sexual, I still can tell a pretty girl when I see one. And race usually does not play into how I see a girl. I'd say an above post is correct. It's not about you, it's about them and how they will look. Do you live in a society where that is what makes you important? (If you're talking about Harvard, I doubt it.) Does your girlfriend know? If you continue to date her, will you lose out on college and other things? I'd say plan carefully, and know what to do by expecting the worst.
(Too many times have parents like this presented an ultimatum)

[Reon]

It's an aesthetic argument based upon my own personal tastes (see: anecdotally).

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

haha, alrighty then. what I'd do now (being in an interracial relationship previously) is just wait till you leave home.

[Marcus]

I agree with tp6626, it's probably more about lower social status than race.

[Vagrant]

Breed until we're beige.

If this forum had signatures, I'd so put that in mine.

Frankly, I think tp6266 hit the nail on the head -- they're worried more about their reputation than your happiness. If they're logical parents, gently point out how illogical they're being about race.

[seoa]

Basically, the girl you end up with is a direct sign of how successful they have been as parents.
i also agree with TP.

the solution...? tell them that it's ok, you're not really dating her, she's just providing you with a cover story, since you're not ready to come out to your school friends yet.

yes, that's right - you're gay...!

play with this for a week or two... once they've realised how much they will *not* want to be telling their friends that story, they'll be much more accepting of any kind of girl... (i'm assuming here that they have this prejudice along with all the others you listed)



(and yes, i'm joking... sort of... :))

[tp6626]

Well, you could get them to know her, and see what she's like. But the point is you shouldn't have to. Plus, some people cannot always be swayed, especially where their reputations are concerned.

Seoa has a point. You could show them what really is bad.

However, I have seen with a number of people that nothing is good enough for them. There's always something that could be better.

That's not your problem though, it's theirs. If they feel there's something missing, it's something in their head that they have to change. But alas, they're more likely to choose to go on getting stressed, being unhappy, and drifting away from their offspring.

Their choice really. Strange what people will sacrifice for social convention. Makes me glad to be an INTJ.

[Andrew Popovici]

i also agree with TP.

the solution...? tell them that it's ok, you're not really dating her, she's just providing you with a cover story, since you're not ready to come out to your school friends yet.

yes, that's right - you're gay...!

play with this for a week or two... once they've realised how much they will *not* want to be telling their friends that story, they'll be much more accepting of any kind of girl... (i'm assuming here that they have this prejudice along with all the others you listed)



(and yes, i'm joking... sort of... :))

Oh, that's tempting! ;D





...But the thing is, it is about reputation, they doknow it, and they're not willing to be logical!

[Sinequanon]

My father is going to have a problem with my SO (she's white). I know this because he already mentioned it to my sister when she was younger. I plan to pull him aside and let him know that I will refuse to ever speak to him again if I ever hear him bring her race up as a negative. Plain and simple.

[tp6626]

My father is going to have a problem with my SO (she's white). I know this because he already mentioned it to my sister when she was younger. I plan to pull him aside and let him know that I will refuse to ever speak to him again if I ever hear him bring her race up as a negative. Plain and simple.
Good stance. Get it in first, and it's his choice then. You're effectively forcing him to swallow his pride and change. Just cross your fingers it doesn't go the other way.

[Zhen]

Oh, that's tempting! ;D

But the thing is, it is about reputation, they doknow it, and they're not willing to be logical!

haha great idea Seoa!

Andrew, I have had a similar experience at least in terms of the distinguished line of high achievers/career status thing and feeling compelled to do things out of parental approval...what I have learnt, don't be afraid to take a stand -because we only get one shot at life and it's your right to be Happy!

Just think you could one day be miserable in a vacuous and soulless marriage without love just because your spouse looks like Barbie and has the right qualifications...what a meaningless exterior you are living?

Maybe follow their wishes a little longer but definitely don't let what they want compromise your right to be happy in the long run. If they truly love you and see you unhappy, one day they will really feel guilt and remorse over their impositions.

[Vandit]

You say you love her and she loves you -- if this were the case you wouldn't have to ask the question. There comes a time in one's life when you have to make a choice -- your time is now. Who do you plan to live your life for? Who are you really trying to make happy? You or your parents?

[Vagrant]

Good stance. Get it in first, and it's his choice then. You're effectively forcing him to swallow his pride and change. Just cross your fingers it doesn't go the other way.

Of course, if it does go the other way, would you really still want to hang around him?

[changos]

Interracial relationships *might* be a problem as for the cultural differences and life styles. But if you match, get along and are willing to try, then... there is no problem.

* Cultural and life styles differences appear even with people of your same race living across the street.

[Henry]

So, I'm Romanian (which classifies as white) and I have a hispanic (El Salvadorian) girlfriend. I love her, she loves me. Her parents are okay with it, my parents are being racist bastards about it. I seriously had no idea how prejudiced they could be. they offered arguments like it'll affect my school performance, I'll never get into Harvard that way, I have no time, but in the end, it all boiled down to race. I have no problem with it, they do. My dad was a little understanding (he hoped it'd be just a phase I'm going through), my mom suprised my by saying there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed, pretty american girls as well as cute Romanian/Italian girls and she doesn't want her kind in her house. This makes the black/white race struggle seem like a cakewalk!

So what do you guys say? First, your opinion on interracial dating, and then any advice.

Nothing wrong with interracial dating. It can be stupid if based on "positive" and largely inaccurate prejudices like asian women being subservient or black men being hung, but if its genuinely two people who met and fell in love with each other - not the idea of the other, not the white-guilt crap - then I don't think there's anything silly about it. And I would never dream of telling another person who they can or cannot sleep with.

Your parents sound a little crazy. College doesn't sound too far off, and then you'll have freedom, ideas, and the ability to live your life your way.

[Marcus]

they're worried more about their reputation than your happiness.

They probably live in a world where the majority of people judge you based on your reputation. You don't see that when you're young.

[BajanMan]

So, I'm Romanian (which classifies as white) and I have a hispanic (El Salvadorian) girlfriend. I love her, she loves me. Her parents are okay with it, my parents are being racist bastards about it. I seriously had no idea how prejudiced they could be. they offered arguments like it'll affect my school performance, I'll never get into Harvard that way, I have no time, but in the end, it all boiled down to race. I have no problem with it, they do. My dad was a little understanding (he hoped it'd be just a phase I'm going through), my mom suprised my by saying there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed, pretty american girls as well as cute Romanian/Italian girls and she doesn't want her kind in her house. This makes the black/white race struggle seem like a cakewalk!

So what do you guys say? First, your opinion on interracial dating, and then any advice.

As I'm mixed, I suppose I need not have an opinion on interracial dating ;D. If you love her, and she loves you, and you guys want to get married, then do so. If you love your parent's approval more than the lady in question, then don't do it.

[jadefalcon]

"Don't want her kind in the house"


If my mother told me this, it is goodbye connections. That is me- I might be different than you. Honestly, I could care less what color my girlfriend is or what her cultural background is, if we find a common ground and love each other than there is nothing better and more powerful than that. I recognize that some folks in some cultures may be ignorant of others, while it is important not to get stuck up in their own ways. In short, diversity is good if it produces desireable results, and in this case it does- you love each other. Explore her side of things! I was in a spanish class in high school for years and I enjoyed Spanish (Espana) and Mexican culture, something completely foreign to me. Likewise, I am sure there are Italian/Romanian traditions she is curious about.


Because I stepped out of my boundaries, I learned something about another culture and cultures in general- everyone is different, and we all need to explore different cultures and different ways of doing things. Ye don't NEED to adopt new customs, but blending two cultures into one is something new... and interesting....


I say go for it! If you love her, nothing else matters. I won't be asking parental approval when I want to marry my future wife, but I will make an effort to know their parents. If their parents are arses about the marriage, then what can I do about it? I won't let that affect my love for the love of my life.

[Gone7]

I love any race then mine mainly international girls (ME<<hates the norm) just something about them turns me on more then my own race

-advice .. F'em they can't control your love life .., so as Russell Simmons says "Do You"

[errrzarrr]

The only problem I Can see with Interracial (interethnical) Relationships is people's prejudices due to closed-mindness and social pressure to break-up that pretty union; people that are, most times, ultra-conservatives and ultra-religious.

[anamatria]

My first reaction is anger. I don't understand why racial issues matter, we're all people! Advice...maybe ask them what they would do if you had children with your g/f. Would they reject their grandchildren because of their race? I can't really think of anything more to tell you at the moment, but I'll think about it.

I agree with Nikita regarding the grandchildren scenario.

I was listening to NPR right before the election and they had a series about race in America and how we as a nation have changed since the days of slavery.

One of the points an older white southern man made (nothing against southerners - my roots are in Tennessee) was that when his daughter married an African-American, he didn't understand it and was scared for the prejudice they would have to deal with. But once they had babies, he couldn't NOT be a part of their lives because of her choice to marry someone who looked different than she did. He loves his grandkids and his racism has been put into perspective because of them.

[errrzarrr]

I agree with Nikita regarding the grandchildren scenario.

I was listening to NPR right before the election and they had a series about race in America and how we as a nation have changed since the days of slavery.

One of the points an older white southern man made (nothing against southerners - my roots are in Tennessee) was that when his daughter married an African-American, he didn't understand it and was scared for the prejudice they would have to deal with. But once they had babies, he couldn't NOT be a part of their lives because of her choice to marry someone who looked different than she did. He loves his grandkids and his racism has been put into perspective because of them. Southern's Racisim is due to ignorance and fear (and lack of desire to open-up to new people/things/ideas, also know as Closed-mindness). Those Racist people are, almost always, very hypocrites and have a big double-moral.

[Reon]

Southern's Racisim is due to ignorance and fear (and lack of desire to open-up to new people/things/ideas, also know as Closed-mindness). Those Racist people are, almost always, very hypocrites and have a big double-moral.

And northern racism is not? Not to be rude, but I think we all get it 'Racism is bad'

[errrzarrr]

And northern racism is not? Not to be rude, but I think we all get it 'Racism is bad'

Sure it is. Any kind of racism, to from any group, to any group, it does not matter. Racism is bad. But it southern people are more prone to be racists (this comes with prejudices, fears, untolerance and ignorance) as AnaMaria said in that example.

[Henry]

Southern's Racisim is due to ignorance and fear (and lack of desire to open-up to new people/things/ideas, also know as Closed-mindness). Those Racist people are, almost always, very hypocrites and have a big double-moral.

Informal segregation still plays a big role in deep-south racism. I lived there for several years. Blacks and whites just don't mix there like they do in other parts of the country, and hard to get around stereotypes if you don't have any experience to base it on.

In the rest of the country, IMO most of the racism is due to very old people who will die soon and the exacerbated "lets get even now" race-consciousness pushed by the far left.

[enfpchick]

lol if your parent are being that negative about a Hispanic girlfriend I would just love to see how they would react if she was black!

[errrzarrr]

So, I'm Romanian (which classifies as white) and I have a hispanic (El Salvadorian) girlfriend. I love her, she loves me. Her parents are okay with it, my parents are being racist bastards about it. I seriously had no idea how prejudiced they could be. they offered arguments like it'll affect my school performance, I'll never get into Harvard that way, I have no time, but in the end, it all boiled down to race. I have no problem with it, they do. My dad was a little understanding (he hoped it'd be just a phase I'm going through), my mom suprised my by saying there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed, pretty american girls as well as cute Romanian/Italian girls and she doesn't want her kind in her house. This makes the black/white race struggle seem like a cakewalk!

So what do you guys say? First, your opinion on interracial dating, and then any advice. I want to ask you if your parents are Religious people, conservatives or rightsist?

I do agree that Romanian girls are haTo view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. like hell. I've been in Spain and i've seen many of 'em, because there are lots of them there and I have many in my hi5. Hawtness is like natural there. Romanian also classify as Latins if you didnt know.


lol if your parent are being that negative about a Hispanic girlfriend I would just love to see how they would react if she was black!
LoL. That's true, that would be a real freakin struggle. :S

[Andrew Popovici]

Well, I wouldn't say Romanians are Latin... but in some aspects they come pretty darn close!

And I know there are some pretty hot Romanian chics out there, but outer beauty can only be so important in a relationship. I mean, as long as the partner isn't a total eyesore...

And yeah, TOTALLY conservative, VERY rightist, and do I need mention RELIGIOUS? (not that there's anything bad about religion. I'm a good Christian, but there are places where religion turns into more of a traditional thing than a true relatinship with God. Also, she's a Christian, and that's most likely what the bible meant about not being unequally yoked. My parents think that applies to other areas of life, mainly race)

[PRBori]

hmmm... well at the end of the day is your business because your parents will not be living with her, nevertheless from a personal experience, if you ever get serious on an interracial relationship with someone from a different culture , I honestly advise you to get acquainted with the cultural beliefs and way of thinking..

I was married to a middle eastern men and I must say it was hell... not to mention the cultural differences that are not obvious during the dating stages are truly felt after marriage, and that includes the family issues and behavior... for it's also hard on their side to accept their child to marry someone else...

So I guess it goes both ways, but seriously, if you ever get to a serious point.. note down things you would like to do as a family and with your future and find out if the two of you concur on it... you may be surprise to what you will find and be able to understand your parents side...

I know I have learned my lesson, after my divorce I vow to only deal with people born and raised in the US or territories and at my intellectual level only.

[OrrDavey]

Personally I am only attracted to white girls with only a few exceptions, but if you are into it, go for it.

And no question about it, ignore your parents on this one - if it is indeed just a race thing. I am guessing you are 17 or so - you are almost a grown up now. It is time to make your own decisions on things like this.

[Jgib5328]

I'm actually at least 6 different races, so I really have no choice. I kind of like seeing interracial couples, it shows me that some people really don't care about what you look like, just about who you are, although they could just care about you looking like a different race, in which case what I just said wouldn't apply, but you get the point.

[Henry]

lol if your parent are being that negative about a Hispanic girlfriend I would just love to see how they would react if she was black!

Many in America view African Americans in a more positive light than Hispanics. Most of them do, after all, have a legal and ethical right to be here.

[Futuremouse]

So, I'm Romanian (which classifies as white) and I have a hispanic (El Salvadorian) girlfriend. I love her, she loves me. Her parents are okay with it, my parents are being racist bastards about it. I seriously had no idea how prejudiced they could be.

did you point out to your mother that she's Romanian?

i mean, really. hardly a master race, when you think about it. probably some mongrelization of ...um.. carpathians and conquering romans? i'm sorry, my grasp of history in that area of the world is a bit lacking, but still.

it could be worse. your girlfriend could be dutch.

i'm not sure which is worse, parents harping on interfaith relationships or interracial ones. in either case, you're likely dealing with generations of bias, so there isn't a easy solution.

challenging bias in a rational way is a good start to changing it, since it doesn't stand up to reasoning for the most part. start a dialogue, put her on the defensive by shooting down her reasoning (which is based on arbitrary assumptions, nothing more), then slowly chip away her racial prejudices. play the guilt card. make threats.

love conquers all.

[errrzarrr]

Many in America view African Americans in a more positive light than Hispanics. Most of them do, after all, have a legal and ethical right to be here.

Why it is that?. I am hispanic :S

[Henry]

Why it is that?. I am hispanic :S

Blacks were forced here and I don't think any additional description is required. Together with Western Europeans, blacks contributed significantly to American development from origin to decadence.

Illegal immigrants, predominantly Hispanic, come here now that its the best place in the world to live because their country is not a nice place to live. Yet they then create communities virtually identical to the ones they left and depress wages for similarly uneducated workers. They are a huge part of the current financial crisis, are an economic blight for all but big business, are taking jobs that would otherwise be filled by african americans, are a cultural blight (see below), and generally need to GTFO.

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A tad over-represented for a minority that constitutes around 15% of US population, wouldn't you say?

Regarding the stupid "but Mexico used to own Southwest US so its ours" argument often repeated by illegal immigrants and their supporters, I need not remind educated people that Mexico sold part of it to the US to bail them out of one of their every-decade-or-so financial panic (curious that since they've started coming en masse we've had a spike of those eh? And in housing no less?) and the rest in two wars of Mexican dictatorial aggression.

I am not an opponent of immigration in general. Hispanics, however, have been treated with a great amount of informal preference in the immigration process for too long, and its time that we give Europeans, Africans, Arabs, and Asians the same informal opportunities hispanics have had for decades.

[Andrew Popovici]

Ouch, well hey I'm against illegal immigration as much as the next guy, but what if they're here legally?

[nihil]

So, I'm Romanian (which classifies as white) and I have a hispanic (El Salvadorian) girlfriend. I love her, she loves me. Her parents are okay with it, my parents are being racist bastards about it. I seriously had no idea how prejudiced they could be. they offered arguments like it'll affect my school performance, I'll never get into Harvard that way, I have no time, but in the end, it all boiled down to race. I have no problem with it, they do. My dad was a little understanding (he hoped it'd be just a phase I'm going through), my mom suprised my by saying there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed, pretty american girls as well as cute Romanian/Italian girls and she doesn't want her kind in her house. This makes the black/white race struggle seem like a cakewalk!

So what do you guys say? First, your opinion on interracial dating, and then any advice.

Didn't they hear that racism is dead ?

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YES WE CAN





nihil added to this post, 3 minutes and 33 seconds later...



I was married to a middle eastern men and I must say it was hell... not to mention the cultural differences that are not obvious during the dating stages are truly felt after marriage, and that includes the family issues and behavior... for it's also hard on their side to accept their child to marry someone else...


A culture of terror innit ?

[Henry]

Ouch, well hey I'm against illegal immigration as much as the next guy, but what if they're here legally?

Its time to give other nationalities a chance, IMO, other than Hispanic and especially Mexican people. Why do they deserve preferential treatment in immigration policy?

[rahdam]

can you detail the preferential treatment?

[Henry]

can you detail the preferential treatment?

I thought it was obvious.

How much immigration, formal or informally allowed, is allowed by the US from hispanic sources? Compare it to the immigration allowed to Eastern European, African, or Arab locations.

Turning a blind eye to 12 million illegal hispanic immigrants while turning millions of non-hispanic applicants away is grossly preferential.

[hullolife]

Beige is sooo in right now. ;)

[rahdam]

I thought it was obvious.

How much immigration, formal or informally allowed, is allowed by the US from hispanic sources? Compare it to the immigration allowed to Eastern European, African, or Arab locations.

Turning a blind eye to 12 million illegal hispanic immigrants while turning millions of non-hispanic applicants away is grossly preferential.

1. Mexico is much closer than the other locations you have listed. I'd imagine there are more immigration applications from Mexico than the other locations listed, and as such, I'd expect more Mexican immigrants.

2. Illegal immigration is easier from Mexico than the locations you listed. If the other places were physically contiguous with the US, you would very likely see a high immigration spike from those ethnicities.

3. The hispanic immigrants have become a key political player.

[Henry]

1. Mexico is much closer than the other locations you have listed. I'd imagine there are more immigration applications from Mexico than the other locations listed, and as such, I'd expect more Mexican immigrants.

2. Illegal immigration is easier from Mexico than the locations you listed. If the other places were physically contiguous with the US, you would very likely see a high immigration spike from those ethnicities.

I'm not asking why it happens, I'm asking why the US government does nothing about it. And asserting that US policy towards hispanics versus Eastern Europeans or arabs is discriminatory. The end result of the US turning a blind eye to the horde of illegal immigrants living in this country is de facto preferential treatment.

Being able to stop and reverse illegal immigration and not doing so while simultaneously denying entry to millions of other applicants is de facto discrimination. Sorry you don't like it.

3. The hispanic immigrants have become a key political player.

Here you've highlighted why the discrimination continues: hispanics have leverage on elected officials.

[rahdam]

I agree that our government could do more about illegal immigration.
But I am not convinced that Latino illegal immigrants are given preferential treatment to illegal immigrants of other ethnicities. You can claim that its preferential treatment for Latinos because they make up the bulk of the illegal immigrants, but its clear that there are geographic reasons why there are more Latino illegal immigrants.

I look forward to your reply (in earnest).

[Sinequanon]

I'm not asking why it happens, I'm asking why the US government does nothing about it.
What should they do about it?
And asserting that US policy towards hispanics versus Eastern Europeans or arabs is discriminatory. The end result of the US turning a blind eye to the horde of illegal immigrants living in this country is de facto preferential treatment.
It's pragmatic to address suffering and immigration within ones own continent before you start addressing it in, say, Tibet, just to say you did. Theoretically, we should share many more cultural, political and economic ties with our neighboring countries (this happens much more with Canada than Mexico, but I have a feeling that has more to do with socio-political factors and the language barrier).

It would seem to me that any reasonable immigration plan would have to include something to raise the common prosperity of Mexico as a nation, since simple human nature is going to cause people to cross (largely imaginary) borders to escape suffering and corruption. But since the factors leading to the suffering and corruption are both fairly well-engrained and extremely complex, the solution will not work in the short term.

Long story short, they're probably here to stay, the more practical matter would be to figure out how best to address the political reality than fantasize about carting off and deporting 12 million people.

Sorry if you don't like it.

[Henry]

What should they do about it?

Uh, enforce immigration law.

Actually patrol the border. Actually hire border agents not in bed with the drug and illegal immgiration cartels. Actually punish employers who use illegal immigrants.

It's pragmatic to address suffering and immigration within ones own continent before you start addressing it in, say, Tibet, just to say you did. Theoretically, we should share many more cultural, political and economic ties with our neighboring countries (this happens much more with Canada than Mexico, but I have a feeling that has more to do with socio-political factors and the language barrier).

It would seem to me that any reasonable immigration plan would have to include something to raise the common prosperity of Mexico as a nation, since simple human nature is going to cause people to cross (largely imaginary) borders to escape suffering and corruption. But since the factors leading to the suffering and corruption are both fairly well-engrained and extremely complex, the solution will not work in the short term.

Mexico's problems are not my problems and are mostly of their own creation, and effective border defense, employment eligibility verification, and housing verification can easily and humanely reduce illegal immigration.

Long story short, they're probably here to stay, the more practical matter would be to figure out how best to address the political reality than fantasize about carting off and deporting 12 million people.

Sorry if you don't like it.

Actually you don't need to deport them. You need to hold the companies that employ them and rent housing to them accountable for doing so. The former was employed in a half-assed manner 2 years ago and has already reduced illegal immigration by about 1m, the latter has popped up in communities ruined by the blight of illegal immigration, formerly great communities like Escondido California that are now indistinguishable from Tiajuana.

And they'll go home, on their own, just as about 8% of them did in response to very small or localized anti-illegal immigration measures.


But I am not convinced that Latino illegal immigrants are given preferential treatment to illegal immigrants of other ethnicities. You can claim that its preferential treatment for Latinos because they make up the bulk of the illegal immigrants, but its clear that there are geographic reasons why there are more Latino illegal immigrants.

Is it actively discriminating against anyone other than hispanics? No. But then again I used the phrase "de facto".

Government is selectively enforcing immigration policies. It is obviously going to have an adverse impact on virtually everyone except Mexicans and hispanics. Its rather like not enforcing speeding laws on the "white" side of town.

[Sinequanon]

Uh, enforce immigration law.

Actually patrol the border. Actually hire border agents not in bed with the drug and illegal immgiration cartels. Actually punish employers who use illegal immigrants.
Very few of these things deal with the underlying causes or the existent situation, which makes the solution quite trite. "Enforce immigration law" doesn't address the question of how do you possibly deal with a hidden underclass of 12 million people.

Mexico's problems are not my problems and are mostly of their own creation, and effective border defense, employment eligibility verification, and housing verification can easily and humanely reduce illegal immigration.My beef isn't with reducing illegal immigration as we move forward. We get it, enforce the border, yadda yadda.

And if you think that Mexico's problems aren't the US's problems, I'd like to introduce you to every other country on the planet Earth. It seems like sometimes the things that go on there might have some tangential effect on us, just like the way the policies we shape might have some effect on them. I know this is a pre-W model of thinking about the world, but I think it's coming back into vogue. ;)

Actually you don't need to deport them. You need to hold the companies that employ them and rent housing to them accountable for doing so. The former was employed in a half-assed manner 2 years ago and has already reduced illegal immigration by about 1m, the latter has popped up in communities ruined by the blight of illegal immigration, formerly great communities like Escondido California that are now indistinguishable from Tiajuana. So your solution to a largely lawless underclass is to further marginalize them by making it impossible for them to attain employment or housing? Which will, I'm sure, cause them all to simply peacefully leave, rather than turning even further to black markets, separate communities and lots and lots of crime. This is a very poor (and again, trite) solution.

By the way, I've been to Escondido, frequently, and I've been to Tijuana a few times, the hyperbole is completely unnecessary. The whores are WAY more expensive in Escondido.
And they'll go home, on their own, just as about 8% of them did in response to very small or localized anti-illegal immigration measures.Just like all of those Irish people went "home" after Americans refused to give them work, and all those Africans went "home" after they were treated so badly in the Jim Crow South. Look around, dude. They are home. Sorry.

Is it actively discriminating against anyone other than hispanics? No. But then again I used the phrase "de facto".

Government is selectively enforcing immigration policies. It is obviously going to have an adverse impact on virtually everyone except Mexicans and hispanics. Its rather like not enforcing speeding laws on the "white" side of town.Selective enforcement is not the same thing as discrimination. Sometimes it is the result of common sense. If I saw a group of angry looking Arabic young men about to board a plane, should I stop every 80 year old woman too so that it doesn't look like I'm discriminating?

[demaugustus]

My last girlfriend was a short Chinese woman and I'm a tall white guy...looking back I think I was just someone she could fool around with and never really get serious because her parents wouldn't approve of it.

[Ytterbium]

LOL-thread. I don't like the term white, black, asian and so forth. They're stupid and makes no sense apart from visual appearances. I would take offence if someone lumped me as white together with a 'racist southerner' or a Romanian. I say that I'm mixed because my mother is Finnish and my father is Swedish. It's all about DNA, genes and such. One could actually be more closely related to someone that you don't like. Just as the threadstarter's mother could be more closely related to the 'Hispanic' girl than any other European. As someone else already pointed out Romanians aren't really the top-notch themselves in Europe either.

[Henry]

Very few of these things deal with the underlying causes or the existent situation, which makes the solution quite trite. "Enforce immigration law" doesn't address the question of how do you possibly deal with a hidden underclass of 12 million people.

My beef isn't with reducing illegal immigration as we move forward. We get it, enforce the border, yadda yadda.

And if you think that Mexico's problems aren't the US's problems, I'd like to introduce you to every other country on the planet Earth. It seems like sometimes the things that go on there might have some tangential effect on us, just like the way the policies we shape might have some effect on them. I know this is a pre-W model of thinking about the world, but I think it's coming back into vogue. ;)

Please actually read my posts and address the things I'm saying instead of making up arguments I never used and responding to those.


So your solution to a largely lawless underclass is to further marginalize them by making it impossible for them to attain employment or housing? Which will, I'm sure, cause them all to simply peacefully leave, rather than turning even further to black markets, separate communities and lots and lots of crime. This is a very poor (and again, trite) solution.

I'm growing concerned at your level of reading comprehension, as these two measures are largely what drove the ~1 million illegals home last year - an 8% drop. Are you not aware of this? Imagine the results if these steps were taken furhter.

Bo-hoo-hoo they're marginalized. They're here illegally, against democratic will, and need to go home. And they're already causing a grossly disproportinate amount of the crime so that's not an argument.

By the way, I've been to Escondido, frequently, and I've been to Tijuana a few times, the hyperbole is completely unnecessary. The whores are WAY more expensive in Escondido.

Just like all of those Irish people went "home" after Americans refused to give them work, and all those Africans went "home" after they were treated so badly in the Jim Crow South. Look around, dude. They are home. Sorry.

Actually I worked in Escondido for about 6 months. Aside from a handful of nicer places in Escondido and the donkey shows in TJ, its indistinguishable.

And they're not home, at least not according to the vast majority voters who think immigration policy is too lax. But since something less-than-democratic is in control of US immigration policy, I'm sure they'll stay.


Regarding your pirating of my use of "sorry" as a closer, its looking pretty cheap right now. You're low on credibility, and this plays poorly in that circumstance.


Regarding the reference to blacks and the Irish, there are a few key differences.

First of all, don't ever compare black America to the people who come here illegally because they want to go from making 10k per year to 25k per year. Its ridiculous on an intellectual level and outrageous on an emotional level to compare the plight of a people who's identity is inseparable from slavery to a group who comes here so they can go from 10k to 25k. Absurd to compare a people brought here in shackles to the people that can't be kept out.

Secondly, both groups were here in accordance with the democratic process and the applicable laws of the times. The horde of hispanic immigration here meets neither condition.



Selective enforcement is not the same thing as discrimination. Sometimes it is the result of common sense. If I saw a group of angry looking Arabic young men about to board a plane, should I stop every 80 year old woman too so that it doesn't look like I'm discriminating?


What "common sense" is driving immigration policy? Because Americans overwhelmingly support staunch anti-illegal immigration measures, and selective enforcement makes no sense to me.

You're saying that because discrimination yields positive results in anti-terrorism it also yields positive results in immigration policy? Tell me what positive results, besides cheap tomatoes, is the horde of hispanic immigrants producing? That Eastern European immigrants are like "angry looking Arabic young men" and mexicans are like "80 year old woman"s? Are you suggesting that Mexicans are somehow inherintly more entitled to come to the country than Eastern Europeans?

That argument is full of fail.

[Sinequanon]

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Ad hominem, but okay.

Please actually read my posts and address the things I'm saying instead of making up arguments I never used and responding to those.
There's a difference between saying "You're saying Y" when you're actually saying X, and me arguing against Y.

What I'm saying is that the "solutions" you've provided do not really address either the root cause of illegal immigration from Mexico and other Latin American countries, nor do they largely do much to address the problem of people who are already here illegally and likely (unless we somehow manage to do a mass deportation, which is unfeasible and largely inhumane) will be for life.

Saying that your answer is inadequate because it doesn't address the question isn't strawmanning you, it's pointing out the failure of your answer to address the question. "Enforce the border!" isn't an answer for the problem of dealing with the people who are already here.

I'm growing concerned at your level of reading comprehension, as these two measures are largely what drove the ~1 million illegals home last year. Are you not aware of this? Imagine the results if these steps were taken furhter.
Source?

According to this (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.) article from 10.2.2008, while the rate of illegal immigration has slowed, it hasn't reversed. You seem to be confusing the difference between slowing the rate of illegal immigration and actual deportation. Enforcing the border will help to slow the rate of more people coming in, and I'm all for that, but does nothing to deal with those here already.

Bo-hoo-hoo they're marginalized. They're here illegally, against democratic will, and need to go home. And they're already causing a grossly disproportinate amount of the crime so that's not an argument.
I think the difference between us is I am far more interested in dealing with the reality of the situation than you are. I am not concerned about them being marginalized because I care about their feelings. I'm concerned about them being marginalized precisely because that's what pushes them towards criminal behavior.

We can talk about ideal behavior and what we should do all day, but if the effect of those actions pushes people to become more desperate and more criminal then it's bad policy.

Actually I worked in Escondido for about 6 months. Aside from a handful of nicer places in Escondido and the donkey shows in TJ, its indistinguishable.
There were 4 homicides in Escondido in 2007. There were 355 homicides in Tijuana in 2004 (the last full year of statistics on Wikipedia, I don't feel like diving in to do real research to refute something this asinine). Just because the people are brown doesn't mean they're all the same. As I said, hyperbolic and plain wrong.

And they're not home, at least not according to the vast majority voters who think immigration policy is too lax. But since something less-than-democratic is in control of US immigration policy, I'm sure they'll stay.
For all practical purposes, they're home. If you want to start kicking people out of the country based on ancestral property claims, we'd have a whole lot less "Americans" in this country (and a whole lot more "Mexicans").

Regarding your pirating of my use of "sorry" as a closer, its looking pretty cheap right now. You're low on credibility, and this plays poorly in that circumstance.
Sorry.

Regarding the reference to blacks and the Irish, there are a few key differences.

First of all, don't ever compare black America to the people who come here illegally because they want to go from making 10k per year to 25k per year. Its ridiculous on an intellectual level and outrageous on an emotional level to compare the plight of a people who's identity is inseparable from slavery to a group who comes here so they can go from 10k to 25k. Absurd to compare a people brought here in shackles to the people that can't be kept out.
a.) I am black so you can save me the lecture set to "Lift Every Voice and Sing" already. I find your outrage outrageous. By the way, I and my family are able to cull an identity for ourselves that's quite distinct from slavery, but thanks for telling me how I think.
b.) What group emigrates here, legally or otherwise, but to hope for a better life? Are you really holding that against them?

Secondly, both groups were here in accordance with the democratic process and the applicable laws of the times. The horde of hispanic immigration here meets neither condition.
"Both groups were here in accordance with the democratic process"? They had a democratic process aboard the Amistad?

No, what happened is that post-slavery America had to deal with the question of how to deal with the newly freed black slaves, because they were already here. The simplest solution was to give them citizenship because shipping them back to where they came from was as impractical then as it is today. Though I'm sure there were plenty of people such as yourself around who were on the wrong side of history then, too.

What "common sense" is driving immigration policy? Because Americans overwhelmingly support staunch anti-illegal immigration measures, and selective enforcement makes no sense to me.
Again it's common sense to aim an immigration policy towards neighboring countries and ones own hemisphere before one aims it at the rest of the world. Inclusion for inclusion's sake doesn't really make much sense. When you combine it with the fact that people are streaming across the border from Mexico whether we ask them to or not, why does it not make practical sense to aim at least a bit of our immigration policy towards the most immediate concern?

You're saying that because discrimination yields positive results in anti-terrorism it also yields positive results in immigration policy?
I'm saying common sense policies tend to work better than blanket policies which are enacted for the sake of being blanket policies. If there is a crisis south of the border that's causing immigration rates (legal or otherwise) to skyrocket, maybe it would make sense to address those issues (from the standpoint of enforcement but also economic trade, political and social pressure) instead of trying to make sure we fill our quota of people from Singapore for the sake of blind diversity.

Tell me what positive results, besides cheap tomatoes, is the horde of hispanic immigrants producing? That Eastern European immigrants are like "angry looking Arabic young men" and mexicans are like "80 year old woman"s? Are you suggesting that Mexicans are somehow inherintly more entitled to come to the country than Eastern Europeans?
Tell me what positive results are the eastern European immigrants bringing to the country?

That argument is full of fail.
Sorry (again).

[zibber]

I am not an opponent of immigration in general. Hispanics, however, have been treated with a great amount of informal preference in the immigration process for too long, and its time that we give Europeans, Africans, Arabs, and Asians the same informal opportunities hispanics have had for decades.

Europeans don't need opportunities, we make opportunities. Those injun bastards were stinking up good land and we went ahead and took it. Ethical right to be here.. Yeah right.

[Mozzes]

Europeans don't need opportunities, we make opportunities. Those injun bastards were stinking up good land and we went ahead and took it. Ethical right to be here.. Yeah right.

Why don't people ever feel sorry for the Neanderthals? We should clone them so we can give them back the land they deserve. 'Out of Africa?' Pfft! We should start the 'Back to Africa' movement. Cram all filthy humans back in the small corner of the globe where we belong!

[probity]

Interracial relationships are the reason I'm alive, I'm all for them. It's actually practically a tradition in my family to breed interracially. Consequentially, I have no idea how to deal with racist parents.

[Naturelle]

A few things.

As a black woman having lived and conducted business in many parts of America, I fail to see how people of latin descent are less preferred or respected than black people. A bigot is a bigot; it doesn't matter.

To the OP, I can not give you a definitive answer because there are so many missing variables -- it seems to me that the mother is the dominant one in the house, but I am not sure. If she is, then your life is going to be hell until you break up with your gf or graduate. If she isn't, ignore her but don't give her fodder to argue about. She seems to be the kind of person that is bent on status, and has issues from her own marriage.

Secondly, from one person in a interracial relationship to another, your mother is not alone. There are many people, people you think you know well and strangers alike, who feel as if you have to apologize for your choices or that you owe them some sort of explanation. They will follow you in the mall, make you wait a little longer in the restaurant, make snide comments, act as if one of you are not present...you get what I am saying. This kind of behavior never ends. However, if you love this person, really love them, then it is a small price to pay. That doesn't mean it hurts less, it is just something you learn to deal with in your own way whether it is ignoring it (which works best most of the time) or being more assertive (read:confrontational).

I just find it amusing that people who disagree with your life choices often don't have better alternatives.

[Reon]

Interracial relationships are the reason I'm alive, I'm all for them. It's actually practically a tradition in my family to breed interracially. Consequentially, I have no idea how to deal with racist parents.

Question, why is it considered a 'tradition' in your family?

[Firebrand]

My first reaction is anger. I don't understand why racial issues matter, we're all people! Advice...maybe ask them what they would do if you had children with your g/f. Would they reject their grandchildren because of their race? I can't really think of anything more to tell you at the moment, but I'll think about it.

Some people want to preserve their own culture, not blend it with another. The magazine "The Atlantic" has an article on this this month (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.). By 2023 will be the tipping point where whites start becoming a minority.

I don't think it's inherently wrong to have interracial relationships, just understand that not everyone will agree, and no one should be forced to concede on this just because "we're living in modern society" (it seems that the only thing safe to discriminate against these days are the discriminators). People have the right to preserve their own culture if they choose.





Firebrand9 added to this post, 1 minutes and 51 seconds later...

I have also noticed, anecdotally, that mixed race offspring are generally more attractive that pure race offspring.

I don't agree.

[Sesquipedalian]

Personally I don't have any desire to date most other races simply because I'm not attracted to them. I have never been attracted to a Black woman, and rarely am I ever attracted to Asians. It's nothing personal! I've found some latina women to be incredibly sexy, but most of them are part-white anyway. So... basically they just look like white chicks with some latina blood.

As far as my stance on it in general... I don't see why two people from ANY race shouldn't be able to fall in love and enjoy life together. However, I can understand why some parents are wary (and I'm not talking about racism, which is another issue). Living life as an interracial couple is so much harder than same-race, so I can understand how some parents would want to shield their children from that. It's just a fact; there are a lot of racist and close-minded people out there. To complicate matters, children of interracial couples often have trouble identifying with any one ethnic background.

If you're willing to put up with that, that's great. For me though, I'd rather not put up with it. Some of you might think this is petty, but I'm a pragmatist, and for every beautiful asian girl out that there I might be attracted to, there is a white one, so it'd be pretty pointless of me to choose the harder path unless someone amazing dropped into my lap and made it worthwhile. I'm not going to go looking for that though, because life's hard enough as it is.

[Firebrand]

So, I'm Romanian (which classifies as white) and I have a hispanic (El Salvadorian) girlfriend. I love her, she loves me. Her parents are okay with it, my parents are being racist bastards about it. I seriously had no idea how prejudiced they could be. they offered arguments like it'll affect my school performance, I'll never get into Harvard that way, I have no time, but in the end, it all boiled down to race. I have no problem with it, they do. My dad was a little understanding (he hoped it'd be just a phase I'm going through), my mom suprised my by saying there are plenty of blond-haired, blue eyed, pretty american girls as well as cute Romanian/Italian girls and she doesn't want her kind in her house. This makes the black/white race struggle seem like a cakewalk!

So what do you guys say? First, your opinion on interracial dating, and then any advice.

Well, your parents have their opinion and you have yours. Ultimately, it's your life, and you should not look for their approval to continue the course you're on. I gave up on my parents approving of anything about me a long long time ago.

I'm not specifically against it in other people, though I am most attracted to white women, and ethnically, Italian women. I don't mind any culture as friends, but I'm not usually attracted to blacks or asians and I don't really see myself ever ending up with one of them. Just my personal preference. I like my culture and the cultures that make up my bloodline (half Italian, half German) and I'd like to maintain that, and would also like someone who thinks likewise.

[Zombicide]

As an avid supporter of eugenics, assuming you're both intellectually high quality individuals, I say the heterosis alone should mean choosing your girlfriend over your parents to the point of disavowing your parents altogether if you must, what do they even matter? Moreover, one's romantic interest should always be more important than one's parents anyway.

However, seeing as you're apparently having trouble simply telling your parents to **** off and die (as I would, I have no particular connection to mine nor should I), I'll assume the downside is related to inheriting a significant amount of funds or resources from your parents upon their death. If the issue is a matter of you missing out on receiving a significant inheritance weighed by your relationship with your girlfriend, I say go with the money / property. If that is not at stake, I do not see what the problem is, be with your girlfriend instead and have as many heterotically enhanced offspring as you can support.

[Karamazov]

Race isn't a factor that I pay much attention to. Simply put, If I'm attracted to said woman, I'll give it a go irrespective of cultural differences. If it doesn't work out, that's fine too. Though, I'm not sure I understand the rationale behind this "preserving culture" bromide. When ever a group of people, who were enculturated with their set of values, assimilate into another society, chances are the offspring will lose their old values and will adopt new ones. It just seems like an exercise of tilting at windmills.

[JoshuaFairtex]

I've only dated asian girls my entire life so my parents have no problems with it, and if they did I would tell them to accept it or they are out of my life. I find it's not only over protective parents that are the problem when it comes to interacial dating, it is ALSO the person you are dating, as I find they are always afraid of their parents and will not speak up and pretty much tell their parent to get over it.

[Noehelia]

Hm, I do not live in USA so I think my perspective is different but since I have read the OP I have this big question on my head: Is a relationship between a hispanic and a romanian an interracial dating? Well, there are different ethnicities involved obviously but hispanics are white to my eyes.

[rahdam]

I'm not asking why it happens, I'm asking why the US government does nothing about it. And asserting that US policy towards hispanics versus Eastern Europeans or arabs is discriminatory. The end result of the US turning a blind eye to the horde of illegal immigrants living in this country is de facto preferential treatment.
Being able to stop and reverse illegal immigration and not doing so while simultaneously denying entry to millions of other applicants is de facto discrimination. Sorry you don't like it.
Here you've highlighted why the discrimination continues: hispanics have leverage on elected officials.
There is no racial discrimination. It has nothing to do with the race of any given illegal immigrant, and everything to do with their current location inside or outside the country. It is much easier to keep out new illegal immigrants than to forcibly remove old illegal immigrants, both from a practical standpoint and a humanitarian standpoint. You could argue that the government discriminates against those who wish to immigrate but are not already in the country and shows preferential treatment to those already inside the border illegally. There is a correlation here with the Hispanic immigrants, but we all know correlation is not causation. It has nothing to do with race, and everything to do with the fact that they are already here; that is, at some point, they successfully hopped the border, so to speak.

Is it actively discriminating against anyone other than hispanics? No. But then again I used the phrase "de facto".
Government is selectively enforcing immigration policies. It is obviously going to have an adverse impact on virtually everyone except Mexicans and hispanics. Its rather like not enforcing speeding laws on the "white" side of town.
Again, the active discrimination in your argument is against those who wish to immigrate into the country and are unable to enter illegally to circumvent the legal processes designed to control the flow of immigration. This selective enforcement of immigrant policies is rather perverse. Nonetheless, there is a correlation with Hispanics, but correlation is not causation. The causation is present physical location, either inside or outside the country.
I don't agree.
That’s great. I’m exceedingly happy for you.

[Nikita]

Some people want to preserve their own culture, not blend it with another. The magazine "The Atlantic" has an article on this this month (To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.). By 2023 will be the tipping point where whites start becoming a minority.

I don't think it's inherently wrong to have interracial relationships, just understand that not everyone will agree, and no one should be forced to concede on this just because "we're living in modern society" (it seems that the only thing safe to discriminate against these days are the discriminators). People have the right to preserve their own culture if they choose.

There is a big difference between choosing to "preserve your own culture" and trying to force another to preserve your culture for you. You can make your own choices for your own life, but it is wrong to presume to force them on anybody else. If you choose to disown your child because (s)he elected not to love prejudicially, that is your choice, but it does not make you right.

[Zombicide]

Hm, I do not live in USA so I think my perspective is different but since I have read the OP I have this big question on my head: Is a relationship between a Hispanic and a romanian an interracial dating? Well, there are different ethnicities involved obviously but hispanics are white to my eyes.

Mediterranean and directly Prussian descended people are two distinctly different genetic isolations to begin with, then there's the mediterranean migrant breedings throughout history that even in less apparent cases have deluded their caucasian genealogy but he said that she's from El salvador, which implies that she's both of Spanish descent and bred in with the local population i.e. a sort of native American.

[Lantigua]

Hm, I do not live in USA so I think my perspective is different but since I have read the OP I have this big question on my head: Is a relationship between a hispanic and a romanian an interracial dating? Well, there are different ethnicities involved obviously but hispanics are white to my eyes.
Hispanic is not a race, its an ethnicity.

If you have ever traveled to any Hispanic country, and I'm assuming you haven't based on your response, you would know that Hispanics come in all colors and races. Not only is this true within the population of any particular Hispanic country, but also between Hispanic countries as well. Puerto Ricans look nothing like Mexicans, who themselves look nothing like Peruvians, who themselves look nothing like Dominicans, who themselves look nothing like Argentinians and yet, they are all Hispanic peoples, they see each other as Hispanic people, and they pretty much understand each other in ways non-Hispanics will never fully understand. Also, within each of those countries, everyone is Hispanic despite everyone in each country not being of the same race - albeit most tend to be either mestizos or mulattoes mixes.

Many people are shocked when they see a Black or Mulatto or White or Arab or Asian person say they are Hispanic. To many people, Hispanic equals a particular look which they equate with a separate race, but in reality being Hispanic has more to do with culture and tradition than with physical appearances.

Its more or less similar to being Black in the United States. A very large percentage of "Black" Americans are not biologically Black, but rather Mulattoes - which is a separate race from either Blacks or Whites. However, due to a history of the One-Drop-Rule which ignores biological differences between a pure Black person of African origin and a person of mixed European-African ancestry and due to cultural ties; Blacks and Mulattoes in the U.S. are lumped together as simply Blacks or African Americans.

It has little to do with physical appearances or actual race, but more with culture and tradition.

In most countries in the world, for example, Barack Obama is not seen as Black because his race is Mulatto. But, in the U.S. he's Black regardless of his real race. In fact, most Americans are completely unaware that mixed people exist since they are forced to go one way or the other.

[Noehelia]

Mediterranean and directly Prussian descended people are two distinctly different genetic isolations to begin with, then there's the mediterranean migrant breedings throughout history that even in less apparent cases have deluded their caucasian genealogy but he said that she's from El salvador, which implies that she's both of Spanish descent and bred in with the local population i.e. a sort of native American.

What Prussians have to do with this? And Mediterraneans are not all the same.

The thing is that "white people" is a very loose term that has a different meaning in every country. If you read wikipedia To view links or images in this forum your post count must be 2 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. you can see that. And also in the same countries there were different conceptions of what is "white" through history. For instance, in US "The cultural boundaries separating white Americans from other racial or ethnic categories are contested and always changing. According to John Tehranian, among those not considered white at some points in American history have been: the Irish, Germans, Jews, Italians, Spaniards, Hispanics, Slavs, and Greeks".

I do not see the problem that OP poses as interracial matter but more as cultural. Hispanics are regarded as a different united cultural entity and it seems that some North Americans have negative associations with it.





Noehelia added to this post, 5 minutes and 12 seconds later...

Hispanic is not a race, its an ethnicity.

If you have ever traveled to any Hispanic country, and I'm assuming you haven't based on your response, you would know that Hispanics come in all colors and races. Not only is this true within the population of any particular Hispanic country, but also between Hispanic countries as well. Puerto Ricans look nothing like Mexicans, who themselves look nothing like Peruvians, who themselves look nothing like Dominicans, who themselves look nothing like Argentinians and yet, they are all Hispanic peoples, they see each other as Hispanic people, and they pretty much understand each other in ways non-Hispanics will never fully understand. Also, within each of those countries, everyone is Hispanic despite everyone in each country not being of the same race - albeit most tend to be either mestizos or mulattoes mixes.

Many people are shocked when they see a Black or Mulatto or White or Arab or Asian person say they are Hispanic. To many people, Hispanic equals a particular look which they equate with a separate race, but in reality being Hispanic has more to do with culture and tradition than with physical appearances.

Its more or less similar to being Black in the United States. A very large percentage of "Black" Americans are not biologically Black, but rather Mulattoes - which is a separate race from either Blacks or Whites. However, due to a history of the One-Drop-Rule which ignores biological differences between a pure Black person of African origin and a person of mixed European-African ancestry and due to cultural ties; Blacks and Mulattoes in the U.S. are lumped together as simply Blacks or African Americans.

It has little to do with physical appearances or actual race, but more with culture and tradition.

In most countries in the world, for example, Barack Obama is not seen as Black because his race is Mulatto. But, in the U.S. he's Black regardless of his real race. In fact, most Americans are completely unaware that mixed people exist since they are forced to go one way or the other.

I agree more or less with this post as you can see in my above response which I have started writing it in previously time. Apart from the choice of "ethnicity" as a word to describe all Hispanics. Ethnos is something very different.
I understand that Hispanics see themselves as an entity like Europeans see the same for themselves (or another example Mediterraneans). The fact that Hispanics have the same language makes the cultural bond even tighter.

[childofprodigy]

I have also noticed, anecdotally, that mixed race offspring are generally more attractive that pure race offspring.

I can attest, through experience, that mixed race offspring (especially half europeans half asians) are generally more attractive than pure race offspring.

But of course, we need statistics to confirm this.

[Brilliance]

I find no reason why it would even be an issue. If their is a mutual respect or caring between two individuals then why should race determine anything? What is annoying is where you get some ignorant individuals either being over adamant for no particular reason to prevent the mixture of race OR quite the opposite, people specifically looking for a specific race other than their own and rejecting all possible mates in some form of checklist format. These two scenarios are quite common, yet accepted. I think that for a relationship to succeed their has to be depth. Shallow water cannot fill the swimming pool.

[brainysmurf]

Well, my mom (more than my dad) is horrified at what my other relatives will thinks, she is disgusted at the thought of babies walking around that look more hispanic than white, and she hates hispanics in general. My mother's parents dislike it when my mom married my dad. She was Baptist, he was Petecostal, but that was enough to set them off. (My mom's pastor said my dad would burn in hell).


A lot of people have prejudices when they are insecure and want to "organize" their little world into good, bad etc. I'd suggest you try to get them to meet a few times and it would probably also be good if your girlfriend mentioned that she supports your ambition with respect to college. Doesn't have your girlfriend anything in common with your parents (e.g. hobby) or some interest in sports or anything else. That might be a good starting point to connect. BTW, I never understood how "good" christians could be racists. Didn't the bible tell us to love our neighbors? It's also interesting that you mentioned, that your parent's families weren't happy about them marrying. That's kind of ironic, I think. ;-) Anyway, try to stay calm.